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WAC season awards
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ThunderDan49 Offline
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Post: #21
RE: WAC season awards
(03-07-2017 06:48 PM)FINALFOUR1970SWEETSIXTEEN1992 Wrote:  
(03-07-2017 03:52 PM)LopesUp Wrote:  
(03-07-2017 03:30 PM)gleadley Wrote:  
(03-07-2017 03:26 PM)FINALFOUR1970SWEETSIXTEEN1992 Wrote:  Russell deserved the award. Ian Baker deserved the award.


That might be the most coherent thing I've ever seen you post, Frank. It probably the most accurate assessment I've read today. Thanks for sharing that perspective.
Yup, and only one of them earned it.

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You don't know **** about college basketball if you don't think Ian Baker didn't deserve it.

There is a difference between earned and deserved and I don't think LopesUp was saying Baker didn't deserve it, but even in advance stats. DeWayne earned it more.
03-07-2017 07:01 PM
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LopesUp Offline
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Post: #22
RE: WAC season awards
Thanks TD49. You will quickly learn that rationale explanations and facts have no effect on some individuals in this message board. They would rather resort to personal attacks and name calling. It's all good.

(03-07-2017 07:01 PM)ThunderDan49 Wrote:  
(03-07-2017 06:48 PM)FINALFOUR1970SWEETSIXTEEN1992 Wrote:  
(03-07-2017 03:52 PM)LopesUp Wrote:  
(03-07-2017 03:30 PM)gleadley Wrote:  
(03-07-2017 03:26 PM)FINALFOUR1970SWEETSIXTEEN1992 Wrote:  Russell deserved the award. Ian Baker deserved the award.


That might be the most coherent thing I've ever seen you post, Frank. It probably the most accurate assessment I've read today. Thanks for sharing that perspective.
Yup, and only one of them earned it.

Sent from my SM-N920T using CSNbbs mobile app


You don't know **** about college basketball if you don't think Ian Baker didn't deserve it.

There is a difference between earned and deserved and I don't think LopesUp was saying Baker didn't deserve it, but even in advance stats. DeWayne earned it more.
03-07-2017 07:09 PM
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gleadley Offline
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Post: #23
RE: WAC season awards
(03-07-2017 07:09 PM)LopesUp Wrote:  Thanks TD49. You will quickly learn that rationale explanations and facts have no effect on some individuals in this message board. They would rather resort to personal attacks and name calling. It's all good.

A certain tiny-handed, orange commander in chief comes to mind. Hahahaha.
(This post was last modified: 03-07-2017 07:23 PM by gleadley.)
03-07-2017 07:22 PM
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FINALFOUR1970SWEETSIXTEEN1992 Offline
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Post: #24
RE: WAC season awards
Ian Baker deserved and earned WAC Player of the Year.
03-07-2017 07:38 PM
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LopesUp Offline
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Post: #25
RE: WAC season awards
(03-07-2017 07:38 PM)FINALFOUR1970SWEETSIXTEEN1992 Wrote:  Ian Baker deserved and earned WAC Player of the Year.
Alternative facts.
03-07-2017 07:52 PM
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SeattleVandals Offline
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Post: #26
RE: WAC season awards
What about wins? Has any GCU fan factored into how Baker was on the better team? What about defense? I keep seeing just stats used. What about defense? Who made a bigger impact in the game when on the floor? Maybe like Kavas beating Oscar for FOY, which I do disagree with, Baker just was the better overall player. Stats arent everything. I have no issue with Baker winning.

Granted, I didnt watch enough GCU and NMSU to definitively know if Baker or Russell is the better defender. Just an idea no one seems to be using. Just name calling and who was higher in stats

Baker was on the all-defense team last year
(This post was last modified: 03-07-2017 09:11 PM by SeattleVandals.)
03-07-2017 09:08 PM
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FINALFOUR1970SWEETSIXTEEN1992 Offline
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Post: #27
RE: WAC season awards
(03-07-2017 07:52 PM)LopesUp Wrote:  
(03-07-2017 07:38 PM)FINALFOUR1970SWEETSIXTEEN1992 Wrote:  Ian Baker deserved and earned WAC Player of the Year.
Alternative facts.


