It amazes me the people who say we were "ok" under Fedora. F'n delusional. 12-2 (most wins in history of program), beat Top 10 Houston and won bowl game. Yes, we lost to two teams we shouldn't have but also beat a couple we could have lost. it's called football. Southern Miss was losing to teams they shouldn't have LONG before Fedora ever got here and that tradition has continued.

And inherited? he didn't inherit ****. True Freshman QB and a True Freshman 5 star wide receiver were f'n exciting to watch. He inherited a 7-6 team coming off a loss to Cincy in a bowl game that didn't finish in the Top 25. Please explain how he inherited something. Uh, Jeff Bower was let go for a reason. Usually when you replace a fired coach, you ain't inheriting crap.

We averaged the same record that Bower did from 08-10. 7-8 wins each. People weren't happy. Many questioned why we got rid of Bower in the first place. If I recall, there were lots of 'snake oil salesman', 'can't get them on campus', and 'hair gel' comments. But it's easy to remember the one year that a top S&C coach happened to come available and be desperate for a job, along with a DC that understood defense better than Brafor.

(09-11-2017 01:29 PM)HarborPointe Wrote:  

(09-11-2017 12:12 PM)BeagleUSM Wrote:  

(09-11-2017 11:51 AM)HarborPointe Wrote:  We'd all trade a body part for one awesome year right about now.

Beyond that, though, when Fedora was here, you could count the double-digit losses on one hand, maybe even with fingers left over.

Off the top of my head: Auburn 2008, Boise 2008, UAB 2009 (believe they scored a late TD to make it look worse than it was, would need to check box score), MTSU 2009, South Carolina 2010.

"Off the top of your head." Umm-hmm.

But yes, there aren't any fingers left over on that one hand over a 4-year span. As a point of comparison to another coach not named Ellis Johnson and who didn't inherit a train wreck, Hopson had 4 double-digit losses last year.

And some of those double digit losses were to teams that weren't even FBS (Old Dominion, Charlotte, and possibly UTSA) when Fedora was our coach.

(09-11-2017 01:45 PM)theheadeagle Wrote:  And inherited? he didn't inherit ****. True Freshman QB and a True Freshman 5 star wide receiver were f'n exciting to watch. He inherited a 7-6 team coming off a loss to Cincy in a bowl game that didn't finish in the Top 25. Please explain how he inherited something. Uh, Jeff Bower was let go for a reason. Usually when you replace a fired coach, you ain't inheriting crap.

If this was aimed at my comment, I just wasn't going to include Monken in that particular conversation because he had a ridiculously tough row to hoe coming in after Johnson. I totally agree Fedora took over a flawed program, but there's no comparing the situation in his 1st year to that of Monken's.

I know some on here may not agree with me but...

IMO, Fedora is the best coach we've ever had from the standpoint of recruiting, exciting the fan base, and winning games. Sure he wasn't a defensive genius, but there is not a member in here that wouldn't rehire him back, period! I can't seem to understand why some here seem to dispise the fact the fact that he was our coach! The man did exactly what he said he was going to do. Sure, we lost to UAB and Marshall...it sucks...but we also won CUSA by beating #6 Houston on the way to a 12-2 record.

If he would have stayed at USM instead of being hired by UNC, there is no telling what he could have done given more years at USM. Same goes of Monken! Only if we would have hired Monken the day Fedora left, he would have kept the ship sailing.

Todd Monken proved to be exceptional by bringing us out of the ship wreck of Ellis Johnson!

What amazes me even more is those that make Fedora a god because of one great year and the rest mediocre, and lost to UAM and Marshall both pitiful teams at the time...Oh well, maybe they liked his hair gell.

Fedora had the best season in USM history. 12-2, nationally ranked, a win over the #6 team in the country (an ass-whipping to be honest).

He also had the best season in UNC history. He had an historically average football program one half away from the 4-team college football playoff.

He didn't leave the cupboard dry either. Pappy Buttermilk went 0-12 with a team sprinkled with NFL talent, then the program collapsed.

(09-12-2017 12:43 AM)Jayesseagle Wrote:  I know some on here may not agree with me but...

