VT will hire Rich Rod, if WVU doesn't beat them to it.

Gary Pinkel, Missouri HC, resigning 12/31/15 due to health reasons.

(11-03-2015 09:05 AM)DiceRogerLion Wrote:  Two weeks ago everyone loved Withers... now half the people here want him to leave.

Do you all remember getting skull dragged at home by Stony Brook? We are achieving under this coaching staff. We had COLLEGE GAMEDAY on campus. Never would that happen with the past 6-6/7-5 regime.

The program makes a concerted effort to engage fans now. Exponential increase in social media presence in addition to bolstered video/graphics. We need to keep pushing forward. The culture in place is a successful one.

I don't. I remember in 2013 JMU losing a close game at home to SBU 41-38. When was this skull dragging at home to SBU that you speak of?

(11-17-2015 11:09 PM)BDKJMU Wrote:  

(11-03-2015 09:05 AM)DiceRogerLion Wrote:  Two weeks ago everyone loved Withers... now half the people here want him to leave.

Do you all remember getting skull dragged at home by Stony Brook? We are achieving under this coaching staff. We had COLLEGE GAMEDAY on campus. Never would that happen with the past 6-6/7-5 regime.

The program makes a concerted effort to engage fans now. Exponential increase in social media presence in addition to bolstered video/graphics. We need to keep pushing forward. The culture in place is a successful one.

I don't. I remember in 2013 JMU losing a close game at home to SBU 41-38. When was this skull dragging at home to SBU that you speak of?

Agree with you BDK, that game was not only close in score but went down to the final minutes. I guess it's all in the eye of the beholder.

In addition, I don't think anyone on here has said anything about wanting him to leave. Lot's of talk about what he might do or who might pursue him. Lot's of disappointment on the defense, much of which can be explained away by the loss of certain players. Sure, there is also frustration going around on the continued use of the 3 - 4, but it's all a just Monday morning quarterbacking, nothing more.

(10-27-2015 12:33 PM)PurpleStreamers Wrote:  

(10-27-2015 12:14 PM)adogg6jmu Wrote:  

(10-27-2015 11:34 AM)Big Duke Wrote:  

(10-27-2015 10:08 AM)adogg6jmu Wrote:  After what I saw on Saturday, it may be a blessing if he leaves. I think the success of this team since last year is almost all Vad Lee. Withers was a DC for many D-I schools, including Urban Meyer. And what I saw on Saturday was the worst defense I have ever seen. Ever. And to make matters worse, nothing was done to keep the ball in Vad and the offense's hands and out of Richmond's hands(punting both times around midfield in the 2nd half...no onside kick with 4 min remaining). Rocco out-coached the hell out of Withers on Saturday. And Rocco stinks.

I know he is fighting personnel issues on defense, but it should not have been THAT bad.

Well oh my. I CAN'T BELIEVE WE LOST ONE GAME THIS YEAR. Fire everyone, cut all scholarships and put the for sale sign out on BFS. This board is getting rediculious

Yea, because that's exactly what I said in my post. Calm down. It's like if someone criticizes EW, people get their panties in a bunch. By no means am I saying to fire Withers - that would be lunacy given his record over the past year and half and the strides that he's made in player discipline. All I am saying is that the jury is still out on whether our success has more to do with him, or that we have a special player in Vad Lee. From what I have seen, I am leaning toward that success being VL related.

What do we think our record would be if Birdsong was the QB for the past year and a half? How likely is it that EW is able to get quarterback talent like VL to come to JMU consistently? Can people seriously not be concerned with our defense and how they are playing in year 2 of EW?

