http://www.ncaa.org/sites/default/files/...170615.pdf

Here's the actual NCAA report that strips the Cardinal of the 2013 title.

Holy smokes.

in the long term- the big thing is no additional post season ban.

...and yet they can't do anything to UNC .... Riddle me that Batman.

(06-15-2017 10:31 AM)PirateTreasureNC Wrote:  ...and yet they can't do anything to UNC .... Riddle me that Batman.

UNC is using the Cardinal Richelieu defense. They're merely trying to string this out.

(06-15-2017 10:26 AM)stever20 Wrote:  in the long term- the big thing is no additional post season ban.

Got off light. They gave them the more lenient prior penalty structure.

Good thing Louisville joined the ACC. If they were still in the AAC, they'd have gotten the death penalty

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Deep in that NCAA release: Louisville argued its penalties should be downgraded because the sex acts/stripteases weren't worth all that much

Question, does the stripping of wins vacate conference Tournament Credits? Logically, you think it should but NCAA and logic rarely go together. Also, it appears if it does strip the Tourney Credits. Those credits belong to the AAC not the ACC. So the AAC gets screwed and Louisville still reaps the money from the ACC. Does anyone know the precident or answer about the credits when wins are stripped/vacated?

(06-15-2017 12:40 PM)SuperFlyBCat Wrote:  Luke Winn‏Verified account
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Deep in that NCAA release: Louisville argued its penalties should be downgraded because the sex acts/stripteases weren't worth all that much

If I were one of the strippers, I'd file a defamation of character suit against the University of Louisville. I'd then Offer the judge a lap Dance to prove my case.

I saw where UofL is forfeiting certain Conference distributions, so in effect, they are forfeiting tournament credits.

(06-15-2017 12:56 PM)msm96wolf Wrote:  Question, does the stripping of wins vacate conference Tournament Credits? Logically, you think it should but NCAA and logic rarely go together. Also, it appears if it does strip the Tourney Credits. Those credits belong to the AAC not the ACC. So the AAC gets screwed and Louisville still reaps the money from the ACC. Does anyone know the precident or answer about the credits when wins are stripped/vacated?

The AAC could use the money-- particularly UC, UConn and USF who were the schools that shared a conference with UofL.

(06-15-2017 01:11 PM)CliftonAve Wrote:  

(06-15-2017 12:56 PM)msm96wolf Wrote:  Question, does the stripping of wins vacate conference Tournament Credits? Logically, you think it should but NCAA and logic rarely go together. Also, it appears if it does strip the Tourney Credits. Those credits belong to the AAC not the ACC. So the AAC gets screwed and Louisville still reaps the money from the ACC. Does anyone know the precident or answer about the credits when wins are stripped/vacated?

The AAC could use the money-- particularly UC, UConn and USF who were the schools that shared a conference with UofL.

it's not just that. would also include the 2014 season which had 8 current programs(all but Tulane, ECU, Tulsa, and obviously Wichita).

From CBSSPORTS:

A $5,000 fine (self-imposed by the university). The university must also return to the NCAA the money received through conference revenue sharing for its appearances in the 2012, 2013, 2014 and 2015 NCAA Division I Men's Basketball Championships. Future revenue distributions that are scheduled to be provided to the university from those tournaments also must be withheld by the conference and forfeited to the NCAA. It seems like 2012 & 23 hits the AAC and the 2014 and 15 impacts the ACC. Does anyone else read it that way?

(06-15-2017 12:56 PM)msm96wolf Wrote:  Question, does the stripping of wins vacate conference Tournament Credits? Logically, you think it should but NCAA and logic rarely go together. Also, it appears if it does strip the Tourney Credits. Those credits belong to the AAC not the ACC. So the AAC gets screwed and Louisville still reaps the money from the ACC. Does anyone know the precident or answer about the credits when wins are stripped/vacated?

if it was done properly (it is the NCAA so that is in question) the money would be distributed to the conference, the conference would distribute it how they were going to and then Louisville would pay the NCAA back the part that represents their credits amount

so for the AAC that would mean they get the money, split it up to their members (with some getting more because of being there during the BE years) and then Louisville would pay back the NCAA the amount equal to their credits

but knowing the NCAA it might be how you think it could be and that is the NCAA just mails a smaller check and it is up to the conference to figure it out

and it looks like they will lose the 6 years that come from 2015 so that means they will lose some while in the ACC

I suppose one could TRY and argue that because the infractions happened while in the BE/AAC that is where the punishment goes, but of course that ignores that Louisville crapped the bed and then ran off elsewhere

I wonder if the agreement for leaving the conference (or any conference) covers issues like this and what happens if in the future infractions come to light that result in a loss of revenue "to the conference" and that former member is not longer around to feel the pain of that by the conference simply giving them less money

and if not it would be interesting to see of the AAC attempts to get that money from Louisville based on them breaking agreements they were a party to while in the conference

(06-15-2017 01:17 PM)TodgeRodge Wrote:  

(06-15-2017 12:56 PM)msm96wolf Wrote:  Question, does the stripping of wins vacate conference Tournament Credits? Logically, you think it should but NCAA and logic rarely go together. Also, it appears if it does strip the Tourney Credits. Those credits belong to the AAC not the ACC. So the AAC gets screwed and Louisville still reaps the money from the ACC. Does anyone know the precident or answer about the credits when wins are stripped/vacated?

