The last two games provided clarity that the QB read option offensive attack is back and here to stay. This is Huskie football.
There are 3 main components to this offense
1) a running QB that makes the defense respect multiple run options
2) short, high % passes that are basically passing handoffs (bubble screens); and/or WR and slot receiver quick ins, outs and hooks; delays, wheels, throw backs to the TE
3) this is the key...successfully executing 1&2 typically results in wide open deep routes; via play action or straight drops.

For this offense to flourish you need all three. Childers has done 1&2 well, but to date has failed miserably on 3. I think that will improve, quite frankly it can't get worse, he has missed on virtually all attempts. The scheme has worked albeit against poor to average opponents, the execution has been pretty good. Childers has many of the skills necessary to run this offense effectively.

Santa for whatever reason (and it's not because of his lack of athleticism) was not asked to perform #1 (the QB read run option). Although he is athletic, fast enough and strong enough, it did not seem to be part of his game. His running came on broken plays, or scrambles. Santa was okay at 2; not bad (his completion % was very good) but there was certainly room for improvement. This is what made Santa's ability to perform #3 so impressive. Not only did he hit those recivers in stride, the WR typically had tight coverage due to a lack of execution of 1&2. This may have contributed to the picks

Conclusion, Childers is the better fit for this offense; Santa is the better QB. Graham is 2nd in both categories. The choice to Childers makes sense. Not sure how Santa fits moving forward.

This is a pretty accurate assessment. I couldn't even tell you what our offensive identity was the last few years with all of the QB injuries, aside from the let Maddie be Maddie period late last year. With Childers we have one again, and one that we know works. His running ability opens everything else up. We could still see Graham or Santa in relief if Childers isn't putting up points in a given game but in general he looks to be the guy.

Unless Childers can suddenly improve his passing skills this team is doomed to a mediocre to bad showing on offense as long as he remains at the helm.

Carey is and always has been a "safe player". I believe that all NIU QBs have been told over and over again throw it long and you are never wrong. He has them so afraid of making a mistake that they cannot make big plays even when they are there for the taking. QB after QB has missed receivers by overthrowing them which is far safer than under throwing them.

Under this philosophy the team will not beat themselves but they also will not beat good teams, they will not come back from big or even moderate deficits and they will be ungodly boring to watch on offense.

Give me a young QB like Santa any day that has show that he can execute a passing game and make big plays. I will live with his occasional mishaps while I enjoy watching him grow and improve. Sadly I will not have the chance to this this in his remaining tenure at NIU.

Perhaps Childress can improve in the passing game, I sure hope so but it is difficult to do that when you are playing scared of making a mistake.

(10-17-2017 09:41 AM)NIU1981 Wrote:  This is a pretty accurate assessment. I couldn't even tell you what our offensive identity was the last few years with all of the QB injuries, aside from the let Maddie be Maddie period late last year. With Childers we have one again, and one that we know works. His running ability opens everything else up. We could still see Graham or Santa in relief if Childers isn't putting up points in a given game but in general he looks to be the guy.

It works against Kent State and a Buffalo team on their #3 QB.

What's funny is Santa goes 2-1 as the starter this season, including winning at Nebraska and getting us back into the SDSU game with his passing and then gets benched for a few interceptions. Yet the coaching staff keeps trotting out the same terrible kicker every game. I bet out punter could do a better job making FGs than Hagan.

(10-17-2017 12:06 PM)epasnoopy Wrote:  What's funny is Santa goes 2-1 as the starter this season, including winning at Nebraska and getting us back into the SDSU game with his passing and then gets benched for a few interceptions. Yet the coaching staff keeps trotting out the same terrible kicker every game. I bet out punter could do a better job making FGs than Hagan.

Looks like Santa now occupies the same dog house that Huff once lived in.

Santa's performance in the SDSU game makes him the starter in my mind. Yes, the interception cost us the game, but we wouldn't have been in the game to begin with without Santa.

(10-17-2017 08:48 AM)Djud Wrote:  The last two games provided clarity that the QB read option offensive attack is back and here to stay. This is Huskie football.
There are 3 main components to this offense
1) a running QB that makes the defense respect multiple run options
2) short, high % passes that are basically passing handoffs (bubble screens); and/or WR and slot receiver quick ins, outs and hooks; delays, wheels, throw backs to the TE
3) this is the key...successfully executing 1&2 typically results in wide open deep routes; via play action or straight drops.

