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Is the AAC a 'Power Conference' at least in basketball now w/t addition of WSU?
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Indiana Bones Offline
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Is the AAC a 'Power Conference' at least in basketball now w/t addition of WSU?
I already thought the AAC was at least on the cusp before this move. Ultimately, I guess it's where you decide to draw the line but it appears that the AAC is clearly at least the 7th best conference moving forward (already the 6th best in football). My school (ECU) isn't really helping the cause at this juncture and obviously I'm a bit biased but given the history of the programs in the AAC in conjunction with this add, it looks to be a 3-6 bid league every year which would put us on par with the SEC (with 2 less members). No reason to think WSU won't transition at least as well as Creighton, Butler, and Xavier have in the Big East.

All the schools in the AAC are diligently working to try to break through the threshold & the league appears to be as stable as it's been since it's inception. Maybe I'm being optimistic but I think it's realistic to expect a pay raise above what the Big East currently makes. Fox needed content at the time and the Big East had a brand & good quality basketball ready to go. That being said, how different is the quality of product provided by ECU then lets say DePaul at this point. Moreover, the top of the leagues don't look much different in terms of brand, history, etc. Add in the fact that the AAC has a fairly good football product to offer as well (the biggest revenue sport by far) and that creates a presumption that the AAC will get a significant pay raise now that the dust has settled.

Maybe I'm looking through rose colored glasses as I've been know to do but things are certainly looking up at this point for the conference as a whole. For those that don't see it my way, I'm certainly interested in your rebuttals but I'm perhaps more interested in ideas about how to further enhance our collective product in order to continue to improve the AAC's trajectory.
04-08-2017 07:23 PM
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hawghiggs Offline
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Post: #2
RE: Is the AAC a 'Power Conference' at least in basketball now w/t addition of WSU?
I think that the AAC is a fine conference. I'm not sure that adding WSU was a good idea. I may be proven wrong. But that's another time. Now back to the topic. The only real way that I can see of the AAC getting to be seen as a " Power Conference" is for the AAC to push for the post season bowl games to become four team tournaments. This would allow a conference like the AAC more chances to play in more nationally recognized games.
04-08-2017 09:59 PM
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BigEastHomer Offline
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RE: Is the AAC a 'Power Conference' at least in basketball now w/t addition of WSU?
(04-08-2017 09:59 PM)hawghiggs Wrote:  I think that the AAC is a fine conference. I'm not sure that adding WSU was a good idea. I may be proven wrong. But that's another time. Now back to the topic. The only real way that I can see of the AAC getting to be seen as a " Power Conference" is for the AAC to push for the post season bowl games to become four team tournaments. This would allow a conference like the AAC more chances to play in more nationally recognized games.

^^ This is exactly the problem with trying to blend football vernacular with basketball. Most people have absolutely no idea what they're talking about. This poll will only measure a bunch of peoples differing perceptions.
(This post was last modified: 04-08-2017 10:11 PM by BigEastHomer.)
04-08-2017 10:10 PM
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hawghiggs Offline
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RE: Is the AAC a 'Power Conference' at least in basketball now w/t addition of WSU?
I don't think that Wichita state actually helps the AAC as far as bids to the NCAA tourney. They will either push the bottom down even further by being a top team, or they will start to lose more games from being in a overall better conference. Then that will hurt the AAC.
04-08-2017 11:39 PM
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nzmorange Offline
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Post: #5
RE: Is the AAC a 'Power Conference' at least in basketball now w/t addition of WSU?
"Power Conference" refers to money, so no.

But I think you mean "high major." I'm torn on this question. On one hand, I don't consider the AAC a high major, but I do consider the SEC one. However, I think that the AAC could very well be better than the SEC more years than not - or at least one of the SEC or PAC. As such, if competency was the only factor, then logically I should either consider the SEC a mid major, or I should consider the AAC a high major. Since I don't, either I'm illogical (which is possible), or there's another unknown, subconscious factor, like name recognition (which is possible).