IMO, Fedora is the best coach we've ever had from the standpoint of recruiting, exciting the fan base, and winning games. Sure he wasn't a defensive genius, but there is not a member in here that wouldn't rehire him back, period! I can't seem to understand why some here seem to dispise the fact the fact that he was our coach! The man did exactly what he said he was going to do. Sure, we lost to UAB and Marshall...it sucks...but we also won CUSA by beating #6 Houston on the way to a 12-2 record.

If he would have stayed at USM instead of being hired by UNC, there is no telling what he could have done given more years at USM. Same goes of Monken! Only if we would have hired Monken the day Fedora left, he would have kept the ship sailing.

Todd Monken proved to be exceptional by bringing us out of the ship wreck of Ellis Johnson!

THIS^^^^^

This is how I feel. The excitement under Fedora was palpable and he helped to generate it. Monken was no doubt a good coach but I'd still take Fedora over him. Amazing to me Fedora is being criticized for lack of defense after playing one of the most potent offenses in the country led by the Heisman Trophy winner. Just hilarious. Hell, I'll take a loss scoring 50 rather than lose 21-3 with ZERO excitement. The one thing I'll always remember about Fedora is I felt like we could win any game on the schedule even when we were losing I felt we could come back. Never felt like that with Bower and never really felt like that with Monken.

(09-12-2017 07:29 AM)nastybunch Wrote:  What amazes me even more is those that make Fedora a god because of one great year and the rest mediocre, and lost to UAM and Marshall both pitiful teams at the time...Oh well, maybe they liked his hair gell.

If you think those bad losses define him or our program, you haven't been paying attention for long. USM has a long history of losing to teams like that. If that would be your measuring stick, we've NEVER had a coach worth a ****. Bobby Collins whipped Florida state on national TV in the early 80s launching us into the Top 10 for the first time in history only to follow up with a horrible upset loss to dismal Louisville. Jeff Bower consistently lost to teams we shouldn't. Brett Favre and Co beat highly ranked Florida State in the early 90s on national tv launching us into the top 25 only to lose to lowly Miss St. the very next week at HOME. HORRIBLE. Fedora's loss to UAB costing us a potential Sugar Bowl bid was simply classic Southern Miss. But at least we still had an incredible season. Hell, after Favre and Co beat Florida State back in the day to only lose to State the next week....they went on to have a losing season that year. People forget that. Hell, at least Fedora went on to a 12-2 season beating a top 10 team to finish. USM has historically lost to teams we shouldn't and we still do. Bank on it this year because it's gonna happen.

(09-12-2017 12:26 AM)HarborPointe Wrote:  

(09-11-2017 01:45 PM)theheadeagle Wrote:  And inherited? he didn't inherit ****. True Freshman QB and a True Freshman 5 star wide receiver were f'n exciting to watch. He inherited a 7-6 team coming off a loss to Cincy in a bowl game that didn't finish in the Top 25. Please explain how he inherited something. Uh, Jeff Bower was let go for a reason. Usually when you replace a fired coach, you ain't inheriting crap.

If this was aimed at my comment, I just wasn't going to include Monken in that particular conversation because he had a ridiculously tough row to hoe coming in after Johnson. I totally agree Fedora took over a flawed program, but there's no comparing the situation in his 1st year to that of Monken's.

I agree with this. Monken definitely had a tougher job....MUCH TOUGHER.

(09-11-2017 01:40 PM)TheChosenOne Wrote:  

(09-11-2017 01:28 PM)shiftyeagle Wrote:  

(09-11-2017 01:15 PM)TTT Wrote:  

(09-11-2017 01:12 PM)EagleFWB Wrote:  I liked Fedora and he was no doubt what our program needed at that time. I'll always root for him. That being said, i'd rather have Monken back between the two of them. I loved that dude and his say whatever's on my mind attitude. I would loved to have seen what another three years of him being here would have done for our program.

Agree. I think Monken could've done much more than what Fedora did if he was hired instead of Fedora.

