VCU and WSU will make UConn happy???

Short of the ACC, the only thing that will make UConn bball fans happy is playing Nova, Gtown, etc every year.

(03-02-2017 10:18 AM)Soobahk40050 Wrote:  A basketball expansion (particularly with a school like Wichita State that is considering adding football) seems smart. However, the conference does need to be cautious. I always hate the phrase "well we tried it before and it didn't work," because circumstances are always changing, but the history of the AAC/Big East and the basketball/football school division should give them reason to be smart about who to expand with and how to develop the league. Wichita could be the new Villanova in terms of football - always a possibility but never happening. I am not saying it is a bad idea at all, in fact it does make sense in this iteration, just that the conference needs to tread carefully and make good decisions.

I have generally imagined the AAC as eventually being an academic focused league, with smaller privates and generally well rated publics. So for instance, if Houston ever does leave for the Big 12, take Rice. Then if Cincy leaves, take UMass or Buffalo(?) and you wind up with a North of: Temple, UConn, UMass, South Florida (heavy research) + ECU and UCF. The South would be SMU/Tulsa/Rice/Tulane + Navy and Memphis. I feel like that is an identity worth building, so any basketball additions need to leave open that possibility, or also be solid research institutions or well rated privates.

Im not sure the AAC knows exactly what the AAC wants to be when it grows up. If the goal is earning a near P5 pay check--then small privates like Rice probably wont help much in progressing toward that goal. You'd want solid TV draws with the success on the field and big fan bases (as G5 schools go). You want schools that appeal to TV audiences, increase ratings, and build media value. On the other hand, if the idea is to be a more prestigious exclusive academic conference---kind of a poor mans ACC---then replacement schools like Rice or UMass might make a ton more sense.

Up to now, the AAC has been able to select schools that largely provide all those components in a single package (TV value, athletic performance, big athletic budget, good TV market, large fanbase, and solid academics). This is borne out by the stats. The AAC has had the highest average attendance in the G5 by a good margin (so, largest fan bases). Every AAC school is a top 200 USNWP school except for one. The AAC has the highest average athletic budgets in the G5. The AAC has had excellent success on the football field managing to get multiple teams into the top 25 most years. Finally, the AAC has seen solid basketball success as a consistent multi-bid league---even winning one national championship in its short 3 year history.

So, up to now---the AAC has been able to select schools that each fits BOTH the academic and "P6" role. Going forward however, I don't see any schools that really fit that dual role mold. There are really no schools left that are top 200 USNWR schools, with big fan bases, with large athletic budgets, that perform well on the football and basketball fields of play. From here on--the AAC will have to make a real decision on what direction it wants to go---Academics or media value.

(03-02-2017 10:52 AM)MplsBison Wrote:  VCU and WSU will make UConn happy???

Short of the ACC, the only thing that will make UConn bball fans happy is playing Nova, Gtown, etc every year.

Damn right. Adding those 3 would instantly create an AAC conference situation that draws more bids come March than the NBE. The AAC has been building up nicely till now with coaching hires. It's just building those roasters back up to full strength. Even SMU has been playing short-handed.

Such a conference would have a coaching group to rival most every conference in the country.

(03-02-2017 09:03 AM)CliftonAve Wrote:  

(03-02-2017 07:55 AM)orangefan Wrote:  Makes a huge amount of sense. The conference has a few strong brands, but too many of the members have weak basketball programs. Add the three listed and the AAC separates itself from high mid-majors and moves closer to major status.

Query whether this is the American's reaction to rumors about UConn talking to the Big East.

My guess is these schools were in talks before UConn started talking to the BE. The AAC has been dealing with rumors of schools departing for the past few years now (everyone to the BigXII).

(03-02-2017 08:46 AM)GoldenWarrior11 Wrote:  Would be extremely smart move. Not only does it improve basketball but each school is within the footprint.

The question, however, is whether these additions help increase value of next TV deal. If they don't, the AAC then needs the next deal to be much higher from football to not take away anything from current members.

Not sure if it helps the contract-- possibly, maybe. If anything though, it will get the conference more NCAA Tourny credits. As it stands this conference has been only able to muster 2-3 tourney bids a year. That's a drastic decline from what UC, UConn and USF were used to while in the Big East.

AAC had 4 bids last year.

(03-02-2017 11:13 AM)BigEastHomer Wrote:  Adding those 3 would instantly create an AAC conference situation that draws more bids come March than the NBE.

That's not the point.

The point is that UConn fans and admin (for the sake of ticket sales) want to play known, historical rivals. Not teams in Texas, Florida, etc. that are ranked highly but the fans don't know or care about.

(03-02-2017 11:13 AM)BigEastHomer Wrote:  It's just building those roasters back up to full strength.

