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For those proponents of alcohol at Cary Zable
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hktribefan Offline
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Post: #21
RE: For those proponents of alcohol at Cary Zable
I'll start this off by saying I agree we should sell alcohol.

I did a little math because I was curious as to what the amount would be at a place like WM. OSU played 7 home games, with an average attendance of 107,494. Throw out box seats because they get free booze, throw out anyone under 21, and the fact that a lot of people won't pay for alcohol at a stadium. I'll take a stab and say 30% of people bought alcohol, and let's say the average person bought 2 beverages (I figure if you're going to buy a drink at a stadium and pay that price, you're the kind of person with the means/alcoholic appetite for at least two beverages). $1.35 million is $192,857 per game, 30% of the average attendance is 32,248, meaning 64,496 beverages paid for. That works out to a profit of $3 per beverage.

We had five home games with an average attendance of 8236. Applying the same 30% ratio, that's 2471 people who consume 4942 beverages. At $3 profit per beverage we're making $14,826 per game, or $74,130 per year. It's not $1.35 million, but its not small change either. For a program of our size, $75,000 is good money. When you figure the only cost to this is buying whatever equipment you need to serve (which can't be THAT expensive) since you already have people working the concession booths, it can be basically straight profit. It also enhances the gameday experience a bit, and maybe helps keep people from dipping out mid-way through the game (winning helps do that too, but beer doesn't hurt).

Now, NJ....the REAL question is does Purdue sell alcohol at their games? =)
12-11-2017 12:38 PM
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Rocco Offline
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Post: #22
RE: For those proponents of alcohol at Cary Zable
http://www.dispatch.com/news/20171210/oh...35-million

"Down the road in Athens, Ohio University raked in more than $66,000 in gross beer sales this season in its first year of expanded sales at Bobcats football games. That netted the university $23,100 for its general athletics fund, per the revenue-sharing contract the university has with AVI Foodsystems Inc., according to Ohio University spokeswoman Carly Leatherwood."

Ohio drew ~130k in attendance this season. W&M drew around 41k. Scale the numbers and assume prices, consumption etc. remains equal and W&M would pull in around $7k, which is useful but not exactly a game changer.
12-11-2017 12:41 PM
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nj alum Offline
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Post: #23
RE: For those proponents of alcohol at Cary Zable
Unless I'm missing something (and I have zero business background and rudimentary math skills), I think the folks in Athens could learn something form the folks in Columbus on how to turn a profit.

Multiply the Athens attendance by 10 (greater than Buckeye attendance), and multiply the Athens profit by 10 ... Athens would still only generate about 10% of the Buckeye profit.
12-11-2017 05:50 PM
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nj alum Offline
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Post: #24
RE: For those proponents of alcohol at Cary Zable
(12-11-2017 12:38 PM)hktribefan Wrote:  I'll start this off by saying I agree we should sell alcohol.

Now, NJ....the REAL question is does Purdue sell alcohol at their games? =)

See Post #1 of this thread.

:-)
12-11-2017 05:53 PM
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Zorch Offline
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Post: #25
RE: For those proponents of alcohol at Cary Zable
(12-11-2017 12:38 PM)hktribefan Wrote:  that's 2471 people who consume 4942 beverages.

Keep in mind that those folks were probably already consuming 4942 other beverages (at high prices although likely not as expensive as beer) so you would need to subtract that amount.
12-11-2017 10:59 PM
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bubbadog57 Offline
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Post: #26
RE: For those proponents of alcohol at Cary Zable
I can easily survive three hours of football without a beer....although I will admit that a couple of our home games last fall might easily drive a man to drink!
12-12-2017 06:53 AM
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mrjoolius Online
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Post: #27
RE: For those proponents of alcohol at Cary Zable
What is the downside of offering beer at Zable? It's not a matter of needing or not needing a beer. Sure, there could be an uptick in public drunkenness, but doubtful at stadium pricing. Even if profits are small because of distributor costs and smaller crowds - it's still a profit. Anheiser Busch partners with the college on other things. Why not a good deal on beer? William and mary athletics are in no position to turn down any viable revenue sources.
(This post was last modified: 12-12-2017 07:10 AM by mrjoolius.)
12-12-2017 07:07 AM
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LeadBolt Offline
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Post: #28
RE: For those proponents of alcohol at Cary Zable
(12-12-2017 07:07 AM)mrjoolius Wrote:  What is the downside of offering beer at Zable? It's not a matter of needing or not needing a beer. Sure, there could be an uptick in public drunkenness, but doubtful at stadium pricing. Even if profits are small because of distributor costs and smaller crowds - it's still a profit. Anheiser Busch partners with the college on other things. Why not a good deal on beer? William and mary athletics are in no position to turn down any viable revenue sources.

