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So, how deep does this scandal go?
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ken d Offline
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Post: #1
So, how deep does this scandal go?
I can't imagine there are any fans, coaches, administrators or athletes who ever believed that surreptitious payments to elite high school players were just rumors. Or, for that matter, cared very much that it was going on.

My question is this. How far down the list of star players do we have to go before we find players who are not getting paid? Is this just limited to five star athletes, or does it go much deeper?

Look at the schools who have been charged so far. If you were making a list of schools who are signing the best players, would these seven schools be at the top of your list? And if the players those schools are signing are getting paid, can we assume the lottery pick players are not?

And given that football drives the athletics bus, can we assume that this is a basketball issue only?

At some point, is it unreasonable to assume that the blue blood schools (and their coaches) who are signing the best players year after year might also be involved?
09-26-2017 01:11 PM
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RutgersGuy Offline
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Post: #2
RE: So, how deep does this scandal go?
(09-26-2017 01:11 PM)ken d Wrote:  I can't imagine there are any fans, coaches, administrators or athletes who ever believed that surreptitious payments to elite high school players were just rumors. Or, for that matter, cared very much that it was going on.

My question is this. How far down the list of star players do we have to go before we find players who are not getting paid? Is this just limited to five star athletes, or does it go much deeper?

Look at the schools who have been charged so far. If you were making a list of schools who are signing the best players, would these seven schools be at the top of your list? And if the players those schools are signing are getting paid, can we assume the lottery pick players are not?

And given that football drives the athletics bus, can we assume that this is a basketball issue only?

At some point, is it unreasonable to assume that the blue blood schools (and their coaches) who are signing the best players year after year might also be involved?

Seeing as how it's connected to agents and financial advisers i'd say it's mostly 5* kids and probably high 4*. It has a lot to do with when kids move to the NBA and make a bunch of money so those guys reap the reward of their investment.
09-26-2017 01:15 PM
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bullet Offline
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Post: #3
RE: So, how deep does this scandal go?
(09-26-2017 01:11 PM)ken d Wrote:  I can't imagine there are any fans, coaches, administrators or athletes who ever believed that surreptitious payments to elite high school players were just rumors. Or, for that matter, cared very much that it was going on.

My question is this. How far down the list of star players do we have to go before we find players who are not getting paid? Is this just limited to five star athletes, or does it go much deeper?

Look at the schools who have been charged so far. If you were making a list of schools who are signing the best players, would these seven schools be at the top of your list? And if the players those schools are signing are getting paid, can we assume the lottery pick players are not?

And given that football drives the athletics bus, can we assume that this is a basketball issue only?

At some point, is it unreasonable to assume that the blue blood schools (and their coaches) who are signing the best players year after year might also be involved?

Kansas is an Adidas client. And they signed a player last summer in a deal that just smells Adidas (this according to a KU fan on another board). Think they get connected as well. I imagine Adidas tried to "help" Indiana as well.
09-26-2017 01:16 PM
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ODUDrunkard13 Offline
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Post: #4
RE: So, how deep does this scandal go?
I work with a current bball 5* recruit's mom. She told me she has had to tell numerous coaches and agents her son is not for sale. It's a systemic problem and not isolated to just the programs known to cheat.
(This post was last modified: 09-26-2017 01:19 PM by ODUDrunkard13.)
09-26-2017 01:18 PM
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Rube Dali Offline
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RE: So, how deep does this scandal go?
Once, not if, this issue hits college football, the **** doing the mating dance with the oscillator won't be regular manure, but radioactive.
09-26-2017 01:26 PM
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BadgerMJ Offline
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Post: #6
RE: So, how deep does this scandal go?
I'll be up front and say that I have absolutely no proof of what I'm going to say, it's just my opinion.

But.....

Something stinks and when there's a smell, there's usually some form of "waste" nearby.

What I mean is that I find it hard to believe that a large number of 4 & 5 star athletes would choose to attend schools located in BFE, some shitehole or in some backwards hump of a city unless they were getting paid, and paid WELL.

Not to mention any names, but I think most people have a general idea of what I'm talking about.

I also would be shocked if this DIDN'T cross over to football... For the exact same reasons.

Now the question is do people care or care enough to do something about it.
09-26-2017 01:38 PM
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GhentFan Offline
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RE: So, how deep does this scandal go?
Will anything really happen as a result of this?