With all due respect - wait a second, what am I saying. With no due respect, you're just wrong. I love Vad but this is an ENTIRELY different program with EW than MM and it's waaaay beyond the QB1. With the same players, MM would've used Vad, Cardon, Abdullah, and Cheatham with an occasional desperate fade route to Domo Taylor or maybe a jet sweep to Ravenel. EW's regime has consistently found ways to put ALL of it athletes (Davis, Miller, Tutt, Hyman, etc.) in space which is one of JMU's bigger advantages over other teams (depth of speed and athletic ability). And don't even bring up Birdsong. He knew he wasn't a fit in the system and left and is now picking up splinters on Marshall's bench. Small sample size of course, but I'd much rather have Schor this weekend than MB and that's not meant as a dig at the GingaNinja, it's just that quick decision-making and pace of play are huge in this offense and those never seemed to be his strong suits.

Go back and look at 2008 and 2009 when MM had Rodney Landers, a lot of people touched the ball in those years. And these were athletes he recruited as freshmen. Last time MB played in Bridgeforth he was the same year as Schor, lets not forget how young and green he was. The spread offense is a fad that a lot of coaches have picked up on , so I cant give EW the credit when JMU has been running the spread for years. They just run it at a faster pace. MM had better defenses so he wanted to control clock.

(11-17-2015 11:42 PM)Hotrod829 Wrote:  

(10-27-2015 12:33 PM)PurpleStreamers Wrote:  

(10-27-2015 12:14 PM)adogg6jmu Wrote:  

(10-27-2015 11:34 AM)Big Duke Wrote:  

(10-27-2015 10:08 AM)adogg6jmu Wrote:  After what I saw on Saturday, it may be a blessing if he leaves. I think the success of this team since last year is almost all Vad Lee. Withers was a DC for many D-I schools, including Urban Meyer. And what I saw on Saturday was the worst defense I have ever seen. Ever. And to make matters worse, nothing was done to keep the ball in Vad and the offense's hands and out of Richmond's hands(punting both times around midfield in the 2nd half...no onside kick with 4 min remaining). Rocco out-coached the hell out of Withers on Saturday. And Rocco stinks.

I know he is fighting personnel issues on defense, but it should not have been THAT bad.

Well oh my. I CAN'T BELIEVE WE LOST ONE GAME THIS YEAR. Fire everyone, cut all scholarships and put the for sale sign out on BFS. This board is getting rediculious

Yea, because that's exactly what I said in my post. Calm down. It's like if someone criticizes EW, people get their panties in a bunch. By no means am I saying to fire Withers - that would be lunacy given his record over the past year and half and the strides that he's made in player discipline. All I am saying is that the jury is still out on whether our success has more to do with him, or that we have a special player in Vad Lee. From what I have seen, I am leaning toward that success being VL related.

What do we think our record would be if Birdsong was the QB for the past year and a half? How likely is it that EW is able to get quarterback talent like VL to come to JMU consistently? Can people seriously not be concerned with our defense and how they are playing in year 2 of EW?

With all due respect - wait a second, what am I saying. With no due respect, you're just wrong. I love Vad but this is an ENTIRELY different program with EW than MM and it's waaaay beyond the QB1. With the same players, MM would've used Vad, Cardon, Abdullah, and Cheatham with an occasional desperate fade route to Domo Taylor or maybe a jet sweep to Ravenel. EW's regime has consistently found ways to put ALL of it athletes (Davis, Miller, Tutt, Hyman, etc.) in space which is one of JMU's bigger advantages over other teams (depth of speed and athletic ability). And don't even bring up Birdsong. He knew he wasn't a fit in the system and left and is now picking up splinters on Marshall's bench. Small sample size of course, but I'd much rather have Schor this weekend than MB and that's not meant as a dig at the GingaNinja, it's just that quick decision-making and pace of play are huge in this offense and those never seemed to be his strong suits.

Go back and look at 2008 and 2009 when MM had Rodney Landers, a lot of people touched the ball in those years. And these were athletes he recruited as freshmen. Last time MB played in Bridgeforth he was the same year as Schor, lets not forget how young and green he was. The spread offense is a fad that a lot of coaches have picked up on , so I cant give EW the credit when JMU has been running the spread for years. They just run it at a faster pace. MM had better defenses so he wanted to control clock.

