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Big West rejects UC San Diego
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NMSUPistolPete Online
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Post: #61
RE: Big West rejects UC San Diego
(04-15-2017 12:01 AM)SDHornet Wrote:  
(04-14-2017 11:01 PM)SJHornet Wrote:  How important is RPI for conferences that are one bid leagues? Unless a school is ranked in the top 25 nearly all season long, the Big West, WAC, and other mid majors are only sending one team to the tourney.

Becuase it's not. RPI is an easy out to use. SDSU used it on the BW, but the real reason was they didn't want their program prestige to take a hit by playing in glorified HS gyms. Not even Fisher could have landed top recruits with them knowing the type of digs they would be playing in.

The better reason for the BW to not expand is so they don't have to split their pie between 2 more mouths. More money is always a legit reason to stay put, and a believable one too.

And stop with the talk about the BW adding a pair of programs that require air travel. That's just total nonsense.

I like the WAC over the BW because it gives us regional exposure while the BW is just a CA also ran league. If athletics is truly viewed as an avenue to expand the brand, then being in a CA only league does nothing to benefit that concept. I like to look at Bako and their recent increase in athletic success and exposure. They wouldn't be anywhere near what they have become had they been accepted into the CA bus league. The WAC offers exposure (albeit minimal, but better than nothing) in major markets across the west coast...and it will increase when CBU comes on board.

The WAC offers more recruiting avenues being in 8 different states and a more interesting conference schedule to prospective recruits than just playing in a California bus league like the BWC; although a trip to Hawaii is nice.

If Hurd can continue to add more programs located in large western cities with major commercial airports (Denver, San Diego, San Francisco, Portland, Sacramento, etc.), then the WAC will have its' new identity as a conference progressing forward... big city, non-football playing, schools.
(This post was last modified: 04-15-2017 02:18 AM by NMSUPistolPete.)
04-15-2017 01:23 AM
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Clarity Offline
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Post: #62
RE: Big West rejects UC San Diego
Denver would be an awesome addition. I hope UCSD will just give up the Big West dream and come to the WAC.
04-15-2017 01:44 AM
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72Tiger Offline
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Post: #63
RE: Big West rejects UC San Diego
If Metro St of Denver ever moves up, the WAC would be a great fit.
04-15-2017 07:15 AM
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SJHornet Offline
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Post: #64
RE: Big West rejects UC San Diego
(04-15-2017 01:23 AM)NMSUPistolPete Wrote:  
(04-15-2017 12:01 AM)SDHornet Wrote:  
(04-14-2017 11:01 PM)SJHornet Wrote:  How important is RPI for conferences that are one bid leagues? Unless a school is ranked in the top 25 nearly all season long, the Big West, WAC, and other mid majors are only sending one team to the tourney.

Becuase it's not. RPI is an easy out to use. SDSU used it on the BW, but the real reason was they didn't want their program prestige to take a hit by playing in glorified HS gyms. Not even Fisher could have landed top recruits with them knowing the type of digs they would be playing in.

The better reason for the BW to not expand is so they don't have to split their pie between 2 more mouths. More money is always a legit reason to stay put, and a believable one too.

And stop with the talk about the BW adding a pair of programs that require air travel. That's just total nonsense.

I like the WAC over the BW because it gives us regional exposure while the BW is just a CA also ran league. If athletics is truly viewed as an avenue to expand the brand, then being in a CA only league does nothing to benefit that concept. I like to look at Bako and their recent increase in athletic success and exposure. They wouldn't be anywhere near what they have become had they been accepted into the CA bus league. The WAC offers exposure (albeit minimal, but better than nothing) in major markets across the west coast...and it will increase when CBU comes on board.

The WAC offers more recruiting avenues being in 8 different states and a more interesting conference schedule to prospective recruits than just playing in a California bus league like the BWC; although a trip to Hawaii is nice.

