(10-15-2017 07:08 PM)rath v2.0 Wrote:  Folks need to take a deep breath. We desperately need bodies. That takes time.

given we have the worse Oline in FBS with practically nothing in the hopper for next year means this rebuild will most likely take longer than people want to realize. This won't turnaround to a 10 win team next year either.

(10-17-2017 06:55 AM)Bearcats#1 Wrote:  

(10-15-2017 07:08 PM)rath v2.0 Wrote:  Folks need to take a deep breath. We desperately need bodies. That takes time.

given we have the worse Oline in FBS with practically nothing in the hopper for next year means this rebuild will most likely take longer than people want to realize. This won't turnaround to a 10 win team next year either.

I saw someone make a comment that I liked, can't remember where I saw it, or the exact wording, but it went something like:

"Everyone is okay with the idea of a 'rebuild' up until they are in the middle of one."

Next year might be a bit better, but I agree that it still won't be back to conference champs just yet. Some people just aren't going to be able to handle that.

(10-17-2017 06:55 AM)Bearcats#1 Wrote:  

(10-15-2017 07:08 PM)rath v2.0 Wrote:  Folks need to take a deep breath. We desperately need bodies. That takes time.

given we have the worse Oline in FBS with practically nothing in the hopper for next year means this rebuild will most likely take longer than people want to realize. This won't turnaround to a 10 win team next year either.

Of course it won't.

Some are just going to have a decision to make. Admit they had no clue about the piss poor status of this roster or blame the coaching. One is easier than the other. C'est la vie.

Hey, I'm with you on this. I'm old school; I'm going to support the 'Cats win or lose and I've sat through more losing seasons than I'd care to recount. What we've enjoyed in (most of) the recent years has been the best of Bearcat football. CLF will get it going but my anger is increasingly directed at the previous coach who allowed such atrophy to occur.

I've said it before I can live with the losing due to the state of the roster. The teams that UC lost to are just better.

What I would like to start seeing is a decrease in stupid penalties and the team being more disciplined.

"What I would like to start seeing is a decrease in stupid penalties and the team being more disciplined."

Amen

I think a lot of the stupid penalties and lack of discipline are a direct result of having your ass handed to you every down. I can see where they might be frustrated...

(10-17-2017 08:51 AM)Bearcatbdub Wrote:  I think a lot of the stupid penalties and lack of discipline are a direct result of having your ass handed to you every down. I can see where they might be frustrated...

It's a combination of issues IMO. Often, penalties are the result of having lesser talent. When the guy is kicking your butt on every play, it is human nature to do whatever you can to gain an advantage (hold, face mask, jump offside to get that first step, etc.).

The delay of game penalties (especially the ones we have had to begin a game or a half) are on coaching. Its one thing for this to happen in the 1st or 2nd game, but it should not be happening in the 7th game of the season.

(10-15-2017 05:36 PM)rosewater Wrote:  Back in January, I looked at the depth chart and noticed that on defense, the only returning linebacker was back up Jaylin Minor. Sure We had all our defensive backfield return sans a safety, but was this a good thing. Even since then, our best of the group was thrown off the team. The only strong defensive position was the defensive line. Last night the defense shined. Even now, the two deep is littered with true freshman and red shirt freshman and sophomores. I think the fire Fick talk is ridiculous.

On the offensive side, you need to go no further than the oline. 3 starters on the offensive line that did not have scholarships is unbelievable. Can anyone give me an instance when they can remember 3 non scholarship players starting on both sides of the ball rather than limited to one position group. Some of the other stories on the offensive line consist of converted defensive tackles and hockey players. Lets be realistic, this is not the formula for winning. Place the blame where it belongs, at Flubervilles feet.

In addition, Fick is recruiting like a mad man. He is making all the correct decisions. Yea his game management leaves a little to be desired, but if this is his only weakness, he will do fine. Taking over a new program is a daunting task. Everything is brand new to the coach and the players. The players do not know the schemes or drills and it takes forever to get across all the nuances. Once the team gets on the same page and the talent takes its place in the lineup, this team will take off. Enjoy the ride.

