Just wondern?

I think the Rice program takes monumental steps back when you get hammered in these games.

(09-26-2015 06:03 PM)DocAllentown Wrote:  Just wondern?

I think the Rice program takes monumental steps back when you get hammered in these games.

Baylor sucked when this game was scheduled. It's our fault for not getting better.

(09-26-2015 06:03 PM)DocAllentown Wrote:  Just wondern?

I think the Rice program takes monumental steps back when you get hammered in these games.

Money, as well as the other reasons discussed.

(09-26-2015 06:03 PM)DocAllentown Wrote:  Just wondern?

I think the Rice program takes monumental steps back when you get hammered in these games.

We got hammered by a not-very-good Texas team. So yeah, most of us considered Baylor to be a loss, but really, the loss was far worse than it should have been

it doesn't if you don't show up in them.... but how else is a school that doesn't play anyone with any football reputation whatsoever supposed to see if they are getting any better?

(09-26-2015 06:20 PM)baker-13 Wrote:  

(09-26-2015 06:03 PM)DocAllentown Wrote:  Just wondern?

I think the Rice program takes monumental steps back when you get hammered in these games.

Money, as well as the other reasons discussed.

The Baylor series is a part of a 4 year, 2 @Baylor, 2@Rice. It's not a money game, but having Baylor@Rice will increase attendance and increase $$$.

The other 2 year, home and home Baylor series resulted in lopsided Baylor wins even when they weren't good.

It helps more than scheduling Wagner. It's coaching not the teams we schedule. Go see what La Tech did last week against Kansas State

Running away and pretending these games don't matter is not the answer. facing the challenge and admitting what we are doing and who is leading bus in those decisions is not working is the key to start to solve the problem.

If you're shooting a probe at Pluto and your team leaders consistently miscalculate and miss the mark despite improved resources, does that mean you stop trying to go to Pluto? No, you fire the team and get people who know how to do interstellar math well. Same if your coach doesn't seem to be good at executing actual game-play strategy and in-game coaching, despite the perceived talent increase.

Shooting a probe at Pluto? Interstellar Math?

That's quite possibly the most Rice post I've see on these boards.

Sorry for commenting on another posters comments instead of just bashing players and coaches which is the true intent of these boards.

Unlike other elements of the University, this provides an opportunity to see how the team really stacks up and provides a marker for achievement. If we only schedule against teams we think are better than us, we'll think we have a great program. As someone once told me, there's no glory in being the tallest midget

(09-27-2015 09:13 AM)Riceman2004 Wrote:  Unlike other elements of the University, this provides an opportunity to see how the team really stacks up and provides a marker for achievement. If we only schedule against teams we think are better than us, we'll think we have a great program. As someone once told me, there's no glory in being the tallest midget

Or taller than the average midget, in our case

(09-27-2015 01:44 AM)GoodOwl Wrote:  Running away and pretending these games don't matter is not the answer. facing the challenge and admitting what we are doing and who is leading bus in those decisions is not working is the key to start to solve the problem.

If you're shooting a probe at Pluto and your team leaders consistently miscalculate and miss the mark despite improved resources, does that mean you stop trying to go to Pluto? No, you fire the team and get people who know how to do interstellar math well. Same if your coach doesn't seem to be good at executing actual game-play strategy and in-game coaching, despite the perceived talent increase.

Are you trying to suggest that the coaching staff has received increased resources? If so, besides the unbuilt EZF, which is not yet a recruiting tool, I'm wondering what increased resources you're aware about that I am not.

(09-27-2015 10:14 AM)RiceLad15 Wrote:  

(09-27-2015 01:44 AM)GoodOwl Wrote:  Running away and pretending these games don't matter is not the answer. facing the challenge and admitting what we are doing and who is leading bus in those decisions is not working is the key to start to solve the problem.

If you're shooting a probe at Pluto and your team leaders consistently miscalculate and miss the mark despite improved resources, does that mean you stop trying to go to Pluto? No, you fire the team and get people who know how to do interstellar math well. Same if your coach doesn't seem to be good at executing actual game-play strategy and in-game coaching, despite the perceived talent increase.