Well thank goodness, wouldn't want anyone to go hungry!

Wichita, St. Louis and Dayton would end the plurality the AAC has with the MVC and A10.

It would get basketball in the AAC back to the level it was in back during the time of CUSA 1.0.

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While this may be a good thing, everyone needs to be reminded that this article came from one of the worst sources for Big 12 expansion that existed. Mark Blaudschun was wrong about virtually everything when it came to Big 12 expansion news. What makes you think he suddenly is right or in the know about AAC expansion?

(03-02-2017 11:04 AM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(03-02-2017 10:18 AM)Soobahk40050 Wrote:  A basketball expansion (particularly with a school like Wichita State that is considering adding football) seems smart. However, the conference does need to be cautious. I always hate the phrase "well we tried it before and it didn't work," because circumstances are always changing, but the history of the AAC/Big East and the basketball/football school division should give them reason to be smart about who to expand with and how to develop the league. Wichita could be the new Villanova in terms of football - always a possibility but never happening. I am not saying it is a bad idea at all, in fact it does make sense in this iteration, just that the conference needs to tread carefully and make good decisions.

I have generally imagined the AAC as eventually being an academic focused league, with smaller privates and generally well rated publics. So for instance, if Houston ever does leave for the Big 12, take Rice. Then if Cincy leaves, take UMass or Buffalo(?) and you wind up with a North of: Temple, UConn, UMass, South Florida (heavy research) + ECU and UCF. The South would be SMU/Tulsa/Rice/Tulane + Navy and Memphis. I feel like that is an identity worth building, so any basketball additions need to leave open that possibility, or also be solid research institutions or well rated privates.

Im not sure the AAC knows exactly what the AAC wants to be when it grows up. If the goal is earning a near P5 pay check--then small privates like Rice probably wont help much in progressing toward that goal. You'd want solid TV draws with the success on the field and big fan bases (as G5 schools go). You want schools that appeal to TV audiences, increase ratings, and build media value. On the other hand, if the idea is to be a more prestigious exclusive academic conference---kind of a poor mans ACC---then replacement schools like Rice or UMass might make a ton more sense.

Up to now, the AAC has been able to select schools that largely provide all those components in a single package (TV value, athletic performance, big athletic budget, good TV market, large fanbase, and solid academics). This is borne out by the stats. The AAC has had the highest average attendance in the G5 by a good margin (so, largest fan bases). Every AAC school all a top 200 USNWP school except for one. The AAC has the highest average athletic budgets in the G5. The AAC has had excellent success on the football field managing to get multiple teams into the top 25 most years. Finally, the AAC has seen solid basketball success as a consistent multi-bid league---even winning one national championship in its short 3 year history.

So, up to now---the AAC has been able to select schools that each fits BOTH the academic and "P6" role. Going forward however, I don't see any schools that really fit that dual role mold. There are really no schools left that are top 200 USNWR schools, with big fan bases, with large athletic budgets, that perform well on the football and basketball fields of play. From here on--the AAC will have to make a real decision on what direction it wants to go---Academics or media value.

That's a fair analysis. I have proposed Rice/UMass/Buffalo for the academic side, but what schools would fit in with the AAC on a media value side? I'm thinking UTSA/Charlotte/ODU type schools, but they are relative newbies to FBS. What schools might you legitimately recommend as replacements/expansion candidates outside of say a best of the rest conference with Boise/SDSU type schools joining? Thanks.

IF the AAC add a BB only member the conference will like fall apart in a decade.

A conference needs an identity. That's not to say that having schools good at other sports is bad but whey they don't' even play the most important sport it really shows a different focus. A conference needs all members working toward the same goal and BB only members dont' accomplish that.

It would be fun for Tulsa and SMU to have another close game but overall WSU is a better member of the NBE as a BB first school as a complement to Creighton.

There is no reason to let Uconn dictate membership unless they sign a GOR. Letting UConn add a couple of BB schools only to leave in a few years would be a disaster.

(03-02-2017 12:14 PM)Soobahk40050 Wrote:  

(03-02-2017 11:04 AM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(03-02-2017 10:18 AM)Soobahk40050 Wrote:  A basketball expansion (particularly with a school like Wichita State that is considering adding football) seems smart. However, the conference does need to be cautious. I always hate the phrase "well we tried it before and it didn't work," because circumstances are always changing, but the history of the AAC/Big East and the basketball/football school division should give them reason to be smart about who to expand with and how to develop the league. Wichita could be the new Villanova in terms of football - always a possibility but never happening. I am not saying it is a bad idea at all, in fact it does make sense in this iteration, just that the conference needs to tread carefully and make good decisions.

