http://www.steynonline.com/7433/witless-...rector-cut

I love this line.

The past is another country, and the Chamber of Commerce Republicans gave it away.


We all know what the problems are. Our middle class has no jobs. America was built and thrived by a middle class. I had a a Democrat friend tell me this is why he can't vote for Clinton. It's either Bernie or Trump for him. Clinton was in cahoots with the Chamber of Commerce with the free trade deals and our past is our past. Different country.

Careful Mach, don't read too much Stein.

The middle class is a new phenomenon created after WW2 to combat the spread of communism. Historically America is ruled by elites.

(01-23-2016 10:07 AM)Machiavelli Wrote:  http://www.steynonline.com/7433/witless-...rector-cut

I love this line.

The past is another country, and the Chamber of Commerce Republicans gave it away.


We all know what the problems are. Our middle class has no jobs. America was built and thrived by a middle class. I had a a Democrat friend tell me this is why he can't vote for Clinton. It's either Bernie or Trump for him. Clinton was in cahoots with the Chamber of Commerce with the free trade deals and our past is our past. Different country.

Bill Clinton pushed NAFTA and then Bush signed it. Both gangs are equally guilty of killing off the American middle class. I have to give Trump credit on one of his points...and I paraphrase... "Im for free trade..but..we have to be smart about it. If Ford says it is going to move a plant to Mexico?...Then I tell them they can expect a 35% tax on everything crossing the border."...."Tomorrow they call me and say never mind...we are changed our mind."

Im just going to say this Mach... When France recently elected a bitter angry socialist bent on "punishing" the wealthy it did not go over well for anyone at all.

You're not going to add middle class jobs by making it more expensive to do business here.

(01-23-2016 10:41 AM)Fo Shizzle Wrote:  

(01-23-2016 10:07 AM)Machiavelli Wrote:  http://www.steynonline.com/7433/witless-...rector-cut

I love this line.

The past is another country, and the Chamber of Commerce Republicans gave it away.


We all know what the problems are. Our middle class has no jobs. America was built and thrived by a middle class. I had a a Democrat friend tell me this is why he can't vote for Clinton. It's either Bernie or Trump for him. Clinton was in cahoots with the Chamber of Commerce with the free trade deals and our past is our past. Different country.

Bill Clinton pushed NAFTA and then Bush signed it. Both gangs are equally guilty of killing off the American middle class. I have to give Trump credit on one of his points...and I paraphrase... "Im for free trade..but..we have to be smart about it. If Ford says it is going to move a plant to Mexico?...Then I tell them they can expect a 35% tax on everything crossing the border."...."Tomorrow they call me and say never mind...we are changed our mind."

Other way aroun. GHWB pushed Nafta, then Clinton signed it.

(01-23-2016 10:50 AM)Bull_In_Exile Wrote:  Im just going to say this Mach... When France recently elected a bitter angry socialist bent on "punishing" the wealthy it did not go over well for anyone at all.

You're not going to add middle class jobs by making it more expensive to do business here.

Then how do you do it?

Make America friendly to business. Again.

(01-23-2016 10:53 AM)Fitbud Wrote:  

(01-23-2016 10:50 AM)Bull_In_Exile Wrote:  Im just going to say this Mach... When France recently elected a bitter angry socialist bent on "punishing" the wealthy it did not go over well for anyone at all.

You're not going to add middle class jobs by making it more expensive to do business here.

Then how do you do it?

Start by making your corporate tax rate comparable with more successful industrial economies.

Make it easier for new companies to start up by easing some of the over regulation.

(01-23-2016 10:58 AM)Paul M Wrote:  Make America friendly to business. Again.

This. It should be our #1 national goal and do whatever it takes to accomplish. Id first eliminate ALL taxes on business and install a consumption paradigm. We would see money and jobs stream back across the border.

(01-23-2016 10:41 AM)Fo Shizzle Wrote:  

(01-23-2016 10:07 AM)Machiavelli Wrote:  http://www.steynonline.com/7433/witless-...rector-cut
I love this line.
The past is another country, and the Chamber of Commerce Republicans gave it away.
We all know what the problems are. Our middle class has no jobs. America was built and thrived by a middle class. I had a a Democrat friend tell me this is why he can't vote for Clinton. It's either Bernie or Trump for him. Clinton was in cahoots with the Chamber of Commerce with the free trade deals and our past is our past. Different country.

Bill Clinton pushed NAFTA and then Bush signed it. Both gangs are equally guilty of killing off the American middle class. I have to give Trump credit on one of his points...and I paraphrase... "Im for free trade..but..we have to be smart about it. If Ford says it is going to move a plant to Mexico?...Then I tell them they can expect a 35% tax on everything crossing the border."...."Tomorrow they call me and say never mind...we are changed our mind."

