(01-27-2017 01:09 PM)john01992 Wrote:  there is a reason only 1% of all voter fraud cases are the kind of voter fraud a photo ID prevents. then of that 1% almost all the cases involve family members which explains how they got the personal info.

Citation? and it better not be that study you posted earlier in the week. The methodology there is worse than the ODU study.

there is a heritage list of all voter fraud convictions that they could find. 700 cases and only 6 or 7 involved voter impersonation. of those six or seven almost all of them had the victim being a family member.

if you want to claim that people don't use sigs to verify fine. you are wrong but that wouldn't be the first time either. I love how you claim it is easy to fake a face. is there no such thing as fake IDs. hell I knew someone who was able to buy booze using a license he found on the street that looked nothing like him and he was able to get away with it. plus not to mention how often sblings use each others fake ids. and if you want to get on the magnetic strip. bouncers use them all the time and fake IDs account for that. you are ridiclious with this claim.

then your response to fo just reeks of stupid. it is stupid to say that you will get 100,000 people to independently commit in person voter fraud on their own. you need to pay just to get people to do that and that means coordination. you need to give them registration info and transportation which again takes coordination. what a ridiclious statement.

(01-27-2017 04:36 PM)Bull_Is_Back Wrote:  

(01-27-2017 01:09 PM)john01992 Wrote:  there is a reason only 1% of all voter fraud cases are the kind of voter fraud a photo ID prevents. then of that 1% almost all the cases involve family members which explains how they got the personal info.

Citation? and it better not be that study you posted earlier in the week. The methodology there is worse than the ODU study.

you don't give a s*** how legitimate a citation is. hell go look at the heritage list. their own damn data shows 1%.

or you can:

News21, a reporting project affiliated with Arizona State University, in 2012 found 2,068 cases of election fraud nationwide since 2000. Of those, just 10 involved voter impersonation — or one out of every 15 million prospective voters. More common was absentee mail-in ballot fraud, with 491 cases. None affected the outcome of an election.

http://www.pbs.org/newshour/rundown/pers...elections/

(01-27-2017 01:29 PM)2-Hood-Rich Wrote:  

(01-27-2017 01:23 PM)Fo Shizzle Wrote:  

(01-27-2017 01:17 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  Signatures can be forged.
If you're being paid, then there is a personal benefit.
If the person you are impersonating is dead, he/she is pretty unlikely to show uplifted to vote.
There probably isn't much one off impersonation for the reasons you list.
But an organized effort to cheat can get around all of them.

All valid points. Wouldn't fraud of this volume almost have to be organized and orchestrated? How the hell do you keep that conspiracy quiet with so many people watching the process? It seems damn near impossible to me.

why do you assume it's a conspiracy? couldn't there be many who just assume they can vote? I mean, if somebody's here illegally it stands to reason that they aren't familiar with our laws.

I don't. I called fabrics on this 800k figure from the start. Do I believe an amount of fraud exists? Sure..but..I don't believe this.

Fo. under any circumstances do you think people will openly commit a felony just to support a trivial gain for a politician outside of a handful of freak cases or their being paid to do it? I think such notion is asinine.

(01-27-2017 04:38 PM)john01992 Wrote:  there is a heritage list of all voter fraud convictions that they could find. 700 cases and only 6 or 7 involved voter impersonation. of those six or seven almost all of them had the victim being a family member.

if you want to claim that people don't use sigs to verify fine. you are wrong but that wouldn't be the first time either. I love how you claim it is easy to fake a face. is there no such thing as fake IDs. hell I knew someone who was able to buy booze using a license he found on the street that looked nothing like him and he was able to get away with it. plus not to mention how often sblings use each others fake ids. and if you want to get on the magnetic strip. bouncers use them all the time and fake IDs account for that. you are ridiclious with this claim.

then your response to fo just reeks of stupid. it is stupid to say that you will get 100,000 people to independently commit in person voter fraud on their own. you need to pay just to get people to do that and that means coordination. you need to give them registration info and transportation which again takes coordination. what a ridiclious statement.

On this subject? I agree with you. Occam's Razor.

(01-27-2017 04:45 PM)john01992 Wrote:  Fo. under any circumstances do you think people will openly commit a felony just to support a trivial gain for a politician outside of a handful of freak cases or their being paid to do it? I think such notion is asinine.

I can't logically think of one.

(01-27-2017 04:38 PM)john01992 Wrote:  there is a heritage list of all voter fraud convictions that they could find. 700 cases and only 6 or 7 involved voter impersonation. of those six or seven almost all of them had the victim being a family member.

That's not the same as saying "only 1% of voter fraud committed" and you know it.

(01-27-2017 12:00 PM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  Proof?

Where is the proof from the leftist's that say "40%" of gun purchases are done without a background check?

Or that Homosexuals are being cart s off to internment camps in the US? Proof?

(01-27-2017 05:39 PM)Bull_Is_Back Wrote:  

(01-27-2017 04:38 PM)john01992 Wrote:  there is a heritage list of all voter fraud convictions that they could find. 700 cases and only 6 or 7 involved voter impersonation. of those six or seven almost all of them had the victim being a family member.

That's not the same as saying "only 1% of voter fraud committed" and you know it.

at this point you just prefer to deny facts.

800k seems low.

The real moral of the story is we need to get rid of illegal immigrants.

What's funny is that the media has said that voter fraud and illegal voting is 100% not a problem. Trump claims it is a huge probem. Trump has the high ground here. All he has to do is find 1 semi significant example and boom, he has proven the media wrong again in the eyes of most

I find voter fraud and Pizzagate to have been responded to similarly in the mainstream media. That both were so quickly dismissed as beyond the realm of reason really concerns me. While I hope neither are true, I suspect there are threads of truth in each, and the power establishment in this country has no interest in exposing these issues to full sunlight.

I am certain voter fraud exists, just have no concrete feel to what extent. But the Pizzagate scandal is equally disturbing. A kid's pizzeria with graphic sexually-explicit photos in the bathroom, numerous social media tweats referencing child molestation, and late-night satanic entertainment makes no sense to me. I fear the results, but hope this is fully investigated.

(01-27-2017 06:52 PM)john01992 Wrote:  

(01-27-2017 05:39 PM)Bull_Is_Back Wrote:  

(01-27-2017 04:38 PM)john01992 Wrote:  there is a heritage list of all voter fraud convictions that they could find. 700 cases and only 6 or 7 involved voter impersonation. of those six or seven almost all of them had the victim being a family member.

That's not the same as saying "only 1% of voter fraud committed" and you know it.

at this point you just prefer to deny facts.

Hard to deny something that hasn't been presented.

(01-27-2017 07:02 PM)HeartOfDixie Wrote:  800k seems low.

The real moral of the story is we need to get rid of illegal immigrants.

I disagree with the former....and totally agree with the later.