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(08-23-2015 06:06 PM)cjpritODU Wrote:  

(08-23-2015 03:41 PM)FTW ODU Wrote:  Punishing some kids for exercising their freedom of speech off the campus (granted in bad taste) and doing so in a legal manor should not be punished under the Code of Conduct. Also, the Code of Conduct applies to legal activities outside of school if the President of the University doesn't like something?That is a dangerous precedent that gives the President of the University way to much power.

It is punishable under the code of conduct because its sexual assault. Its a Title IX violation. Given the focus that sexual assault has received in the past year makes this an even bigger issue and if you find humor in this then you are part of the problem. Here are a couple of facts for you and also a reason why ODU is making a "big deal" as some on this board would call it out of this:
1) The First 6 weeks are the Red Zone for women when they are most likely to be sexually assaulted in their life
2) ODU has received a grant from the federal government to help find ways to reduce and eventually eliminate sexual assault from college campuses

There is zero reason for this to happen ever on campus because once a person male or female is sexually assaulted that lives with them forever. ODU should be an inviting place where everyone feels as though they are in a safe and accepting community and this does the opposite of that and sends the wrong message about what ODU is all about. In the letter President Broderick spoke of a student who was uncomfortable by the message sent by the banners, now she is likely to tell other people about the negative experience she had at ODU which will make people go other places to receive their degree. The last point that I will make to those who find humor in this is if that were your daughter that the signs were directed towards I would doubt you would find the same humor you find in it now.

No, it has nothing to do with sexually assault rape. Don't let these people redefine rape as hanging signs. You want your son growing up in this environment?

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(08-24-2015 05:54 AM)EverRespect Wrote:  

(08-23-2015 06:06 PM)cjpritODU Wrote:  

(08-23-2015 03:41 PM)FTW ODU Wrote:  Punishing some kids for exercising their freedom of speech off the campus (granted in bad taste) and doing so in a legal manor should not be punished under the Code of Conduct. Also, the Code of Conduct applies to legal activities outside of school if the President of the University doesn't like something?That is a dangerous precedent that gives the President of the University way to much power.

It is punishable under the code of conduct because its sexual assault. Its a Title IX violation. Given the focus that sexual assault has received in the past year makes this an even bigger issue and if you find humor in this then you are part of the problem. Here are a couple of facts for you and also a reason why ODU is making a "big deal" as some on this board would call it out of this:
1) The First 6 weeks are the Red Zone for women when they are most likely to be sexually assaulted in their life
2) ODU has received a grant from the federal government to help find ways to reduce and eventually eliminate sexual assault from college campuses

There is zero reason for this to happen ever on campus because once a person male or female is sexually assaulted that lives with them forever. ODU should be an inviting place where everyone feels as though they are in a safe and accepting community and this does the opposite of that and sends the wrong message about what ODU is all about. In the letter President Broderick spoke of a student who was uncomfortable by the message sent by the banners, now she is likely to tell other people about the negative experience she had at ODU which will make people go other places to receive their degree. The last point that I will make to those who find humor in this is if that were your daughter that the signs were directed towards I would doubt you would find the same humor you find in it now.

No, it has nothing to do with sexually assault rape. Don't let these people redefine rape as hanging signs. You want your son growing up in this environment?

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Do you want your daughter growing up in this environment?

(08-24-2015 05:56 AM)Justanodufan Wrote:  

(08-24-2015 05:54 AM)EverRespect Wrote:  

(08-23-2015 06:06 PM)cjpritODU Wrote:  

(08-23-2015 03:41 PM)FTW ODU Wrote:  Punishing some kids for exercising their freedom of speech off the campus (granted in bad taste) and doing so in a legal manor should not be punished under the Code of Conduct. Also, the Code of Conduct applies to legal activities outside of school if the President of the University doesn't like something?That is a dangerous precedent that gives the President of the University way to much power.

