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It's a drop in the bucket.. but it's a start:
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Redwingtom Offline
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Post: #21
RE: It's a drop in the bucket.. but it's a start:
An update.

Debt on trump day one: $19.947T
Debt as of 3/7: $20.880T

+ $.933T

https://www.treasurydirect.gov/NP/debt/s...dYear=2018

We're gonna need a bigger bucket!
03-09-2018 12:14 PM
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UTSAMarineVet09 Offline
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Post: #22
RE: It's a drop in the bucket.. but it's a start:
(03-09-2018 12:14 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  An update.

Debt on trump day one: $19.947T
Debt as of 3/7: $20.880T

+ $.933T

https://www.treasurydirect.gov/NP/debt/s...dYear=2018

We're gonna need a bigger bucket!

Member when you used to ***** about the debt when Oblunder was president... yeah, neither do I. 07-coffee3
03-09-2018 12:51 PM
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Redwingtom Offline
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Post: #23
RE: It's a drop in the bucket.. but it's a start:
(03-09-2018 12:51 PM)UTSAMarineVet09 Wrote:  
(03-09-2018 12:14 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  An update.

Debt on trump day one: $19.947T
Debt as of 3/7: $20.880T

+ $.933T

https://www.treasurydirect.gov/NP/debt/s...dYear=2018

We're gonna need a bigger bucket!

Member when you used to ***** about the debt when Oblunder was president... yeah, neither do I. 07-coffee3

You do this every time dude. the point of my post is that YOU GUYS used to care about this...and now...since an R is in there, YOU don't.
03-09-2018 01:16 PM
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BuffaloTN Offline
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Post: #24
RE: It's a drop in the bucket.. but it's a start:
I care. But we owe 20 trillion now. That's not ever getting paid back. The chance to address this and fix it has passed.
03-09-2018 01:29 PM
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BatonRougeEscapee Offline
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Post: #25
RE: It's a drop in the bucket.. but it's a start:
(03-09-2018 12:14 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  An update.

Debt on trump day one: $19.947T
Debt as of 3/7: $20.880T

+ $.933T

https://www.treasurydirect.gov/NP/debt/s...dYear=2018

We're gonna need a bigger bucket!
Using your website link and crunching some numbers:
https://www.treasurydirect.gov/NP/debt/s...dYear=2018

1/19/2018 = 20,493,342,622,878.63
1/20/2017 = 19,947,304,555,212.49
1/20/2016 = 18,941,406,899,252.15

Debt increase Obama's last year = 1,005,897,655,960.34

Debt increase Trump's first year = 546,038,067,666.14

Obama bragged when he "cut the deficit"
#winning
03-09-2018 01:32 PM
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Hambone10 Offline
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Post: #26
RE: It's a drop in the bucket.. but it's a start:
(02-23-2017 09:15 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  This is nothing earth shattering. The debt typically goes down slightly near the end of the first month of each quarter, because that's when a lot of tax payments come in. Didn't happen for Obama because tax payments were down due to the recession, plus welfare and other payments were up for the same reason. Don't go spiking any footballs or getting any panties in a wad.

This...

That said....

(02-23-2017 04:43 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  The figure is just the federal debt. It's a US Treasury figure and it will sometimes decrease. It doesn't include agency debt nor the unfunded liabilities of entitlement programs like Social Security and Medicare.

Agency Debt
That’s the amount of debt outstanding issued by federal agencies (such as FHLB and GNMA) and government-sponsored enterprises (such as Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac).

Up to now, Agency Debt has not been included in the total debt of the United States government as published by the United States Department of the Treasury.
http://www.usgovernmentdebt.us/federal_debt_chart

Quote:Why does the debt sometimes decrease?

The Public Debt Outstanding decreases when there are more redemptions of Treasury securities than there are issues.
https://www.treasurydirect.gov/govt/reso...icdebt.htm

As you see from this chart, the federal debt will swing from day to day. It was actually down to 19.884 on February 8th, and was up to 19.935 as of yesterday.

Regardless, Trump has not done anything to change any of these figures yet. He's changed no tax policy nor has he altered any spending policy. These figures are all the result of prior budgets.

Sorry, it just doesn't work that way.

This isn't how it works either. The debt of GNMA, FHLMC and FNMA are mostly (almost entirely) secured by private property as opposed to being 'faith and credit' obligations. Similar though not identical for FHLB, which is a big part of why they aren't included... because nobody independently values the assets backing that debt.... so $1 trillion in FNMA debt may only represent $1byn in 'risk'... (of course depending on property values etc)


and why would there be more redemptions than issuance? Because the need for money decreases... Yes it may be only temporary as Owl suggests and related to other things... but it isn't the 'more redemptions than issuance' line implied in the above.