Are you trying to suggest that the coaching staff has received increased resources? If so, besides the unbuilt EZF, which is not yet a recruiting tool, I'm wondering what increased resources you're aware about that I am not.

We get it, RiceLad. There's seemingly almost nothing that Bailiff & Co. can do to change your apparent unending man-love crush for him.

Things Bailiff has at Rice that previous coaches supposedly didn't:

• Commitment from BOT, including a Chairman who was a prominent, important athlete for Rice
  
  Support for football from Rice's President. Ever heard of George Rupp? Big difference for Bailiff & Co right there.
  
  Commitment to, funding for and now actual substantial construction of an EZF, the first major renovation for Rice stadium not initiated by a Head Coach (Todd Graham, much of a pill as he was when he left, jump-started and raised his own money to get rid of the wooden splinter bench seasting, pressure washed the stadium, got a new transport (with his face plastered all over it, but still), new scoreboard (not always working great, but at least he put one there where none had been before), etc... He didn't wait around for someone else to do it, he found a way to get it done himself, in one season.
  
  Support from AD for improving football situation, including longer term phases for further stadium renovations
  
  Much improved marketing from AD's offfice
  
  Allegedly better players from his own recruiting, purported to help Rice play better and beat better teams--better players would be a resource
  
  And I'd be willing to bet there's even more behind-the-scenes stuff that Bailiff has had made available to him as Rice's Head Football Coach that previous coaches would have loved to have.
  

I'm not so much upset at the loss to Baylor, as all the numerous losses, many embarrassing, for Rice to quality teams and opportunity games inn the past decade. Not once does he come through. The Marshall game in the CUSA Championship is suspect due to the circumstances of Marshall having to come here where they had a strong argument that they should have hosted that game, coupled with our complete disappearance act against Miss State in the Liberty Bowl. Not saying we should have won, but we took a tremendous opportunity to at least demonstrate to the football-watching nation the supposed improvement at Rice and showed we still had absolutely no clue, and were likely just lucky to win a very bad lower-tier conference.

As for me, what could Bailiff do to change my mind? Easy, WIN a Game that Matters against a team that matters. Sure, I've been rooting for that from him for ten years. Sure, I'd like more than one, but we can start with one--Oops, we'll have to wait until next season, fall of 2016 before he;ll get another chance. No more national opportunity games left this year. And I'm pretty sure Bailiff will be here again next year--his skill is always doing just enough not to get fired. That is something he IS really good at. Good for Bailiff & Co., not so good for Rice or the players.

(09-27-2015 12:36 PM)GoodOwl Wrote:  

(09-27-2015 10:14 AM)RiceLad15 Wrote:  

(09-27-2015 01:44 AM)GoodOwl Wrote:  Running away and pretending these games don't matter is not the answer. facing the challenge and admitting what we are doing and who is leading bus in those decisions is not working is the key to start to solve the problem.

If you're shooting a probe at Pluto and your team leaders consistently miscalculate and miss the mark despite improved resources, does that mean you stop trying to go to Pluto? No, you fire the team and get people who know how to do interstellar math well. Same if your coach doesn't seem to be good at executing actual game-play strategy and in-game coaching, despite the perceived talent increase.

Are you trying to suggest that the coaching staff has received increased resources? If so, besides the unbuilt EZF, which is not yet a recruiting tool, I'm wondering what increased resources you're aware about that I am not.

We get it, RiceLad. There's seemingly almost nothing that Bailiff & Co. can do to change your apparent unending man-love crush for him.

Things Bailiff has at Rice that previous coaches supposedly didn't:

• Commitment from BOT, including a Chairman who was a prominent, important athlete for Rice
  
  Support for football from Rice's President. Ever heard of George Rupp? Big difference for Bailiff & Co right there.
  
  Commitment to, funding for and now actual substantial construction of an EZF, the first major renovation for Rice stadium not initiated by a Head Coach (Todd Graham, much of a pill as he was when he left, jump-started and raised his own money to get rid of the wooden splinter bench seasting, pressure washed the stadium, got a new transport (with his face plastered all over it, but still), new scoreboard (not always working great, but at least he put one there where none had been before), etc... He didn't wait around for someone else to do it, he found a way to get it done himself, in one season.
  