It is punishable under the code of conduct because its sexual assault. Its a Title IX violation. Given the focus that sexual assault has received in the past year makes this an even bigger issue and if you find humor in this then you are part of the problem. Here are a couple of facts for you and also a reason why ODU is making a "big deal" as some on this board would call it out of this:
1) The First 6 weeks are the Red Zone for women when they are most likely to be sexually assaulted in their life
2) ODU has received a grant from the federal government to help find ways to reduce and eventually eliminate sexual assault from college campuses

There is zero reason for this to happen ever on campus because once a person male or female is sexually assaulted that lives with them forever. ODU should be an inviting place where everyone feels as though they are in a safe and accepting community and this does the opposite of that and sends the wrong message about what ODU is all about. In the letter President Broderick spoke of a student who was uncomfortable by the message sent by the banners, now she is likely to tell other people about the negative experience she had at ODU which will make people go other places to receive their degree. The last point that I will make to those who find humor in this is if that were your daughter that the signs were directed towards I would doubt you would find the same humor you find in it now.

No, it has nothing to do with sexually assault rape. Don't let these people redefine rape as hanging signs. You want your son growing up in this environment?

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Do you want your daughter growing up in this environment?

In what environment? Men wanting to have sex with her? Of course not, but hang these kids in the middle of Kaufman Mall and that won't change biology. Grow some balls and look at what really happened here. Broderick just lost control of the school by sacrificing his students to the wolves over a fake crime and pushing an agenda being promoted by very bad people that don't have the interest of the students in mind. I wouldn't send a child, son or daughter, to ODU with this guy in charge.

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(08-24-2015 05:52 AM)EverRespect Wrote:  

(08-23-2015 10:53 AM)monarchman Wrote:  Absolutely embarrassing and disgusting. ODU already has serious perception issues with crime and safety, and this only pours fuel to the fire and provides more negative publicity. In the message board world it may seem much to do about nothing, but with fraternities under high media scrutiny as of late, don't be shocked if this got national attention. ODU needs to throw down the hammer.

Broderick should be addressing real crime, not making up a fake crime to make him look tough. This will blow up in his face and he should consider resignation. He doesn't have the students back. If he wants to show he is a weak, pathetic loser, he could have just said that he disagrees with the poor taste of the signs, but he needs to behind his students under this kind of witch hunt.

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You have proved yourself many times over to be a reasonable poster, ER. So I'll ask you to reconsider a couple of your points.

He doesn't have the students['] back:

The idiots who hung those sheets are not the only students involved. Just as involved are the incoming freshman, who are being taunted upon their arrival to campus. Assault and intimidation is not limited to actual, physical conduct. These "jokes" may have been funny to the knuckleheads who hung them on move-in day -- but only because they subjectively knew that they were only kidding. Others have no way of knowing their subjective intentions, and I can fully understand the distress of an already nervous freshman being greeted to new campus with that kind of nasty filth.

As between the two, the "student backs" that President Broderick was properly watching out for were those who were not responsible for the problem.

[T]his kind of witch hunt:

Unless and until these students are prosecuted (which I don't believe will happen), any blowback that they are feeling from the administration is not a witch hunt. It is a justified reply to a very offensive dialogue that they opted to start. No one forced them to hang those sheets. They did it on their own accord. If they can't deal with the consequences of their own act, then that's on them.

President Broderick has no duty whatsoever to cover for student stupidity.

Just my opinion.

(And, for the record, I do very much feel sorry for them. Their thoughtlessness is being blown way out of proportion. But that's just a reality of today's social media, not anything that ODU has done to them. President Broderick and the university owe them nothing but justifiable disdain.)

President Broderick did the right thing.

(08-24-2015 06:40 AM)AdoptedMonarch Wrote:  

(08-24-2015 05:52 AM)EverRespect Wrote:  

(08-23-2015 10:53 AM)monarchman Wrote:  Absolutely embarrassing and disgusting. ODU already has serious perception issues with crime and safety, and this only pours fuel to the fire and provides more negative publicity. In the message board world it may seem much to do about nothing, but with fraternities under high media scrutiny as of late, don't be shocked if this got national attention. ODU needs to throw down the hammer.

Broderick should be addressing real crime, not making up a fake crime to make him look tough. This will blow up in his face and he should consider resignation. He doesn't have the students back. If he wants to show he is a weak, pathetic loser, he could have just said that he disagrees with the poor taste of the signs, but he needs to behind his students under this kind of witch hunt.

Sent from my XT1254 using Tapatalk

You have proved yourself many times over to be a reasonable poster, ER. So I'll ask you to reconsider a couple of your points.