I have generally imagined the AAC as eventually being an academic focused league, with smaller privates and generally well rated publics. So for instance, if Houston ever does leave for the Big 12, take Rice. Then if Cincy leaves, take UMass or Buffalo(?) and you wind up with a North of: Temple, UConn, UMass, South Florida (heavy research) + ECU and UCF. The South would be SMU/Tulsa/Rice/Tulane + Navy and Memphis. I feel like that is an identity worth building, so any basketball additions need to leave open that possibility, or also be solid research institutions or well rated privates.

Im not sure the AAC knows exactly what the AAC wants to be when it grows up. If the goal is earning a near P5 pay check--then small privates like Rice probably wont help much in progressing toward that goal. You'd want solid TV draws with the success on the field and big fan bases (as G5 schools go). You want schools that appeal to TV audiences, increase ratings, and build media value. On the other hand, if the idea is to be a more prestigious exclusive academic conference---kind of a poor mans ACC---then replacement schools like Rice or UMass might make a ton more sense.

Up to now, the AAC has been able to select schools that largely provide all those components in a single package (TV value, athletic performance, big athletic budget, good TV market, large fanbase, and solid academics). This is borne out by the stats. The AAC has had the highest average attendance in the G5 by a good margin (so, largest fan bases). Every AAC school all a top 200 USNWP school except for one. The AAC has the highest average athletic budgets in the G5. The AAC has had excellent success on the football field managing to get multiple teams into the top 25 most years. Finally, the AAC has seen solid basketball success as a consistent multi-bid league---even winning one national championship in its short 3 year history.

So, up to now---the AAC has been able to select schools that each fits BOTH the academic and "P6" role. Going forward however, I don't see any schools that really fit that dual role mold. There are really no schools left that are top 200 USNWR schools, with big fan bases, with large athletic budgets, that perform well on the football and basketball fields of play. From here on--the AAC will have to make a real decision on what direction it wants to go---Academics or media value.

That's a fair analysis. I have proposed Rice/UMass/Buffalo for the academic side, but what schools would fit in with the AAC on a media value side? I'm thinking UTSA/Charlotte/ODU type schools, but they are relative newbies to FBS. What schools might you legitimately recommend as replacements/expansion candidates outside of say a best of the rest conference with Boise/SDSU type schools joining? Thanks.

Im thinking there are 2 schools of thought on media value. It can be driven by performance---so schools like Marshall, S Miss, W Kentucky, LaTech, AkySt, etc make some sense. Or---you go by potential---then your looking for large enrollment publics with big budgets---Old Dominion, Arky St, Texas St, UTSA, etc come to mind.

Wichita State is on the record interested in adding football to join an FBS conference. Is that how UConn got into the Big East FBS conference that they had to add football to be a member of the Big East football?

VCU also was on the record on thinking of adding football. They was thinking of buying the city's stadium for football to do that.

Dayton was rumored of thinking of going FBS to try to get into a better conference.

One thing you might see is this for the Big East.

They do not want publics. Sorry Wichita State and VCU. They would grab Saint Louis and Richmond instead since those 2 are privates.
Xavier is blocking Dayton from joining the Big East claiming they share the same tv market. There is no other choices for those 3 to go to for a better conference. AAC>MVC and A10.

Basketball members would not get Football shares. Football typically get 4x or 5x the payout as non-Football. The old Big East was the most Basketball tilted and it was still 3x for Football. So a move from the A10, which is about $400k, would probably only double that, but at the cost of entry and exit fees (pretty steep) - it would take five or more years to be above water on the move. This would constitute a long term bet on the American and against the A10. Both Conferences will send 2 teams to the Tournament, the American might send a 3rd this year. It's a sideways, slightly up move without a Basketball new TV contract upgrade by the American. There is also the issue of the two-tier conference that blew up the Big East. I can see schools moving, but its far from a slam dunk.

For Wichita State its a different story, the MVC has lost a lot of it's luster, and they feel for the long term health of the program they have to move. The MWC is actually preferred over the American, but they would take either if offered. Note, Wichita State is more valuable without football, which would be weak and drain resources from Basketball, than with Football.

I think this probably is floated as the American looks at TV contracts, but goes away when no big basketball offer is made.

(03-02-2017 12:37 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  Wichita State is on the record interested in adding football to join an FBS conference. Is that how UConn got into the Big East FBS conference that they had to add football to be a member of the Big East football?

VCU also was on the record on thinking of adding football. They was thinking of buying the city's stadium for football to do that.

Dayton was rumored of thinking of going FBS to try to get into a better conference.

One thing you might see is this for the Big East.

They do not want publics. Sorry Wichita State and VCU. They would grab Saint Louis and Richmond instead since those 2 are privates.
Xavier is blocking Dayton from joining the Big East claiming they share the same tv market. There is no other choices for those 3 to go to for a better conference. AAC>MVC and A10.