That's the terribly long-winded way of saying "no," but I don't have a great reason as to why not.
04-08-2017 11:54 PM
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Kaplony Offline
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RE: Is the AAC a 'Power Conference' at least in basketball now w/t addition of WSU?
(04-08-2017 11:54 PM)nzmorange Wrote:  "Power Conference" refers to money, so no.

But I think you mean "high major." I'm torn on this question. On one hand, I don't consider the AAC a high major, but I do consider the SEC one. However, I think that the AAC could very well be better than the SEC more years than not - or at least one of the SEC or PAC. As such, if competency was the only factor, then logically I should either consider the SEC a mid major, or I should consider the AAC a high major. Since I don't, either I'm illogical (which is possible), or there's another unknown, subconscious factor, like name recognition (which is possible).

That's the terribly long-winded way of saying "no," but I don't have a great reason as to why not.

We share the same line of thinking on this, but I disagree on your opinion of the SEC. They have made some solid coaching hires the past few years and seem to be taking hoops seriously now.
04-09-2017 12:01 AM
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shizzle787 Offline
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RE: Is the AAC a 'Power Conference' at least in basketball now w/t addition of WSU?
IMO, you are a power conference if 1/3 of your teams regularly gets to the tourney. So that would be 4/12 for the AAC. I think it will hover just below that on average.
04-09-2017 12:10 AM
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IWokeUpLikeThis Offline
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RE: Is the AAC a 'Power Conference' at least in basketball now w/t addition of WSU?
I think the media will render the AAC the way they did CUSAv1.
04-09-2017 12:46 AM
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Kaplony Offline
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RE: Is the AAC a 'Power Conference' at least in basketball now w/t addition of WSU?
For the record I voted no. I think that just adding WSU is going to lead to cannibalization among the AAC programs with a chance at getting a bid, and IMO will eventually lead to Marshall bailing on WSU first decent chance he gets.

The AAC's problem isn't that the top of the conference wasn't good enough.....it's the fact that the rest of the conference was that damn bad. For all the good this does to the top of the conference it makes the bottom that much worse.
04-09-2017 12:59 AM
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BigEastHomer Offline
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Post: #10
RE: Is the AAC a 'Power Conference' at least in basketball now w/t addition of WSU?
(04-09-2017 12:01 AM)Kaplony Wrote:  
(04-08-2017 11:54 PM)nzmorange Wrote:  "Power Conference" refers to money, so no.

But I think you mean "high major." I'm torn on this question. On one hand, I don't consider the AAC a high major, but I do consider the SEC one. However, I think that the AAC could very well be better than the SEC more years than not - or at least one of the SEC or PAC. As such, if competency was the only factor, then logically I should either consider the SEC a mid major, or I should consider the AAC a high major. Since I don't, either I'm illogical (which is possible), or there's another unknown, subconscious factor, like name recognition (which is possible).

Quote:
Quote:That's the terribly long-winded way of saying "no," but I don't have a great reason as to why not.

We share the same line of thinking on this, but I disagree on your opinion of the SEC. They have made some solid coaching hires the past few years and seem to be taking hoops seriously now.

Some interesting quotes. 04-cheers

The SEC gets credit for making solid coaching hires? I'd counter that the AAC is doing excellent in that department.

[Image: KrBohI.jpg]

Love the Wichita add for a lot of reasons that don't include basketball. They are an institutional, geographic, and athletic fit (extending beyond basketball). If we're going to talk basketball though, the fact that Wichita State is in every Top 10 list for next year, and Cincinnati and SMU are rounding out a lot of Top 25s, says a lot.

We can talk about metrics, brands, coaches, etc, but the bottom line is that the AAC has already proven its relevance. There's really not much that needs to be said beyond that.

Brand for brand, the conference stacks up favorably with the best conferences.

You can't talk about the great history of college basketball and exclude the programs in the AAC. There are too many that built this sport. Whether you prefer to count championships, final fours, etc.

Shockers MBB is a great compliment to the conference. Nevertheless, beyond MBB the Shockers just hired an accomplished WBB coach to build a program to one day challenge Geno's Huskies. It's an exciting time. Already, in its relatively short history, the AAC has lay claim to both the Men's and Women's National Champions in the same year.