There is some evidence that enhancements to the game day experience such as sale of alcoholic beverages might have a marginally positive effect on ticket sales as well. Extra athletic revenue is extra athletic revenue, even if it is swapped out to olympic sports (3,2,1).

To be honest, when the College banned re-entry I thought it would be to sell beer, wine, booze, etc.
(This post was last modified: 12-12-2017 08:02 AM by LeadBolt.)
12-12-2017 08:00 AM
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nogretheogre Offline
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Post: #29
RE: For those proponents of alcohol at Cary Zable
There absolutely would be an uptick in ticket sales. I myself was drawn as a spectator to sports by the social aspects of them. I didnt grow up a sports fan. As a young alum, I started attending minor league sports as "sure" gesture toward friends and for something else to do...but thats only because I could enjoy the weather and a beer. After learning the nuances and gaining an appreciation and attachment to the game, I kept coming. This eventually pushed toward Tribe sports. I go to games, but boy do I miss the beers. Many of my friends however did not get the same push to the Tribe. When we meet for homecoming etc, they just stay at the Leafe and i go to the game. If there was beer there, Im sure theyd follow.
12-12-2017 08:46 AM
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Rocco Offline
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Post: #30
RE: For those proponents of alcohol at Cary Zable
http://www.cleveland.com/metro/index.ssf...colle.html

"Beer sales peaked at $28,000 (at Kent State) during the 2013 season, according to the newspaper."

"A larger school, West Virginia University, which in the Big 12, began beer sales in 2011 in part to counter a problem with drunken fans coming and going from tailgate parties during games, ESPN.com said. Fans no longer can re-enter the stadium once they leave.

Beer sales have brought in at least $516,000 each of the past three years and campus police say alcohol-related incidents have declined sharply."

http://www.hookemplus.com/story/texas-fa...cent-2016/

"The athletic department netted about $1.3 million of those sales as part of its contract with 1883 Provision Company, a UT spokesman said."

VT sells alcohol to a small part of the stadium, though they've since expanded it to another small part beyond what's in this article. I can't find any revenue numbers through some quick digging. http://www.dailypress.com/sports/teel-bl...-post.html

"The west side club seats represent approximately 2 percent of Lane Stadium’s 65,632 capacity, and the athletic department will net only 12 percent of beer and wine sales. "

If I had to guess it looks like a) there's a fairly significant amount of overhead/sunk costs that goes in to selling beer at games, and b) the larger schools have a bigger percentage of their attendance that's over 21 and able to drink. It might not be cost effective given attendance and expected revenues.
12-12-2017 09:38 AM
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nj alum Offline
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Post: #31
RE: For those proponents of alcohol at Cary Zable
I love the West Virginia example.

They sell alcohol and have a no re-entry policy to address alcohol behavioral issues, and it worked, and they made money.

Conversely, at the College of Knowledge, we don't sell alcohol and have a no re-entry policy to address ... what exactly? ... has it worked? ... have we made money?

We have got to get 21 year old students and young alumni to the football games, or there will be no fan base in the future. The failure to sell alcohol flies in the face of almost every public venue of almost every public event that I have attended in my life.

