AD raises possibility the 'Canes might not travel to Arkansas State for fear they cannot return to Miami in a prompt manner.

Seems an unlikely choice because people will question why Miami would stay in the path of a strong hurricane rather than some place dry, like the stadium they are scheduled to play in.

Of course could bus north and ride it out there.

http://caneswatch.blog.palmbeachpost.com...nse-storm/

(09-05-2017 12:34 PM)arkstfan Wrote:  AD raises possibility the 'Canes might not travel to Arkansas State for fear they cannot return to Miami in a prompt manner.

Seems an unlikely choice because people will question why Miami would stay in the path of a strong hurricane rather than some place dry, like the stadium they are scheduled to play in.

Of course could bus north and ride it out there.

http://caneswatch.blog.palmbeachpost.com...nse-storm/

But then you did scare the crap out of Nebraska and Mark Richt probably sees big advantages to postponing that game and eventually playing only 11. I think that Arkansas State folks might want to call Mark Emmert if this looks likely. The whole organization becomes moot if people can cancel willy nilly. That's why Sankey had to resolve the Florida / L.S.U. issue a year ago. After all conferences are scheduling organizations and the NCAA governs the whole structure.

A cancellation for spurious reasons leaves Arkansas State with damages. And this kind of behavior by Florida schools will eventually lead to nobody wanting to schedule them out of conference. After all August to November is usually the peak of Hurricane season and if that becomes an acceptable excuse it will be abused. Moving the location of a game is the proper way to go about it when you have appropriate lead time. Canceling a game in Arkansas because of a South Florida hurricane is absurd.

Right now the hurricane in question, Irma, is the second-strongest storm in recorded history for the Atlantic basin with max sustained winds of 185 mph. It almost certainly won't be that strong when it makes its approach to the U.S. coast, but there's almost no way that it won't be a very fearsome storm this weekend. It could be Andrew-esque, it could be a little better ... it could be a little worse.

They absolutely should play the game if at all possible, but it's also a reasonable concern that they find themselves stranded in Arkansas, or somewhere else, because South Florida looks like the site of a nuclear detonation and they can't get back.

(09-05-2017 01:31 PM)Cyniclone Wrote:  Right now the hurricane in question, Irma, is the second-strongest storm in recorded history for the Atlantic basin with max sustained winds of 185 mph. It almost certainly won't be that strong when it makes its approach to the U.S. coast, but there's almost no way that it won't be a very fearsome storm this weekend. It could be Andrew-esque, it could be a little better ... it could be a little worse.

They absolutely should play the game if at all possible, but it's also a reasonable concern that they find themselves stranded in Arkansas, or somewhere else, because South Florida looks like the site of a nuclear detonation and they can't get back.

You fly into Tampa, Orlando, or Jacksonville, or even Atlanta and take a bus ride right down I95, or over from Tampa and down I95. There's no excuse. And I remember Andrew and went through Camille. And, wind damage and spin off tornadoes still won't be the issue that storm surge will be. If it is that disastrous they are better off not being there.

That said the satellite view of Irma's double eye wall this morning was quite impressive.

(09-05-2017 01:40 PM)JRsec Wrote:  

(09-05-2017 01:31 PM)Cyniclone Wrote:  Right now the hurricane in question, Irma, is the second-strongest storm in recorded history for the Atlantic basin with max sustained winds of 185 mph. It almost certainly won't be that strong when it makes its approach to the U.S. coast, but there's almost no way that it won't be a very fearsome storm this weekend. It could be Andrew-esque, it could be a little better ... it could be a little worse.

They absolutely should play the game if at all possible, but it's also a reasonable concern that they find themselves stranded in Arkansas, or somewhere else, because South Florida looks like the site of a nuclear detonation and they can't get back.

You fly into Tampa, Orlando, or Jacksonville, or even Atlanta and take a bus ride right down I95, or over from Tampa and down I95. There's no excuse. And I remember Andrew and went through Camille. And, wind damage and spin off tornadoes still won't be the issue that storm surge will be. If it is that disastrous they are better off not being there.

That said the satellite view of Irma's double eye wall this morning was quite impressive.

Cat 5 with sustained 185mph winds.....thats one scary eye wall.

This is potentially one hell ***** of a storm.

If it turns toward south Florida, Miami football is leaving one way or the other. Either flying to play a game or bussing north to safety.

Question really becomes do you wait it out in Jonesboro or Memphis or fly to Tampa or Orlando and wait and bus from there after playing? Or do you not play and bus to Tampa or Orlando to wait? They've already paid for a flight and have rooms in Memphis for Friday night.

