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Tribeheart Offline
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Post: #61
RE: New Tribe Logo
So, a cap with the new logo and a couple of feathers behind it would sell on the bootleg market pretty well I bet, if the AD would turn a blind eye.
10-20-2019 04:46 PM
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mrjoolius Online
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Post: #62
RE: New Tribe Logo
(10-20-2019 04:46 PM)Tribeheart Wrote:  So, a cap with the new logo and a couple of feathers behind it would sell on the bootleg market pretty well I bet, if the AD would turn a blind eye.
New logo design?
10-20-2019 05:13 PM
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TDenverFan Offline
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Post: #63
RE: New Tribe Logo
I kinda wish they sold that gear without the 'track and field' at the bottom.
10-20-2019 05:20 PM
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nogretheogre Offline
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Post: #64
RE: New Tribe Logo
Dig the new video spot. If only we had some ESPN3 coverage to show it03-banghead



10-20-2019 05:28 PM
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mrjoolius Online
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Post: #65
RE: New Tribe Logo
(10-20-2019 05:13 PM)mrjoolius Wrote:  
(10-20-2019 04:46 PM)Tribeheart Wrote:  So, a cap with the new logo and a couple of feathers behind it would sell on the bootleg market pretty well I bet, if the AD would turn a blind eye.
New logo design?
Who's got an embroidery machine? [Image: 2eb90a7e190b34ee46c050eaf74dffef.gif]
10-20-2019 07:07 PM
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nogretheogre Offline
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Post: #66
RE: New Tribe Logo
(10-20-2019 07:07 PM)mrjoolius Wrote:  
(10-20-2019 05:13 PM)mrjoolius Wrote:  
(10-20-2019 04:46 PM)Tribeheart Wrote:  So, a cap with the new logo and a couple of feathers behind it would sell on the bootleg market pretty well I bet, if the AD would turn a blind eye.
New logo design?
Who's got an embroidery machine? [Image: 2eb90a7e190b34ee46c050eaf74dffef.gif]

Ummm maybe we can PM this into a Tshirt order...
10-20-2019 07:12 PM
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billymac Offline
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Post: #67
RE: New Tribe Logo
(10-20-2019 05:28 PM)nogretheogre Wrote:  Dig the new video spot. If only we had some ESPN3 coverage to show it03-banghead





Sounds like they put Mike T. to work while he was in town.

Nice video.

04-cheers
10-20-2019 09:10 PM
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WMInTheBurg Offline
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Post: #68
RE: New Tribe Logo
(10-20-2019 09:10 PM)billymac Wrote:  Sounds like they put Mike T. to work while he was in town.

Nice video.

04-cheers

I heard he spoke to the team and the recruits. Nice thing to have an NFL head coach alum on a bye...
10-20-2019 11:02 PM
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Zorch Offline
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Post: #69
RE: New Tribe Logo
(10-20-2019 05:28 PM)nogretheogre Wrote:  Dig the new video spot. If only we had some ESPN3 coverage to show it03-banghead




Hmmm, nice video --- but it will need some serious editing if they do wind up cutting some sports.
10-20-2019 11:26 PM
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bubbadog57 Offline
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Post: #70
RE: New Tribe Logo
We have more varsity teams than many Big Five programs...inevitable that there will be
a cutting of some at William and Mary. Driscoll had considered the move several seasons back and it has to come in the near future.

There will be lots of indignant objections, but in the real world we cannot afford all these teams today.

It will strengthen our overall program greatly.
10-21-2019 05:47 AM
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zablenoise Offline
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Post: #71
RE: New Tribe Logo
(10-21-2019 05:47 AM)bubbadog57 Wrote:  We have more varsity teams than many Big Five programs...inevitable that there will be
a cutting of some at William and Mary. Driscoll had considered the move several seasons back and it has to come in the near future.

There will be lots of indignant objections, but in the real world we cannot afford all these teams today.

It will strengthen our overall program greatly.

well this is basically confirmation that we'll be cutting some programs soon
10-21-2019 07:31 AM
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TribePride52 Offline
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Post: #72
RE: New Tribe Logo
(10-21-2019 07:31 AM)zablenoise Wrote:  
(10-21-2019 05:47 AM)bubbadog57 Wrote:  We have more varsity teams than many Big Five programs...inevitable that there will be
a cutting of some at William and Mary. Driscoll had considered the move several seasons back and it has to come in the near future.

There will be lots of indignant objections, but in the real world we cannot afford all these teams today.

It will strengthen our overall program greatly.

well this is basically confirmation that we'll be cutting some programs soon

Kiss swimming goodbye.
No inside knowledge, just makes sense.
(This post was last modified: 10-21-2019 08:03 AM by TribePride52.)
10-21-2019 08:03 AM
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nj alum Offline
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Post: #73
RE: New Tribe Logo
(10-21-2019 05:47 AM)bubbadog57 Wrote:  We have more varsity teams than many Big Five programs...inevitable that there will be
a cutting of some at William and Mary. Driscoll had considered the move several seasons back and it has to come in the near future.