I agree. It should probably take about 3 years to get this program back on track with coach Fickell. I just hope he has the patience to do it.

(10-17-2017 09:12 AM)bearcat54 Wrote:  

(10-15-2017 05:36 PM)rosewater Wrote:  Back in January, I looked at the depth chart and noticed that on defense, the only returning linebacker was back up Jaylin Minor. Sure We had all our defensive backfield return sans a safety, but was this a good thing. Even since then, our best of the group was thrown off the team. The only strong defensive position was the defensive line. Last night the defense shined. Even now, the two deep is littered with true freshman and red shirt freshman and sophomores. I think the fire Fick talk is ridiculous.

On the offensive side, you need to go no further than the oline. 3 starters on the offensive line that did not have scholarships is unbelievable. Can anyone give me an instance when they can remember 3 non scholarship players starting on both sides of the ball rather than limited to one position group. Some of the other stories on the offensive line consist of converted defensive tackles and hockey players. Lets be realistic, this is not the formula for winning. Place the blame where it belongs, at Flubervilles feet.

In addition, Fick is recruiting like a mad man. He is making all the correct decisions. Yea his game management leaves a little to be desired, but if this is his only weakness, he will do fine. Taking over a new program is a daunting task. Everything is brand new to the coach and the players. The players do not know the schemes or drills and it takes forever to get across all the nuances. Once the team gets on the same page and the talent takes its place in the lineup, this team will take off. Enjoy the ride.

I agree. It should probably take about 3 years to get this program back on track with coach Fickell. I just hope he has the patience to do it.

His patience won't be the issue, methinks. It'll be the fanbase.

As to the original poster's question, at my age, nothing surprises me.

UC could have hire Knute Rockne and I don't know if he would have done any better. The roster is what it is.

Also back to the original question, here is how it looks from the average fan's view:

We just fired a coach for going 4-8. This new guy looks like he is going to do even worse. Seems we made a bad hire.

(10-17-2017 12:56 PM)Bruce Monnin Wrote:  Also back to the original question, here is how it looks from the average fan's view:

We just fired a coach for going 4-8. This new guy looks like he is going to do even worse. Seems we made a bad hire.

That's a premature and unfair conclusion in the midst of his first season. The coach that went 4-8 last year might have only won 2 games with this team this year. Judgments should wait till at least end of next season when he's got more of his recruits on the field and isn't trying to win with Tommy's years of crap and half baked recruiting. He's made some real head scratching decisions in some games thus far, but he's off to a good start recruiting-wise so let's wait and see. He didn't exactly inherit the squads both Butch and Tommy inherited.

I believe the Trail move was politically timed. its not a coincidence the move is being made right as the schedule softens. moore was left in the last couple games, despite an obvious need for change, to take the butt kickings. now the coaches have new player leadership to rally the team around and when the team inevitably plays better against lesser competition it creates momentum into the offseason. also gives fans reason to be optimistic for a better performance next season.

(10-17-2017 02:32 PM)cincy7718 Wrote:  I believe the Trail move was politically timed. its not a coincidence the move is being made right as the schedule softens. moore was left in the last couple games, despite an obvious need for change, to take the butt kickings. now the coaches have new player leadership to rally the team around and when the team inevitably plays better against lesser competition it creates momentum into the offseason. also gives fans reason to be optimistic for a better performance next season.

Fickell said today that Moore will start Saturday.

(10-17-2017 02:35 PM)CliftonAve Wrote:  

(10-17-2017 02:32 PM)cincy7718 Wrote:  I believe the Trail move was politically timed. its not a coincidence the move is being made right as the schedule softens. moore was left in the last couple games, despite an obvious need for change, to take the butt kickings. now the coaches have new player leadership to rally the team around and when the team inevitably plays better against lesser competition it creates momentum into the offseason. also gives fans reason to be optimistic for a better performance next season.

Fickell said today that Moore will start Saturday.

