ODU Monarchs

Hello There, Guest! (LoginRegister)

Post Reply 
ODU Volleyball and Softball
Author Message
Monarchblue Offline
Heisman
*

Posts: 8,669
Joined: May 2012
Reputation: 170
I Root For: ODU
Location:
Post: #21
RE: ODU Volleyball and Softball
(01-22-2017 12:01 PM)ODUwildman Wrote:  My opinion that's rooted in years of covering this: "Cutting sports doesn't solve the budget problems schools say they do"

Do I have a file cabinet of numbers and donations from all those schools? Not immediately at my disposal, but for the purposes of this board, I'm much more vested and experienced in the research and process. But because I can't pull up hard numbers typing on my phone on a Sunday morning, casting off my opinion, based on experience and research for two decades as "emotional" shows you really don't want an answer. It's just the whole "nah, I don't believe you, prove it" over and over.

There are plenty of numbers to support the argument, I just can't refile a few hundred FOIA requests just to prove one guy on a message board wrong

If I post facts about wrestling conversationally on this board, few will question it, but post something that's borderline divisive, then I'm emotional and my experience doesn't matter

I'm not going to reform research projects for the sake of winning an internet disagreement.

I donate and support the ODAF, have contributed to it since graduation and spend a lot of money annually on ODU-related things with the ODAF and just giving back as an alum without asking for a receipt. We are better enough to be proactive and inventive to solve these problems. I've always felt this. JMU took the easy/lazy way and what has that gotten them .... FCS titles. Great. We are better than that.
I am not questioning the points that you make, but something has to change. If you feel that cutting sports will not solve the problem, then what is the answer? The reality is, if the AD isn't lying about the lack of funds to do the basic things needed to ensure that we are highly competitive in basketball and football, while we have one of the highest budgets among mid major programs, then they need to cut spending somewhere. We went low on hiring a basketball coach and we are seeing the effects of that. We went low on the football stadium, and left the program with no room to grow. We went low on a women's basketball coach and it is a disaster. We went low on a basketball practice facility and it is an embarrassment compared to VCU, who was a basketball peer until a few years ago, and we are going low on our football staff, and it seems creating bad blood that will make it difficult to keep a very good coaching staff in the near future. Something has to change.

Sent from my Pixel C using Tapatalk
01-22-2017 01:28 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
ODU Hoops Offline
Special Teams
*

Posts: 725
Joined: Sep 2013
Reputation: 8
I Root For: ODU
Location:
Post: #22
ODU Volleyball and Softball
(01-22-2017 01:28 PM)Monarchblue Wrote:  
(01-22-2017 12:01 PM)ODUwildman Wrote:  My opinion that's rooted in years of covering this: "Cutting sports doesn't solve the budget problems schools say they do"

Do I have a file cabinet of numbers and donations from all those schools? Not immediately at my disposal, but for the purposes of this board, I'm much more vested and experienced in the research and process. But because I can't pull up hard numbers typing on my phone on a Sunday morning, casting off my opinion, based on experience and research for two decades as "emotional" shows you really don't want an answer. It's just the whole "nah, I don't believe you, prove it" over and over.

There are plenty of numbers to support the argument, I just can't refile a few hundred FOIA requests just to prove one guy on a message board wrong

If I post facts about wrestling conversationally on this board, few will question it, but post something that's borderline divisive, then I'm emotional and my experience doesn't matter

I'm not going to reform research projects for the sake of winning an internet disagreement.

I donate and support the ODAF, have contributed to it since graduation and spend a lot of money annually on ODU-related things with the ODAF and just giving back as an alum without asking for a receipt. We are better enough to be proactive and inventive to solve these problems. I've always felt this. JMU took the easy/lazy way and what has that gotten them .... FCS titles. Great. We are better than that.
I am not questioning the points that you make, but something has to change. If you feel that cutting sports will not solve the problem, then what is the answer? The reality is, if the AD isn't lying about the lack of funds to do the basic things needed to ensure that we are highly competitive in basketball and football, while we have one of the highest budgets among mid major programs, then they need to cut spending somewhere. We went low on hiring a basketball coach and we are seeing the effects of that. We went low on the football stadium, and left the program with no room to grow. We went low on a women's basketball coach and it is a disaster. We went low on a basketball practice facility and it is an embarrassment compared to VCU, who was a basketball peer until a few years ago, and we are going low on our football staff, and it seems creating bad blood that will make it difficult to keep a very good coaching staff in the near future. Something has to change.