If adequate housing is available in Jonesboro, they'd be treated like kings by the community if they have to stay over and I suspect that people in Memphis would be very hospitable as well.

There is no reason for Miami not to play this game.

(09-05-2017 02:57 PM)arkstfan Wrote:  This is potentially one hell ***** of a storm.

If it turns toward south Florida, Miami football is leaving one way or the other. Either flying to play a game or bussing north to safety.

Question really becomes do you wait it out in Jonesboro or Memphis or fly to Tampa or Orlando and wait and bus from there after playing? Or do you not play and bus to Tampa or Orlando to wait? They've already paid for a flight and have rooms in Memphis for Friday night.

If adequate housing is available in Jonesboro, they'd be treated like kings by the community if they have to stay over and I suspect that people in Memphis would be very hospitable as well.

If some of the computer model projections verify, then they need to get out of Florida period, because it could easily go up the spine of the peninsula, and everyone east of Pensacola gets splattered.

The other thing to consider, although not to the same degree, is that perhaps asking a team whose home might be getting torn to shreds to play a football game while it's happening may not be ideal. Obviously at that point it's not a matter of playing in unsafe conditions, but it's still something to at least acknowledge. I wonder, for example, if Lamar should have played its game even though it wasn't on their water-logged campus. Gotta be hard to keep your head in the game with that on your mind.

They still should play the game if possible, but there are other considerations that factor in.

(09-05-2017 03:25 PM)Big Frog II Wrote:  There is no reason for Miami not to play this game.

Plus their players lose a game worth of eligibility and a game worth of stats. That should make them feel better.

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(09-05-2017 03:29 PM)Cyniclone Wrote:  

(09-05-2017 02:57 PM)arkstfan Wrote:  This is potentially one hell ***** of a storm.

If it turns toward south Florida, Miami football is leaving one way or the other. Either flying to play a game or bussing north to safety.

Question really becomes do you wait it out in Jonesboro or Memphis or fly to Tampa or Orlando and wait and bus from there after playing? Or do you not play and bus to Tampa or Orlando to wait? They've already paid for a flight and have rooms in Memphis for Friday night.

If adequate housing is available in Jonesboro, they'd be treated like kings by the community if they have to stay over and I suspect that people in Memphis would be very hospitable as well.

If some of the computer model projections verify, then they need to get out of Florida period, because it could easily go up the spine of the peninsula, and everyone east of Pensacola gets splattered.

The other thing to consider, although not to the same degree, is that perhaps asking a team whose home might be getting torn to shreds to play a football game while it's happening may not be ideal. Obviously at that point it's not a matter of playing in unsafe conditions, but it's still something to at least acknowledge. I wonder, for example, if Lamar should have played its game even though it wasn't on their water-logged campus. Gotta be hard to keep your head in the game with that on your mind.

They still should play the game if possible, but there are other considerations that factor in.

There is no easy/simple solution, but I can't imagine sitting in a hotel room watching CNN or Weather Channel covering the city potentially getting swamped is the best choice.

If they relocate anywhere easily reached by bus, they are taking up hotel rooms that other evacuees would be in, at a time when they have an aircraft booked and rooms reserved 1000 miles away. If their air charter is based in the Miami area, bet they have no issues with getting their seven figure investment in the air and out of the area early.

If a hurricane is coming to Florida doesn't it make sense for them to leave and go to an inland state where they are safe from the storm? Wait, Jonesboro, AR is an inland state!

Play the game and stop making excuses. Trying to use the weather to avoid playing on the road against a competent G5 is cowardly. Don't know the details but I venture to say the the Redwolves probably had to agree to a 2 for 1 to get the Canes to come to their place and have marketed the game to casual fans and as an incentive for season ticket sales. Don't rob them of that.

(09-05-2017 04:37 PM)Fighting Muskie Wrote:  If a hurricane is coming to Florida doesn't it make sense for them to leave and go to an inland state where they are safe from the storm? Wait, Jonesboro, AR is an inland state!

Play the game and stop making excuses. Trying to use the weather to avoid playing on the road against a competent G5 is cowardly. Don't know the details but I venture to say the the Redwolves probably had to agree to a 2 for 1 to get the Canes to come to their place and have marketed the game to casual fans and as an incentive for season ticket sales. Don't rob them of that.

Straight home and home. Went there in 2014.

