Eh, yeah, ideally he slides down at the 1. Either way, not a huge deal in my mind. He's going for awards this year, so stats are nice and the likelihood of it hurting our chances of winning the game were slim. Ideally he slides down at the 1, we run the clock down to 20 seconds, then pound it in for the TD with less time left. However, I'm good with him rewarding the fans that stuck it out until the end with a huge breakaway TD.

(10-09-2016 03:59 PM)Potomac Wrote:  Here's another point no one has said so far.

THEY'RE NERDS. RUN IT DOWN THEIR NERD THROATS.

I laughed.

Mathematically would have been best decision by a long shot to run down and stop right before the goal line, kneel and end the game considering WM had no timeouts. I would not expect a player to make this correct choice unless he had been prepped by the coaches ahead of time. The chances of losing in either situation are remote, but much better for WM with time and ball down 2 scores. In the other situation you have to fumble the victory formation (this is never going to happen) with 35 seconds left and then give up a 95 yard TD drive in little time. We are probably talking about the difference between losing .2% of the time and .02% of the time between the two options.

I crush coaches all the time for brain dead decisions regarding use of timeouts and poor time management. I am certain not scoring and going down on the far end of the field is the "better" play but either way we are talking about remote possibilities of well less than 1%. With 1 min left and 3rd and 4, I'm sure the coaches have fifty things on their mind, none of them being what happens if the guy takes it 75 yards to the house. I don't blame the coaching staff here at all, but definitely am curious by some of the game management thoughts of posters in this thread LOL.

i can't believe this is even an issue.

as UofR said, the chances are between .2% and .02%.

i'd even say they are greater. Because even a fumble in V formation could only lead W&M to a tie, which we could win in OT, or they go for 2 and miss, in which case we still win.

the odds were between .02% and .002%

basically, nil. you take the TD and let Khalid enjoy another stat for his stellar performance so far this year. Kid is a 1st Team all American.

I don't think there is a right or wrong decision here. The only time it's definitely wrong to score is if we are up 1 and he breaks free. Then they can tie the game with the possession they get being down only 8.

Can you do a poll on this site? I should have done one. Would have been fun to see the results. I say always take the points.

HBurg/Chad, Can you add a poll?

Take the points

Take a knee

(10-09-2016 06:31 PM)BSKB 24 Wrote:  Can you do a poll on this site? I should have done one. Would have been fun to see the results. I say always take the points.

HBurg/Chad, Can you add a poll?

Take the points

Take a knee

Done

http://csnbbs.com/thread-793943.html

I'm forgetting the details now, because it's been so long but in the Scotty McGee game, I recall benefiting from UR scoring a TD late when they should have taken a down. I remember looking around to everyone in the crowd and we all seemed to agree that yeah, we allowed that score.

Maybe someone else remembers the details.

EDIT: I just found it. We were trailing by 1 with 3:21 left, and UR was on the JMU 3. The situation is different there because allowing them to take several running shots for the end zone in a game we were already losing late made no sense. Let them get in so we have more time left to get a TD and 2pt conversion to tie.

(10-10-2016 07:01 AM)Dukie95 Wrote:  I'm forgetting the details now, because it's been so long but in the Scotty McGee game, I recall benefiting from UR scoring a TD late when they should have taken a knee. I remember looking around to everyone in the crowd and we all seemed to agree that yeah, we allowed that score.

Maybe someone else remembers the details.

EDIT: I just found it. We were trailing by 1 with 3:21 left, and UR was on the JMU 3. The situation is different there because allowing them to take several running shots for the end zone in a game we were already losing late made no sense. Let them get in so we have more time left to get a TD and 2pt conversion to tie.

It was a tied game 31-31 when Richmond punted with 18 seconds left. The conventional thinking was for McGee to field the punt and try to get out of bounds, stopping the clock to help set up a winning FG scenario. He took it and headed to the sideline and with the clock running with precious seconds ticking away, he takes it along the sideline and scores with 00:01 seconds left. It set off the loudest continuous roar, scream, euphoria I think I have ever been a part of, I mean it continued to well after the game ended. PURE JOY! In my group we were all crying. I have tears now typing this.