That said, this is still 'nothing', not even a drop in the bucket.... as Tom points out, not even really a drop at all.

While not an expert in the Federal Deficit, I AM an expert in Institutional Debt (especially Mortgage related debt) which includes GNMA, FHLMC, FNMA, FHLB and Treasury securities
(This post was last modified: 03-09-2018 02:46 PM by Hambone10.)
03-09-2018 02:26 PM
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Fort Bend Owl Offline
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Post: #27
RE: It's a drop in the bucket.. but it's a start:
So I just finished filling out my taxes for 2017. My small refund is about the same as 2016 (which makes sense because the revenue for the year was similar). But they told me my refund is going to be about 4x higher next year once the new tax cuts go into effect.

I'm happy with that and I realize that the economy seems strong from all indicators I notice. I do wonder if the deficit will be smaller by next year. I guess all we can say for sure is wait and see.
03-09-2018 02:31 PM
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Redwingtom Offline
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Post: #28
RE: It's a drop in the bucket.. but it's a start:
(03-09-2018 01:32 PM)BatonRougeEscapee Wrote:  
(03-09-2018 12:14 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  An update.

Debt on trump day one: $19.947T
Debt as of 3/7: $20.880T

+ $.933T

https://www.treasurydirect.gov/NP/debt/s...dYear=2018

We're gonna need a bigger bucket!
Using your website link and crunching some numbers:
https://www.treasurydirect.gov/NP/debt/s...dYear=2018

1/19/2018 = 20,493,342,622,878.63
1/20/2017 = 19,947,304,555,212.49
1/20/2016 = 18,941,406,899,252.15

Debt increase Obama's last year = 1,005,897,655,960.34

Debt increase Trump's first year = 546,038,067,666.14

Obama bragged when he "cut the deficit"
#winning

Deficit <> Debt

#confused
03-09-2018 02:33 PM
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UTSAMarineVet09 Offline
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Post: #29
RE: It's a drop in the bucket.. but it's a start:
(03-09-2018 01:16 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  
(03-09-2018 12:51 PM)UTSAMarineVet09 Wrote:  
(03-09-2018 12:14 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  An update.

Debt on trump day one: $19.947T
Debt as of 3/7: $20.880T

+ $.933T

https://www.treasurydirect.gov/NP/debt/s...dYear=2018

We're gonna need a bigger bucket!

Member when you used to ***** about the debt when Oblunder was president... yeah, neither do I. 07-coffee3

You do this every time dude. the point of my post is that YOU GUYS used to care about this...and now...since an R is in there, YOU don't.

You do this every time dude. the point of my post is that YOU GUYS never cared about this...and now...since an R is in there, YOU do. 07-coffee3
03-09-2018 02:34 PM
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Redwingtom Offline
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Post: #30
RE: It's a drop in the bucket.. but it's a start:
(03-09-2018 02:31 PM)Fort Bend Owl Wrote:  So I just finished filling out my taxes for 2017. My small refund is about the same as 2016 (which makes sense because the revenue for the year was similar). But they told me my refund is going to be about 4x higher next year once the new tax cuts go into effect.

I'm happy with that and I realize that the economy seems strong from all indicators I notice. I do wonder if the deficit will be smaller by next year. I guess all we can say for sure is wait and see.

Your refund won't likely change if you're paid in wages via W-2, as your withholding would be decreased to mirror the reduction in the tax rate.

Refund is more a function of what you pay in rather than the tax rate.
03-09-2018 02:37 PM
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Redwingtom Offline
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Post: #31
RE: It's a drop in the bucket.. but it's a start:
(03-09-2018 02:34 PM)UTSAMarineVet09 Wrote:  
(03-09-2018 01:16 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  
(03-09-2018 12:51 PM)UTSAMarineVet09 Wrote:  
(03-09-2018 12:14 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  An update.

Debt on trump day one: $19.947T
Debt as of 3/7: $20.880T

+ $.933T

https://www.treasurydirect.gov/NP/debt/s...dYear=2018

We're gonna need a bigger bucket!

Member when you used to ***** about the debt when Oblunder was president... yeah, neither do I. 07-coffee3

You do this every time dude. the point of my post is that YOU GUYS used to care about this...and now...since an R is in there, YOU don't.

You do this every time dude. the point of my post is that YOU GUYS never cared about this...and now...since an R is in there, YOU do. 07-coffee3

Show me where I said I cared about it. You assume too much.
03-09-2018 02:39 PM
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SoMs Eagle Offline
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Post: #32
RE: It's a drop in the bucket.. but it's a start:
(02-23-2017 04:43 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  The figure is just the federal debt. It's a US Treasury figure and it will sometimes decrease. It doesn't include agency debt nor the unfunded liabilities of entitlement programs like Social Security and Medicare.