  Support from AD for improving football situation, including longer term phases for further stadium renovations
  
  Much improved marketing from AD's offfice
  
  Allegedly better players from his own recruiting, purported to help Rice play better and beat better teams--better players would be a resource
  
  And I'd be willing to bet there's even more behind-the-scenes stuff that Bailiff has had made available to him as Rice's Head Football Coach that previous coaches would have loved to have.
  

I'm not so much upset at the loss to Baylor, as all the numerous losses, many embarrassing, for Rice to quality teams and opportunity games inn the past decade. Not once does he come through. The Marshall game in the CUSA Championship is suspect due to the circumstances of Marshall having to come here where they had a strong argument that they should have hosted that game, coupled with our complete disappearance act against Miss State in the Liberty Bowl. Not saying we should have won, but we took a tremendous opportunity to at least demonstrate to the football-watching nation the supposed improvement at Rice and showed we still had absolutely no clue, and were likely just lucky to win a very bad lower-tier conference.

As for me, what could Bailiff do to change my mind? Easy, WIN a Game that Matters against a team that matters. Sure, I've been rooting for that from him for ten years. Sure, I'd like more than one, but we can start with one--Oops, we'll have to wait until next season, fall of 2016 before he;ll get another chance. No more national opportunity games left this year. And I'm pretty sure Bailiff will be here again next year--his skill is always doing just enough not to get fired. That is something he IS really good at. Good for Bailiff & Co., not so good for Rice or the players.

It's no man crush. I just don't like empty talking points which plenty of people use when talking about Bailiff. So when you suggest that Bailiff has improved resources, I want to know what the heck you're talking about, because it isn't that obvious. The biggest change is the EZF which isn't even built yet. Bailiff was forced to work under Ranger Rick, which probably cancels the benefits of working under CDC and then JK.

I've been pretty consistent about asking people to back up their very vague, yet biting, comments because they are just that vague, and very often incorrect. Sorry for asking you to provide some facts to back up your assertions. But just like you're mischaracterizing my "man-crush" on Bailiff, I'm probably mischaracterizing your seeming unwavering hatred for the coach.

(09-27-2015 12:44 PM)RiceLad15 Wrote:  It's no man crush. I just don't like empty talking points which plenty of people use when talking about Bailiff. So when you suggest that Bailiff has improved resources, I want to know what the heck you're talking about, because it isn't that obvious. The biggest change is the EZF which isn't even built yet. Bailiff was forced to work under Ranger Rick, which probably cancels the benefits of working under CDC and then JK.

I've been pretty consistent about asking people to back up their very vague, yet biting, comments because they are just that vague, and very often incorrect. Sorry for asking you to provide some facts to back up your assertions. But just like you're mischaracterizing my "man-crush" on Bailiff, I'm probably mischaracterizing your seeming unwavering hatred for the coach.

Well, from reading your comments, which are your personal opinion and you are certainly entitled to it, I really don't know what else to call it. I sometimes wonder if you're paid staff for him.

For me, no I don't hate the man. Most everyone here agrees he's a swell person. But I do hate his record here. Underwhelming would be a complement. And, he did not inherit a bare cupboard here. He was in the right place at the right time. That is more his M.O. than his own personal skill at being a Head football Coach. I've repeatedly credited him with that skill. But it is one that helps Bailiff & Co far more than it helps Rice, especially at this point.

I don't know what to do with your comment about poor Bailiff & Co's mighty struggles with the 3 ADs. Excuses, and more excuses. Bailiff & Co need to own their mediocrity, plateau, under-performances, mesa, whatever. Owl69 is a pretty smart guy and he has pointed out the inconsistency that is the enigma of Bailiff & Co. I'm more passionate, but it's two sides of the same coin. The guy is just not very capable, and he's had more than enough time and chances.