It ... is ... bone-headed ... not ... to ... do ... this!
12-12-2017 12:03 PM
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Rocco Offline
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Post: #32
RE: For those proponents of alcohol at Cary Zable
Man, the ellipses really make the argument. $500K for WVU is a drop in the bucket. They made almost $105M in 2015-16. They've had issues with crowd behavior in the past. Plus I don't believe they've ever had issues with student attendance at games, so offering the 1/4 of the student base the ability to drink probably doesn't matter. Football is a tradition there. I don't think WVU cares about students buying beer either- they care about getting the fans who work and make money to buy beer, because they have more disposable income.

http://sports.usatoday.com/ncaa/finances/

It's disingenuous to point to much larger schools making money, point to that same pile of money and say "W&M could have that pile of money!". The evidence suggests W&M wouldn't really make a lot of money on it. This is not to say they shouldn't sell beer at the games (I believe I said as much at the beginning of this thread), but any revenues for W&M wouldn't be much of a game changer. What would probably help more is having a good team with a functional offense. After that would be to get concessions produced after 1977. Third on the list would be alcohol.
12-12-2017 12:25 PM
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Tribe32 Offline
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Post: #33
RE: For those proponents of alcohol at Cary Zable
We should keep adding things to the game experience that make the fans want to be inside the gates instead of at their cars tailgating or just not coming at all.

Here some really simple ideas:

Food trucks
A beer truck or two
Margarita machine(s)
Corn Hole or other games over behind the end zones and near the beer truck
Good wifi
Anything that makes noise and keeps some of our fans awake
12-12-2017 01:21 PM
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zablenoise Offline
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Post: #34
RE: For those proponents of alcohol at Cary Zable
For me, the money is all gravy. There should be beer at sporting events just because.
12-12-2017 01:53 PM
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Tribe32 Offline
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Post: #35
RE: For those proponents of alcohol at Cary Zable
My point exactly. You will make more money by selling more tickets and once you have butts in seats you can sell them stuff.

(12-12-2017 01:53 PM)zablenoise Wrote:  For me, the money is all gravy. There should be beer at sporting events just because.
12-12-2017 03:12 PM
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nj alum Offline
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Post: #36
RE: For those proponents of alcohol at Cary Zable
(12-12-2017 12:25 PM)Rocco Wrote:  Man, the ellipses really make the argument. $500K for WVU is a drop in the bucket. They made almost $105M in 2015-16. They've had issues with crowd behavior in the past. Plus I don't believe they've ever had issues with student attendance at games, so offering the 1/4 of the student base the ability to drink probably doesn't matter. Football is a tradition there. I don't think WVU cares about students buying beer either- they care about getting the fans who work and make money to buy beer, because they have more disposable income.

http://sports.usatoday.com/ncaa/finances/

It's disingenuous to point to much larger schools making money, point to that same pile of money and say "W&M could have that pile of money!". The evidence suggests W&M wouldn't really make a lot of money on it. This is not to say they shouldn't sell beer at the games (I believe I said as much at the beginning of this thread), but any revenues for W&M wouldn't be much of a game changer. What would probably help more is having a good team with a functional offense. After that would be to get concessions produced after 1977. Third on the list would be alcohol.

Oh, I'm sorry ... I didn't know there was a prioritized list. Let me know what I can, and can't talk about, and in what order, and I'll be sure to try to keep you happy.

Are you Roman Catholic? If you are, you will be familiar with the saying, "the Church was built on the pennies of the poor".

You're (a) once again moving the goalposts (eg. pile of money, game changer) and (b) not seeing the forest through the trees, all in the name of being a contrarian.

It boils down to this. One has to "play the game" to be part of the game.

Alcohol. Marching band. Video boards. Merchandising. Coaching salaries. Recruiting budget. COA. They're all part of "playing the game". Some of these are minor items; some are major. Regardless, there are things you just have to do.

Finally, you're a bright guy. Student and young alumni attendance at sporting events is, IMO, the #1 long range issue facing Tribe athletics. Every little bit helps in that regard.
12-12-2017 03:22 PM
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TribeNiner Offline
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Post: #37
RE: For those proponents of alcohol at Cary Zable
Not that hard to figure out numbers. If you sell a $6 beer to 1 out of every 5 fans that come into the stadium and you average only 10k/game for 6 games, then you're looking at revenue of $72k/year. Manage to sell two beers and you're double that. It's not going to line the coffers, but it will cover a few scholarships.