If Hurd can continue to add more programs located in large western cities with major commercial airports (Denver, San Diego, San Francisco, Portland, Sacramento, etc.), then the WAC will have its' new identity as a conference progressing forward... big city, non-football playing, schools.

This reminds new me of the old Metro Conference. They got quite a lot of attention in the early-mid 90s. Football ended up killing off that conference. If the WAC could become a western large market conference, a media outlet would surely take notice.
04-15-2017 04:13 PM
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dbackjon Online
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Post: #65
RE: Big West rejects UC San Diego
(04-14-2017 11:01 PM)SJHornet Wrote:  How important is RPI for conferences that are one bid leagues? Unless a school is ranked in the top 25 nearly all season long, the Big West, WAC, and other mid majors are only sending one team to the tourney.

It can/does affect the seeding of the one-bid. A low RPI conference is unlikely to have a single member with high RPI (it does happen, but usually the other members drag the one down). Much better chance of winning a game as an 11-seed than a 15/16 seed...
04-17-2017 05:15 PM
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RunnerBall Offline
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Post: #66
RE: Big West rejects UC San Diego
In other news....
Not that exciting of a story, but FYI..

SDUT: "UCSD's way forward to Div. I"

http://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/spor...story.html
(This post was last modified: 04-17-2017 10:50 PM by RunnerBall.)
04-17-2017 10:43 PM
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nogood52 Offline
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Post: #67
RE: Big West rejects UC San Diego
(04-17-2017 10:43 PM)RunnerBall Wrote:  In other news....
Not that exciting of a story, but FYI..

SDUT: "UCSD's way forward to Div. I"

http://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/spor...story.html

UCSD should just accept its fate and join the WAC. They'd be welcome with open arms and gives them time to develop as a Division-I program. But the WAC could survive as a 12-team hoops league if a few schools see the vision. See below

WAC Pacific

CSUB
Cal Baptist
Grand Canyon
Seattle
Utah Valley
UC-San Diego

WAC Central?

New Mexico State
UMKC
UTRGV
SIU-Edwardsville (natural rival with UMKC, joins from OVC)
UT-Arlington (former WAC member joins from Sun Belt)
TAMU-Corpus Christi (natural rival with UTRGV, joins from Southland)

UT-Arlington and TAMU-CC ditch the football-dominant Southland/Sun Conference and help add hoops depth to WAC. SIU-Edwardsville, located in Greater St. Louis, adds a natural rival/travel partner for UMKC. 16-game regular season with home-and-homes against division rivals plus three-away, three-home inter-division matchups. Limits travel, plus has two-bid league potential. Look at postseason performances from all teams below.

NMSU 28-6 NCAA Rd.1
UTA 27-9 NIT Quarters
CSUB 25-10 NIT Semis
GCU 22-9
TAMU-CC 24-12 L CIT Champs
UMKC 18-17 CBI-Quarters
UVU 17-17 CBI-Semis
SEATTLE 13-17
UTRGV 10-22
SIU-E 6-24

CAL BAPTIST 26-5 NCAA D-2 Rd.2
UC-SAN DIEGO 27-6 NCAA D-2 S16
(This post was last modified: 04-20-2017 01:22 AM by nogood52.)
04-20-2017 01:20 AM
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RunnerBall Offline
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Post: #68
RE: Big West rejects UC San Diego
I see we have another 'Runners fan on. Welcome to the board. If Clarity brought you on, too bad we don't have a bonus for him for bringing in new members. 03-razz Maybe a few Reputation points, but I don't have that privilege yet.
Perhaps....CP can help me out with that....since he ....appreciates....new CSUB fans. 04-cheers
(This post was last modified: 04-20-2017 11:18 AM by RunnerBall.)
04-20-2017 11:14 AM
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Clarity Offline
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Post: #69
RE: Big West rejects UC San Diego
That 2 division stuff is definitely dream territory but on paper it would be great. I wonder if Stephen F Austin would ever consider leaving the Southland. That would be better and a major get. Also welcome to another Runners fan 04-cheers
(This post was last modified: 04-20-2017 01:51 PM by Clarity.)
04-20-2017 01:37 PM
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NuMexAg Offline
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Post: #70
RE: Big West rejects UC San Diego
(04-17-2017 10:43 PM)RunnerBall Wrote:  In other news....
Not that exciting of a story, but FYI..