Looking at the rest of the schedule, we play such crappy teams most of the rest of the way that, yes, Bailiff & Co will very likely win 8 games this season, bad as they are. That has next to nothing to do with Coaching skill at this point and almost everything to do with playing the very worst of the worst.

But let's see how we do next week against WKU, a nothing team that few nationally really care much about. If I were them, I'd feel I had an excellent chance to score 100 on this Rice team the way it is coached. I don't want that to happen to us, but I'd be lying if I didn't say I feel it's feasible.

(09-27-2015 01:11 PM)GoodOwl Wrote:  

(09-27-2015 12:44 PM)RiceLad15 Wrote:  It's no man crush. I just don't like empty talking points which plenty of people use when talking about Bailiff. So when you suggest that Bailiff has improved resources, I want to know what the heck you're talking about, because it isn't that obvious. The biggest change is the EZF which isn't even built yet. Bailiff was forced to work under Ranger Rick, which probably cancels the benefits of working under CDC and then JK.

I've been pretty consistent about asking people to back up their very vague, yet biting, comments because they are just that vague, and very often incorrect. Sorry for asking you to provide some facts to back up your assertions. But just like you're mischaracterizing my "man-crush" on Bailiff, I'm probably mischaracterizing your seeming unwavering hatred for the coach.

Well, from reading your comments, which are your personal opinion and you are certainly entitled to it, I really don't know what else to call it. I sometimes wonder if you're paid staff for him.

For me, no I don't hate the man. Most everyone here agrees he's a swell person. But I do hate his record here. Underwhelming would be a complement. And, he did not inherit a bare cupboard here. He was in the right place at the right time. That is more his M.O. than his own personal skill at being a Head football Coach. I've repeatedly credited him with that skill. But it is one that helps Bailiff & Co far more than it helps Rice, especially at this point.

I don't know what to do with your comment about poor Bailiff & Co's mighty struggles with the 3 ADs. Excuses, and more excuses. Bailiff & Co need to own their mediocrity, plateau, under-performances, mesa, whatever. Owl69 is a pretty smart guy and he has pointed out the inconsistency that is the enigma of Bailiff & Co. I'm more passionate, but it's two sides of the same coin. The guy is just not very capable, and he's had more than enough time and chances.

Looking at the rest of the schedule, we play such crappy teams most of the rest of the way that, yes, Bailiff & Co will very likely win 8 games this season, bad as they are. That has next to nothing to do with Coaching skill at this point and almost everything to do with playing the very worst of the worst.

But let's see how we do next week against WKU, a nothing team that few nationally really care much about. If I were them, I'd feel I had an excellent chance to score 100 on this Rice team the way it is coached. I don't want that to happen to us, but I'd be lying if I didn't say I feel it's feasible.

OK, dude, if RiceLad has a mancrush on Bailiff, then you've been sleeping with Rhoades since July before last.

Is one better than the other? Probably. Do either (or any of the coaches at Rice) deserve nearly the virulent praise/criticism in either direction? Probably not.

I'm ok with having Bailiff here this year and next year if it helps us get the rest of the athletic department in order. If football can be stable here while the rest of the ship rights itself, excellent. If not and JK's ready to make a change, by all means.

But the complete and utter lack of self-awareness in some of the critiques of the parties involved is baffling to me. I get that these arguments are mostly emotion-based (whether people admit it or not), but...do try to at least show some self-consistency in your evaluations.

(09-27-2015 12:39 PM)GoodOwl Wrote:  As for me, what could Bailiff do to change my mind? Easy, WIN a Game that Matters against a team that matters. Sure, I've been rooting for that from him for ten years. Sure, I'd like more than one, but we can start with one--Oops, we'll have to wait until next season, fall of 2016 before he;ll get another chance. No more national opportunity games left this year. And I'm pretty sure Bailiff will be here again next year--his skill is always doing just enough not to get fired. That is something he IS really good at. Good for Bailiff & Co., not so good for Rice or the players.

I believe Rice still has games that matter in 2015, starting with Louisiana Tech. Western Kentucky kind of matters, and if we beat Louisiana Tech, Southern Mississippi will probably matter. Get through those three, and we are probably hosting the C-USA championship game with a bowl game against the Big 12 in Dallas if we win. That game would matter.

