MadEagle Wrote:I know alot of area high school coaches who all think Jeff Bower is a Stuck-up A$$ Hole.

Personally, I think Bower is a damn good coach.

However, if those rumors are true that he doesn't get along with area HS coaches, that is REALLY, REALLY bad news for USM.

From the quote above, there is a little "Nugget" that I have that would seem to back that up. He interviewed at TCU when Franchione left -- and from a very high official, straight out of his mouth, "it didn't go very well at all." From what this official said, Bower seemed to have a chip on his shoulder and seemed to be too arrogant for their tastes. (That being said, they came this close to sending the AD with a contract in hand to Hattiesburg to work out a deal.)

Lanny huh ? I hear you get most to all of your infomation from KC. Im sure you know who that is. And well we on EP get the same kinda of infomation on EP that you make people pay for on ET.

And I for one never said or claimed to be a expert on how Southern Miss recruits. I go with what people around the situation say to me. Instead of kissing all the people who works for So.Miss Azz to get more money for a website like you do boy.

Nugget's Ghost Wrote:There seems to be a whole USM message board that feels this should happen. Curious as to other opinions on this subject.
They claim he can't take USM to the next level and he can't recruit. He can't get along with local high school coaches. He can't hire a decent OC and fires them every two years. He can't win against BCS teams..etc...etc...etc.....

I really am serious about comments on this from our conference mates. Thanks.

Ghost, the message board to which you refer is not dedicated to anything. It is simply a message board. If there are more posters on that board who want Bower replaced than there are posters who want him to stay, it is not the fault or or the purpose of the message board. Other C-USA fans need to know that the message board is open and not censored except for porn, profanity, personal attacks, etc. The more frequently used message board is, however, biased. It is heavily censored and posters who do not please the USM Athletic Department and the head coach are blacklisted. Those who raise thoughtful and serious arguments about the direction of the football program are not allowed to post there. So USM has a neutral and open board and it has a biased and closed politically correct board. Your comment was unfair.

MongoSlade Wrote:

Nugget's Ghost Wrote:There seems to be a whole USM message board that feels this should happen.  Curious as to other opinions on this subject.
They claim he can't take USM to the next level and he can't recruit. He can't get along with local high school coaches. He can't hire a decent OC and fires them every two years. He can't win against BCS teams..etc...etc...etc.....

I really am serious about comments on this from our conference mates. Thanks.

What's the next level for Southern Miss...?

Southern Miss is right in the middle of SEC country, and whether Eagle fans like it or not, the best players are going the SEC (or other BCS school) route. If Eagle fans have expectations of landing BCS-quality talent, maybe its time for them to revisit said expectations...

The fact that we are in SEC country has only caused cowardice in recent years. USM fans used to relish the thought of showing up our SEC brethren while working to improve the program to the point that it could play with marquee teams on an equal footing. The cowardice set in when it was clear that the program was not improving, had stagnated, and had no strong, experienced leader.

Brick City Pirate Wrote:How long has Coach Bower been the head coach? What was your program like before he became head coach? I'd say stick it out & support the guy until you are 100% sure he can't get the job done.

Let's see...When Bower took over USM was coming off a season in which we defeated Alabama and Auburn at their place. Earned a spot in a bowl when bowl games meant something. Since Bower has been HC we have won no games against marquee opponents who finished the season with a winning record (both Bama and Auburn had winning records as mentioned above). Bower's only wins against marquee opponents have been when those programs were are their depths. Under Bower, programs that USM used to dominate have now surpassed us in recruiting and in big time wins. I'm not sure how long we should be required to hold on to him to prove to everybody that he cannot take us to the level of competition that we used to seek. But he's been here 15 years and we are not accomplishing on the field what we were accomplishing before he became HC.

eaglefever Wrote:

Nugget's Ghost Wrote:There seems to be a whole USM message board that feels this should happen.  Curious as to other opinions on this subject.
They claim he can't take USM to the next level and he can't recruit. He can't get along with local high school coaches. He can't hire a decent OC and fires them every two years. He can't win against BCS teams..etc...etc...etc.....

I really am serious about comments on this from our conference mates. Thanks.