if it was done properly (it is the NCAA so that is in question) the money would be distributed to the conference, the conference would distribute it how they were going to and then Louisville would pay the NCAA back the part that represents their credits amount

so for the AAC that would mean they get the money, split it up to their members (with some getting more because of being there during the BE years) and then Louisville would pay back the NCAA the amount equal to their credits

but knowing the NCAA it might be how you think it could be and that is the NCAA just mails a smaller check and it is up to the conference to figure it out

and it looks like they will lose the 6 years that come from 2015 so that means they will lose some while in the ACC

Six years of conference tourney revenue from Louisville could mean several hundred thousands of dollars (my cursory math is estimating $400-600K) if this article from Forbes is to be believed.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/chrissmith/...f2cff32b05

(06-15-2017 01:27 PM)CliftonAve Wrote:  

(06-15-2017 01:17 PM)TodgeRodge Wrote:  

(06-15-2017 12:56 PM)msm96wolf Wrote:  Question, does the stripping of wins vacate conference Tournament Credits? Logically, you think it should but NCAA and logic rarely go together. Also, it appears if it does strip the Tourney Credits. Those credits belong to the AAC not the ACC. So the AAC gets screwed and Louisville still reaps the money from the ACC. Does anyone know the precident or answer about the credits when wins are stripped/vacated?

if it was done properly (it is the NCAA so that is in question) the money would be distributed to the conference, the conference would distribute it how they were going to and then Louisville would pay the NCAA back the part that represents their credits amount

so for the AAC that would mean they get the money, split it up to their members (with some getting more because of being there during the BE years) and then Louisville would pay back the NCAA the amount equal to their credits

but knowing the NCAA it might be how you think it could be and that is the NCAA just mails a smaller check and it is up to the conference to figure it out

and it looks like they will lose the 6 years that come from 2015 so that means they will lose some while in the ACC

Six years of conference tourney revenue from Louisville could mean several hundred thousands of dollars (my cursory math is estimating $400-600K) if this article from Forbes is to be believed.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/chrissmith/...f2cff32b05

it is actually probably more like millions and millions

(06-15-2017 01:23 PM)TodgeRodge Wrote:  I suppose one could TRY and argue that because the infractions happened while in the BE/AAC that is where the punishment goes, but of course that ignores that Louisville crapped the bed and then ran off elsewhere

I wonder if the agreement for leaving the conference (or any conference) covers issues like this and what happens if in the future infractions come to light that result in a loss of revenue "to the conference" and that former member is not longer around to feel the pain of that by the conference simply giving them less money

and if not it would be interesting to see of the AAC attempts to get that money from Louisville based on them breaking agreements they were a party to while in the conference

Yes but the hit to the ACC would be minimal even though it may be more money than it would be for the AAC. ACC has the TV contract money where the AAC does not but you have to imagine the ACC will say we got 2014 and 15 but we are not responsible for 12 & 13, those are AAC units. It does seem the NCAA just reduces the payments to both conferences. You have to figure, it would cost the AAC more in legal fees than whatever they could get in court. Also, I guess the question would come down to when UCONN was on probation, did they lose tournament credits and how did the league handle that. To that I have no clue.

(06-15-2017 01:34 PM)msm96wolf Wrote:  

(06-15-2017 01:23 PM)TodgeRodge Wrote:  I suppose one could TRY and argue that because the infractions happened while in the BE/AAC that is where the punishment goes, but of course that ignores that Louisville crapped the bed and then ran off elsewhere

I wonder if the agreement for leaving the conference (or any conference) covers issues like this and what happens if in the future infractions come to light that result in a loss of revenue "to the conference" and that former member is not longer around to feel the pain of that by the conference simply giving them less money

and if not it would be interesting to see of the AAC attempts to get that money from Louisville based on them breaking agreements they were a party to while in the conference

Yes but the hit to the ACC would be minimal even though it may be more money than it would be for the AAC. ACC has the TV contract money where the AAC does not but you have to imagine the ACC will say we got 2014 and 15 but we are not responsible for 12 & 13, those are AAC units. It does seem the NCAA just reduces the payments to both conferences. You have to figure, it would cost the AAC more in legal fees than whatever they could get in court. Also, I guess the question would come down to when UCONN was on probation, did they lose tournament credits and how did the league handle that. To that I have no clue.

there is no chance in hell the ACC is just going to get whatever money they get from the NCAA and divide it up by 15 ways

they are going to get the money they get and divide it up with Louisville getting the money taken from them and I would not be surprised if the conference did not figure out what the distribution would be if Louisville was not having money withheld and pay the other 14 that and take the difference out of the total conference distribution for Louisville

so if the total money that the ACC was going to get was $2.5 million per team X 15 teams or $37,500,000

and Louisville was responsible for $5,000,000 of that

instead of the conference saying well now we are getting $32,500,000 and we will divide that by 14 and all get $2,321,428 and Louisville you get nothing

the conference would instead say well we all get $2.5 million dollars and Louisville you get nothing for NCAA credits and you owe us $2.5 million from other conference monies so that the rest of us still get $2.5 million instead of $2,321,428 million