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Fort Wayne or IUPUI to Horizon?
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Chuck_A Offline
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Fort Wayne or IUPUI to Horizon?
Purdue BOT had a meeting on 5/5 to discuss a Special "athletics matter". Could they have discussed Fort Wayne and a possible move to the Horizon League? Very interesting!

In accordance with the Bylaws, a special meeting of the Board of Trustees of The Trustees of Purdue University will convene at 7:15 p.m. on Friday, May 5, 2017, in the Boilermaker Aquatic Center on the West Lafayette campus of Purdue University for the purpose of acting on a special Purdue athletics matter.


Link per purdue.edu: Purdue has Special BOT Meeting
(This post was last modified: 05-08-2017 10:11 AM by Chuck_A.)
05-08-2017 06:14 AM
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prisonmike Offline
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RE: Fort Wayne Set to Move to HL?
Just curious why the Horizon League would take Fort Wayne over IUPU - Indianapolis? From an outsiders perspective just looking at the numbers:

IUPUI has much larger enrollment.
IUPUI has much larger endowment.
IUPUI has a bigger media market.

Is Fort Wayne just that much better at athletics?
05-08-2017 07:50 AM
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Mister Consistency Offline
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RE: Fort Wayne Set to Move to HL?
They renamed the aquatics center after their former AD Morgan Burke, hence their convening at said aquatics center. Thou hast jumped thine gun.

But that doesn't mean Fort Wayne won't be considered for the Horizon League in the near future, depending on how aggressively they want to expand. I would expect them to take a long, hard look at IUPUI, though.
05-08-2017 07:56 AM
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Chuck_A Offline
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RE: Fort Wayne Set to Move to HL?
Aw shucks!
05-08-2017 08:17 AM
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MplsBison Offline
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RE: Fort Wayne Set to Move to HL?
Chuck, I suggest you rename the title of the thread (which you can do by doing a 'Full Edit' of the OP, if you didn't know) to something like "PU Fort Wayne or IU Indianapolis, better choice for Horizon League?"


And to that end, I guess at the moment you could say that FW's MBB program is better. Plays in a nicer arena, and I think has higher attendance and RPI (not sure though). Indy doesn't have a bad setup for BB though.


The one interesting thing, which may not amount to a hill of beans, is that IU Indy is very much a similar profile institution to UIC. They're both the health science/med school/university hospital for the Big Ten public flagship in their respective states (IU and UIUC). So that might win over UIC ... or maybe they won't care about that.


IU Indy does have some really nice facilities, though. Especially swimming and track & field/soccer.
05-08-2017 08:52 AM
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chargeradio Offline
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RE: Fort Wayne Set to Move to HL?
Fort Wayne has baseball, IUPUI does not.
05-08-2017 09:00 AM
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MplsBison Offline
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RE: Fort Wayne Set to Move to HL?
Sure, that is an important point ... particularly for the Summit League.

Adding Fort Wayne would give HL 8 baseball teams, and would drop Summit down to 5.
05-08-2017 09:03 AM
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Chuck_A Offline
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RE: Fort Wayne or IUPUI to Horizon?
(05-08-2017 09:03 AM)MplsBison Wrote:  Sure, that is an important point ... particularly for the Summit League.

Adding Fort Wayne would give HL 8 baseball teams, and would drop Summit down to 5.

Thanks for the suggestion on the thread renaming.

Remember if Valpo goes that leaves the HL with 6 baseball teams. Adding Fort Wayne gives the league 7 again. Baseball is the second sport in the HL and UIC, Wright State and Milwaukee want to make sure that sport is secure. Based on that, the Mastodons would appear to have the upper hand.

As far as the medical/sciences, when IPFW split, Indiana-Fort Wayne now handles that part of the campus. Although they will become two separate entities, they both are still next to each other so I don't think that issue will affect a vote from the HL...if there is one.