Smells like a too big to fail situation. Networks will put pressure on the NCAA to do nothing.
09-26-2017 02:02 PM
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RutgersGuy Offline
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Post: #8
RE: So, how deep does this scandal go?
(09-26-2017 02:02 PM)GhentFan Wrote:  Will anything really happen as a result of this?

Smells like a too big to fail situation. Networks will put pressure on the NCAA to do nothing.

Will they pressure the FBI as well? C'mon this is way bigger than the NCAA here. The NCAA will follow the feds lead when coaches are found guilty the NCAA wil use that as proof and punish them then.
09-26-2017 02:05 PM
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ken d Offline
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Post: #9
RE: So, how deep does this scandal go?
(09-26-2017 02:02 PM)GhentFan Wrote:  Will anything really happen as a result of this?

Smells like a too big to fail situation. Networks will put pressure on the NCAA to do nothing.

The problem is that this isn't an NCAA investigation. This is the FBI. I don't think they care about pressure from ESPN.
09-26-2017 02:05 PM
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Lord Stanley Offline
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RE: So, how deep does this scandal go?
I was not paid outside of an athletics scholarship in college.

I was however, illegally recruited to attend a certain high school when in 9th grade. The rot probably goes deep. High school, AAU (110% certain) and probably some camps as well.

It doesn't help that the NCAA rules can be hard to interpret, always applied unfairly (watch out East Carolina!) and change if not on yearly basis. For instance, one year I could work at a private deli for (I think) 20 hours per week. The next year I couldn't work at the deli, but could work in the Athletic department for 20 hours.

Who knows anymore?

Assume the worst, hope for the best and prioritize the APR and GPA over Ws and Ls so that the vast majority of these men and women graduate and go on to something greater in life than athletic competition.
09-26-2017 02:16 PM
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IWokeUpLikeThis Offline
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Post: #11
RE: So, how deep does this scandal go?
I have no doubt this Adidas scandal spans all the way back to when Eric Gordon (adidas player) dumped Illinois last second (after they spent nearly a whole year undefeated/#1) for Kelvin Sampson & Indiana (adidas school).
09-26-2017 02:18 PM
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The Cutter of Bish Offline
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RE: So, how deep does this scandal go?
I am really proud of my country when they go in for this. With the amount of money that moves around higher education, and how it gets to bypass taxation...bravo, FBI.

NCAA is going to get so burnt on this, too, you wait. People who will have heard things and didn't do a darn thing about it.
09-26-2017 02:19 PM
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IWokeUpLikeThis Offline
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RE: So, how deep does this scandal go?
(09-26-2017 02:19 PM)The Cutter of Bish Wrote:  I am really proud of my country when they go in for this. With the amount of money that moves around higher education, and how it gets to bypass taxation...bravo, FBI.

NCAA is going to get so burnt on this, too, you wait. People who will have heard things and didn't do a darn thing about it.
Yes! God bless the FBI. This is a great day for college hoops.
09-26-2017 02:22 PM
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AssyrianDuke Offline
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RE: So, how deep does this scandal go?
(09-26-2017 02:19 PM)The Cutter of Bish Wrote:  I am really proud of my country when they go in for this. With the amount of money that moves around higher education, and how it gets to bypass taxation...bravo, FBI.

NCAA is going to get so burnt on this, too, you wait. People who will have heard things and didn't do a darn thing about it.

Yeah, just like at Penn State, right? I certainly believe that heads should roll, but I have no faith that they will.
09-26-2017 02:39 PM
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The Cutter of Bish Offline
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RE: So, how deep does this scandal go?
(09-26-2017 02:39 PM)AssyrianDuke Wrote:  Yeah, just like at Penn State, right? I certainly believe that heads should roll, but I have no faith that they will.

It's a different game when the FBI turns its sites onto someone there. This doesn't become a NCAA circle j**k where it can try to commandeer the whole thing and then mess it all up purposefully so the entire body can still profit from the money factory programs.
09-26-2017 02:59 PM
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TripleA Offline
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RE: So, how deep does this scandal go?
I think this goes back about 25 years to when AAU ball got big, and the shoe companies started fighting each other.

I also think it definitely involves almost all 5 stars without family ties, and a good bunch of 4-stars, down to about the Top 100. The better ones get more money, but there are payoffs down the line a bit, in many cases, afaik.
09-26-2017 03:18 PM
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DaSaintFan Offline
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RE: So, how deep does this scandal go?
(09-26-2017 01:38 PM)BadgerMJ Wrote:  I also would be shocked if this DIDN'T cross over to football... For the exact same reasons.