Thats... something.

This is building up to another Kay and Legaux situation.

(10-17-2017 02:37 PM)The T-Shirt Wrote:  

(10-17-2017 02:35 PM)CliftonAve Wrote:  

(10-17-2017 02:32 PM)cincy7718 Wrote:  I believe the Trail move was politically timed. its not a coincidence the move is being made right as the schedule softens. moore was left in the last couple games, despite an obvious need for change, to take the butt kickings. now the coaches have new player leadership to rally the team around and when the team inevitably plays better against lesser competition it creates momentum into the offseason. also gives fans reason to be optimistic for a better performance next season.

Fickell said today that Moore will start Saturday.

Thats... something.

This is building up to another Kay and Legaux situation.

Except that we knew Kay was a much better QB than Munchie (we had witnessed it based on their play on the field). At this point we only hope that Trail is a better QB than Moore. Let's hope that benching Moore last week sent him a message and he'll come out and play more heads up football this week. Guess we'll see.....

(10-17-2017 02:35 PM)CliftonAve Wrote:  

(10-17-2017 02:32 PM)cincy7718 Wrote:  I believe the Trail move was politically timed. its not a coincidence the move is being made right as the schedule softens. moore was left in the last couple games, despite an obvious need for change, to take the butt kickings. now the coaches have new player leadership to rally the team around and when the team inevitably plays better against lesser competition it creates momentum into the offseason. also gives fans reason to be optimistic for a better performance next season.

Fickell said today that Moore will start Saturday.

well then im wrong lol. that's just what I had been expecting the last couple weeks and misheard that change had been decided.

(10-17-2017 02:44 PM)Racinejake Wrote:  

(10-17-2017 02:37 PM)The T-Shirt Wrote:  

(10-17-2017 02:35 PM)CliftonAve Wrote:  

(10-17-2017 02:32 PM)cincy7718 Wrote:  I believe the Trail move was politically timed. its not a coincidence the move is being made right as the schedule softens. moore was left in the last couple games, despite an obvious need for change, to take the butt kickings. now the coaches have new player leadership to rally the team around and when the team inevitably plays better against lesser competition it creates momentum into the offseason. also gives fans reason to be optimistic for a better performance next season.

Fickell said today that Moore will start Saturday.

Thats... something.

This is building up to another Kay and Legaux situation.

Except that we knew Kay was a much better QB than Munchie (we had witnessed it based on their play on the field). At this point we only hope that Trail is a better QB than Moore. Let's hope that benching Moore last week sent him a message and he'll come out and play more heads up football this week. Guess we'll see.....

Supposedly Moore was taken out due to an elbow injury, not performance related.

http://www.cincinnati.com/story/sports/c...771148001/

(10-17-2017 03:22 PM)TheGreatNate Wrote:  

(10-17-2017 02:44 PM)Racinejake Wrote:  

(10-17-2017 02:37 PM)The T-Shirt Wrote:  

(10-17-2017 02:35 PM)CliftonAve Wrote:  

(10-17-2017 02:32 PM)cincy7718 Wrote:  I believe the Trail move was politically timed. its not a coincidence the move is being made right as the schedule softens. moore was left in the last couple games, despite an obvious need for change, to take the butt kickings. now the coaches have new player leadership to rally the team around and when the team inevitably plays better against lesser competition it creates momentum into the offseason. also gives fans reason to be optimistic for a better performance next season.

Fickell said today that Moore will start Saturday.

Thats... something.

This is building up to another Kay and Legaux situation.

Except that we knew Kay was a much better QB than Munchie (we had witnessed it based on their play on the field). At this point we only hope that Trail is a better QB than Moore. Let's hope that benching Moore last week sent him a message and he'll come out and play more heads up football this week. Guess we'll see.....

Supposedly Moore was taken out due to an elbow injury, not performance related.

http://www.cincinnati.com/story/sports/c...771148001/

Well that takes care of that then. Did not see any injury to Moore so that's surprising. Guess we'll just keep our fingers crossed his play improves.