Ghost, the message board to which you refer is not dedicated to anything. It is simply a message board. If there are more posters on that board who want Bower replaced than there are posters who want him to stay, it is not the fault or or the purpose of the message board. Other C-USA fans need to know that the message board is open and not censored except for porn, profanity, personal attacks, etc. The more frequently used message board is, however, biased. It is heavily censored and posters who do not please the USM Athletic Department and the head coach are blacklisted. Those who raise thoughtful and serious arguments about the direction of the football program are not allowed to post there. So USM has a neutral and open board and it has a biased and closed politically correct board. Your comment was unfair.

EP is a sewer.

Nugget's Ghost Wrote:[QUOTE=Nugget's Ghost,Dec 29 2004, 03:55 PM] EP is a sewer.

EP is just a message board. You're welcome to participate. What bothers you is that it is an open board, where serious discussions can take place. A sewer would be a severely censored board where USM fans are blacklisted for wanting the program to improve. A sewer would be a board that blacklists fans who follow the rules but do not toe the politically correct line. A sewer is a message board where a USM fan can be personally attacked and lied about and where when the attacked poster responds the owner erases the response and allows the lying attack to remain on the board. That's the kind of board you like. A board that will go to any lengths to prevent a serious discussion of USM athletics.

Not really Nugget I am sure you'd love EP if you came over and talked with us for awhile. Some of the best Southern Miss fans you'll ever meet is on at EP.

[QUOTE] Let's see...When Bower took over USM was coming off a season in which we defeated Alabama and Auburn at their place.[QUOTE]

Come on, let's give the "whole" story.

Let's look back to two years before Bower took over the program.....1989. First of all, we had Brett Favre. We had that "marquee" opening win over Florida State, but then rambled off 4 straight losses including an embarrassing home loss to Mississippi State! We went on to eventually lose to Louisiana-Laffayette and finish with a losing record that year. In 1990 we did beat Bama and Auburn.....very respectible. But, we lost to Mississippi State AGAIN! We finished with an 8-4 record and played in the All-American Bowl, but we still couldn't find our way into the A.P. final poll. After Coach Bower took the reigns, he quickly discovered that the coach before him (Curley Hallman) didn't know how to redshirt and left the team in shambles.....not to mention Hallman left us without a QB (since he couldn't recruit one...Favre was brought in during the Carmody era). Bower spent his first several years rebuilding and trying to get attendance back up. During Hallman's tenure before Bower, attendance averaged it's lowest for any coach that had been around since the expansion of the stadium.

Bower has done well in a system that keeps the "have-nots" down.

RowdyRoost Wrote:Bower has done well in a system that keeps the "have-nots" down.

amen to that

Quote:I'm not sure how long we should be required to hold on to him to prove to everybody that he cannot take us to the level of competition that we used to seek.

it doesnt matter who is coaching the eagles, our level of competition will be low as long we are in the "new" cusa, granted memphis, marshall and utep are good teams, but we are now stuck in conf with a bunch of teams that hurt us imo.

MadEagle Wrote:Lanny huh ? I hear you get most to all of your infomation from KC. Im sure you know who that is. And well we on EP get the same kinda of infomation on EP that you make people pay for on ET.

And I for one never said or claimed to be a expert on how Southern Miss recruits. I go with what people around the situation say to me. Instead of kissing all the people who works for So.Miss Azz to get more money for a website like you do boy.

Make no mistakes I do know who posts as Karl Childers, I consider him a friend. I am sure that he considers me a friend as well.

And like I said before, I don't get into petty arguements between the fas of the the two sites. Both sites serve a purpose, and you will find that many people post on both sites.

You seen to really dislike me for some reason, is it becaues I called you and and you have no answers? It's obvious that you know nothing about me or what I do......the only thing you know about me is what is said on EP. The vast majority of what is said is lies, but if they can live with that, so can I. I don't have to hide behind fake monikers. I've never hidden who I am and never will. To bad you can't say the same.

It would probably suprise you of how many friends I have that post on EP. Some of the people on EP who hate EagleTalk the most, are still friends of mine.

[quote="RowdyRoost"] [QUOTE] Let's see...When Bower took over USM was coming off a season in which we defeated Alabama and Auburn at their place.[QUOTE]

Come on, let's give the "whole" story.