Of course, beyond the hardwood, I love the add on a baseball level as well. The AAC is already one of the best (high major, power, whatever words to wish to use) baseball conferences in the land too, and the Shockers are a former national champion in that sport.

This is really about excellence in all sports. The records and accomplishments are already there.
(This post was last modified: 04-09-2017 04:41 AM by BigEastHomer.)
04-09-2017 04:00 AM
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ken d Online
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RE: Is the AAC a 'Power Conference' at least in basketball now w/t addition of WSU?
(04-09-2017 12:59 AM)Kaplony Wrote:  For the record I voted no. I think that just adding WSU is going to lead to cannibalization among the AAC programs with a chance at getting a bid, and IMO will eventually lead to Marshall bailing on WSU first decent chance he gets.

The AAC's problem isn't that the top of the conference wasn't good enough.....it's the fact that the rest of the conference was that damn bad. For all the good this does to the top of the conference it makes the bottom that much worse.

I also vote no, but I'm not ready to accept the idea that the top of the AAC is good enough to warrant "power" status. To me, the top would have to be good enough to be legitimate contenders to win the tournament, not just get invited most years. The initial perception of the AAC is that UConn is such a team. But I'm not convinced they can maintain the level of excellence they achieved in the (original) Big East under Calhoun. Their time may have passed.

Other than UConn, who else is going to be a perennial contender? Maybe WSU can be, but their recent success notwithstanding, I'm not convinced they are.

To me, "multi-bid league" does not equal "power conference". The AAC is the former, and WSU solidifies that status. IMO, they have now separated themselves (further)from the A10 and are one of the Top 8 conferences (out of 32). That's nothing to be ashamed of.
04-09-2017 07:53 AM
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Chappy Offline
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RE: Is the AAC a 'Power Conference' at least in basketball now w/t addition of WSU?
(04-09-2017 07:53 AM)ken d Wrote:  Other than UConn, who else is going to be a perennial contender?

NCAA Appearances - Last 10 Seasons

UCF - 0
Cincinnati - 7
Connecticut - 6
East Carolina - 0
Houston - 1
Memphis - 6
South Florida - 1
SMU - 2*
Temple - 7
Tulane - 0
Tulsa - 2
Wichita State - 6

38 Appearances, or 3.8 per season. Over the course of a decade, none of the teams are what I'd call 'perennial contenders', but Cincinnati, UConn, Memphis, Temple and Wichita State all made it more often than they missed it over that span.
04-09-2017 08:13 AM
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RE: Is the AAC a 'Power Conference' at least in basketball now w/t addition of WSU?
Close in MBB; galaxies away in CFB
04-09-2017 08:14 AM
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loki_the_bubba Offline
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RE: Is the AAC a 'Power Conference' at least in basketball now w/t addition of WSU?
Looks like we have 14 fans of AAC schools voting.
04-09-2017 08:14 AM
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Native Georgian Offline
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RE: Is the AAC a 'Power Conference' at least in basketball now w/t addition of WSU?
I voted Yes but admit that Kaplony and Ken-d bring up some legitimate points.

I just want to address one comment right now:
Quote:IMO, [AAC] have now separated themselves (further)from the A10 and are one of the Top 8 conferences (out of 32). That's nothing to be ashamed of.
If AAC is now judged to be ahead of the A10, wouldn't that put AAC in the Top 7 not Top 8?

If we view the following as the Top 8:
ACC
BE
Big <XII
SEC
B1G
PAC
AAC
A10
(This post was last modified: 04-09-2017 08:18 AM by Native Georgian.)
04-09-2017 08:14 AM
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BigEastHomer Offline
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RE: Is the AAC a 'Power Conference' at least in basketball now w/t addition of WSU?
(04-09-2017 08:14 AM)loki_the_bubba Wrote:  Looks like we have 14 fans of AAC schools voting.