(09-05-2017 04:37 PM)Fighting Muskie Wrote:  If a hurricane is coming to Florida doesn't it make sense for them to leave and go to an inland state where they are safe from the storm? Wait, Jonesboro, AR is an inland state!

Play the game and stop making excuses. Trying to use the weather to avoid playing on the road against a competent G5 is cowardly. Don't know the details but I venture to say the the Redwolves probably had to agree to a 2 for 1 to get the Canes to come to their place and have marketed the game to casual fans and as an incentive for season ticket sales. Don't rob them of that.

This is not about safety.

But there is a contract, and they can buy it out for whatever reason they want.

Schools may have to think twice about scheduling schools that do this sort of thing lightly though.

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Suck it up Miami and go to Jonesboro! You made your bed (contract), now deal with it.

(09-05-2017 04:52 PM)ark30inf Wrote:  

(09-05-2017 04:37 PM)Fighting Muskie Wrote:  If a hurricane is coming to Florida doesn't it make sense for them to leave and go to an inland state where they are safe from the storm? Wait, Jonesboro, AR is an inland state!

Play the game and stop making excuses. Trying to use the weather to avoid playing on the road against a competent G5 is cowardly. Don't know the details but I venture to say the the Redwolves probably had to agree to a 2 for 1 to get the Canes to come to their place and have marketed the game to casual fans and as an incentive for season ticket sales. Don't rob them of that.

This is not about safety.

But there is a contract, and they can buy it out for whatever reason they want.

Schools may have to think twice about scheduling schools that do this sort of thing lightly though.

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To be sure, there's a 99.9% chance that there's a force majeure clause in the contract which absolves either party of liability for reasons outside of their reasonable control (and extreme weather like a hurricane is basically what these clauses are written to cover). Assuming that there's a force majeure clause (and I'd be shocked if it isn't there because it's a boilerplate clause in virtually every contract that you see anywhere in any context), there might be a fight about what's actually under Miami's control (e.g. whether the inability to return to Miami after the game is played is enough), but it's far from assured that a buyout clause would apply. A hurricane is the *epitome* of the application of a force majeure clause (as anyone that has had to suspend business in Houston over the past couple of weeks can attest to) - it's what I actually have always used as a real life example of when that clause is used when I need to explain its meaning.

(09-05-2017 06:06 PM)Frank the Tank Wrote:  

(09-05-2017 04:52 PM)ark30inf Wrote:  

(09-05-2017 04:37 PM)Fighting Muskie Wrote:  If a hurricane is coming to Florida doesn't it make sense for them to leave and go to an inland state where they are safe from the storm? Wait, Jonesboro, AR is an inland state!

Play the game and stop making excuses. Trying to use the weather to avoid playing on the road against a competent G5 is cowardly. Don't know the details but I venture to say the the Redwolves probably had to agree to a 2 for 1 to get the Canes to come to their place and have marketed the game to casual fans and as an incentive for season ticket sales. Don't rob them of that.

This is not about safety.

But there is a contract, and they can buy it out for whatever reason they want.

Schools may have to think twice about scheduling schools that do this sort of thing lightly though.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

To be sure, there's a 99.9% chance that there's a force majeure clause in the contract which absolves either party of liability for reasons outside of their reasonable control (and extreme weather like a hurricane is basically what these clauses are written to cover). Assuming that there's a force majeure clause (and I'd be shocked if it isn't there because it's a boilerplate clause in virtually every contract that you see anywhere in any context), there might be a fight about what's actually under Miami's control (e.g. whether the inability to return to Miami after the game is played is enough), but it's far from assured that a buyout clause would apply. A hurricane is the *epitome* of the application of a force majeure clause (as anyone that has had to suspend business in Houston over the past couple of weeks can attest to) - it's what I actually have always used as a real life example of when that clause is used when I need to explain its meaning.

Sure, they will be able to get out of it. But other schools will need to pay attention to how they handle it and take it into account in future contracts.

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(09-05-2017 06:34 PM)ark30inf Wrote:  

(09-05-2017 06:06 PM)Frank the Tank Wrote:  

(09-05-2017 04:52 PM)ark30inf Wrote:  

(09-05-2017 04:37 PM)Fighting Muskie Wrote:  If a hurricane is coming to Florida doesn't it make sense for them to leave and go to an inland state where they are safe from the storm? Wait, Jonesboro, AR is an inland state!