He would've done better than 12-2 and a national ranking?

brave words

Could be wrong but believe TTT was referring to the whole body of work not just one season. 12-2 season was special however it also had its bumps. Freaking Marshall and UAB?!? Fedora is an offsense genious but needs to put some emphasis on defense

Yes - body of work. I think Monken could've had multiple 10+ win seasons as well as division/conf. championships between '08-'11 IMO.

It appears that Monken's biggest weakness was recruiting. However, most of his recruiting was coming off garbage seasons, so that may be a bit unfair to him. I would have loved to have seen what he could have done with 3 or 4 solid recruiting classes.

(09-12-2017 10:09 AM)TTT Wrote:  

(09-11-2017 01:40 PM)TheChosenOne Wrote:  

(09-11-2017 01:28 PM)shiftyeagle Wrote:  

(09-11-2017 01:15 PM)TTT Wrote:  

(09-11-2017 01:12 PM)EagleFWB Wrote:  I liked Fedora and he was no doubt what our program needed at that time. I'll always root for him. That being said, i'd rather have Monken back between the two of them. I loved that dude and his say whatever's on my mind attitude. I would loved to have seen what another three years of him being here would have done for our program.

Agree. I think Monken could've done much more than what Fedora did if he was hired instead of Fedora.

He would've done better than 12-2 and a national ranking?

brave words

Could be wrong but believe TTT was referring to the whole body of work not just one season. 12-2 season was special however it also had its bumps. Freaking Marshall and UAB?!? Fedora is an offsense genious but needs to put some emphasis on defense

Yes - body of work. I think Monken could've had multiple 10+ win seasons as well as division/conf. championships between '08-'11 IMO.

Multiple 10 win seasons? You're f'n delusional. While Monken inherited a disaster, the conference was also much much weaker. We'll never know the answer to this. But Monken NEVER would have stirred the fan base like Fedora did, wasn't his personality. Fedora's personality is part of what made him good.

Monken never won a very weak ass CUSA title.....in year 4 maybe he would have but we'll never know. Christ all this hype about Monken and he had one winning season. One, with a capital O. Doesn't matter if he was rebuilding, we'll never know how good he may or may not have been. There's no way to judge it. He was 13-25 as head coach. Jeez. And I really liked Monken!! Really wish we could have seen him coach year 4.

(09-12-2017 11:02 AM)theheadeagle Wrote:  

(09-12-2017 10:09 AM)TTT Wrote:  

(09-11-2017 01:40 PM)TheChosenOne Wrote:  

(09-11-2017 01:28 PM)shiftyeagle Wrote:  

(09-11-2017 01:15 PM)TTT Wrote:  Agree. I think Monken could've done much more than what Fedora did if he was hired instead of Fedora.

He would've done better than 12-2 and a national ranking?

brave words

Could be wrong but believe TTT was referring to the whole body of work not just one season. 12-2 season was special however it also had its bumps. Freaking Marshall and UAB?!? Fedora is an offsense genious but needs to put some emphasis on defense

Yes - body of work. I think Monken could've had multiple 10+ win seasons as well as division/conf. championships between '08-'11 IMO.

Multiple 10 win seasons? You're f'n delusional. While Monken inherited a disaster, the conference was also much much weaker. We'll never know the answer to this. But Monken NEVER would have stirred the fan base like Fedora did, wasn't his personality. Fedora's personality is part of what made him good.

Monken never won a very weak ass CUSA title.....in year 4 maybe he would have but we'll never know. Christ all this hype about Monken and he had one winning season. One, with a capital O. Doesn't matter if he was rebuilding, we'll never know how good he may or may not have been. There's no way to judge it. He was 13-25 as head coach. Jeez. And I really liked Monken!! Really wish we could have seen him coach year 4.

Monken inherited a disaster...you just said so yourself. Also - it didn't matter how weak/bad our conference was...we had like 60 players on freaking scholarship due to the mass exodus of players during the Elloss-Johnson experience. Doesn't anyone remember this? We could've played in the MVC or the Big Sky conference in the '13-'14 seasons and still had losing seasons be/c of the low scholly #'s we had.