I had the same thoughr Badger.. if this doesn't cross over to football, I will be surprised.. and assuming it does cross over...

That list of schools/coaches/players is going to be jaw dropping IMO.
(This post was last modified: 09-26-2017 03:31 PM by DaSaintFan.)
09-26-2017 03:31 PM
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ken d Offline
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RE: So, how deep does this scandal go?
In a quick google search, I find that both Kentucky and Duke - the kings of one and done - are both Nike schools. On page one of the Kentucky search is a recent (6/17) story where Bam Adebayo just signed a lucrative contract with Nike now that he has turned pro. Perhaps that's just a coincidence.

I already see a lot of posts suggesting that Rick Pitino and Bruce Pearl are now toast. The presumption is, of course, that how could they not know what is going on with their prized recruits.

I haven't yet heard anyone express concern that Coach Cal or Coach K could be in jeopardy. I guess the one and done kids they recruit don't need the money, and don't mind that their AAU teammates are getting paid and they aren't.

This story won't have much impact if it's just the Bruce Pearls of the basketball world that pay the price. But what if it touches the golden boys? What if it touches Coach K - or worse, what if it touches Nick Saban?
(This post was last modified: 09-26-2017 03:49 PM by ken d.)
09-26-2017 03:48 PM
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Hood-rich Offline
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Post: #19
RE: So, how deep does this scandal go?
(09-26-2017 01:11 PM)ken d Wrote:  I can't imagine there are any fans, coaches, administrators or athletes who ever believed that surreptitious payments to elite high school players were just rumors. Or, for that matter, cared very much that it was going on.

My question is this. How far down the list of star players do we have to go before we find players who are not getting paid? Is this just limited to five star athletes, or does it go much deeper?

Tough to say but I think the objective is to steer these kids towards future shoe deal loyalties. It's probably limited to the 4* and 5* recruits.

(09-26-2017 01:11 PM)ken d Wrote:  Look at the schools who have been charged so far. If you were making a list of schools who are signing the best players, would these seven schools be at the top of your list? And if the players those schools are signing are getting paid, can we assume the lottery pick players are not?

Looking at their recent (past 5 years or so) recruiting classes. Most of them are recruiting very well, especially Arizona and UL.

Arizona - 2018, 2017 classes are all 4* and 5*. 2016 class has two 4*and a 5* star. 2015 two 5*and two 4*.

UL - 2018 one 5*, one 4*; 2017 two 5*, three 4*; 2016 one 5*; 2015 three 4*; 2014 four 4*

Auburn - 2018 one 4*; 2017 two 4*; 2016 one 5* and two 4*; 2015
three 4*; 2014 two 4*

Okla State - 2018 one 4*; 2017 one 4*; 2015 two 4*; 2014 two 4*

USC - 2018 three 4*; 2017 two 4*; 2016 two 4*; 2015 two 4*; 2014 two 4*

Miami - 2017 one 5* and two 4*; 2016 two 4*; 2015 one 4*; 2014 two 4*; 2013 three 4*

(09-26-2017 01:11 PM)ken d Wrote:  And given that football drives the athletics bus, can we assume that this is a basketball issue only?

No way.

(09-26-2017 01:11 PM)ken d Wrote:  At some point, is it unreasonable to assume that the blue blood schools (and their coaches) who are signing the best players year after year might also be involved?

Absolutely.
09-26-2017 03:53 PM
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jrj84105 Offline
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Post: #20
RE: So, how deep does this scandal go?
This isn't just 4 and 5 stars; it's the majority of D1 recruits and the majority of schools.

One coach sounding off (I REALLY hope he stuck to his guns).
http://archive.sltrib.com/article.php?id...type=CMSID

"Did you know," Larry Krystkowiak asked in his Montana drawl, leaning over his lectern, "that there's a lot of cheating in college basketball?"

His earnest delivery prompted some chuckles among the audience of roughly 40 people. But Utah's men's basketball coach wasn't going to leave it hanging without telling a story. He asked two compliance officials if he could venture on.

The tale: He was once recruiting a top-level player, and the player (or his representatives) called Krystkowiak in the middle of the night. They told Krystkowiak the recruit's transcript would cost the Utes $50,000, and "it'll probably cost you $50,000 more to sign him."
09-26-2017 03:53 PM
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