But it's more about fan experience. I can get a couple of beers and some good food off of a food truck while checking out some good football on an awesome October afternoon. Nothing wrong with that.
12-12-2017 03:56 PM
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Rocco Offline
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Post: #38
RE: For those proponents of alcohol at Cary Zable
(12-12-2017 03:22 PM)nj alum Wrote:  
(12-12-2017 12:25 PM)Rocco Wrote:  Man, the ellipses really make the argument. $500K for WVU is a drop in the bucket. They made almost $105M in 2015-16. They've had issues with crowd behavior in the past. Plus I don't believe they've ever had issues with student attendance at games, so offering the 1/4 of the student base the ability to drink probably doesn't matter. Football is a tradition there. I don't think WVU cares about students buying beer either- they care about getting the fans who work and make money to buy beer, because they have more disposable income.

http://sports.usatoday.com/ncaa/finances/

It's disingenuous to point to much larger schools making money, point to that same pile of money and say "W&M could have that pile of money!". The evidence suggests W&M wouldn't really make a lot of money on it. This is not to say they shouldn't sell beer at the games (I believe I said as much at the beginning of this thread), but any revenues for W&M wouldn't be much of a game changer. What would probably help more is having a good team with a functional offense. After that would be to get concessions produced after 1977. Third on the list would be alcohol.

Oh, I'm sorry ... I didn't know there was a prioritized list. Let me know what I can, and can't talk about, and in what order, and I'll be sure to try to keep you happy.

Are you Roman Catholic? If you are, you will be familiar with the saying, "the Church was built on the pennies of the poor".

You're (a) once again moving the goalposts (eg. pile of money, game changer) and (b) not seeing the forest through the trees, all in the name of being a contrarian.

It boils down to this. One has to "play the game" to be part of the game.

Alcohol. Marching band. Video boards. Merchandising. Coaching salaries. Recruiting budget. COA. They're all part of "playing the game". Some of these are minor items; some are major. Regardless, there are things you just have to do.

Finally, you're a bright guy. Student and young alumni attendance at sporting events is, IMO, the #1 long range issue facing Tribe athletics. Every little bit helps in that regard.

Look at you being all snarky. You're the one that brought up alcohol sales as a moneymaker, not me. You're the one talking about money schools with much larger stadiums are making as if W&M would make anything close to that.

I'm not sure how you can say I'm being a contrarian when I'm saying they should sell alcohol at games. I'm simply disagreeing with it doing all that much to either make money or grow the fanbase. It's a nice thing to have. There are deeper structural problems. The product is most important, and that's what is lacking now as compared to when most of us were at W&M.
12-12-2017 05:07 PM
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Rocco Offline
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Post: #39
RE: For those proponents of alcohol at Cary Zable
(12-12-2017 03:56 PM)TribeNiner Wrote:  Not that hard to figure out numbers. If you sell a $6 beer to 1 out of every 5 fans that come into the stadium and you average only 10k/game for 6 games, then you're looking at revenue of $72k/year. Manage to sell two beers and you're double that. It's not going to line the coffers, but it will cover a few scholarships.

But it's more about fan experience. I can get a couple of beers and some good food off of a food truck while checking out some good football on an awesome October afternoon. Nothing wrong with that.

The problem is it doesn't look like they'd make that much, just based on what schools slightly bigger than they are made. They should still at least explore it because it would improve things for fans.
12-12-2017 05:09 PM
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Tribal Offline
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Post: #40
For those proponents of alcohol at Cary Zable
I wonder what the DUI numbers look like. Drink before the game, have 3 hours to gain your sobriety, then drive home vs drink before the game, spend the next 3 hours maintaining intoxication and drive home under the influence.
(This post was last modified: 12-12-2017 05:30 PM by Tribal.)
12-12-2017 05:29 PM
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