I mentioned earlier that over the past 5 years, Fort Wayne has a better record, winning 110 games. At this point, I'm sure the HL wants to bring in a team or teams that will help the league...not bring down the conference RPI. Oakland and NKU were good pick ups. The league wants the next one, two or three to be triples at least, because I really don't see any homeruns!
05-08-2017 10:28 AM
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Kittonhead Offline
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RE: Fort Wayne or IUPUI to Horizon?
I would not take both Indiana schools from the Summit.

Take IUPUI to finally fill in for Butler's departure. Valpo probably hasn't wanted it to water down the brand of the Horizon League but now they are gone.

But Fort Wayne would not completely surprise me because of the size of their market is comparable to Youngstown St or Green Bay.

Or take both and push membership to 11. Move to that 20 game schedule everyone is talking about.

I feel bad for Detroit-Mercy left behind in the Horizon, a conference that once had Notre Dame, Loyola, Xavier and Butler among its membership. There isn't much they can do about it because of their location.
05-08-2017 11:02 AM
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Kittonhead Offline
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RE: Fort Wayne or IUPUI to Horizon?
If the Horizon moves to 11 with IUPUI/Ft Wayne.

Does that compel UMKC to take an opening in the Summit? North Dakota is moving there so there is some forward momentum.

Probably not as they like the sexy West Coast recruiting locales than butt freezing Dakotas.
05-08-2017 11:20 AM
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Cyniclone Offline
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RE: Fort Wayne or IUPUI to Horizon?
(05-08-2017 08:52 AM)MplsBison Wrote:  Chuck, I suggest you rename the title of the thread (which you can do by doing a 'Full Edit' of the OP, if you didn't know) to something like "PU Fort Wayne or IU Indianapolis, better choice for Horizon League?"

Good luck trying to market that
05-08-2017 11:51 AM
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Chuck_A Offline
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RE: Fort Wayne or IUPUI to Horizon?
(05-08-2017 11:02 AM)Kittonhead Wrote:  I would not take both Indiana schools from the Summit.

Take IUPUI to finally fill in for Butler's departure. Valpo probably hasn't wanted it to water down the brand of the Horizon League but now they are gone.

But Fort Wayne would not completely surprise me because of the size of their market is comparable to Youngstown St or Green Bay.

Or take both and push membership to 11. Move to that 20 game schedule everyone is talking about.

I feel bad for Detroit-Mercy left behind in the Horizon, a conference that once had Notre Dame, Loyola, Xavier and Butler among its membership. There isn't much they can do about it because of their location.

I don't think the HL will stop at 11. They want to add 3 programs to go to 12 basketball teams. The question for us HL fans is, "which three programs"? I'm sure the League has done its due diligence and will more than likely try to add all three. If not able to do so, will try to add one this season and the remainder for the '18-'19 season.
05-08-2017 12:17 PM
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MWC Tex Online
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RE: Fort Wayne or IUPUI to Horizon?
(05-08-2017 11:20 AM)Kittonhead Wrote:  If the Horizon moves to 11 with IUPUI/Ft Wayne.

Does that compel UMKC to take an opening in the Summit? North Dakota is moving there so there is some forward momentum.

Probably not as they like the sexy West Coast recruiting locales than butt freezing Dakotas.

I think UMKC is glad to be out of the Dakota league.
05-08-2017 04:58 PM
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Fighting Muskie Online
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RE: Fort Wayne or IUPUI to Horizon?
Just a question about the sudden interest in 11 member all sports leagues:

Don't they create more trouble than they are worth? Each week one school is left out and doesn't have any conference games to play and has to scramble to find OOC games to fill the dates. It also means splitting you NCAA credits with an extra school.