Let's look back to two years before Bower took over the program.....1989. First of all, we had Brett Favre. We had that "marquee" opening win over Florida State, but then rambled off 4 straight losses including an embarrassing home loss to Mississippi State! We went on to eventually lose to Louisiana-Laffayette and finish with a losing record that year. In 1990 we did beat Bama and Auburn.....very respectible. But, we lost to Mississippi State AGAIN! We finished with an 8-4 record and played in the All-American Bowl, but we still couldn't find our way into the A.P. final poll. After Coach Bower took the reigns, he quickly discovered that the coach before him (Curley Hallman) didn't know how to redshirt and left the team in shambles.....not to mention Hallman left us without a QB (since he couldn't recruit one...Favre was brought in during the Carmody era). Bower spent his first several years rebuilding and trying to get attendance back up. During Hallman's tenure before Bower, attendance averaged it's lowest for any coach that had been around since the expansion of the stadium.

Bower has done well in a system that keeps the "have-nots" down. [/quote]
I told the whole story. You can diminish those accomplishements all you want, but the truth is Bower's teams have never played to the level of Hallman's teams. You say it was personnel, Favre etc., and that is just an excuse. In 15 years Bower has had the opportunity to recruit. If your excuse is that Bower can't recruit, you have just agreed that he needs to go. The whole story on the Miss St losses was that they put everything they had into winning those last two games against us. Losing either one of them meant Rockey Felker would be fired on Sunday. Beating us let him finish out the last season before getting the axe. I'd still take a repeat of that season over anything Bower has done. Anything. I'm not defending Hallman and I agree that he mis-handled the redshirt program. But that has NOTHING to do with Bower post 1993. And blaming it on the "system" is just self-defeating. If we don't want to play in the system, there's always NAIA. All you're good at is making excuses while being totally blind to the absolutely obvious problem.

This topic is so gay(nice to see ya back safety ).

Heck no you shouldn't fire Bower. If you really want to help Bower and your team get to the next level you need to stop scheduling 3 suicide OOC games every year. Look at the schedule of the "top" mid majors. They do not play Nebraska, Cal, and Alabama (in Tuscaloosa) every year and have a tough loss or two on national TV. They may play Miami, atm, and some other BCS school and then other mid majors and then run their conference. That is what Utah, Louisville and Boise St. did and they still get plenty of national hype.

A better OC would help as well.

The new C-USA should help you guys as well right off the bat on your schedule you have Memphis UAB and Marshall, three bowl teams.

EagleTalk Wrote:

MadEagle Wrote:Lanny huh ? I hear you get most to all of your infomation from KC. Im sure you know who that is. And well we on EP get the same kinda of infomation on EP that you make people pay for on ET.

And I for one never said or claimed to be a expert on how Southern Miss recruits. I go with what people around the situation say to me. Instead of kissing all the people who works for So.Miss Azz to get more money for a website like you do boy.

Make no mistakes I do know who posts as Karl Childers, I consider him a friend. I am sure that he considers me a friend as well.

And like I said before, I don't get into petty arguements between the fas of the the two sites. Both sites serve a purpose, and you will find that many people post on both sites.

You seen to really dislike me for some reason, is it becaues I called you and and you have no answers? It's obvious that you know nothing about me or what I do......the only thing you know about me is what is said on EP. The vast majority of what is said is lies, but if they can live with that, so can I. I don't have to hide behind fake monikers. I've never hidden who I am and never will. To bad you can't say the same.

It would probably suprise you of how many friends I have that post on EP. Some of the people on EP who hate EagleTalk the most, are still friends of mine.

I dislike you because you're dropping your Roost spot and taking a principled stand. Now there's nobody parking between me and BP.

You bum you...........

Rock I could care less if you like me love me or hate me. I dont have anything against any of you. And that includes Lanny and actually Lanny I do know you pretty well. And I do consider you a good friend I like to rile you up a little bit though. Or that was the purpose of my last post to you especially the "boy" part I had hoped that would give me away. My lady told me to tell you hello Lanny. LoL I think we all have something in common we all want the best for Southern Mississippi. And we all have our differnt views on it all. I never said in any of my post that I think we should FIRE BOWER. I really wish he'd make a better effort to get along with some of the area coaches. I do think its important he builds those realitonships. Thats my biggest gripe about Bower that and I think he needs to stop letten go of everyone of our offensive coordinators every two years. I think its bad for an offense to learn another guys system. I think bringing along Jay Johnson could've been a good thing that is if Jeff Bower lets him do his thing.

I don't post on ET or EP because both boards have jerk-offs that when you don't agree with their POV go off on a tangent cause they haven't been taking their meds on a regular basis.

Now having said that.......