Sent from my Pixel C using Tapatalk

It makes me sad to read, but that is a quality post.
01-22-2017 01:39 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
ODUwildman Offline
Special Teams
*

Posts: 728
Joined: May 2012
Reputation: 46
I Root For: SCSU
Location:
Post: #23
RE: ODU Volleyball and Softball
(01-22-2017 01:18 PM)ODU Hoops Wrote:  I might be surprised if you put some validity behind your posts, but you don't. So I'm not surprised.

On one hand you don't expect me to refile the FOIA's to validate my claims, and on the other, you say I haven't posted any validity. Clear to me you either want me to waste my time proving something to you that you're not going to accept regardless -- or you sit there and say I haven't provided anything.

You know what I provide in this instance that no one else has? Experience and research. This stuff is in my head because it's been a part of my life. I'm a well-respected journalist in wrestling nationally, and locally, I'm still regarded as a good one, even though I don't live in Hampton Roads anymore.

If Harry were to come on this board and say the same thing in the same manner, how many would simply take it as valid? I'd say most of you, right?

I'm not an expert on ODAF specifically, but I've also been on the inside of the boosters at ODU long enough to know there's money directly tied to non-revenue alumni that do go into the coffers of football and basketball.

Where I am an expert is in the factors that led to hundreds of programs being dropped and, in wrestling's specific situation, the over 160 new college wrestling teams that have sprouted up across all Divisions since 2000.

So you're asking for validity -- my word is valid. I have zero reason to contrive things. Wrestling is on strong footing, so I'm not worried there.

He's a simple example from SIU Edwardsville. They're D1 now, but when they were D2, they were a wrestling powerhouse, coached by Olympians and routinely placed wrestlers at the D1 level (in an era where D2 champions qualified for the D1 tournament).

The program was the most successful historically and had a long line of wealthy alumni, including a guy with an incredible net worth. The school dropped wrestling and the donations came to a crawl. When they reinstated wrestling, it perked up with new facilities, but then the admins moved to D1, fast-tracked soccer and alienated the same wrestling alums again. They pulled a ton of support, not just for athletic facilities, but for academic ones as well because of poor athletic management.

The lesson for SIUE was be careful which sports you alienate and alums you feel you have a "handle" on, because the school is still fighting for financial support. This guy is now funding a local youth wrestling club where SIUE could have reaped the benefits of this alum's support.


Long story short, if you don't think what I'm saying has any validity, then you're not going to think anything I post is valid, regardless if I dig up my research and FOIA requests from the past 15 years. Even if I wasted my time to "surprise" you, questioning if what I'm saying is valid or not is simply putting your head in the sand. I'm not just some zealot about wrestling -- I've put years of time and research into this. The fact you're unfamiliar with it isn't my problem, it just means your search for validity needs to expand past what you're familiar with.

What I'm saying is valid. I'm not going to spend any more time bellowing about how it is because you say it isn't.


I trust our admins to do the right thing, not the lazy thing.
(This post was last modified: 01-22-2017 02:02 PM by ODUwildman.)
01-22-2017 01:59 PM
Visit this user's website Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
ODU Hoops Offline
Special Teams
*

Posts: 725
Joined: Sep 2013
Reputation: 8
I Root For: ODU
Location:
Post: #24
ODU Volleyball and Softball
Again, trying to tell us you are an expert on wrestling does nothing but water down your argument. Using some directional school from Illinois as a comparison only makes it worse.

Over the years you have proven yourself to be a self-promoter, but I'm glad you can call yourself an expert. Sorry but I don't like arrogant people and your history suggests you fall in that category. You would be surprised, I actually like wrestling and hope ODU never cuts the sport. The difference between you and me is that I recognize the value of the revenue sports and you are playing the role of the non-revenue spots martyr.
01-22-2017 02:36 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
odusteeler Offline
Jersey Retired
Jersey Retired

Posts: 1,104
Joined: May 2012
Reputation: 25
I Root For: ODU, W&M
Location:
Post: #25
RE: ODU Volleyball and Softball
If money made teams competitive, UVA football would have no problems.
01-22-2017 02:44 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Monarchblue Offline
Heisman
*

Posts: 8,669
Joined: May 2012
Reputation: 170
I Root For: ODU
Location:
Post: #26
RE: ODU Volleyball and Softball
...And if money was meaningless there would be no such thing as a power conference.

Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk
01-22-2017 03:11 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Chillie Willie Offline
All American
*

Posts: 4,915
Joined: Oct 2012
Reputation: 154
I Root For: Old Dominion
Location:
Post: #27
RE: ODU Volleyball and Softball
Well played Monarchblue. So I guess the lesson here is money means something but not everything.
01-22-2017 04:58 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
ODUwildman Offline
Special Teams
*

Posts: 728
Joined: May 2012
Reputation: 46
I Root For: SCSU
Location:
Post: #28
RE: ODU Volleyball and Softball
If you want to continue this in a civil manner, please, by all means, PM me and we can continue. Don't think folks here are interested in your personal attacks as we've taken the thread off its rails.
01-22-2017 06:01 PM
Visit this user's website Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
ODU Hoops Offline
Special Teams
*

Posts: 725
Joined: Sep 2013
Reputation: 8
I Root For: ODU
Location:
Post: #29
ODU Volleyball and Softball
Not personal attacks, just calling it like I see it. Sorry you don't like that.
01-22-2017 06:49 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Justanodufan Offline
1st String
*

Posts: 2,085
Joined: Jul 2012
Reputation: -1
I Root For: Odu
Location:
Post: #30
RE: ODU Volleyball and Softball
(01-22-2017 06:40 AM)ODUwildman Wrote:  More alumni have dogs in the non-revenue fight. Cutting any program can have bigger impacts than just on the ledger for a few years

You cut sports, you cut out revenue streams from alumni who played those sports. Decades of alumni played something other than the big two.

If we want to be an also-ran athletically and "just another school," that's the solution.

It's the lazy way out and ultimately, you will always be back where you started.

Cutting non-revenue sports rarely solves the budget issues presented by piss poor management of football and basketball spending at programs nationwide.

Cutting non-revenue sports won't solve all budget issues, but it does help. While football and basketball do account for a large portion of athletic departments' budgets, they also bring in the most amount of money.

No one can honestly say that if ODU cut wrestling (just picking the most likely cut male sport) that the amount of donations that no longer come in would be catastrophic.
01-22-2017 07:12 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
cjpritODU Offline
Water Engineer
*

Posts: 88
Joined: Nov 2013
Reputation: 15
I Root For: ODU
Location:
Post: #31
RE: ODU Volleyball and Softball
(01-22-2017 07:12 PM)Justanodufan Wrote:  
(01-22-2017 06:40 AM)ODUwildman Wrote:  More alumni have dogs in the non-revenue fight. Cutting any program can have bigger impacts than just on the ledger for a few years

You cut sports, you cut out revenue streams from alumni who played those sports. Decades of alumni played something other than the big two.

If we want to be an also-ran athletically and "just another school," that's the solution.

It's the lazy way out and ultimately, you will always be back where you started.

Cutting non-revenue sports rarely solves the budget issues presented by piss poor management of football and basketball spending at programs nationwide.

Cutting non-revenue sports won't solve all budget issues, but it does help. While football and basketball do account for a large portion of athletic departments' budgets, they also bring in the most amount of money.

No one can honestly say that if ODU cut wrestling (just picking the most likely cut male sport) that the amount of donations that no longer come in would be catastrophic.
Why is wrestling the most likely cut sport? I would say cutting men's swimming and diving would be better (if you were to cut a sport) because both sports award 9.9 scholarships and wrestling sells tickets which brings in more money then swim and dive...
01-22-2017 08:25 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Post Reply 




User(s) browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)


Copyright © 2002-2024 Collegiate Sports Nation Bulletin Board System (CSNbbs), All Rights Reserved.
CSNbbs is an independent fan site and is in no way affiliated to the NCAA or any of the schools and conferences it represents.
This site monetizes links. FTC Disclosure.
We allow third-party companies to serve ads and/or collect certain anonymous information when you visit our web site. These companies may use non-personally identifiable information (e.g., click stream information, browser type, time and date, subject of advertisements clicked or scrolled over) during your visits to this and other Web sites in order to provide advertisements about goods and services likely to be of greater interest to you. These companies typically use a cookie or third party web beacon to collect this information. To learn more about this behavioral advertising practice or to opt-out of this type of advertising, you can visit http://www.networkadvertising.org.
Powered By MyBB, © 2002-2024 MyBB Group.