SDUT: "UCSD's way forward to Div. I"

http://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/spor...story.html

Based on this story, and other reports that the BW vote was entirely along UC/Cal St lines, I can't see UCSD joining the WAC.

The BW athletic directors unanimously wanted UCSD. So, they don't need to improve or grow their athletic program in order to get in. They need to convince 2 of 4 Cal State presidents to vote for them. I doubt membership in the WAC is going to advance that cause much.

I think they are more likely to spend time trying to convince 4 UC presidents to vote for Bakersfield.
04-20-2017 07:07 PM
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Stugray2 Offline
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Post: #71
RE: Big West rejects UC San Diego
I actually have an email conversation going with Mark Zeigler about this article. He admits he doesn't know how the voting went. He is under the impression the referendum mentioned Big West by name. It didn't.

I have a request in with UCSD AS Elections folks to get a copy of the 2016 wording of the referendum. But from what I could find online, the AD said it was simply an updated version of the 2012 referendum, with September 30 2018 the expiration date (the 2012 was September 30, 2014), and slightly different fee numbers (a couple dollars more ... inflation, increase of $49 instead of $47 to start with or something like that). You can read the 2012 version here.

http://as.ucsd.edu/docs/ICA_Election_Results_2012.pdf

Zeigler did not consider the WAC option because he thinks the referendum specifically said Big West. I told him I'll forward the 2016 wording as soon as I get it from UCSD. I will also post it here so you can all see there is no clause specifying the Big West.
04-20-2017 11:33 PM
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CPslograd Offline
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Post: #72
RE: Big West rejects UC San Diego
(04-06-2017 11:59 PM)jdgaucho Wrote:  The Big West has voted no on UC San Diego.

http://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/spor...story.html

That is surprising. From an athletic standpoint inviting them would have been stupid, but I was sure the politics would get them in.
04-21-2017 12:04 AM
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Clarity Offline
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Post: #73
RE: Big West rejects UC San Diego
I agree as well the Big West only clause is probably not true. It really is as simple as if UCSD wants to play D1 athletics they have to join the WAC. The Big West has no interest.
04-21-2017 12:04 AM
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CPslograd Offline
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Post: #74
RE: Big West rejects UC San Diego
(04-07-2017 11:01 PM)Columbia Blue Wrote:  I'm just not seeing what exactly UCSD offers the WAC. Basically if invited they will come in with a D2 roster, and drag down the WAC's RPI while in transition. Not everybody can compete right out of D2 like GCU. As soon as they get acclimated to Division 1, and the kinks are worked out, they will jump to the Big West.

So in essence, the WAC is acting as kind of a triple AAA affiliate for a conference which is only marginally stronger than them (if at all). 03-yawn

I was never super jazzed about ucsd. I honestly think APU or Cal Lute could be better athletically. But if the WAC can get UCSD they have to take them. We still don't know how long the Raggies will be around.
04-21-2017 12:18 AM
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RunnerBall Offline
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Post: #75
RE: Big West rejects UC San Diego
Allllllright...CPSLO. You made it over!
Don't forget to update your "I Root For..." value. 03-wink 03-thumbsup
(This post was last modified: 04-21-2017 12:23 AM by RunnerBall.)
04-21-2017 12:21 AM
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Post: #76
RE: Big West rejects UC San Diego
(04-21-2017 12:18 AM)CPslograd Wrote:  
(04-07-2017 11:01 PM)Columbia Blue Wrote:  I'm just not seeing what exactly UCSD offers the WAC. Basically if invited they will come in with a D2 roster, and drag down the WAC's RPI while in transition. Not everybody can compete right out of D2 like GCU. As soon as they get acclimated to Division 1, and the kinks are worked out, they will jump to the Big West.