For this offense to flourish you need all three. Childers has done 1&2 well, but to date has failed miserably on 3. I think that will improve, quite frankly it can't get worse, he has missed on virtually all attempts. The scheme has worked albeit against poor to average opponents, the execution has been pretty good. Childers has many of the skills necessary to run this offense effectively.

Santa for whatever reason (and it's not because of his lack of athleticism) was not asked to perform #1 (the QB read run option). Although he is athletic, fast enough and strong enough, it did not seem to be part of his game. His running came on broken plays, or scrambles. Santa was okay at 2; not bad (his completion % was very good) but there was certainly room for improvement. This is what made Santa's ability to perform #3 so impressive. Not only did he hit those recivers in stride, the WR typically had tight coverage due to a lack of execution of 1&2. This may have contributed to the picks

Conclusion, Childers is the better fit for this offense; Santa is the better QB. Graham is 2nd in both categories. The choice to Childers makes sense. Not sure how Santa fits moving forward.

So true. We still don't know why Santa's running seemed limited. I will say it was fantastic to hit the big deep play with him and I still believe we will need that against better opponents.

Flip side is I loved the offense with Childers running. Puts so much pressure on the D. Hit a few deep balls and we can't be stopped. Plus it is so much more consistent of an offense. Getting 3-6 yards running. Keeps it 3rd and short and extends drives. Keeps defense fresh to do what they do.

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(10-17-2017 09:53 AM)bikechuck Wrote:  Unless Childers can suddenly improve his passing skills this team is doomed to a mediocre to bad showing on offense as long as he remains at the helm.

Carey is and always has been a "safe player". I believe that all NIU QBs have been told over and over again throw it long and you are never wrong. He has them so afraid of making a mistake that they cannot make big plays even when they are there for the taking. QB after QB has missed receivers by overthrowing them which is far safer than under throwing them.

Under this philosophy the team will not beat themselves but they also will not beat good teams, they will not come back from big or even moderate deficits and they will be ungodly boring to watch on offense.

Give me a young QB like Santa any day that has show that he can execute a passing game and make big plays. I will live with his occasional mishaps while I enjoy watching him grow and improve. Sadly I will not have the chance to this this in his remaining tenure at NIU.

Perhaps Childress can improve in the passing game, I sure hope so but it is difficult to do that when you are playing scared of making a mistake.

You are correct on the Carey assessment. His qbs are scared to throw a jump ball for fear of the interception and coach's wrath.



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(10-17-2017 12:06 PM)epasnoopy Wrote:  What's funny is Santa goes 2-1 as the starter this season, including winning at Nebraska and getting us back into the SDSU game with his passing and then gets benched for a few interceptions. Yet the coaching staff keeps trotting out the same terrible kicker every game. I bet out punter could do a better job making FGs than Hagan.

We are only left to wonder on our kicker. The nfl teams would bring in a couple kickers for tryouts by now. Not sure what we can do. Is there another leg on campus?

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Childers after a few more starts will far exceed santa in every category. He has the. Better skill set for the position and a better arm

How does he have the better arm? He can't even hit a wide open receiver down field and constantly throws behind guys on his short passes. The song Wobble should play every time he throws a pass.

(10-17-2017 08:48 AM)Djud Wrote:  The last two games provided clarity that the QB read option offensive attack is back and here to stay. This is Huskie football.
There are 3 main components to this offense
1) a running QB that makes the defense respect multiple run options
2) short, high % passes that are basically passing handoffs (bubble screens); and/or WR and slot receiver quick ins, outs and hooks; delays, wheels, throw backs to the TE
3) this is the key...successfully executing 1&2 typically results in wide open deep routes; via play action or straight drops.

For this offense to flourish you need all three. Childers has done 1&2 well, but to date has failed miserably on 3. I think that will improve, quite frankly it can't get worse, he has missed on virtually all attempts. The scheme has worked albeit against poor to average opponents, the execution has been pretty good. Childers has many of the skills necessary to run this offense effectively.

Santa for whatever reason (and it's not because of his lack of athleticism) was not asked to perform #1 (the QB read run option). Although he is athletic, fast enough and strong enough, it did not seem to be part of his game. His running came on broken plays, or scrambles. Santa was okay at 2; not bad (his completion % was very good) but there was certainly room for improvement. This is what made Santa's ability to perform #3 so impressive. Not only did he hit those recivers in stride, the WR typically had tight coverage due to a lack of execution of 1&2. This may have contributed to the picks

Conclusion, Childers is the better fit for this offense; Santa is the better QB. Graham is 2nd in both categories. The choice to Childers makes sense. Not sure how Santa fits moving forward.