I finally agree with everything you have stated, I will add to your last sentence, not only did he want to control the clock, he wanted to control as much as he possibly could. Very seldom did Rodney have the freedom that VL has had. That's why dang near every play he had the offense look to the sideline. He wanted control.

(11-17-2015 11:09 PM)BDKJMU Wrote:  

(11-03-2015 09:05 AM)DiceRogerLion Wrote:  Two weeks ago everyone loved Withers... now half the people here want him to leave.

Do you all remember getting skull dragged at home by Stony Brook? We are achieving under this coaching staff. We had COLLEGE GAMEDAY on campus. Never would that happen with the past 6-6/7-5 regime.

The program makes a concerted effort to engage fans now. Exponential increase in social media presence in addition to bolstered video/graphics. We need to keep pushing forward. The culture in place is a successful one.

I don't. I remember in 2013 JMU losing a close game at home to SBU 41-38. When was this skull dragging at home to SBU that you speak of?

You're right. I didn't remember the score... just how I felt when it was happening.

That's why dang near every play he had the offense look to the sideline. He wanted control.
[/quote]

Yep, but they were not looking at MM, they were looking at the playcaller in the red vest. That play was coming from upstairs, not on the field. MM did not call any plays.

(11-18-2015 08:57 AM)JMUsince89 Wrote:  That's why dang near every play he had the offense look to the sideline. He wanted control.

Yep, but they were not looking at MM, they were looking at the playcaller in the red vest. That play was coming from upstairs, not on the field. MM did not call any plays.
[/quote]

It wasn't a matter of him actually calling the plays, we are talking about control and I can assure you MM wore out the OC's headset.

Until you get Durden on these boards saying MM gave him free reign, no one is buying that MM did not intervene into the offensive play calling.

(11-18-2015 10:16 PM)JMUNation Wrote:  Until you get Durden on these boards saying MM gave him free reign, no one is buying that MM did not intervene into the offensive play calling.

That is exactly what I am saying. He wanted to control everything. I can assure you VL had certain circumstances where he need not look to the sideline. Especially after a long first down play where he ran to the line of scrimmage and got the next play off within 10 seconds of the previous whistle.

My response was for 89. Anyone who followed the program even somewhat closely over the MM era would agree with you.

Well think what you want but I was on the sidelines with MM for about the first 8 years he was there Believe me he didn't call the plays, Durden did. He just would ask what was the play you just ran. Never heard him call a single play, he may have told the OC not to run a certain play again because it was a flop and the other team covered it to well but he did not call plays. Now as far as strategys during coaches meetings during the week he suggested plays to run. Deez, knows how I can attest to this first hand

(11-19-2015 07:18 AM)JMUsince89 Wrote:  Well think what you want but I was on the sidelines with MM for about the first 8 years he was there Believe me he didn't call the plays, Durden did. He just would ask what was the play you just ran. Never heard him call a single play, he may have told the OC not to run a certain play again because it was a flop and the other team covered it to well but he did not call plays. Now as far as strategys during coaches meetings during the week he suggested plays to run. Deez, knows how I can attest to this first hand

89, I don't think I am communicating this very well. We are not saying that MM actually called the plays. We are only talking about the way he was so controlling. Watch EW on the sidelines during a timeout, especially one that is under an extremely crucial circumstance, EW practically hangs out, he let's others do their job. MM was always in the center of discussion.

I'm not saying one is going to produce a better outcome at our level over the other. Clearly, at JMU our HC has much, much more experience than do anyone down there with him, yet he still allows them to do their thing. This could be to the detriment of our performance. I don't know that answer, other than to say last year he clearly stated about half-way through the season that he was going to get more involved. Our defense seemed to come alive after that statement.