2008 vs Richmond at Richmond. Everyone in the stands (and the TV announcer also) was screaming for Scotty to get out of bounds. I guess he saw a clear lane to the endzone and took it. One of several great endings and games in a magical season for the Dukes. After he scored we were all hugging and screaming in the stands. What a play!!

Still gives me shivers when I watch the play on YouTube!!!

Along with Rodneys throw to Bosco Williams at Villanova in the tropical storm like weather!!

And lets not forget App State!!

2008, what a season!!

Brian

There is no need to get out of bounds on a punt because the clock stops on a change of possession anyway. I know the TV amouncer mentioned it erroneously

I was talking about an earlier play. JMU trailed by one...rather than put up a time-consuming goal line stand for 3 downs, UR scored relatively easily. The punt return gets all the attention in that game, but no one remembers how poorly London handled that play earlier that allowed JMU an opportunity to tie the game.

London wasn't exactly known for his game management skills.

I surprised the talk is not about the play call.

The Abdullah 74 yard TD run was a pitch play. When the QB rolled right with Abdullah trailing, I thought, no way, they are running the option? Fumbling that pitch-out is possible and that play call was 'gutsy'. Did the coaching staff see something? It worked but high risk. I'll bet W&M did not see that coming. It stretched the WM defense and 'off to the races.' He did beat two or three players to get the TD but I'll bet it was a surprise to WM. How many coaches run that play, late in the game, in your half of the field and in the rainy conditions? Gutsy!

(10-10-2016 10:53 AM)Dukie95 Wrote:  I was talking about an earlier play. JMU trailed by one...rather than put up a time-consuming goal line stand for 3 downs, UR scored relatively easily. The punt return gets all the attention in that game, but no one remembers how poorly London handled that play earlier that allowed JMU an opportunity to tie the game.

So I am guessing if you are JMU, you want to keep them out of the end zone. After all I have seen plenty of 3 down, 1 yard goal line stands.

If you are Richmond, ideally you want to run three runs and score on the 3rd.

What if JMU coaches told the Defense to let Richmond score and the Richmond coaches told the RB not to score. He runs up the middle, there is a huge hole, he stops in it and then lays down. Repeat once more and now you have 3rd and goal form the 1 staring you in the face. No coach on earth would want to risk that, no matter what the clock says. I wouldn't even want to count on my college FG kicker to have to make a 15 yard FG. You score when you can and let the D win the game. Richmond's Defense failed, not the scheme to score but eat up a bunch of clock.

(10-10-2016 11:46 AM)JMU1985 Wrote:  I surprised the talk is not about the play call.

The Abdullah 74 yard TD run was a pitch play. When the QB rolled right with Abdullah trailing, I thought, no way, they are running the option? Fumbling that pitch-out is possible and that play call was 'gutsy'. Did the coaching staff see something? It worked but high risk. I'll bet W&M did not see that coming. It stretched the WM defense and 'off to the races.' He did beat two or three players to get the TD but I'll bet it was a surprise to WM. How many coaches run that play, late in the game, in your half of the field and in the rainy conditions? Gutsy!

Strangely enough the Eagles ran basically the same play on 3rd and 2 trying to get the first down and run the clock out yesterday and Ryan Mathews fumbled (not on the pitch) and it resulted in the Eagles losing the game.

(10-10-2016 10:53 AM)Dukie95 Wrote:  I was talking about an earlier play. JMU trailed by one...rather than put up a time-consuming goal line stand for 3 downs, UR scored relatively easily. The punt return gets all the attention in that game, but no one remembers how poorly London handled that play earlier that allowed JMU an opportunity to tie the game.

There were so many end of game situations in that game. I remember what you are talking about, as well as an unbelievable 2 point conversion that the Spider fans are still talking about. Truly one of the best games in JMU history.

(10-10-2016 11:46 AM)JMU1985 Wrote:  I surprised the talk is not about the play call.

The Abdullah 74 yard TD run was a pitch play. When the QB rolled right with Abdullah trailing, I thought, no way, they are running the option? Fumbling that pitch-out is possible and that play call was 'gutsy'. Did the coaching staff see something? It worked but high risk. I'll bet W&M did not see that coming. It stretched the WM defense and 'off to the races.' He did beat two or three players to get the TD but I'll bet it was a surprise to WM. How many coaches run that play, late in the game, in your half of the field and in the rainy conditions? Gutsy!