Very good analysis, and Childers does fit Carey's thinking.

Let's not forget, the potential future QB (Hall) is a strong runner and needs a lot of work on his passing from what was said by those who saw him at practice. So, a Childers type offense fits the future plan. Hall had good passing stats in HS; but he was passing mainly to a 5-star WR who I think ended up at Florida St., and i am sure made Hall look much better. We have seen RS FR QBs in the past and that has not worked very well, so I would not be surprised to see Childers beat out Hall at least next year. Let's also not forget Childers is a RS FR and should improve with his long passes.

I am still interested why Santa did not run the read option/running. We know he can run, so why wasn't he doing it? I speculate it was injury concerns, at least initially. But why not now? Just speculation by me; I suspect he did not look comfortable with the multiple run options in practice. At this point I am not sure we will ever see what Santa could do with the whole playbook; that is a shame, because he made a believer out of me with his passing ability, and I still think his running would have softened the defense for his passing. I disagree with MD that Childers has a better arm than Santa.

I agree with your conclusion that Santa is the better QB, but Childers is the better fit for this offense - more like Carey's comfort zone, which is what I think you were referring to. I see Graham being a distant 3rd, but suspect Carey may not see it that way.

(10-17-2017 12:21 PM)MiamiHuskie Wrote:  Santa's performance in the SDSU game makes him the starter in my mind. Yes, the interception cost us the game, but we wouldn't have been in the game to begin with without Santa.

The defense gave up 13 points to SDSU. If it wasn’t for the offense and special teams handing SDSU 21 points, NIU wins. Not sure how you could say NIU isn’t in that game without Santa.

(10-17-2017 08:48 AM)Djud Wrote:  The last two games provided clarity that the QB read option offensive attack is back and here to stay. This is Huskie football.
There are 3 main components to this offense
1) a running QB that makes the defense respect multiple run options
2) short, high % passes that are basically passing handoffs (bubble screens); and/or WR and slot receiver quick ins, outs and hooks; delays, wheels, throw backs to the TE
3) this is the key...successfully executing 1&2 typically results in wide open deep routes; via play action or straight drops.

For this offense to flourish you need all three. Childers has done 1&2 well, but to date has failed miserably on 3. I think that will improve, quite frankly it can't get worse, he has missed on virtually all attempts. The scheme has worked albeit against poor to average opponents, the execution has been pretty good. Childers has many of the skills necessary to run this offense effectively.

Santa for whatever reason (and it's not because of his lack of athleticism) was not asked to perform #1 (the QB read run option). Although he is athletic, fast enough and strong enough, it did not seem to be part of his game. His running came on broken plays, or scrambles. Santa was okay at 2; not bad (his completion % was very good) but there was certainly room for improvement. This is what made Santa's ability to perform #3 so impressive. Not only did he hit those recivers in stride, the WR typically had tight coverage due to a lack of execution of 1&2. This may have contributed to the picks

Conclusion, Childers is the better fit for this offense; Santa is the better QB. Graham is 2nd in both categories. The choice to Childers makes sense. Not sure how Santa fits moving forward.

This is a really good post, and honestly it’s why I was such a fan of Maddie’s. There’s no doubt the offense is back to being the offense we are used to under Childers. The question is if he’s good enough with his arm for it to work.

(10-17-2017 01:54 PM)7 Wrote:  

(10-17-2017 12:21 PM)MiamiHuskie Wrote:  Santa's performance in the SDSU game makes him the starter in my mind. Yes, the interception cost us the game, but we wouldn't have been in the game to begin with without Santa.

The defense gave up 13 points to SDSU. If it wasn’t for the offense and special teams handing SDSU 21 points, NIU wins. Not sure how you could say NIU isn’t in that game without Santa.

I'm not sure Childers can score 14+ on SDSU. Their one major flaw on D was that corner. I doubt Childers exposes him. Also, The 3 and outs would give SDSU better field position and probably lead to more points for them.

We were shut out by buffalo in the second half. That only happened one time last year and we lost 7 games. EMU. Then we brought Santa in for the second half and rallied to the win. It's going to be rough during the learning curve.

(10-17-2017 02:09 PM)Rabid Squirrel Wrote:  

(10-17-2017 01:54 PM)7 Wrote:  

(10-17-2017 12:21 PM)MiamiHuskie Wrote:  Santa's performance in the SDSU game makes him the starter in my mind. Yes, the interception cost us the game, but we wouldn't have been in the game to begin with without Santa.