Agency Debt
That’s the amount of debt outstanding issued by federal agencies (such as FHLB and GNMA) and government-sponsored enterprises (such as Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac).

Up to now, Agency Debt has not been included in the total debt of the United States government as published by the United States Department of the Treasury.
http://www.usgovernmentdebt.us/federal_debt_chart

Quote:Why does the debt sometimes decrease?

The Public Debt Outstanding decreases when there are more redemptions of Treasury securities than there are issues.
https://www.treasurydirect.gov/govt/reso...icdebt.htm

As you see from this chart, the federal debt will swing from day to day. It was actually down to 19.884 on February 8th, and was up to 19.935 as of yesterday.

Regardless, Trump has not done anything to change any of these figures yet. He's changed no tax policy nor has he altered any spending policy. These figures are all the result of prior budgets.

Sorry, it just doesn't work that way.

Sorry but YOU are wrong. Just yesterday Trump raised tariffs on steel and aluminum. Earlier he lowered corporate taxes which has brought investment and money held abroad back into the states. Trump has been in the White House just over one year and only the most partisan America haters don’t recognize the good things he has done with the establishment, media and left wing loons attacking him every second.
03-09-2018 02:45 PM
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UTSAMarineVet09 Offline
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Post: #33
RE: It's a drop in the bucket.. but it's a start:
(03-09-2018 02:39 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  
(03-09-2018 02:34 PM)UTSAMarineVet09 Wrote:  
(03-09-2018 01:16 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  
(03-09-2018 12:51 PM)UTSAMarineVet09 Wrote:  
(03-09-2018 12:14 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  An update.

Debt on trump day one: $19.947T
Debt as of 3/7: $20.880T

+ $.933T

https://www.treasurydirect.gov/NP/debt/s...dYear=2018

We're gonna need a bigger bucket!

Member when you used to ***** about the debt when Oblunder was president... yeah, neither do I. 07-coffee3

You do this every time dude. the point of my post is that YOU GUYS used to care about this...and now...since an R is in there, YOU don't.

You do this every time dude. the point of my post is that YOU GUYS never cared about this...and now...since an R is in there, YOU do. 07-coffee3

Show me where I said I cared about it. You assume too much.

so you dont care about the debt but you still come in here and post about the debt? Interesting... 07-coffee3
03-09-2018 02:55 PM
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Redwingtom Offline
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Post: #34
RE: It's a drop in the bucket.. but it's a start:
(03-09-2018 02:45 PM)SoMs Eagle Wrote:  
(02-23-2017 04:43 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  The figure is just the federal debt. It's a US Treasury figure and it will sometimes decrease. It doesn't include agency debt nor the unfunded liabilities of entitlement programs like Social Security and Medicare.

Agency Debt
That’s the amount of debt outstanding issued by federal agencies (such as FHLB and GNMA) and government-sponsored enterprises (such as Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac).

Up to now, Agency Debt has not been included in the total debt of the United States government as published by the United States Department of the Treasury.
http://www.usgovernmentdebt.us/federal_debt_chart

Quote:Why does the debt sometimes decrease?

The Public Debt Outstanding decreases when there are more redemptions of Treasury securities than there are issues.
https://www.treasurydirect.gov/govt/reso...icdebt.htm

As you see from this chart, the federal debt will swing from day to day. It was actually down to 19.884 on February 8th, and was up to 19.935 as of yesterday.

Regardless, Trump has not done anything to change any of these figures yet. He's changed no tax policy nor has he altered any spending policy. These figures are all the result of prior budgets.

Sorry, it just doesn't work that way.

Sorry but YOU are wrong. Just yesterday Trump raised tariffs on steel and aluminum. Earlier he lowered corporate taxes which has brought investment and money held abroad back into the states. Trump has been in the White House just over one year and only the most partisan America haters don’t recognize the good things he has done with the establishment, media and left wing loons attacking him every second.

Not quite sure if you noticed this or not, but my comment was made in February of 2017. 1 month into his term.
03-09-2018 03:14 PM
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Redwingtom Offline
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Post: #35
RE: It's a drop in the bucket.. but it's a start:
(03-09-2018 02:55 PM)UTSAMarineVet09 Wrote:  
(03-09-2018 02:39 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  
(03-09-2018 02:34 PM)UTSAMarineVet09 Wrote:  
(03-09-2018 01:16 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  
(03-09-2018 12:51 PM)UTSAMarineVet09 Wrote:  Member when you used to ***** about the debt when Oblunder was president... yeah, neither do I. 07-coffee3

You do this every time dude. the point of my post is that YOU GUYS used to care about this...and now...since an R is in there, YOU don't.