NAFTA didn't cause the death of the middle class. It was already well underway before NAFTA ever came about. Free trade treaties are not the problem, they're a symptom of the real problem, which is that the US is not a competitive place to engage in many businesses. It is generally for retail, because retail has to be close to the customer and we have a large market. You're not going to go see a barber in Germany every time you need a haircut. But that barber may very well choose to purchase tools that were made in Germany. Companies don't leave the US because of free trade treaties. They leave the US because the US is not a competitive place to do business. Trade treaties are just an attempt to negotiate our way out of the worst. That doesn't usually work, because we are negotiating from a position of weakness to start with.

As long as the US is a high cost, high tax, and heavily regulated business environment, businesses are going to go offshore. And they don't have to go to the third world to find suitable venues either. Much of Europe is more friendly to business than we are, and that's certainly not because they pay starvation wages or don't offer any benefits. What I would like for someone on the left to explain to me is why higher costs, higher taxes, and more intrusive regulations will bring them back.

As for the Trump quote, if I were Ford then I'd have to take a look at the numbers. If my costs in Mexico were 35% lower than here, I'd say sure, fine, tax me. If not, then I'd make cars for the US here and cars for the export market in Mexico. And I'd file a grievance with the WTO that the US in engaging in unfair trade practices. Which I would win.

(01-23-2016 10:07 AM)Machiavelli Wrote:  http://www.steynonline.com/7433/witless-...rector-cut

I love this line.

The past is another country, and the Chamber of Commerce Republicans gave it away.


We all know what the problems are. Our middle class has no jobs. America was built and thrived by a middle class. I had a a Democrat friend tell me this is why he can't vote for Clinton. It's either Bernie or Trump for him. Clinton was in cahoots with the Chamber of Commerce with the free trade deals and our past is our past. Different country.

At least Bush turned Virginia purple. The GOP platforms mirror the US Nazi party platform.

(01-24-2016 12:15 PM)dcCid Wrote:  

(01-23-2016 10:07 AM)Machiavelli Wrote:  http://www.steynonline.com/7433/witless-...rector-cut

I love this line.

The past is another country, and the Chamber of Commerce Republicans gave it away.


We all know what the problems are. Our middle class has no jobs. America was built and thrived by a middle class. I had a a Democrat friend tell me this is why he can't vote for Clinton. It's either Bernie or Trump for him. Clinton was in cahoots with the Chamber of Commerce with the free trade deals and our past is our past. Different country.

At least Bush turned Virginia purple. The GOP platforms mirror the US Nazi party platform.

(01-23-2016 10:53 AM)Fitbud Wrote:  

(01-23-2016 10:50 AM)Bull_In_Exile Wrote:  Im just going to say this Mach... When France recently elected a bitter angry socialist bent on "punishing" the wealthy it did not go over well for anyone at all.

You're not going to add middle class jobs by making it more expensive to do business here.

Then how do you do it?

Are you serious?

Sent from my VS980 4G using Tapatalk

(01-24-2016 12:23 PM)Bull_In_Exile Wrote:  

(01-24-2016 12:15 PM)dcCid Wrote:  

(01-23-2016 10:07 AM)Machiavelli Wrote:  http://www.steynonline.com/7433/witless-...rector-cut

I love this line.

The past is another country, and the Chamber of Commerce Republicans gave it away.


We all know what the problems are. Our middle class has no jobs. America was built and thrived by a middle class. I had a a Democrat friend tell me this is why he can't vote for Clinton. It's either Bernie or Trump for him. Clinton was in cahoots with the Chamber of Commerce with the free trade deals and our past is our past. Different country.

At least Bush turned Virginia purple. The GOP platforms mirror the US Nazi party platform.

Just go to their website. Denial is not just a Mountain in Alaska.

(01-24-2016 12:44 PM)dcCid Wrote:  

(01-24-2016 12:23 PM)Bull_In_Exile Wrote:  

(01-24-2016 12:15 PM)dcCid Wrote:  

(01-23-2016 10:07 AM)Machiavelli Wrote:  http://www.steynonline.com/7433/witless-...rector-cut

I love this line.

The past is another country, and the Chamber of Commerce Republicans gave it away.


We all know what the problems are. Our middle class has no jobs. America was built and thrived by a middle class. I had a a Democrat friend tell me this is why he can't vote for Clinton. It's either Bernie or Trump for him. Clinton was in cahoots with the Chamber of Commerce with the free trade deals and our past is our past. Different country.

At least Bush turned Virginia purple. The GOP platforms mirror the US Nazi party platform.

Just go to their website. Denial is not just a Mountain in Alaska.