So in essence, the WAC is acting as kind of a triple AAA affiliate for a conference which is only marginally stronger than them (if at all). 03-yawn

I was never super jazzed about ucsd. I honestly think APU or Cal Lute could be better athletically. But if the WAC can get UCSD they have to take them. We still don't know how long the Raggies will be around.

Any D2 California school is good for the WAC. UCSD, CSLA, Chico, etc
04-21-2017 12:24 AM
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Clarity Offline
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Post: #77
RE: Big West rejects UC San Diego
The thing about UCSD is that the WAC needs them in case multiple members start jumping ship to hold the conference together. UCSD basketball is pretty good for D2 and are in a big market. I fail to see how adding Cal Luthern a D3 school would be better than UCSD. The WAC is at 8 now, in 2018 Cal Baptist joins and Chicago State most likely leaves. Still at 8 but there are multiple members who could leave UMKC and GCU the most likely. The conference needs to expand in anyway possible to keep the conference alive. The WAC needs to look into adding more D2 schools like Azusa or UCSD. I don't think any other D1 schools would be interested in joining the WAC.
04-21-2017 12:29 AM
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CPslograd Offline
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Post: #78
RE: Big West rejects UC San Diego
(04-21-2017 12:21 AM)RunnerBall Wrote:  Allllllright...CPSLO. You made it over!
Don't forget to update your "I Root For..." value. 03-wink 03-thumbsup

I'm still a little bummed to turn the lights off the old WAC board. But it looks like there is some decent activity here.

I forgot I used to post here during the SDS/BSU to the Big East saga, so I already had an account.
04-21-2017 12:39 AM
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RunnerBall Offline
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Post: #79
RE: Big West rejects UC San Diego
(04-21-2017 12:39 AM)CPslograd Wrote:  
(04-21-2017 12:21 AM)RunnerBall Wrote:  Allllllright...CPSLO. You made it over!
Don't forget to update your "I Root For..." value. 03-wink 03-thumbsup

I'm still a little bummed to turn the lights off the old WAC board. But it looks like there is some decent activity here.

I forgot I used to post here during the SDS/BSU to the Big East saga, so I already had an account.

I understand. That was where I really began posting too, when we joined. Ah, I recall, my first real altercation came on that board, with a Fresno St fan. Memories, good times!
We actually have enough members now to use our CSUB sub-board now! 02-13-banana

Yah, that whole Big East, SDSU, BSU thing was sure a wild fiasco! What a feeding frenzy on that. BW made some cash off BSU, IIRC, to the delight of many posters.
(This post was last modified: 04-21-2017 01:05 AM by RunnerBall.)
04-21-2017 12:57 AM
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jdgaucho Offline
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Post: #80
RE: Big West rejects UC San Diego
(04-20-2017 07:07 PM)NuMexAg Wrote:  
(04-17-2017 10:43 PM)RunnerBall Wrote:  In other news....
Not that exciting of a story, but FYI..

SDUT: "UCSD's way forward to Div. I"

http://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/spor...story.html

Based on this story, and other reports that the BW vote was entirely along UC/Cal St lines, I can't see UCSD joining the WAC.

The BW athletic directors unanimously wanted UCSD. So, they don't need to improve or grow their athletic program in order to get in. They need to convince 2 of 4 Cal State presidents to vote for them. I doubt membership in the WAC is going to advance that cause much.

I think they are more likely to spend time trying to convince 4 UC presidents to vote for Bakersfield.

If "there is no appetite for Bakersfield" or football (Sac State), then UCSD has to try to align with someone outside of California.

The BW as a whole might find Grand Canyon hard to stomach but they may be the best compromise. UCs vote for Grand Canyon, the Cal State's vote for UCSD. Azusa Pacific eventually moves up to the WAC and everything's a done deal.
04-21-2017 01:55 AM
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