You are full of crap.
(This post was last modified: 03-07-2017 09:11 PM by FINALFOUR1970SWEETSIXTEEN1992.)
03-07-2017 09:10 PM
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LopesUp Offline
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Post: #28
RE: WAC season awards
(03-07-2017 09:10 PM)FINALFOUR1970SWEETSIXTEEN1992 Wrote:  
(03-07-2017 07:52 PM)LopesUp Wrote:  
(03-07-2017 07:38 PM)FINALFOUR1970SWEETSIXTEEN1992 Wrote:  Ian Baker deserved and earned WAC Player of the Year.
Alternative facts.


You are full of crap.

Probably
03-07-2017 09:24 PM
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dancingNMSUaggie Online
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Post: #29
RE: WAC season awards
(03-07-2017 09:24 PM)LopesUp Wrote:  
(03-07-2017 09:10 PM)FINALFOUR1970SWEETSIXTEEN1992 Wrote:  
(03-07-2017 07:52 PM)LopesUp Wrote:  
(03-07-2017 07:38 PM)FINALFOUR1970SWEETSIXTEEN1992 Wrote:  Ian Baker deserved and earned WAC Player of the Year.
Alternative facts.


You are full of crap.

Probably

OK Lopes fans. Quit whining. My fellow Aggie fans put me on my place when I was whining about Barnes. Russell was no way much better than Baker. Quit whining and accept that Baker won.
03-07-2017 10:28 PM
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dancingNMSUaggie Online
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Post: #30
RE: WAC season awards
(03-07-2017 09:24 PM)LopesUp Wrote:  
(03-07-2017 09:10 PM)FINALFOUR1970SWEETSIXTEEN1992 Wrote:  
(03-07-2017 07:52 PM)LopesUp Wrote:  
(03-07-2017 07:38 PM)FINALFOUR1970SWEETSIXTEEN1992 Wrote:  Ian Baker deserved and earned WAC Player of the Year.
Alternative facts.


You are full of crap.

Probably

OK Lopes fans. Quit whining. My fellow Aggie fans put me on my place when I was whining about Barnes. Russell was no way much better than Baker. Quit whining and accept that Baker won.
03-07-2017 10:28 PM
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ThunderDan49 Offline
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Post: #31
RE: WAC season awards
(03-07-2017 09:08 PM)SeattleVandals Wrote:  What about wins? Has any GCU fan factored into how Baker was on the better team? What about defense? I keep seeing just stats used. What about defense? Who made a bigger impact in the game when on the floor? Maybe like Kavas beating Oscar for FOY, which I do disagree with, Baker just was the better overall player. Stats arent everything. I have no issue with Baker winning.

Granted, I didnt watch enough GCU and NMSU to definitively know if Baker or Russell is the better defender. Just an idea no one seems to be using. Just name calling and who was higher in stats

Baker was on the all-defense team last year

DeWayne has a slightly better defensive win share, so if you want to factor defense into it, DeWayne does a better job contributing to a win on the defensive end. I'm pulling this from advance metrics Here and most of them show DeWayne is the better player. I'm not just trying to use the common stats to justify it.
03-07-2017 10:35 PM
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FINALFOUR1970SWEETSIXTEEN1992 Offline
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Post: #32
RE: WAC season awards
If you look at stats for WAC games only, you'll see why Ian Baker is the WAC Player of the Year.

He averaged 17.3 PPG, 5.0 RPG, and 5.1 APG. He is the only player to rank in the top of the conference in these categories. Baker also finished ahead of Russell in Assist/Turnover Ratio.
03-07-2017 10:48 PM
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ThunderDan49 Offline
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Post: #33
RE: WAC season awards
(03-07-2017 10:48 PM)FINALFOUR1970SWEETSIXTEEN1992 Wrote:  If you look at stats for WAC games only, you'll see why Ian Baker is the WAC Player of the Year.

He averaged 17.3 PPG, 5.0 RPG, and 5.1 APG. He is the only player to rank in the top of the conference in these categories. Baker also finished ahead of Russell in Assist/Turnover Ratio.