There is a HUGE difference between the Hallman Error of the late 80's & now. There is more TV, Conference & Bowl $$ out there & for non-BCS teams it's evened the playing field between. Also some of these teams are spending tremendous ammounts of $$ just to try & catch us. Louisville has a $32 - $40million athletic budget. Memphis is paying their coach $800K but year in & out USM has a better chance of winning than anyone else in our league because of Jeff Bower.

Say what you want but 11 strait winning seasons is 11 strait winning seasons. There will be ups & downs & as fans you have to take the good with the bad. Also since the formation of CUSA in 1996 Bower has a 70-38 record & a .648 winning %.

Now as for Hallman beating "marquee" teams remember our incredible 10-2 season we only beat 4 teams w/winning records. Louisville (8-3), UTEP (10-3), Memphis (6-5) & LaLaf (6-5). Everyone else that year had a losing season. The 2 real teams FSU & Auburn both beat us. Then we were 5-6 (1 marquee win) followed by 8-4 (2 marquee wins). All before confernece expansion, BCS, about 10 - 12 (most of from the South taking talent away from us) more D1A teams & everything else in the world.

A friend of mine that I work with is a HUGE Alabama fan he even played for Bear Bryant, Jeff Bower came to his home & tried to recrit his son. He said that Bower was the only coach that he would of let his son go play for other than Gene Stallings & had he known Stallings was going to be foreced out he would have encouraged his son to go to USM rather than Bama. - That story told me more about Jeff Bower's chraricter than just about anything & probably changed my opinion of him som as well.

I've never been a HUGE JB fan. However until we have a sub .500 seasons or miss bowl games in back to back years I will continue to support the man even though I may disagree with the way he runs the team at times.

MadEagle Wrote:If Nugget reads from the "other" USM message board he knows that I am one of them who agree's that Jeff Bower can do better. I know alot of area high school coaches who all think Jeff Bower is a Stuck-up A$$ Hole. Hell Bobby Bowden just came to Hattiesburg and had dinner with alot of local coaches. How do you think that made our area High School coaches feel knowing Jeff is right down the road and did not even get invitation to come talk with them. I heard about a couple of recruits who wanted to play at So.Miss but Jeff would not recruit them nearly as hard as David Cutcliff or Bobby Bowden for that matter. They would come down and have lunch with the kids parents or something like that. The sad thing is Jeff Bower was closer to the kid and did not do any of this. We have 3 All-Americans within 60 miles of us and from what I hear we are not trying all that much at all to land none of them. That my friend is Sad. When you cant land All-Americans in your own backyard. WE want someone who would atleast will try and keep local talent home. And to stop firing our Offensive Coordinator every two years. That doesnt do anything but make our Unversity look bad.

Have you ever seen the recruiting budgets of the schools you mention compared to ours??? Does ONE of the guys you talk about WANT to play at USM???
Some of you guys think we are FSU..we're not! You are much like Ole Miss fans in a way. They think they are FSU too. And ANYONE who thinks the the BCS is not an attempt to "keep us down" is as blind as Stevie Wonder.
Given the contracts that have been signed recently with some of our conference brother programs, they could sign Bower for triple of what he makes at USM. And they might soon do just that.
Maybe you guys can single handingly bridge the gap in our budget.

GoGold,
The lack of recruiting funds lies directly at the feet of Bower. It is his responsibility to fire up the fans of the program and promote giving. Instead there aren't enough fans after 14 years of crappy offense to pay for a bus ride to Pascagoula.
No, I don't think we are at the level of FSU. but I remember when they wished they wished they were as good as us.

EagleFever said it alot better than I ever could..lol

Alright.....

Our fan base will never get really "fired up" (regardless of who our coach is) unless we go undefeated or if we find a way to bring an SEC team into the Rock every year. You think that if we beat Bama and Auburn the fans will go nuts and show up like never before! Well, Hallman was able to do that and during his tenure we had the lowest average attendance of any coach since the stadium was expanded.
You continue to grasp at straws with nothing to back up what you say. All you want is a new magical coach that can win 3 away "marquee games" a year on a 13 million dollar budget that doesn't cover adequate recruiting expenses. If you want to become "big time" then you must put up the money to become "big time". That's what Louisville is trying to do. That's what FSU did. The money must come first. Committment has been shown from Bower to our program that he wants us at the next level. Now the fans must ante up.