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Would C-USA be better off splitting up?
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Attackcoog Offline
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Post: #161
RE: Would C-USA be better off splitting up?
(03-30-2017 07:47 AM)johnbragg Wrote:  
(03-30-2017 07:09 AM)ValleyBoy Wrote:  If CUSA wants to split into 2 new conferences there is nothing stopping them from doing so, all they have to do it just do it.

WEST
......

EAST
.......

Done.
CUSA has now been split.

Fairly certain you haven't read the thread, but just for funsies, which side keeps the automatic bid to the NCAA tournament (s), and which side is out in the cold for 8 years?

That's why I keep saying the best option is adding 2 teams to each side and playing strictly a divisional schedule with very little or no crossover play other than championship games. That gives you the cost savings of a regional conference with all the advantages of a large footprint TV deal. It also allows 16-18 teams to share the administrative costs of a conference headquarters rather than having to support 2 conference HQ's. It also is advantageous for bowl deals. You could even just add one to each side and play a 7 game conference schedule which would open space for another OOC game (possibly even a pay day game if schools needed the money). If you wanted to do something NOW to control travel costs---That's the only real option.
(This post was last modified: 03-30-2017 10:26 AM by Attackcoog.)
03-30-2017 10:24 AM
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Tom in Lazybrook Offline
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Post: #162
RE: Would C-USA be better off splitting up?
(03-30-2017 09:51 AM)MplsBison Wrote:  I think they could lose the four Texas schools and still be just fine in that dept, Tom:

- LA Tech, S Miss, and UAB will still carry on thinking themselves better than any Ark, LA, Miss, or Ala Sun Belt program
- FIU/FAU will still carry on thinking themselves better than the Sun Belt
- MTSU and WKU will still carry on thinking themselves better than the Sun Belt
- Marshall will still carry on thinking itself better than the Sun Belt


Gives a somewhat tighter footprint, and a more compact 10 schools, still enough for a CCG.


UTEP and Rice to the MWC. UTSA and N Texas, perhaps back to Sun Belt.

I'm not sure the Belt wants UNT back. I suppose Texas State would.
03-30-2017 10:25 AM
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MplsBison Offline
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Post: #163
RE: Would C-USA be better off splitting up?
Well they probably don't want to crawl back, anyway. Maybe they can form an alliance with NM St. Not sure to what end, though.

Perhaps Texas St and UTA could join up with them to form a new conference, with Sam Houston and Lamar joining.

NM St
UTSA
Texas St
N Texas
UTA
Sam Houston
Lamar

??
(This post was last modified: 03-30-2017 10:30 AM by MplsBison.)
03-30-2017 10:28 AM
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Attackcoog Offline
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Post: #164
RE: Would C-USA be better off splitting up?
(03-30-2017 10:28 AM)MplsBison Wrote:  Well they probably don't want to crawl back, anyway. Maybe they can form an alliance with NM St. Not sure to what end, though.

Perhaps Texas St and UTA could join up with them to form a new conference, with Sam Houston and Lamar joining.

NM St
UTSA
Texas St
N Texas
UTA
Sam Houston
Lamar

??

They might not want to "crawl back", but if that was their only choice, they would certainly take it over trying to start a totally new conference with no CFP membership and no NCAA autobids. UTSA and N Texas in the current Sunbelt wouldn't be much different from their current situation. That said, if the point is to limit travel costs, the two conferences would be better off working together to reorganize in a way that limits travel costs, promotes rivalries, and satisfies the desires of individual schools with regard to potential conference mates. It might not be possible---but if the monetary pressures are such that this type of thing was being looked at---some of the old grudges might have to be dismissed simply because financial realities of self preservation would have a much higher priority to the institutions harboring those old grudges.
(This post was last modified: 03-30-2017 12:21 PM by Attackcoog.)
03-30-2017 11:44 AM
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Tom in Lazybrook Offline
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Post: #165
RE: Would C-USA be better off splitting up?
(03-30-2017 11:44 AM)Attackcoog Wrote:  
(03-30-2017 10:28 AM)MplsBison Wrote:  Well they probably don't want to crawl back, anyway. Maybe they can form an alliance with NM St. Not sure to what end, though.

Perhaps Texas St and UTA could join up with them to form a new conference, with Sam Houston and Lamar joining.