That's what I'm saying about this poll.
You have a lot of fans of other conferences 'defending their turf' by voting the other way.
Its a meaningless exercise.
04-09-2017 09:23 AM
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MWC Tex Offline
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RE: Is the AAC a 'Power Conference' at least in basketball now w/t addition of WSU?
(04-09-2017 09:23 AM)BigEastHomer Wrote:  
(04-09-2017 08:14 AM)loki_the_bubba Wrote:  Looks like we have 14 fans of AAC schools voting.

That's what I'm saying about this poll.
You have a lot of fans of other conferences 'defending their turf' by voting the other way.
Its a meaningless exercise.

Not really, it's that the power conferences get at least 1/2 of the teams in the tournament.
04-09-2017 09:28 AM
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Carolina_Low_Country Offline
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RE: Is the AAC a 'Power Conference' at least in basketball now w/t addition of WSU?
Nm
(This post was last modified: 04-09-2017 09:33 AM by Carolina_Low_Country.)
04-09-2017 09:32 AM
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BigEastHomer Offline
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RE: Is the AAC a 'Power Conference' at least in basketball now w/t addition of WSU?
(04-09-2017 09:28 AM)MWC Tex Wrote:  
(04-09-2017 09:23 AM)BigEastHomer Wrote:  
(04-09-2017 08:14 AM)loki_the_bubba Wrote:  Looks like we have 14 fans of AAC schools voting.

That's what I'm saying about this poll.
You have a lot of fans of other conferences 'defending their turf' by voting the other way.
Its a meaningless exercise.

Not really, it's that the power conferences get at least 1/2 of the teams in the tournament.

My friend, all polls on these boards are nothing but pissing contests.

How many conferences have a national championship to their credit in the last handful of years?
We can talk about consistent bids as another metric of relevance but the AAC wasn't expecting consistent bids right out of the gate. It was a build to begin with because programs were chosen to ensure long term success in all sports. For those out of the conference, its easy to puff out their chests when multiple AAC teams have new regimes and short benches.
The Wichita State addition is another great move for the conference that extends the efforts with the new coaches and infrastructure that have gone in to the movement.
(This post was last modified: 04-09-2017 09:44 AM by BigEastHomer.)
04-09-2017 09:36 AM
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GoldenWarrior11 Offline
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RE: Is the AAC a 'Power Conference' at least in basketball now w/t addition of WSU?
The AAC will always be fighting against perception and for the opportunity to be included with the power conferences. They are fully capable of changing that perception, and establishing itself as a power football/basketball conference, but, IMHO today, they are not. Power conferences have power programs that can be depended on year-in and year-out to carry the league and the brand. The B1G has Michigan/Ohio State in football, and Michigan State, Indiana, Maryland, and Wisconsin in basketball. The SEC has Alabama in football and Kentucky in basketball. The P5 have those programs.

For the American, in football, who has that brand today? The answer, again for today, is no one. Obviously, Houston has a great year last year. UCF did a few years ago. However, it's the year-to-year consistency and establishment that it will compete nationally. In basketball for the American, it's different. UConn is a national brand. However, there is a perception that UConn is struggling after Calhoun/Big East. Next year isn't looking very well either. Memphis can be a top brand, but they, too, have struggled since Calipari - and his 2008 team had everything vacated.

The other big perception that the American faces, more so than other power conferences, is the negative perception of empty stadiums/arenas. IMO, this is largely because any non-P5 conference will struggle with a lack of regional conference members, and the American ranges from Texas to Florida to the Northeast - hardly easy for everyday fans to see games.

There's no question that the American is investing. However, the consistent results on the field/court need to back that up - and the fans of those schools need to show up.

The interesting argument to make is whether the American still adds Wichita State if UConn, Memphis and Temple were winning like they have historically done so, and if Tulane/ECU/USF weren't dragging the bottom of the league down in basketball. SMU has done great in basketball, because of their investment in Larry Brown. Cincinnati has continued to win with Cronin. UCF seems like it has made a great hire in Dawkins, but can he sustain that success and does he stay at UCF?

Long response, but simple answer: Right now the American is not a power conference, but they have the potential and resources to be considered as such long-term.
04-09-2017 09:48 AM
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