Getting back to play calling, will it make you feel different if I said, MM and his staff were very controlling with the next play. I can rarely remember a time the QB didn't take at least a quick look and that was by design of the HC. I will say that he appeared to turn the reigns loose with some of his great QB's like Rascatti and Landers. I put a lot of focus on Landers during the playoff games against Wofford and then Nova. MM allowed Rodney to make some decisions totally on his own, but that had not been the norm.

Again, take your defense of MM off for a moment and realize that I am not attacking him. He wanted his OC responsible for the play calling because that man was under his direct control and much easier to have a responsible discussion with someone on the payroll whether immediate as during a game or a discussion after the game. Nevertheless, MM used that power of being the final word to a much higher level than EW appears to and it was no more evident than between plays.

(11-19-2015 07:18 AM)JMUsince89 Wrote:  Well think what you want but I was on the sidelines with MM for about the first 8 years he was there Believe me he didn't call the plays, Durden did. He just would ask what was the play you just ran. Never heard him call a single play, he may have told the OC not to run a certain play again because it was a flop and the other team covered it to well but he did not call plays. Now as far as strategys during coaches meetings during the week he suggested plays to run. Deez, knows how I can attest to this first hand

I'm not calling into question the crux of your statement, but for the first 8 years Mickey was here, Zurnhelt (or something like that), the Offensive line coach was the OC. Durden was only on the staff the last three of those first 8 (2004-2006). Durden was hired away from VMI in 2004 and stayed on the staff until the conclusion of the 2012 season.

All above is correct I didnt want a battle of symantics here, thought some thought MM called plays. Subject closed as far as I'm concerned. Now lets just go beat the hell out of Villy and get a seed for the playoffs. I'd like to stay home for the Turkey fest weekend.

(11-19-2015 07:18 AM)JMUsince89 Wrote:  Well think what you want but I was on the sidelines with MM for about the first 8 years he was there Believe me he didn't call the plays, Durden did. He just would ask what was the play you just ran. Never heard him call a single play, he may have told the OC not to run a certain play again because it was a flop and the other team covered it to well but he did not call plays. Now as far as strategys during coaches meetings during the week he suggested plays to run. Deez, knows how I can attest to this first hand

Without getting hung up on the specifics of any couple words. MM might not have "called a play" but I also stood near MM on the sideline and repeatedly heard him talking to Durden saying (sometimes yelling) "Just let Rodney run the ball" multiple times per game. Sure I never heard him say which play he wanted called but he certainly vetoed certain plays and directed the type of the desired play.

With that said, all HC coaches have some input in what the game plan and play calling during the game but based on my experience MM asserted himself into the play calling more than most HC and certainly more than most that built their reputation on the defensive side of the ball.

EDIT: Missed your most recent post.

MM did call plays in 2011, I got graphic descriptions of his play-calling "abilities" during wins vs. UR and W&M from a star OL on that team. I believe it was at that time he had stripped Durden of play-calling responsibilities. I will not detail those here because it's beating a dead horse, but there is absolutely no doubt he was the play caller in 2011 for at least the majority of the time.

(11-19-2015 01:35 PM)JMUSteeler Wrote:  MM did call plays in 2011, I got graphic descriptions of his play-calling "abilities" during wins vs. UR and W&M from a star OL on that team. I believe it was at that time he had stripped Durden of play-calling responsibilities. I will not detail those here because it's beating a dead horse, but there is absolutely no doubt he was the play caller in 2011 for at least the majority of the time.

Didn't Durden have some family tragedy leading into that season?

(11-19-2015 03:25 PM)BleedingPurple Wrote:  

(11-19-2015 01:35 PM)JMUSteeler Wrote:  MM did call plays in 2011, I got graphic descriptions of his play-calling "abilities" during wins vs. UR and W&M from a star OL on that team. I believe it was at that time he had stripped Durden of play-calling responsibilities. I will not detail those here because it's beating a dead horse, but there is absolutely no doubt he was the play caller in 2011 for at least the majority of the time.

Didn't Durden have some family tragedy leading into that season?

I think he was going through a contentious divorce.