I'll be there next Saturday rooting for Rice, but admit all of the air will go out of the 2015 season for me if WKU shreds the Rice defense and scores at will.

Yes, I have to agree with RiceLad15 and Baker 13 - I think Bailiff is the coach for Rice at the present time. However, LIKE MOST THINGS IN LIFE, there is room for improvement, so I agree with Owl/69/70/75 (and a few others that have been able to articulate rationale changes) that our team has some work to do.

First, with a spread of 33 points (or whatever the line was yesterday), no one could have rationally expected Rice to win yesterday's game. I'm not saying it wasn't possible for us to do so and certainly, it would have been a wonderful accomplishment. But, I think we all know Baylor was a clear favorite to win the game.

Second, as far as the mechanics of the game, I'll leave that to someone else with more experience and knowledge. As far as the 53 point difference, remember, with the new playoff structure in college football, being ranked #5 isn't where you want to be. And what was Baylor ranked yesterday? That's right - #5. So they had a lot on the line yesterday to try to jump up a slot. I agree, I don't like it when teams beat up on others and run-up the score, but I think we will start seeing more, rather than less, of this type of play.

Third, I think some on this board have unrealistic expectations of our coach and players (or for that matter, NCAA coaches and players at ANY school). Yes, it would be terrific to have a roster of 80, 90 , 100+ players that can run the 40 in less than 4.5 seconds, leap 40+ inches, etc., etc. combined with having 4.0+ GPAs, perfect SAT scores, etc., etc., as well as being able to speak 2 languages, play a musical instrument, etc., etc. Heck it would be hard to field ONE such team from the entire NCAA football player pool. Remember, our players are STUDENT athletes - they are not paid professionals.

I think Bailiff and his staff have done a great job with the Rice program and players over the past 8 seasons. They have worked to integrate our student athletes into the campus culture (look at the great things they do with assisting incoming freshmen during O-Week) and have maintained high academic standards (doesn't Rice often finish on top in terms of football graduation rates - no one calls for Bailiff's firing when this happens). Interestingly, some of you have criticized Coach Brilles for his team's off-the-field behavior and he's a winning coach! We don't have the same press at Rice, yet you want to fire Bailiff. And, you have to be honest, given the size of the program, we certainly have a strong showing in the NFL, especially given how "horrible" the coaching staff is.

Yes, it certainly would be nice if we could go 12-0 and beat teams in P5 conferences. But, you can't let one loss define your season. Starting 2-2 is not terrible (as an aside, a few NFL teams, including the 2014 NFC Championship Seahawks, at best will start their seasons with such a record). We need to make some adjustments and focus on conference opponents. Let's move on to our next game -- Go Owls!

(09-27-2015 02:36 PM)CrabCake Wrote:  I think Bailiff and his staff have done a great job with the Rice program and players over the past 8 seasons.

Without disagreeing with you, I will ask, so what is it that he is trying to do? How does he plan to win football games?

(09-27-2015 02:36 PM)CrabCake Wrote:  First, with a spread of 33 points (or whatever the line was yesterday), no one could have rationally expected Rice to win yesterday's game. I'm not saying it wasn't possible for us to do so and certainly, it would have been a wonderful accomplishment. But, I think we all know Baylor was a clear favorite to win the game.

Second, as far as the mechanics of the game, I'll leave that to someone else with more experience and knowledge. As far as the 53 point difference, remember, with the new playoff structure in college football, being ranked #5 isn't where you want to be. And what was Baylor ranked yesterday? That's right - #5. So they had a lot on the line yesterday to try to jump up a slot. I agree, I don't like it when teams beat up on others and run-up the score, but I think we will start seeing more, rather than less, of this type of play.

Why did we do worse than Lamar and SMU did against Baylor? Baylor needed statement wins against them too to move up for the playoff. Lamar and SMU were likely big underdogs too.

We have a coach in year 9. Lamar is FCS. Is it unrealistic to expect that the former does better than the latter?