NM St
UTSA
Texas St
N Texas
UTA
Sam Houston
Lamar

??

They might not want to "crawl back", but if that was their only choice, they would certainly take it over trying to start a totally new conference with no CFP membership and no NCAA autobids. UTSA and N Texas in the current Sunbelt wouldn't be much different from their current situation. That said, if the point is to limit travel costs, the two conferences would be better off working together to reorganize in a way that limits travel costs, promotes rivalries, and satisfies the desires of individual schools with regard to potential conference mates. It might not be possible---but it the monetary pressures are such that this type of thing was being looked at---some of the old grudges might have to be dismissed simply because financial realities of self preservation would have a much higher priority to the institutions harboring those old grudges.

The current proposal doesn't reduce expenses or travel for USA, Troy, Ga State, Ark State, ULM, Georgia Southern, or ULL. It might reduce some travel for App. It would reduce travel for Texas State.
03-30-2017 12:12 PM
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Attackcoog Offline
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Post: #166
RE: Would C-USA be better off splitting up?
(03-30-2017 12:12 PM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  
(03-30-2017 11:44 AM)Attackcoog Wrote:  
(03-30-2017 10:28 AM)MplsBison Wrote:  Well they probably don't want to crawl back, anyway. Maybe they can form an alliance with NM St. Not sure to what end, though.

Perhaps Texas St and UTA could join up with them to form a new conference, with Sam Houston and Lamar joining.

NM St
UTSA
Texas St
N Texas
UTA
Sam Houston
Lamar

??

They might not want to "crawl back", but if that was their only choice, they would certainly take it over trying to start a totally new conference with no CFP membership and no NCAA autobids. UTSA and N Texas in the current Sunbelt wouldn't be much different from their current situation. That said, if the point is to limit travel costs, the two conferences would be better off working together to reorganize in a way that limits travel costs, promotes rivalries, and satisfies the desires of individual schools with regard to potential conference mates. It might not be possible---but it the monetary pressures are such that this type of thing was being looked at---some of the old grudges might have to be dismissed simply because financial realities of self preservation would have a much higher priority to the institutions harboring those old grudges.

The current proposal doesn't reduce expenses or travel for USA, Troy, Ga State, Ark State, ULM, Georgia Southern, or ULL. It might reduce some travel for App. It would reduce travel for Texas State.

Im really not talking about any specific roster of teams. Its more a general point. For instance, if things got bad enough and the money wasn't there to support it---I could see the AAC being involved in a move to more regional conferences. Im just saying if things get bad enough, the financial survival of the athletic department trumps any grudge/pride considerations.
(This post was last modified: 03-30-2017 12:25 PM by Attackcoog.)
03-30-2017 12:24 PM
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DavidSt Offline
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Post: #167
RE: Would C-USA be better off splitting up?
Even if you add New Mexico State and the Texas schools does not work either.

UTEP does not want to be in the same conference as New Mexico State.


The NCAA waive a waiver for the New Big East and the AAC when they split.

We do need to subtract these schools from C-USA because if and when the Big 12 decides to expand.
Old Dominion AAC
Southern Miss. AAC
Rice AAC
UTEP MWC

East:
Marshall
FIU
FAU
Charlotte
Western Kentucky
Middle Tennessee State
UAB
Toledo
James Madison
Delaware
Georgia State
Stony Brook

West:
UTSA
North Texas
La. Tech
New Mexico State
UTRGV (looking to add football and join FBS)/Lamar
Texas State
ARkansas State
La.-Lafayette
Missouri State
Northern Iowa
South Dakota State
North Dakota State
UTA
Little Rock
UMKC
Omaha

If any schools get picked off in a future expansion? I could see West Texas A&M, Angelo State or Abilene Christian for any spots open. They are more western Texas which could help even out the balance of schools in the conference in Texas.


West side you might see either Dakota schools as conference champs in football.
03-30-2017 12:43 PM
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panama Offline
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Post: #168
RE: Would C-USA be better off splitting up?
(03-29-2017 03:00 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  
(03-29-2017 02:58 PM)AZcats Wrote:  
(03-29-2017 02:18 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  Lets take into account that the Big 12 and the other P5 conferences decides to raid again.