If the award is for the year, then you can't just look at conference games as the reason someone should win the award.
03-07-2017 10:55 PM
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FINALFOUR1970SWEETSIXTEEN1992 Offline
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Post: #34
RE: WAC season awards
If Russell was to be a first round draft pick in the NBA, then maybe you guys would have an argument, but the truth is Russell isn't any better than Baker. Baker deserved and earned the award. GCU fans can cry all you want, but nothing is going to change that NMSU will have it's third All-American in 4 years :)
03-07-2017 11:58 PM
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ThunderDan49 Offline
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Post: #35
RE: WAC season awards
(03-07-2017 11:58 PM)FINALFOUR1970SWEETSIXTEEN1992 Wrote:  If Russell was to be a first round draft pick in the NBA, then maybe you guys would have an argument, but the truth is Russell isn't any better than Baker. Baker deserved and earned the award. GCU fans can cry all you want, but nothing is going to change that NMSU will have it's third All-American in 4 years :)

Lol and you NMSU talk about GCU fans drinking the purple Kool-Aid. Looks like you better check yourself before you wreck yourself.
03-08-2017 12:03 AM
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gleadley Offline
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Post: #36
RE: WAC season awards
That's like Dwight Schulte calling himself "Assistant Manager" when he was an assistant to the manager. If you are trying to sell us again on Aggie players being named honorable mention to the All-American teams as actual All-Americans, nobody is buying. Joshua Braun is an ACTUAL two time 1st Team Academic All-American.
03-08-2017 12:08 AM
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LopesUp Offline
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Post: #37
RE: WAC season awards
I think he's trying to say its third WAC POY in 4 years. He just doesn't know any better. CUE- resume rant.

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03-08-2017 12:22 AM
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NMSUPistolPete Offline
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Post: #38
RE: WAC season awards
Looking at the stats between Russell and Baker, I can understand why Baker won WAC POTY.

In actuality, if one takes into account the time (minutes per game) each player played on the court during WAC play. Baker was actually more product per minute of play than Russell. Baker had a higher production for points and rebounds but Russell was still higher for assists. Neither Russell nor Baker had a great field goal percentage. But Baker shot the ball noticeable better from the free throw line than Russell. Baker also had a better assist to turnover ratio; less turnovers. Overall, in conference play, Baker was more efficient than Russell.

Another thing to take into account is Russell had a substantial drop in his scoring average once WAC play started. Bakers stayed pretty constant throughout the season... in fact his stats were steadily increasing during WAC play.

Russell OOC scoring average - 23.6 ppg
Russell in WAC play - 18.7 ppg (0.478 points/minute)
Baker OOC scoring average - 16.1 ppg,
Baker in WAC play - 17.3 ppg (0.499 points/minute)

I actually think Josh Braun's strong performance during WAC play (once he was healthy) diminished Dewayne Russell's value on the GCU team. Ian Baker on the other hand, was always numero uno for NMSU.
(This post was last modified: 03-08-2017 03:43 AM by NMSUPistolPete.)
03-08-2017 03:34 AM
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gleadley Offline
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Post: #39
RE: WAC season awards
Russell also played with a broken bone in his shooting hand through conference play, so there is that. I don't think it's fair to diminish what either young man did. I can't believe I'm saying this but like Frank suggested, they both put up numbers deserving of the award. Baker got it.

I'm just glad the conference didn't try to do something like a co-POY. I think that would have been worse than not getting it at all. Baker gets the award. Russell carries the chip on his shoulder into off-season training/prep/team workouts. Everyone wins.
03-08-2017 10:54 AM
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FINALFOUR1970SWEETSIXTEEN1992 Offline
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Post: #40
RE: WAC season awards
(03-08-2017 12:08 AM)gleadley Wrote:  That's like Dwight Schulte calling himself "Assistant Manager" when he was an assistant to the manager. If you are trying to sell us again on Aggie players being named honorable mention to the All-American teams as actual All-Americans, nobody is buying. Joshua Braun is an ACTUAL two time 1st Team Academic All-American.


Daniel Mullings, Pascal Siakam, and Ian Baker are AP Honorable Mention All-Americans.
(This post was last modified: 03-08-2017 12:58 PM by FINALFOUR1970SWEETSIXTEEN1992.)
03-08-2017 12:55 PM
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