I'm okay with 12 if it gets you solid divisions and saves on travel money--even better if the 12 schools get you an occasional at-large berth. 11 just seems weird. Can a pro-11 person help me out here?
05-08-2017 10:05 PM
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NoDak Offline
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RE: Fort Wayne or IUPUI to Horizon?
(05-08-2017 10:05 PM)Fighting Muskie Wrote:  Just a question about the sudden interest in 11 member all sports leagues:

Don't they create more trouble than they are worth? Each week one school is left out and doesn't have any conference games to play and has to scramble to find OOC games to fill the dates. It also means splitting you NCAA credits with an extra school.

I'm okay with 12 if it gets you solid divisions and saves on travel money--even better if the 12 schools get you an occasional at-large berth. 11 just seems weird. Can a pro-11 person help me out here?

The Horizon needs other sports too, and doesn't impose those needed requirements on new schools. The 11 would mostly be for vb, wbb, and mbb. Other minor sports may be less. Baseball would be needed if Valpo goes.
05-08-2017 10:11 PM
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solohawks Online
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RE: Fort Wayne or IUPUI to Horizon?
If you are going to 20 games then 11 is no different than 9 which the ACC did fine for decades
05-08-2017 10:12 PM
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IWokeUpLikeThis Online
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RE: Fort Wayne or IUPUI to Horizon?
The UMKC AD has quotes recently talking about how the Kangaroos need regional rivals. I think they're almost certainly Summit-bound in 12 months.
05-08-2017 10:30 PM
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MissouriStateBears Offline
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RE: Fort Wayne or IUPUI to Horizon?
(05-08-2017 10:30 PM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  The UMKC AD has quotes recently talking about how the Kangaroos need regional rivals. I think they're almost certainly Summit-bound in 12 months.

Horizon takes Fort Wayne. Summit adds UMKC.

Denver/Omaha
North Dakota/North Dakota State
South Dakota/South Dakota State
Oral Roberts/UMKC
IUPUI/Western Illinois
05-08-2017 10:36 PM
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NoDak Offline
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RE: Fort Wayne or IUPUI to Horizon?
(05-08-2017 10:30 PM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  The UMKC AD has quotes recently talking about how the Kangaroos need regional rivals. I think they're almost certainly Summit-bound in 12 months.

Well it could mean ORU and Omaha are WAC bound. The WAC needs UMKC until Cal Baptist finishes it's transition.
05-08-2017 10:46 PM
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Stugray2 Offline
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RE: Fort Wayne or IUPUI to Horizon?
(05-08-2017 10:05 PM)Fighting Muskie Wrote:  Just a question about the sudden interest in 11 member all sports leagues:

Don't they create more trouble than they are worth? Each week one school is left out and doesn't have any conference games to play and has to scramble to find OOC games to fill the dates. It also means splitting you NCAA credits with an extra school.

I'm okay with 12 if it gets you solid divisions and saves on travel money--even better if the 12 schools get you an occasional at-large berth. 11 just seems weird. Can a pro-11 person help me out here?

The Horizon looks like this for team sports

Currently:
10 MBB, WBB, MS (Belmont is the 10th, but leaving after '17-18)
9 WVB, SB, WS, MS (after Belmont leaves)
7 BB
Note: Detroit doesn't have WVB, Milwaukee doesn't have SB, UIC doesn't have MS, YSU doesn't have WS
Detroit, Green Bay, and Cleveland State don't have Baseball

After Valpo leaves
9 MBB, WBB
8 WVB, SB, WS, MS (after '17-18 season)
6 BB

If the Horizon adds one school to get back to 10 in Basketball all the other team sports go odd creating byes. A problem the league has to deal with now and is part of the push for 11 from members.

Adding two schools, provided they sponsor almost all the other team sports, should make those sports even, greatly helping scheduling. While for Basketball 11 schools would allow everyone to have 10 conference home games (full round robin), an important incremental increase in revenue.

The Horizon is a bit unusual in that the team sports other than Baseball are "odd" when there are an even number of Basketball schools, and "even" when there are an odd number of Basketball schools.
(This post was last modified: 05-09-2017 01:04 AM by Stugray2.)
05-09-2017 01:02 AM
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