AAC could grab these teams.

UMass.
Old Dominion
Rice
Southern Mississippi
Wichita State all sports including football in the future.
Dayton
VCU

MWC could grab these teams.
UTEP
UTSA
Portland State
Gonzaga
Saint Mary's
Sacramento State
Chaminade to give a travel partner for Hawaii.
Hawaii for all sports
Long Beach State
Cal.-Davis
Cal. Poly
Northern Arizona
Montana
Montana State
either Colorado State-Pueblo or Colorado Mesa down the road if they lose both Colorado State and Air Force.
North Dakota State
South Dakota State

C-USA could split in half.
West:
La. Tech
North Texas
New Mexico State
West Texas A&M (only D2 school that does have a FBS size stadium that is ready to join FBS, and would be a travel partner for New Mexico State as close as they are.)
Northern Illinois?
Arkansas State
Little Rock or they could join the WAC.
La.-Lafayette
Texas State
UTA or they could join the WAC.
Illinois State? Travel partner for Northern Illinois
Missouri State
Northern Iowa
North Dakota
Sam Houston State
SFA
South Dakota

East:
UAB would miss USM.
FAU
FIU
Marshall
Mid. Tennessee State
Charlotte
Western Kentucky
Buffalo
Toledo
Georgia State
South Alabama
James Madison
Delaware
Stony Brook
Towson
Vermont
George Mason
College of Charleston
George Washington
Saint Joseph's

SBC:East:
Appalachian State
Coastal Carolina
Georgia Southern
Troy
Eastern Kentucky
Jacksonville State
Chattanooga
North Florida

SBC WEST:
La.-Monroe
Tenn. State
Central Arkansas
McNeese State
Lamar
Jackson State
UTRGV with football
Drury or UMKC

How many ways can "NO" be said? 05-nono


How many times people want to include teams that could be gone before any split happens? UTEP could be gone to the MWC before any split do happen. Same with Old Dominion and USM.

Worst in a long line of horrible plans.
03-30-2017 01:33 PM
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ValleyBoy Online
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Post: #169
RE: Would C-USA be better off splitting up?
(03-30-2017 12:24 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  
(03-30-2017 12:12 PM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  
(03-30-2017 11:44 AM)Attackcoog Wrote:  
(03-30-2017 10:28 AM)MplsBison Wrote:  Well they probably don't want to crawl back, anyway. Maybe they can form an alliance with NM St. Not sure to what end, though.

Perhaps Texas St and UTA could join up with them to form a new conference, with Sam Houston and Lamar joining.

NM St
UTSA
Texas St
N Texas
UTA
Sam Houston
Lamar

??

They might not want to "crawl back", but if that was their only choice, they would certainly take it over trying to start a totally new conference with no CFP membership and no NCAA autobids. UTSA and N Texas in the current Sunbelt wouldn't be much different from their current situation. That said, if the point is to limit travel costs, the two conferences would be better off working together to reorganize in a way that limits travel costs, promotes rivalries, and satisfies the desires of individual schools with regard to potential conference mates. It might not be possible---but it the monetary pressures are such that this type of thing was being looked at---some of the old grudges might have to be dismissed simply because financial realities of self preservation would have a much higher priority to the institutions harboring those old grudges.

The current proposal doesn't reduce expenses or travel for USA, Troy, Ga State, Ark State, ULM, Georgia Southern, or ULL. It might reduce some travel for App. It would reduce travel for Texas State.

Im really not talking about any specific roster of teams. Its more a general point. For instance, if things got bad enough and the money wasn't there to support it---I could see the AAC being involved in a move to more regional conferences. Im just saying if things get bad enough, the financial survival of the athletic department trumps any grudge/pride considerations.