There will be lots of indignant objections, but in the real world we cannot afford all these teams today.

It will strengthen our overall program greatly.

You are so wrong on so many levels. If your thinking mirrors the AD’s thinking, she is wrong on so many levels. If your thinking mirrors the President’s thinking, she is wrong on many levels.

Let’s start with the real world. The real world would tell W&M to either (1) leave the NCAA, (2) switch to the Patriot, or (3) drop down to D-III.

Let’s move on to which teams can’t we afford? Let’s start with this “emphasis” on football or basketball. Let’s start there, before we talk about swimming.

Let’s talk about the rising costs to athletics that are due solely to rising academic tuition. Why can’t W&M’s academic side get their financial house in order? How about cutting some departments? How about freezing tuition for say, 5-6 years, like Purdue, which would freeze the costs of athletics scholarships?

Indignant objection? Damn right. Cutting sports to “emphasize” football and basketball is stupid, and institutional malpractice.
(This post was last modified: 10-21-2019 09:33 AM by nj alum.)
10-21-2019 08:04 AM
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nj alum Offline
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Post: #74
RE: New Tribe Logo
(10-21-2019 08:03 AM)TribePride52 Wrote:  
(10-21-2019 07:31 AM)zablenoise Wrote:  
(10-21-2019 05:47 AM)bubbadog57 Wrote:  We have more varsity teams than many Big Five programs...inevitable that there will be
a cutting of some at William and Mary. Driscoll had considered the move several seasons back and it has to come in the near future.

There will be lots of indignant objections, but in the real world we cannot afford all these teams today.

It will strengthen our overall program greatly.

well this is basically confirmation that we'll be cutting some programs soon

Kiss swimming goodbye.
No inside knowledge, just makes sense.

You do know that this move will cause irreparable damage to W&M, don’t you?

It does not make sense.
10-21-2019 08:06 AM
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mrjoolius Online
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Post: #75
New Tribe Logo
I'm not trying to get in the line of fire, but I want to look at this with emotions tamped down.

Who do we consider peer schools? Schools that play on a similar tier, with similar $$ coming in. Once that is established, how many men's/women's Varsity sports are being offered at those schools? Do they offer D1 football and/or basketball? How much $$ is spent vs. generated? Results of this search will show where we stand. I haven't looked in depth, but I'd venture we dole out as much as many of them and offer more sports than most schools not in the P5. Again, emotions aside, that seems a poor business model if everyone we see as peers and competition doesn't do the same.

The stated goal of AD Huge (and I'm sure why she was hired by Rowe) was to raise the profile of the 3 money sports. You can agree or disagree with that plan, but there is no denying that is what she was brought in to do. It's no secret that successful basketball and football is the magic formula at most schools. TV money and tournament/bowl money can fund an entire athletics department budget. I think all of us would love to offer as many opportunities for Varsity athletics for as many kids as possible. Basketball and football monies are a priority since they potentially generate revenue. If we are able to increase the money coming in with the current sports structure, then great. Only other way is to cut overhead.

That said, it seems like hiring more administrators and consultants was a poor use of the budget as well unless you can show me the $$ they are responsible for as a return on investment.
10-21-2019 10:00 AM
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Tribe32 Offline
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Post: #76
RE: New Tribe Logo
My big concern is whether anyone will know if the plan isn't working and to abandon it. I would hate to cut sports and then realize that big time FB/MBB never happened. That would be tragic.

I've been around Tribe Athletics in a meaningful way for over 40 years. Attendance at football and basketball games were very, very strong in the 70s, but I don't think it was about how successful our teams were. Back then we had home games against teams that would never dream of playing us on our home turf. Examples include:

Football - Cincinnati, Virginia Tech, West Virginia, Vanderbilt, East Carolina, Ohio, Rutgers, Temple
Basketball - West Virginia, Tech, Wake Forest, UNC, South Carolina, Maryland, Rutgers, Pitt, UVA, Cincinnati, Duke, Georgetown

People came to see us play name schools. It was fun, and we won a bunch of games over the bigger name schools. Oh, to get that back. Seems like it isn't even a reasonable approach, but we shall see what Huge can do.
10-21-2019 10:29 AM
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Zorch Offline
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Post: #77
RE: New Tribe Logo
(10-21-2019 10:00 AM)mrjoolius Wrote:  I'm not trying to get in the line of fire, but I want to look at this with emotions tamped down.

Who do we consider peer schools? Schools that play on a similar tier, with similar $$ coming in. Once that is established, how many men's/women's Varsity sports are being offered at those schools? Do they offer D1 football and/or basketball? How much $$ is spent vs. generated? Results of this search will show where we stand. I haven't looked in depth, but I'd venture we dole out as much as many of them and offer more sports than most schools not in the P5. Again, emotions aside, that seems a poor business model if everyone we see as peers and competition doesn't do the same.