Wouldn't Wichita st need to play FCS first before joining FBS?

I thought the NBE wanted UConn? That's public last time I checked.

(03-02-2017 10:52 AM)MplsBison Wrote:  VCU and WSU will make UConn happy???

Short of the ACC, the only thing that will make UConn bball fans happy is playing Nova, Gtown, etc every year.

they can do that out of conference.

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(03-02-2017 12:13 PM)BullsFanInTX Wrote:  While this may be a good thing, everyone needs to be reminded that this article came from one of the worst sources for Big 12 expansion that existed. Mark Blaudschun was wrong about virtually everything when it came to Big 12 expansion news. What makes you think he suddenly is right or in the know about AAC expansion?

Because he is based out of New England. He had good contacts with the Big East and Providence (AAC hq location).

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(03-02-2017 12:45 PM)Hood-rich Wrote:  

(03-02-2017 12:13 PM)BullsFanInTX Wrote:  While this may be a good thing, everyone needs to be reminded that this article came from one of the worst sources for Big 12 expansion that existed. Mark Blaudschun was wrong about virtually everything when it came to Big 12 expansion news. What makes you think he suddenly is right or in the know about AAC expansion?

Because he is based out of New England. He had good contacts with the Big East and Providence (AAC hq location).

Sent from my SM-J700T using CSNbbs mobile app

He still was wrong about virtually everything he said in reference to Big 12 expansion.

(03-02-2017 12:52 PM)BullsFanInTX Wrote:  

(03-02-2017 12:45 PM)Hood-rich Wrote:  

(03-02-2017 12:13 PM)BullsFanInTX Wrote:  While this may be a good thing, everyone needs to be reminded that this article came from one of the worst sources for Big 12 expansion that existed. Mark Blaudschun was wrong about virtually everything when it came to Big 12 expansion news. What makes you think he suddenly is right or in the know about AAC expansion?

Because he is based out of New England. He had good contacts with the Big East and Providence (AAC hq location).

Sent from my SM-J700T using CSNbbs mobile app

He still was wrong about virtually everything he said in reference to Big 12 expansion.

ok

Sent from my SM-J700T using CSNbbs mobile app

(03-02-2017 12:52 PM)BullsFanInTX Wrote:  

(03-02-2017 12:45 PM)Hood-rich Wrote:  

(03-02-2017 12:13 PM)BullsFanInTX Wrote:  While this may be a good thing, everyone needs to be reminded that this article came from one of the worst sources for Big 12 expansion that existed. Mark Blaudschun was wrong about virtually everything when it came to Big 12 expansion news. What makes you think he suddenly is right or in the know about AAC expansion?

Because he is based out of New England. He had good contacts with the Big East and Providence (AAC hq location).

Sent from my SM-J700T using CSNbbs mobile app

He still was wrong about virtually everything he said in reference to Big 12 expansion.

Everybody was wrong about that issue. It was mainly the Big 12's fault for having everybody jumping through hoops just to join.

(03-02-2017 05:33 AM)DavidSt Wrote:  https://tmgcollegesports.com/2017/03/01/...ade-hoops/


They could add 3 hoop schools.

Wichita State
VCU
Dayton

Three strong basketball schools which could boast ACC up in RPI.

I don't see what joining a football first conference does for VCU or Dayton. Especially if Uconn is looking for the exits. If the AAC needs to make a football move, they'll make it, even if it hurts basketball.

Hey VCU, join the AAC. Then watch as Uconn goes indy and Cincy bails. And Memphis and Temple sink into mediocrity. Then the conference decides to take Southern Miss and Rice. Enjoy the travel.

(03-02-2017 12:59 PM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  

(03-02-2017 05:33 AM)DavidSt Wrote:  https://tmgcollegesports.com/2017/03/01/...ade-hoops/


They could add 3 hoop schools.

Wichita State
VCU
Dayton

Three strong basketball schools which could boast ACC up in RPI.

I don't see what joining a football first conference does for VCU or Dayton. Especially if Uconn is looking for the exits. If the AAC needs to make a football move, they'll make it, even if it hurts basketball.

Hey VCU, join the AAC. Then watch as Uconn goes indy and Cincy bails. And Memphis and Temple sink into mediocrity.

Ummm....Memphis was big all by themselves in CUSA. The reality is jumping to the AAC gives those teams some security. If UConn leaves---so what? If you start with UConn, SMU, Cinci, Temple, Wichita, Memphis, VCU, and Dayton---plus Tulsa and Houston bringing solid mid-tier programs---then you can lose UConn and still have a solid conference. Its just a much deeper, better paying, better exposed league than where any of them currently reside.