I thought the exact same thing. Any pitch is high risk, and to do it with one minute left and only needing 1 first down?

Ballzy when it works, dumb when it doesn't.

Anytime, and I truly mean each and every time, that the following statement applies (all team x needs is a first down and the game is over) you should slide down in the field of play if you get a first down. Doesn't matter if you are up by 1 or up by 100 or up by any number in between. If you slide down in the field of play after picking up the first down then the game is over with a series of Victory Formation snaps with a 99.9999999999999999999999% success rate. He shouldnt even run that far past the first down before sliding. Look, if you score you can lose. Even if it is unlikely that you lose, it is a possibility and you must avoid these possibilities if you want to be an elite football program. Furthermore, football is a violent sport where anything can happen. Every play that is run could result in a devastating injury to one of JMU's players. There is a reason that Abdullah admitted after the game that he should have slid. Its because, all things considered, its the right play and you should put team first and do the right things regardless of desire to win personal awards (not that I think he has those desires, but those desires have been mentioned as justification for scoring by message board posters). If his scoring had ended with a JMU loss, no matter how unlikely, then he would have let the team down.
Series of questions worth pondering...
What if on the ensuing possession Gage Steele or Simeyon Robinson had blown out their ACL when the game could have been over?
What if on the ensuing possession Taylor Reynolds got called for targeting and had to miss the 1H of the game against undefeated (in CAA) NH?
What if JMU had missed the XP and now WM could win with 2 TDs and 1 minute to play?
What if the ensuing kickoff had been returned for a TD followed by a successful onside kick leaving WM 45ish seconds to go 50 yards and score one more TD?
What if Abdullah had prematurely dropped the ball at the 1 yd line like 5 or 6 players have already done this year?
What if someone caught him from behind and punched the ball out for a fumble or even worse through the back of the endzone for a touchback and WM now had the ball down 7 with 55 seconds to go 80 yards?
What if Abdullah had just done something as simple as sliding down across the first down marker and ensuring that none of the above are even possibilities?

(10-10-2016 01:58 PM)JMU_Degenerate Wrote:  Anytime, and I truly mean each and every time, that the following statement applies (all team x needs is a first down and the game is over) you should slide down in the field of play if you get a first down. Doesn't matter if you are up by 1 or up by 100 or up by any number in between. If you slide down in the field of play after picking up the first down then the game is over with a series of Victory Formation snaps with a 99.9999999999999999999999% success rate. He shouldnt even run that far past the first down before sliding. Look, if you score you can lose. Even if it is unlikely that you lose, it is a possibility and you must avoid these possibilities if you want to be an elite football program. Furthermore, football is a violent sport where anything can happen. Every play that is run could result in a devastating injury to one of JMU's players. There is a reason that Abdullah admitted after the game that he should have slid. Its because, all things considered, its the right play and you should put team first and do the right things regardless of desire to win personal awards (not that I think he has those desires, but those desires have been mentioned as justification for scoring by message board posters). If his scoring had ended with a JMU loss, no matter how unlikely, then he would have let the team down.
Series of questions worth pondering...
What if on the ensuing possession Gage Steele or Simeyon Robinson had blown out their ACL when the game could have been over?
What if on the ensuing possession Taylor Reynolds got called for targeting and had to miss the 1H of the game against undefeated (in CAA) NH?
What if JMU had missed the XP and now WM could win with 2 TDs and 1 minute to play?
What if the ensuing kickoff had been returned for a TD followed by a successful onside kick leaving WM 45ish seconds to go 50 yards and score one more TD?
What if Abdullah had prematurely dropped the ball at the 1 yd line like 5 or 6 players have already done this year?
What if someone caught him from behind and punched the ball out for a fumble or even worse through the back of the endzone for a touchback and WM now had the ball down 7 with 55 seconds to go 80 yards?
What if Abdullah had just done something as simple as sliding down across the first down marker and ensuring that none of the above are even possibilities?

+ infinity