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Virginia Beach arena update
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ODU2K1 Offline
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Post: #121
RE: Virginia Beach arena update
(11-08-2017 03:38 PM)Gilesfan Wrote:  
(11-08-2017 01:40 PM)Monarchblue Wrote:  
(11-08-2017 12:09 PM)Gilesfan Wrote:  
(11-08-2017 12:02 PM)Monarchblue Wrote:  
(11-08-2017 10:49 AM)Blue_Trombone Wrote:  I wonder if Kenny Alexander has already called the arena group to talk about Military Circle.
How do you suggest they aquire all of that land quickly to make space for an arena at Military Circle?

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They would likely purchase land from Costco, which would allow Costco to move to a larger site, which is what they want to do.

Then bury the stadium back there where Costco is? It is just a non starter, and generally a terrible location aside from that because the area sucks.

What makes it a terrible location?

For one the Costco site is too small. For another Glenrock Road and Poplar Hall Dr. are far too small to deal with the amount of traffic a decent size arena will generate. Finally, there is not enough existing ancillary amenities (restaurants/bars) in walking distance to support pre and post event activities or space to build them.
11-08-2017 04:11 PM
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Gilesfan Offline
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Post: #122
RE: Virginia Beach arena update
(11-08-2017 04:11 PM)ODU2K1 Wrote:  
(11-08-2017 03:38 PM)Gilesfan Wrote:  
(11-08-2017 01:40 PM)Monarchblue Wrote:  
(11-08-2017 12:09 PM)Gilesfan Wrote:  
(11-08-2017 12:02 PM)Monarchblue Wrote:  How do you suggest they aquire all of that land quickly to make space for an arena at Military Circle?

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They would likely purchase land from Costco, which would allow Costco to move to a larger site, which is what they want to do.

Then bury the stadium back there where Costco is? It is just a non starter, and generally a terrible location aside from that because the area sucks.

What makes it a terrible location?

For one the Costco site is too small. For another Glenrock Road and Poplar Hall Dr. are far too small to deal with the amount of traffic a decent size arena will generate. Finally, there is not enough existing ancillary amenities (restaurants/bars) in walking distance to support pre and post event activities or space to build them.

The city claims to have 15 acres; I'm not sure how suitable that is for arena development. They would likely make road and infrastructure improvements to compliment the arena. FWIW, typically retail is built after the arena gets up and running.

In terms of physical location (access to interstate 64 is imperative), there aren't many other options for an arena. Even Scope is awful in terms of traffic.
11-08-2017 04:22 PM
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jumpshooter Offline
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Post: #123
RE: Virginia Beach arena update
Not that it would ever happen, but what a golden opportunity for several cities to get together and build something (yes, collaborate) on something beneficial to the entire region. We've already got a guy in Ballard who builds all over the region and appears to have solid ideas and resources. Would a summit meeting be possible?

Yes, I'm a dreamer.
11-08-2017 04:35 PM
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bushwack Offline
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Post: #124
RE: Virginia Beach arena update
(11-08-2017 04:35 PM)jumpshooter Wrote:  Not that it would ever happen, but what a golden opportunity for several cities to get together and build something (yes, collaborate) on something beneficial to the entire region. We've already got a guy in Ballard who builds all over the region and appears to have solid ideas and resources. Would a summit meeting be possible?

Yes, I'm a dreamer.

This is the main reason why Hampton Roads will never have a major league team/arena. Whatever city the stadium/team will be located in will need the surrounding cities financial help to build said stadium, but the revenue sharing won't want to be given and the other cities that helped finance the team/stadium won't reap the financial gains or revenue that the host city will.

Like you stated in the opening of your post, it just will never happen. Plus to add salt into the wound I would hate to imagine traffic on 64 or 264 on a Friday night trying to get to stadium/arena to watch said team.
11-08-2017 04:51 PM
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monarx Offline
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Post: #125
RE: Virginia Beach arena update
(11-08-2017 04:11 PM)ODU2K1 Wrote:  
(11-08-2017 03:38 PM)Gilesfan Wrote:  
(11-08-2017 01:40 PM)Monarchblue Wrote:  
(11-08-2017 12:09 PM)Gilesfan Wrote:  
(11-08-2017 12:02 PM)Monarchblue Wrote:  How do you suggest they aquire all of that land quickly to make space for an arena at Military Circle?

Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk

They would likely purchase land from Costco, which would allow Costco to move to a larger site, which is what they want to do.

Then bury the stadium back there where Costco is? It is just a non starter, and generally a terrible location aside from that because the area sucks.

What makes it a terrible location?

For one the Costco site is too small. For another Glenrock Road and Poplar Hall Dr. are far too small to deal with the amount of traffic a decent size arena will generate. Finally, there is not enough existing ancillary amenities (restaurants/bars) in walking distance to support pre and post event activities or space to build them.

They could build a new off ramp off of 64 going into VB Blvd by Military Circle. Thats something thats been needed for a long time anyway. Do that and the traffic issue should be solved.
11-08-2017 05:14 PM
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HeadsetGuy Offline
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Post: #126
RE: Virginia Beach arena update
(05-07-2017 07:00 AM)HeadsetGuy Wrote:  I might still be in the minority on this deal...there are so many red flags...Birdneck Road as a major road artery to the stadium...the parking garage that VB was left holding the bag to pay for...the rejection of light rail by VB...the silly talking point of having a limited summer schedule (the building and its mechanicals still run occupied or not)...moving the veterans memorial (not the actual movement, but the lack of tact announcing it), the mess of the financing deals...
I still don't think it will be built or at best it will be an empty white elephant at the terminus of an interstate spur with no major tenant; the amphitheater just miles away (needing shows too); a little regional cooperation with a build site of Military Circle would have been best.

the NBA main office hated it (the VB site), the VB public hates it (no Light RR) and in the end no reputable banker liked the idea either...no surprises here
11-08-2017 05:56 PM
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Gilesfan Offline
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Post: #127
RE: Virginia Beach arena update
yeah, VB hates everything anyways. So short sighted.
11-08-2017 05:57 PM
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Monarchblue Offline
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Post: #128
RE: Virginia Beach arena update
(11-08-2017 03:38 PM)Gilesfan Wrote:  
(11-08-2017 01:40 PM)Monarchblue Wrote:  
(11-08-2017 12:09 PM)Gilesfan Wrote:  
(11-08-2017 12:02 PM)Monarchblue Wrote:  
(11-08-2017 10:49 AM)Blue_Trombone Wrote:  I wonder if Kenny Alexander has already called the arena group to talk about Military Circle.
How do you suggest they aquire all of that land quickly to make space for an arena at Military Circle?

Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk

They would likely purchase land from Costco, which would allow Costco to move to a larger site, which is what they want to do.

Then bury the stadium back there where Costco is? It is just a non starter, and generally a terrible location aside from that because the area sucks.

What makes it a terrible location?
What isn't bad about Militart Circle/JANAF? Traffic is a perpetual mess, crime is bad, the area should be in every urban planning textbook as an example of how not to do it, there is a crap ton of property that is owned by a crap ton of companies surrounding a crumbling mall that cannot be easily consolidated.

I know some people think the stadium could be a catalyst for redevelopment , but the problem is that there are so many obstacles in that area that it will take half a century to redevelop it under the best of circumstances. I'm not a huge fan of a stadium at the beach, but would be more than happy to drive an extra 20 minutes to not have to spend any more time than I have to in that area.

The beach, Town Center, and Downtown are the only locations that make sense, with an outside possibility of somewhere around Greenbriar

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11-08-2017 08:05 PM
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Gilesfan Offline
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Post: #129
RE: Virginia Beach arena update
(11-08-2017 08:05 PM)Monarchblue Wrote:  
(11-08-2017 03:38 PM)Gilesfan Wrote:  
(11-08-2017 01:40 PM)Monarchblue Wrote:  
(11-08-2017 12:09 PM)Gilesfan Wrote:  
(11-08-2017 12:02 PM)Monarchblue Wrote:  How do you suggest they aquire all of that land quickly to make space for an arena at Military Circle?

Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk

They would likely purchase land from Costco, which would allow Costco to move to a larger site, which is what they want to do.

Then bury the stadium back there where Costco is? It is just a non starter, and generally a terrible location aside from that because the area sucks.

What makes it a terrible location?
What isn't bad about Militart Circle/JANAF? Traffic is a perpetual mess, crime is bad, the area should be in every urban planning textbook as an example of how not to do it, there is a crap ton of property that is owned by a crap ton of companies surrounding a crumbling mall that cannot be easily consolidated.

I know some people think the stadium could be a catalyst for redevelopment , but the problem is that there are so many obstacles in that area that it will take half a century to redevelop it under the best of circumstances. I'm not a huge fan of a stadium at the beach, but would be more than happy to drive an extra 20 minutes to not have to spend any more time than I have to in that area.

The beach, Town Center, and Downtown are the only locations that make sense, with an outside possibility of somewhere around Greenbriar

Sent from my Pixel C using Tapatalk

You seem to think areas with higher demographics(income) means better stadium locations. Have you been to many pro arenas?

You are not putting a pro arena in Greenbrier. Hard to navigate traffic, there is likely no room, and land cost would probably be prohibitive. Residents in greenbrier would probably shoot it down anyways; who wants an Arena in the middle of the PUD?

Reacing scope makes some sense. Town center really doesnt. The only viable alternatives to account for the massive traffic nightmare are Military circle and Downtown.
11-08-2017 08:18 PM
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elon77 Offline
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Post: #130
RE: Virginia Beach arena update
Best place to build it would be Northern Suffolk near the MM Bridge Tunnel. Just a few miles from Newport News and Hampton and now that the ML King Expressway is open it's not to far from Downtown Norfolk. Fair road system in place with 664 and the Western Freeway already in place. Plenty of places to eat and shop in Harbour View and more on the way. Just a thought
11-08-2017 10:23 PM
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Gilesfan Offline
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Post: #131
RE: Virginia Beach arena update
(11-08-2017 10:23 PM)elon77 Wrote:  Best place to build it would be Northern Suffolk near the MM Bridge Tunnel. Just a few miles from Newport News and Hampton and now that the ML King Expressway is open it's not to far from Downtown Norfolk. Fair road system in place with 664 and the Western Freeway already in place. Plenty of places to eat and shop in Harbour View and more on the way. Just a thought

The problem might be the distance people would have to drive. How far of a drive is that for the majority of the fanbase to attend a MOnday night game?
11-08-2017 10:44 PM
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Razor Ramon Monarch Offline
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Post: #132
RE: Virginia Beach arena update
Movement mortgage bought part or all of military circle mall from the city I believe.

I know at the very least they totally renovated it. It's not going anywhere.

I also happen to think the arena is a terrible idea.

Not having a dedicated tenant already is a recipe for disaster.

Btw, the oceanfront is becoming more and more of a dump as well. So glad I moved out of Hampton Roads lol.
11-08-2017 10:55 PM
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GhentFan Offline
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Post: #133
RE: Virginia Beach arena update
(11-08-2017 12:05 PM)ODUDrunkard13 Wrote:  Scope is only viable spot to build for Norfolk. But like HM, I doubt the money is there to make it work. Hope I'm wrong.

The projects are scheduled to come down.

The scope may be too small of a sight, if they want to do a multi-purpose center and perhaps add a convention center to compete with VB.

I labeled 3 sites that could work in theory.

[Image: 13ynxtu.png]
11-08-2017 11:16 PM
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ODUDrunkard13 Offline
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Post: #134
RE: Virginia Beach arena update
(11-08-2017 11:16 PM)GhentFan Wrote:  
(11-08-2017 12:05 PM)ODUDrunkard13 Wrote:  Scope is only viable spot to build for Norfolk. But like HM, I doubt the money is there to make it work. Hope I'm wrong.

The projects are scheduled to come down.