CUSA present members and the one's that have taken a cut in TV money received by each member. Since they have taken this cut what have they done as a conference to try an cut costs or increase the money coming into the conference. From what I have seen they are against playing midweek football games that could increase there TV deal.
Looks like to me posters on this messageboard thread are trying to come up with a way for CUSA members to cut cost without losing revenue coming into the schools since they are the ones that have taken a revenue cut.
Now lets that a look at the SunBelt conference since its members keep being drawn in as possible additions to help cut costs only because of there location and the thought that the conference is beneath CUSA in the pecking order. First off, unlike CUSA the SunBelt has not lost revenue coming into the conference. Secondly the SunBelt has cut cost by not renewing Idaho and NMSU. The SunBelt has also cut cost by adding Coastal Carolina which allowed the conference to make cost cutting changes to how the conference scheduled basketball and other sports.
Yes several years ago each and every SunBelt member today would have jumped with joy and willingly excepted an invite to CUSA just like UNT, FAU, Middle Tenn, FIU, and WKU. But that was then and not today.
03-30-2017 01:50 PM
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Post: #170
RE: Would C-USA be better off splitting up?
(03-30-2017 12:43 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  Even if you add New Mexico State and the Texas schools does not work either.

UTEP does not want to be in the same conference as New Mexico State.


The NCAA waive a waiver for the New Big East and the AAC when they split.

We do need to subtract these schools from C-USA because if and when the Big 12 decides to expand.
Old Dominion AAC
Southern Miss. AAC
Rice AAC
UTEP MWC

East:
Marshall
FIU
FAU
Charlotte
Western Kentucky
Middle Tennessee State
UAB
Toledo
James Madison
Delaware
Georgia State
Stony Brook

West:
UTSA
North Texas
La. Tech
New Mexico State
UTRGV (looking to add football and join FBS)/Lamar
Texas State
ARkansas State
La.-Lafayette
Missouri State
Northern Iowa
South Dakota State
North Dakota State
UTA
Little Rock
UMKC
Omaha

If any schools get picked off in a future expansion? I could see West Texas A&M, Angelo State or Abilene Christian for any spots open. They are more western Texas which could help even out the balance of schools in the conference in Texas.


West side you might see either Dakota schools as conference champs in football.

You have a school from Cedar Falls Iowa in the West with a school on the Mexican border. Why David?
03-30-2017 02:24 PM
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ValleyBoy Online
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Post: #171
RE: Would C-USA be better off splitting up?
(03-30-2017 02:24 PM)billybobby777 Wrote:  You have a school from Cedar Falls Iowa in the West with a school on the Mexican border. Why David?

Do you really want an answer from David.
03-30-2017 02:36 PM
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DavidSt Offline
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Post: #172
RE: Would C-USA be better off splitting up?
(03-30-2017 02:24 PM)billybobby777 Wrote:  
(03-30-2017 12:43 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  Even if you add New Mexico State and the Texas schools does not work either.

UTEP does not want to be in the same conference as New Mexico State.


The NCAA waive a waiver for the New Big East and the AAC when they split.

We do need to subtract these schools from C-USA because if and when the Big 12 decides to expand.
Old Dominion AAC
Southern Miss. AAC
Rice AAC
UTEP MWC

East:
Marshall
FIU
FAU
Charlotte
Western Kentucky
Middle Tennessee State
UAB
Toledo
James Madison
Delaware
Georgia State
Stony Brook

West:
UTSA
North Texas
La. Tech
New Mexico State
UTRGV (looking to add football and join FBS)/Lamar
Texas State
ARkansas State
La.-Lafayette
Missouri State
Northern Iowa
South Dakota State
North Dakota State
UTA
Little Rock
UMKC
Omaha

If any schools get picked off in a future expansion? I could see West Texas A&M, Angelo State or Abilene Christian for any spots open. They are more western Texas which could help even out the balance of schools in the conference in Texas.


West side you might see either Dakota schools as conference champs in football.

You have a school from Cedar Falls Iowa in the West with a school on the Mexican border. Why David?


You could easily split the west conference from north to south.

North:
North Dakota State
South Dakota State
Northern Iowa
Missouri State
Arkansas State
Illinois State football only
Southern Illinois or Indiana State football only


South:
New Mexico State
Texas State
UTSA
Sam Houston State
North Texas
La. Tech
La.-Lafayette

North All Sports:
North Dakota State
South Dakota State
Northern Iowa
Missouri State
Arkansas State
Omaha
UMKC
Little Rock

South All Sports:
UTA
New Mexico State
Texas State
UTSA
Sam Houston State
North Texas
La. Tech
La.-Lafayette
03-30-2017 05:51 PM
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Pony94 Online
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Post: #173
Would C-USA be better off splitting up?
I hope the AAC adds Arkansas Tech
03-30-2017 06:00 PM
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connecticutguy Offline
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Post: #174
RE: Would C-USA be better off splitting up?
Rice to AAC. The rest of USA can stay where they are.
03-30-2017 06:05 PM
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billybobby777 Offline
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Post: #175
RE: Would C-USA be better off splitting up?
(03-30-2017 06:05 PM)connecticutguy Wrote:  Rice to AAC. The rest of USA can stay where they are.