C'mon man, why is it "f'n delusional" to think that Monken would've won these games that Fedora couldn't:

56-50 loss @ Tulsa ('10)
49-50 loss vs. UAB ('10)
43-44 loss vs. ECU ('10)
43-50 loss @ Houston ('09)
40-45 loss @ Rice ('08)
37-40 loss vs. UTEP ('08)

(09-12-2017 02:53 PM)TTT Wrote:  

(09-12-2017 11:02 AM)theheadeagle Wrote:  

(09-12-2017 10:09 AM)TTT Wrote:  

(09-11-2017 01:40 PM)TheChosenOne Wrote:  

(09-11-2017 01:28 PM)shiftyeagle Wrote:  He would've done better than 12-2 and a national ranking?

brave words

Could be wrong but believe TTT was referring to the whole body of work not just one season. 12-2 season was special however it also had its bumps. Freaking Marshall and UAB?!? Fedora is an offsense genious but needs to put some emphasis on defense

Yes - body of work. I think Monken could've had multiple 10+ win seasons as well as division/conf. championships between '08-'11 IMO.

Multiple 10 win seasons? You're f'n delusional. While Monken inherited a disaster, the conference was also much much weaker. We'll never know the answer to this. But Monken NEVER would have stirred the fan base like Fedora did, wasn't his personality. Fedora's personality is part of what made him good.

Monken never won a very weak ass CUSA title.....in year 4 maybe he would have but we'll never know. Christ all this hype about Monken and he had one winning season. One, with a capital O. Doesn't matter if he was rebuilding, we'll never know how good he may or may not have been. There's no way to judge it. He was 13-25 as head coach. Jeez. And I really liked Monken!! Really wish we could have seen him coach year 4.

Monken inherited a disaster...you just said so yourself. Also - it didn't matter how weak/bad our conference was...we had like 60 players on freaking scholarship due to the mass exodus of players during the Elloss-Johnson experience. Doesn't anyone remember this? We could've played in the MVC or the Big Sky conference in the '13-'14 seasons and still had losing seasons be/c of the low scholly #'s we had.

C'mon man, why is it "f'n delusional" to think that Monken would've won these games that Fedora couldn't:

56-50 loss @ Tulsa ('10)
49-50 loss vs. UAB ('10)
43-44 loss vs. ECU ('10)
43-50 loss @ Houston ('09)
40-45 loss @ Rice ('08)
37-40 loss vs. UTEP ('08)

Because it's impossible to know. We'll NEVER know but expecting any coach for any team (that's not named Bama) in the country in any division of football to have multiple 10 win seasons is ridiculous. Monken could have gotten beat by double digits in every one of those games Fedora lost. We will NEVER know. All we can go by are the actual stats available. Hell, even in Monkens best year (his last) he lost to Marshall 31-10. We also beat Texas St. that year 56-50. If anything, the scores and results look eerily familiar to Fedoras. Maybe Fedora would have beaten the Hilltoppers in the CUSA champ game in '15. All speculation. There is one thing I'd bet my life on.....had Fedora not left for greener pastures there's no f'n way we go winless in 2012.

Believe it's safe to say both Monken and Fedora are solid coaches. Each different but solid. Monken was a no shat kinda guy. Fedora could build the fan base. Hate either left

(09-12-2017 03:10 PM)TheChosenOne Wrote:  Believe it's safe to say both Monken and Fedora are solid coaches. Each different but solid. Monken was a no shat kinda guy. Fedora could build the fan base. Hate either left

This

(09-12-2017 03:10 PM)TheChosenOne Wrote:  Believe it's safe to say both Monken and Fedora are solid coaches. Each different but solid. Monken was a no shat kinda guy. Fedora could build the fan base. Hate either left

Both left the program in better shape than they inherited it.

SOMETIMES coaching changes turn out fine when schools fire a fair to middling coach, or a good coach moves on, but most times it does NOT.

Most new coaches bring in their own system....while the players were recruited under a different system...and many times the results are not real positive!

While ELLLLLLLLLLLLOS is, of course, the bell cow of bad coaching hires, looks like ECU and WKU may have some lean years ahead! (but probably no 0-12, bottom 10 disasters)