The scope may be too small of a sight, if they want to do a multi-purpose center and perhaps add a convention center to compete with VB.

I labeled 3 sites that could work in theory.

[Image: 13ynxtu.png]

1 doesnt work at all, as that would require demolishing a brand new bus depot, a newer firehouse and an apartment development being built as we speak. The other 2 won't be viable for another 5 years at least. 10 years is the estimate for when all of the public housing will be vacated.

Further, there are 2 hotels with convention centers in downtown already. So, that's not a necessity. .

There is more than enough land where the Scope sits, just need a more efficient design. Lot of wasted space with Scope.
(This post was last modified: 11-08-2017 11:31 PM by ODUDrunkard13.)
11-08-2017 11:24 PM
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BigBlueMonarch Offline
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Post: #135
RE: Virginia Beach arena update
What about all the surface lots around Harbor Park? Is there not enough room there to build an arena and them build parking decks to support it?

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11-09-2017 06:59 AM
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BigBlueMonarch Offline
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Post: #136
RE: Virginia Beach arena update
(11-09-2017 06:59 AM)BigBlueMonarch Wrote:  What about all the surface lots around Harbor Park? Is there not enough room there to build an arena and them build parking decks to support it?

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Never mind, answered my own question. Harbor Park eats up most of that space.

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11-09-2017 07:02 AM
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ODUDrunkard13 Offline
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Post: #137
RE: Virginia Beach arena update
VB City council members are asked about future after deal fails to close, say they hope they can finish the arena.
https://pilotonline.com/news/government/...c591d.html
(This post was last modified: 11-09-2017 08:38 AM by ODUDrunkard13.)
11-09-2017 08:37 AM
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EverRespect Offline
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Post: #138
RE: Virginia Beach arena update
(11-08-2017 10:55 PM)Razor Ramon Monarch Wrote:  Movement mortgage bought part or all of military circle mall from the city I believe.

I know at the very least they totally renovated it. It's not going anywhere.

I also happen to think the arena is a terrible idea.

Not having a dedicated tenant already is a recipe for disaster.

Btw, the oceanfront is becoming more and more of a dump as well. So glad I moved out of Hampton Roads lol.

Where did you move?

I'm looking to get out of here as well, but unfortunately the money in my profession is in Northern Virginia and that is not an option I am willing to take. You are right though, Chesapeake and Virginia Beach are both turning into dumps unless you are so far off the beaten path that you are commuting an hour just to work. My house in Newport News is worth about $50k less than when I bought it 10 years ago. While the neighborhood and quality of life is still decent, it is going nowhere and once my 3rd grade son hits middle school, we'll have to shell out $12k per year for private school because our middle school is garbage and frankly dangerous.

Looking at Charleston, Savannah, and Pittsburgh but opportunities are few and far between. A few now and then in Charleston, but the pay is crap there. Best opportunities for salary and cost of living seem to be in San Antonio, but my wife doesn't want to be that far from family.
11-09-2017 08:40 AM
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T-Mac Offline
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Post: #139
RE: Virginia Beach arena update
Interesting to see two people who don't live in Virginia Beach or Chesapeake speak with such authority about the condition of both cities. As a resident of Virginia Beach and a business owner in both cities, I can assure both of you that both cities are not on the decline and there's much more evidence to support the argument that both cities are improving in many/most areas.
11-09-2017 08:57 AM
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EverRespect Offline
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Post: #140
RE: Virginia Beach arena update
(11-09-2017 08:57 AM)T-Mac Wrote:  Interesting to see two people who don't live in Virginia Beach or Chesapeake speak with such authority about the condition of both cities. As a resident of Virginia Beach and a business owner in both cities, I can assure both of you that both cities are not on the decline and there's much more evidence to support the argument that both cities are improving in many/most areas.

If you are looking for a simple, hassle-free quality of life, they are in decline. If you are looking for urban sprawl, traffic, and long commutes, both cities are improving. It is all in the individual preferences. I do not prefer city life. If I did, I would be in Northern Virginia, not Hampton Roads.
11-09-2017 09:16 AM
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