Play the game and stop making excuses. Trying to use the weather to avoid playing on the road against a competent G5 is cowardly. Don't know the details but I venture to say the the Redwolves probably had to agree to a 2 for 1 to get the Canes to come to their place and have marketed the game to casual fans and as an incentive for season ticket sales. Don't rob them of that.

This is not about safety.

But there is a contract, and they can buy it out for whatever reason they want.

Schools may have to think twice about scheduling schools that do this sort of thing lightly though.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

To be sure, there's a 99.9% chance that there's a force majeure clause in the contract which absolves either party of liability for reasons outside of their reasonable control (and extreme weather like a hurricane is basically what these clauses are written to cover). Assuming that there's a force majeure clause (and I'd be shocked if it isn't there because it's a boilerplate clause in virtually every contract that you see anywhere in any context), there might be a fight about what's actually under Miami's control (e.g. whether the inability to return to Miami after the game is played is enough), but it's far from assured that a buyout clause would apply. A hurricane is the *epitome* of the application of a force majeure clause (as anyone that has had to suspend business in Houston over the past couple of weeks can attest to) - it's what I actually have always used as a real life example of when that clause is used when I need to explain its meaning.

Sure, they will be able to get out of it. But other schools will need to pay attention to how they handle it and take it into account in future contracts.

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Understood, although in my experience, virtually no one argues over the force majeure clause. It's about as non-controversial of a legal term as which addresses need to be used for legal notices. It is just a really difficult issue to die in the ditch on compared to many other much more important factors in your typical agreement. One could argue that schools playing Florida-based teams or other schools in hurricane-prone areas ought to push back more on those types of clauses, but by the same token, there's no real reason for any Florida-based school to *ever* relent on those clauses on the flip side.

(09-05-2017 06:06 PM)Frank the Tank Wrote:  

(09-05-2017 04:52 PM)ark30inf Wrote:  

(09-05-2017 04:37 PM)Fighting Muskie Wrote:  If a hurricane is coming to Florida doesn't it make sense for them to leave and go to an inland state where they are safe from the storm? Wait, Jonesboro, AR is an inland state!

Play the game and stop making excuses. Trying to use the weather to avoid playing on the road against a competent G5 is cowardly. Don't know the details but I venture to say the the Redwolves probably had to agree to a 2 for 1 to get the Canes to come to their place and have marketed the game to casual fans and as an incentive for season ticket sales. Don't rob them of that.

This is not about safety.

But there is a contract, and they can buy it out for whatever reason they want.

Schools may have to think twice about scheduling schools that do this sort of thing lightly though.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

To be sure, there's a 99.9% chance that there's a force majeure clause in the contract which absolves either party of liability for reasons outside of their reasonable control (and extreme weather like a hurricane is basically what these clauses are written to cover). Assuming that there's a force majeure clause (and I'd be shocked if it isn't there because it's a boilerplate clause in virtually every contract that you see anywhere in any context), there might be a fight about what's actually under Miami's control (e.g. whether the inability to return to Miami after the game is played is enough), but it's far from assured that a buyout clause would apply. A hurricane is the *epitome* of the application of a force majeure clause (as anyone that has had to suspend business in Houston over the past couple of weeks can attest to) - it's what I actually have always used as a real life example of when that clause is used when I need to explain its meaning.

Strangely this is the one game contract I can't find a copy of.
Looking through other contracts, typical language is
"should an unforeseen event occur outside the control of either party which makes it impossible to play the Athletic Competition".

A few say "impossible or impractical"

EDIT
Miami contract says "impossible" to play

So what happens when one side, the P5 visiting team we got their home game and revenue back in 2014, says the weather is too bad but the G5 host who is going to make zero revenue because their opponent bailed and now has to refund a bunch of tickets says it makes sense that the game go on so the visiting team is out of the path of the storm?

It seems to me that if a visiting team decides to cancel due to weather they either owe the home team some cash or a make up date either later in the season or a future year.

(09-05-2017 03:29 PM)Cyniclone Wrote:  The other thing to consider, although not to the same degree, is that perhaps asking a team whose home might be getting torn to shreds to play a football game while it's happening may not be ideal. Obviously at that point it's not a matter of playing in unsafe conditions, but it's still something to at least acknowledge. I wonder, for example, if Lamar should have played its game even though it wasn't on their water-logged campus. Gotta be hard to keep your head in the game with that on your mind.

We can't even accurately predict where a hurricane is going much less what damage it will leave behind. Knowing what we know about now about Harvey, I could not blame Houston if they had decided to postpone, or even cancel, a game so the players and staff be with their families.