You do this every time dude. the point of my post is that YOU GUYS never cared about this...and now...since an R is in there, YOU do. 07-coffee3

Show me where I said I cared about it. You assume too much.

so you dont care about the debt but you still come in here and post about the debt? Interesting... 07-coffee3

Are you new to this board? 03-wink

Do I want the debt to be lower, sure...but I also realize that it's not really all that important in the grand scheme of things...hence, I don't lose any sleep over it. That being said, I can still comment on it, analyze it, and rightly point out that Republicans now seem to be hypocrites on it. Sorry if that bothers you.
(This post was last modified: 03-09-2018 03:17 PM by Redwingtom.)
03-09-2018 03:16 PM
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UTSAMarineVet09 Offline
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Post: #36
RE: It's a drop in the bucket.. but it's a start:
(03-09-2018 03:16 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  
(03-09-2018 02:55 PM)UTSAMarineVet09 Wrote:  
(03-09-2018 02:39 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  
(03-09-2018 02:34 PM)UTSAMarineVet09 Wrote:  
(03-09-2018 01:16 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  You do this every time dude. the point of my post is that YOU GUYS used to care about this...and now...since an R is in there, YOU don't.

You do this every time dude. the point of my post is that YOU GUYS never cared about this...and now...since an R is in there, YOU do. 07-coffee3

Show me where I said I cared about it. You assume too much.

so you dont care about the debt but you still come in here and post about the debt? Interesting... 07-coffee3

Are you new to this board? 03-wink

Do I want the debt to be lower, sure...but I also realize that it's not really all that important in the grand scheme of things...hence, I don't lose any sleep over it. That being said, I can still comment on it, analyze it, and rightly point out that Republicans now seem to be hypocrites on it. Sorry if that bothers you.

but you still dont care about the debt? 07-coffee3
03-09-2018 03:39 PM
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Crebman Offline
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Post: #37
RE: It's a drop in the bucket.. but it's a start:
(03-09-2018 02:31 PM)Fort Bend Owl Wrote:  So I just finished filling out my taxes for 2017. My small refund is about the same as 2016 (which makes sense because the revenue for the year was similar). But they told me my refund is going to be about 4x higher next year once the new tax cuts go into effect.

I'm happy with that and I realize that the economy seems strong from all indicators I notice. I do wonder if the deficit will be smaller by next year. I guess all we can say for sure is wait and see.

This. Eventually we will see if the economy gets kick started by this and if it does whether the debt goes up - stays flat - or actually goes down.............that assumes Congress can keep their spending relatively flat or if they try and spend like giving everyone candy and flowers for votes.....
03-09-2018 04:02 PM
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Hambone10 Offline
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Post: #38
RE: It's a drop in the bucket.. but it's a start:
(03-09-2018 02:33 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  
(03-09-2018 01:32 PM)BatonRougeEscapee Wrote:  
(03-09-2018 12:14 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  An update.

Debt on trump day one: $19.947T
Debt as of 3/7: $20.880T

+ $.933T

https://www.treasurydirect.gov/NP/debt/s...dYear=2018

We're gonna need a bigger bucket!
Using your website link and crunching some numbers:
https://www.treasurydirect.gov/NP/debt/s...dYear=2018

1/19/2018 = 20,493,342,622,878.63
1/20/2017 = 19,947,304,555,212.49
1/20/2016 = 18,941,406,899,252.15

Debt increase Obama's last year = 1,005,897,655,960.34

Debt increase Trump's first year = 546,038,067,666.14

Obama bragged when he "cut the deficit"
#winning

Deficit <> Debt

#confused

No, deficit <> debt, but decreasing the deficit is still a good thing and can easily contribute to either decreasing the debt, OR to decreasing the rate of growth of the debt.

Obama only cut the annual deficit relative to the initial massive increases that were supposed to be 'one off' items.

Trump isn't doing much better, and one year is not a trend (Obama's annual deficit declined before reversing)... but down is still better
03-09-2018 04:11 PM
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BatonRougeEscapee Offline
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Post: #39
RE: It's a drop in the bucket.. but it's a start:
It takes time to put the brakes on/reverse all of Oblunders terrible policies. In just one year, debt added has decreased by half. Will the trend continue? Is it an outlier?We will have to wait and see. However, it’s an improvement. Obama bragged when the rate of deficit spending declined. This seems like a similarly shallow thing to brag about. #MAGA.
03-09-2018 04:49 PM
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