The stated goal of AD Huge (and I'm sure why she was hired by Rowe) was to raise the profile of the 3 money sports. You can agree or disagree with that plan, but there is no denying that is what she was brought in to do. It's no secret that successful basketball and football is the magic formula at most schools. TV money and tournament/bowl money can fund an entire athletics department budget. I think all of us would love to offer as many opportunities for Varsity athletics for as many kids as possible. Basketball and football monies are a priority since they potentially generate revenue. If we are able to increase the money coming in with the current sports structure, then great. Only other way is to cut overhead.

That said, it seems like hiring more administrators and consultants was a poor use of the budget as well unless you can show me the $$ they are responsible for as a return on investment.
First, just a small nit to pick. Huge wasn't hired by Rowe; she arrived one year earlier than Rowe. So Reveley is to blame for the huge fiasco.

Just being devil's advocate (not in favor of this myself) but anyone who can read the writing on the wall can see that football as a viable entity only has about 20 years left. It is expensive to operate. It causes concussions (and other injuries) which bring irreparable harm to those who sustain them. Players thus affected are suing and winning large judgments. Its popularity with the student body has fallen dramatically since the time when many of us were students --- the kids today just don't seem to care about football. So, just saying, if you really want to "realign" some resources where they will do the most good (and where they can sustain sports that are currently winning championships) then how about dropping football? Again, I love football and I have season tickets, but I also can do critical thinking and I wonder if the emphasis on football (which, in my opinion, has a limited lifespan) justifies dropping other sports that are doing well.
10-21-2019 10:35 AM
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zablenoise Offline
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Post: #78
RE: New Tribe Logo
I think what burns me up most about potentially cutting sports is that Huge was lauded as a fundraiser when she was hired. I get it; we're a small school that offers a ton of sports and this move will reduce overhead. I just, naively, thought our goal would be to increase the size of the pie rather than cut it into fewer pieces.

I'm also skeptical that cutting any sport would free up enough money to make a marginal spending difference in football and basketball. Who then, in turn, would have to turn that maybe marginal increase in spending into wins.
10-21-2019 10:41 AM
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Zorch Offline
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Post: #79
RE: New Tribe Logo
(10-21-2019 10:29 AM)Tribe32 Wrote:  My big concern is whether anyone will know if the plan isn't working and to abandon it. I would hate to cut sports and then realize that big time FB/MBB never happened. That would be tragic.

I've been around Tribe Athletics in a meaningful way for over 40 years. Attendance at football and basketball games were very, very strong in the 70s, but I don't think it was about how successful our teams were. Back then we had home games against teams that would never dream of playing us on our home turf. Examples include:

Football - Cincinnati, Virginia Tech, West Virginia, Vanderbilt, East Carolina, Ohio, Rutgers, Temple
Basketball - West Virginia, Tech, Wake Forest, UNC, South Carolina, Maryland, Rutgers, Pitt, UVA, Cincinnati, Duke, Georgetown

People came to see us play name schools. It was fun, and we won a bunch of games over the bigger name schools. Oh, to get that back. Seems like it isn't even a reasonable approach, but we shall see what Huge can do.

^^^ This ^^^

Once a sport is cut then it is hard to get it back. Even if it returns, it would not return to its same competitive level until a number of years after that. Plus coaches, even athletes, would have moved on and so it would be just like starting from scratch.

I remember those football games against Ohio, Rutgers, and Temple. I was there. There was no question that W&M was equal/peer to them. In fact, as home team, W&M was expected to win those games (although I'm pretty sure we lost at least one of those games -- but not because we were overmatched by "playing up").
10-21-2019 10:41 AM
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Sitting bull Offline
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Post: #80
RE: New Tribe Logo
(10-21-2019 10:29 AM)Tribe32 Wrote:  My big concern is whether anyone will know if the plan isn't working and to abandon it. I would hate to cut sports and then realize that big time FB/MBB never happened. That would be tragic.

I've been around Tribe Athletics in a meaningful way for over 40 years. Attendance at football and basketball games were very, very strong in the 70s, but I don't think it was about how successful our teams were. Back then we had home games against teams that would never dream of playing us on our home turf. Examples include:

Football - Cincinnati, Virginia Tech, West Virginia, Vanderbilt, East Carolina, Ohio, Rutgers, Temple
Basketball - West Virginia, Tech, Wake Forest, UNC, South Carolina, Maryland, Rutgers, Pitt, UVA, Cincinnati, Duke, Georgetown

People came to see us play name schools. It was fun, and we won a bunch of games over the bigger name schools. Oh, to get that back. Seems like it isn't even a reasonable approach, but we shall see what Huge can do.

Also was on campus in the 70s - and I agree with your comment as it relates to basketball in the 70s. Not football though.

During that run, we had home games with Tech, Rutgers, East Carolina and Ohio - remember them all - and NONE of those was a sellout. We had ONE sellout during my four years - 1976 against Delaware. That UD game was homecoming and they must have brought 3,000+ fans - they were the reason the game sold out. I believe they were D2. People were shocked at the number of people they brought to the game (and we lost!).

Our football attendance in my view has improved over the years. We have sold out games with some regularity the last 20 years. The reason we didn't stay at the current FBS level was we were filling Zable less than capacity back then - and that was against bigger schools.
10-21-2019 10:52 AM
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