(09-30-2020 01:04 PM)Dynamos Wrote:  

(09-30-2020 12:58 PM)natibeast21 Wrote:  What happens when someone with mental illness (not in a facility) goes bananas on a mental health clinician in broad public? Police will be needed.

This is not negating any argument to police reform. This is an argument against defunding police.

Idk what the origins of police are, but I do know police today do one hell of a job keeping 99.99999% of every single person in this country safe.


Also, I don't understand one bit what point is trying to be made with use of Narcan by police. I'm surprised we offer it as much as we do TBH, but hey they are saving lives. What is on-demand treatment? Put a needle back in their arm? Dear lord. Some people want to change and some don't.

Police are not trained or equipped to handle people with mental illness

Neither are mental health clinicians. I'm married to one, she's likely one of the best in her field.

Send her to a scene where some guy is flipping his schit in a Walmart and have her do what? She's entirely unequipped to deal with something like that. Throw in a concealed weapon of some sort and we've got a buncha dead mental health clinicians on our hands.

Really, really dumb idea.

Have you guys ever been in a Behavioral Unit at a medical facility? I work in healthcare administration. We bring in heavy security because the clinicians and social workers can’t physically deal with these people. Even an adolescent or an elderly person is physically capable of hurting someone. I’ve seen it happen.

As an aside, a lot of mental health workers have their own mental health issues. That’s why a lot of them get into their field- they are looking to self diagnose and treat. I think it would be a recipe for disaster to put them out on the street in lieu of law enforcement.

(09-30-2020 01:10 PM)Dynamos Wrote:  

(09-30-2020 01:08 PM)banker Wrote:  Civilization has had individuals who task it was to enforce laws for centuries before the US was founded. Her education sucked if she really believes this.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slave_patrol

The US education system sucks because it picks and chooses what is taught in school

Just to blow the narrative up even more...patrol is based upon french/german words which predate the formation of the US. Policing has existed in some for centuries if not millennia. Modern policing is descended from England and it's Metropolitan police. Police are not the equivalent of modern slave patrols.

(09-30-2020 03:38 PM)CliftonAve Wrote:  Have you guys ever been in a Behavioral Unit at a medical facility? I work in healthcare administration. We being in heavy security because the clinicians and social workers can’t physically deal with these people. Even an adolescent or an elderly person is physically capable of hurting someone. I’ve seen it happen.

As an aside, a lot of mental health workers have their own mental health issues. That’s why a lot of them get into their field- they are looking to self diagnose and treat. I think it would be a recipe for disaster to put them out on the street in lieu of law enforcement.

As someone who works in law/law enforcement, I have been to ASU/Behavioral Units. What you describe is 100% correct. Severely mentally ill people often have to be forceably confined and restrained. This is a job for hospital security/staff in involuntary commitment facilities and police on the streets. A social worker would get beaten to death with their clip board in the street if we had them handle these type issues.

(09-30-2020 02:44 PM)Dynamos Wrote:  

(09-30-2020 02:41 PM)VA49er Wrote:  

(09-30-2020 01:45 PM)natibeast21 Wrote:  

(09-30-2020 01:04 PM)Dynamos Wrote:  

(09-30-2020 12:58 PM)natibeast21 Wrote:  What happens when someone with mental illness (not in a facility) goes bananas on a mental health clinician in broad public? Police will be needed.

This is not negating any argument to police reform. This is an argument against defunding police.

Idk what the origins of police are, but I do know police today do one hell of a job keeping 99.99999% of every single person in this country safe.


Also, I don't understand one bit what point is trying to be made with use of Narcan by police. I'm surprised we offer it as much as we do TBH, but hey they are saving lives. What is on-demand treatment? Put a needle back in their arm? Dear lord. Some people want to change and some don't.

Police are not trained or equipped to handle people with mental illness

Provide a solution. You cry foul and then provide zero solutions. Low resolution thinking and a waste of time.

If there are enough mental health clinicians to accompany police on calls go for it. Probably not, so sounds like a possible solution is to provide more funding to train police in these areas. If you can argue against that then do so and maybe we can find a real solution.

If a law is being broken, a law is being broken. Some looney is in a hotel/mall/school/public space stabbing people. Send in the mental health clinicians?

Provide relevant solutions to a problem or stop talking. Defunding police is not a solution to anything.

I know that wasn't directed at me; however, I was thinking that since EVERYTHING these days is blamed on mental issues, maybe reopening some Psychiatric hospitals may help? I know they had their issues back in the day but maybe we would have learned from that going forward. Just a thought......

Exactly. Use some of the money given to police on mental health and education. I don’t think most actually understand what defund the police means

So your solution is to take money away from an agency that just about everywhere is already underfunded and give it to someone else that in all conceivable scenarios is going to require them to either respond simultaneously with them or respond first and call the on-call social worker, leaving law enforcement to do what they are currently doing?

Abso-*******-lutely brilliant plan you have there!

https://courses.lumenlearning.com/atd-bm...-policing/

There is the roots of modern day police, started around 800’BC, nothing to do with slaves.

What does that mean black crime is linked to. Does she really wanna play this game?

Did slave patrols write parking tickets???