The defense gave up 13 points to SDSU. If it wasn’t for the offense and special teams handing SDSU 21 points, NIU wins. Not sure how you could say NIU isn’t in that game without Santa.

I'm not sure Childers can score 14+ on SDSU. Their one major flaw on D was that corner. I doubt Childers exposes him. Also, The 3 and outs would give SDSU better field position and probably lead to more points for them.

We were shut out by buffalo in the second half. That only happened one time last year and we lost 7 games. EMU. Then we brought Santa in for the second half and rallied to the win. It's going to be rough during the learning curve.

Huff tore up SDSU, they had more weaknesses than one corner.

Look I would be playing Santa, but they’re both less than ideal choices.

(10-17-2017 02:11 PM)7 Wrote:  

(10-17-2017 02:09 PM)Rabid Squirrel Wrote:  

(10-17-2017 01:54 PM)7 Wrote:  

(10-17-2017 12:21 PM)MiamiHuskie Wrote:  Santa's performance in the SDSU game makes him the starter in my mind. Yes, the interception cost us the game, but we wouldn't have been in the game to begin with without Santa.

The defense gave up 13 points to SDSU. If it wasn’t for the offense and special teams handing SDSU 21 points, NIU wins. Not sure how you could say NIU isn’t in that game without Santa.

I'm not sure Childers can score 14+ on SDSU. Their one major flaw on D was that corner. I doubt Childers exposes him. Also, The 3 and outs would give SDSU better field position and probably lead to more points for them.

We were shut out by buffalo in the second half. That only happened one time last year and we lost 7 games. EMU. Then we brought Santa in for the second half and rallied to the win. It's going to be rough during the learning curve.

Huff tore up SDSU, they had more weaknesses than one corner.

Look I would be playing Santa, but they’re both less than ideal choices.

I'm going under the theory a lot of Huffs success stemmed from a softened up defense trying not to eat beat deep again. Here's huffs numbers under the Graham/Childers...style offense. 33 carries for 109 yards. Under the Santa style offense...52 carries for 341 yards. I know some of that is just circumstantial, but I think there's definitely some truth to what the defenses can do against a non-passing vertical passing offense.

(10-17-2017 02:18 PM)Rabid Squirrel Wrote:  

(10-17-2017 02:11 PM)7 Wrote:  

(10-17-2017 02:09 PM)Rabid Squirrel Wrote:  

(10-17-2017 01:54 PM)7 Wrote:  

(10-17-2017 12:21 PM)MiamiHuskie Wrote:  Santa's performance in the SDSU game makes him the starter in my mind. Yes, the interception cost us the game, but we wouldn't have been in the game to begin with without Santa.

The defense gave up 13 points to SDSU. If it wasn’t for the offense and special teams handing SDSU 21 points, NIU wins. Not sure how you could say NIU isn’t in that game without Santa.

I'm not sure Childers can score 14+ on SDSU. Their one major flaw on D was that corner. I doubt Childers exposes him. Also, The 3 and outs would give SDSU better field position and probably lead to more points for them.

We were shut out by buffalo in the second half. That only happened one time last year and we lost 7 games. EMU. Then we brought Santa in for the second half and rallied to the win. It's going to be rough during the learning curve.

Huff tore up SDSU, they had more weaknesses than one corner.

Look I would be playing Santa, but they’re both less than ideal choices.

I'm going under the theory a lot of Huffs success stemmed from a softened up defense trying not to eat beat deep again. Here's huffs numbers under the Graham/Childers...style offense. 33 carries for 109 yards. Under the Santa style offense...52 carries for 341 yards. I know some of that is just circumstantial, but I think there's definitely some truth to what the defenses can do against a non-passing vertical passing offense.

Santa's TD to Tears came against an 8 man front and I believe was actually a called run play (not to get into that discussion again).

After that play, Santa was 17/22 for 191 yards, 3 TD, 1 INT. He finished the game 23/37 for 262 yards, 3 TD and 3 INT.

In the last 29 minutes of the game, Santa went 6/15 for 71 yards, 0 TD, 2 INT.

Santa played a good first half if you ignore the fact he threw a brutal pick 6. He didn't absolutely nothing in the second half in a game that was very winnable.

NIU was in that game because their defense played insane, Huff running, and Santa making 2-3 nice throws. Santa hitting a few deep balls against SDSU doesn't overshadow everything else though. He did absolutely nothing the week before against Nebraska too.

It's no surprise that SDSU putting another guy on Blake not only made it tougher for Santa to complete passes in the 2nd half but also made it easier for Huff to get a bunch of yards.