But Arky Tech is not in CUSA. Rice and Arky Tech as a combo add
03-30-2017 07:43 PM
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Post: #176
RE: Would C-USA be better off splitting up?
(03-30-2017 06:00 PM)Pony94 Wrote:  I hope the AAC adds Arkansas Tech

But...but...oh yeah, we are building a new athletic facility! 03-woohoo
03-30-2017 10:16 PM
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Attackcoog Offline
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Post: #177
RE: Would C-USA be better off splitting up?
(03-30-2017 06:00 PM)Pony94 Wrote:  I hope the AAC adds Arkansas Tech

There are plenty of D2 prospects that could be travel partners in the area.
03-30-2017 10:33 PM
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Post: #178
RE: Would C-USA be better off splitting up?
Can't split. Must merge. Power in numbers. With so many members, you can create acceptable divisions politically. La Tech need never play ULaMo while participating in the same conference. A big conference makes it doable.

Appy State
Charlotte
Old Dominion
Marshall
Western Kentucky
Middle Tennessee

Georgia Southern
Georgia State
Florida Atlantic
Florida International
South Alabama
Troy

UAB
USM
Louisiana Tech
Texas-El Paso
North Texas
ULaLa

ULaMo
Rice
Arkansas State
Texas-San Antonio
Texas State
NMSU

This separates La Tech and ULaMo, also UTEP and NMSU. Reduces travel costs. Yes, I'm ignoring Coastal Carolina. Those divisions are for football only. You could reconfigure for every other sport. Would generate some excitement I think.
03-31-2017 06:39 PM
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billybobby777 Offline
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Post: #179
RE: Would C-USA be better off splitting up?
(03-31-2017 06:39 PM)USM@FTL Wrote:  Can't split. Must merge. Power in numbers. With so many members, you can create acceptable divisions politically. La Tech need never play ULaMo while participating in the same conference. A big conference makes it doable.

Appy State
Charlotte
Old Dominion
Marshall
Western Kentucky
Middle Tennessee

Georgia Southern
Georgia State
Florida Atlantic
Florida International
South Alabama
Troy

UAB
USM
Louisiana Tech
Texas-El Paso
North Texas
ULaLa

ULaMo
Rice
Arkansas State
Texas-San Antonio
Texas State
NMSU

This separates La Tech and ULaMo, also UTEP and NMSU. Reduces travel costs. Yes, I'm ignoring Coastal Carolina. Those divisions are for football only. You could reconfigure for every other sport. Would generate some excitement I think.

Poor Rice. In a division with Monroe, Arky St, Texas St, UTSA....crazy to think 20 years ago
03-31-2017 09:29 PM
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ValleyBoy Online
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Post: #180
RE: Would C-USA be better off splitting up?
(03-31-2017 06:39 PM)USM@FTL Wrote:  Can't split. Must merge. Power in numbers. With so many members, you can create acceptable divisions politically. La Tech need never play ULaMo while participating in the same conference. A big conference makes it doable.

Appy State
Charlotte
Old Dominion
Marshall
Western Kentucky
Middle Tennessee

Georgia Southern
Georgia State
Florida Atlantic
Florida International
South Alabama
Troy

UAB
USM
Louisiana Tech
Texas-El Paso
North Texas
ULaLa

ULaMo
Rice
Arkansas State
Texas-San Antonio
Texas State
NMSU

This separates La Tech and ULaMo, also UTEP and NMSU. Reduces travel costs. Yes, I'm ignoring Coastal Carolina. Those divisions are for football only. You could reconfigure for every other sport. Would generate some excitement I think.

If the two conferences merge as you say in your post you forgot Coastal Carolina, UTA, and Little Rock. They would have to be included in any merger. Also NMSU since they are not a member of either two fo the conferences they would have to be invited.
03-31-2017 11:14 PM
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