He doesn't have the students['] back:

The idiots who hung those sheets are not the only students involved. Just as involved are the incoming freshman, who are being taunted upon their arrival to campus. Assault and intimidation is not limited to actual, physical conduct. These "jokes" may have been funny to the knuckleheads who hung them on move-in day -- but only because they subjectively knew that they were only kidding. Others have no way of knowing their subjective intentions, and I can fully understand the distress of an already nervous freshman being greeted to new campus with that kind of nasty filth.

As between the two, the "student backs" that President Broderick was properly watching out for were those who were not responsible for the problem.

[T]his kind of witch hunt:

Unless and until these students are prosecuted (which I don't believe will happen), any blowback that they are feeling from the administration is not a witch hunt. It is a justified reply to a very offensive dialogue that they opted to start. No one forced them to hang those sheets. They did it on their own accord. If they can't deal with the consequences of their own act, then that's on them.

President Broderick has no duty whatsoever to cover for student stupidity.

Just my opinion.

(And, for the record, I do very much feel sorry for them. Their thoughtlessness is being blown way out of proportion. But that's just a reality of today's social media, not anything that ODU has done to them. President Broderick and the university owe them nothing but justifiable disdain.)

The people demanding justice and the people Broderick is cowering to are the same people that want to see ODU go down. It tells me he either agrees with those that want ODU to go down, or he is afraid to stand up to them. Either way isn't good. His response made the situation worse. Now instead of it being in the news once, it is now guaranteed to be in the news indefinitely. The students were certainly stupid and thoughtless, but this is small time stuff. Letting the social media warriors paint them as rapists and compare this to sexual assault for a bad joke that any of our sons at that age could have done is reprehensible and frankly didn't even justify an official response.

(08-24-2015 07:15 AM)EverRespect Wrote:  

(08-24-2015 06:40 AM)AdoptedMonarch Wrote:  

(08-24-2015 05:52 AM)EverRespect Wrote:  

(08-23-2015 10:53 AM)monarchman Wrote:  Absolutely embarrassing and disgusting. ODU already has serious perception issues with crime and safety, and this only pours fuel to the fire and provides more negative publicity. In the message board world it may seem much to do about nothing, but with fraternities under high media scrutiny as of late, don't be shocked if this got national attention. ODU needs to throw down the hammer.

Broderick should be addressing real crime, not making up a fake crime to make him look tough. This will blow up in his face and he should consider resignation. He doesn't have the students back. If he wants to show he is a weak, pathetic loser, he could have just said that he disagrees with the poor taste of the signs, but he needs to behind his students under this kind of witch hunt.

Sent from my XT1254 using Tapatalk

You have proved yourself many times over to be a reasonable poster, ER. So I'll ask you to reconsider a couple of your points.

He doesn't have the students['] back:

The idiots who hung those sheets are not the only students involved. Just as involved are the incoming freshman, who are being taunted upon their arrival to campus. Assault and intimidation is not limited to actual, physical conduct. These "jokes" may have been funny to the knuckleheads who hung them on move-in day -- but only because they subjectively knew that they were only kidding. Others have no way of knowing their subjective intentions, and I can fully understand the distress of an already nervous freshman being greeted to new campus with that kind of nasty filth.

As between the two, the "student backs" that President Broderick was properly watching out for were those who were not responsible for the problem.

[T]his kind of witch hunt:

Unless and until these students are prosecuted (which I don't believe will happen), any blowback that they are feeling from the administration is not a witch hunt. It is a justified reply to a very offensive dialogue that they opted to start. No one forced them to hang those sheets. They did it on their own accord. If they can't deal with the consequences of their own act, then that's on them.

President Broderick has no duty whatsoever to cover for student stupidity.

Just my opinion.

(And, for the record, I do very much feel sorry for them. Their thoughtlessness is being blown way out of proportion. But that's just a reality of today's social media, not anything that ODU has done to them. President Broderick and the university owe them nothing but justifiable disdain.)

The people demanding justice and the people Broderick is cowering to are the same people that want to see ODU go down. It tells me he either agrees with those that want ODU to go down, or he is afraid to stand up to them. Either way isn't good. His response made the situation worse. Now instead of it being in the news once, it is now guaranteed to be in the news indefinitely. The students were certainly stupid and thoughtless, but this is small time stuff. Letting the social media warriors paint them as rapists and compare this to sexual assault for a bad joke that any of our sons at that age could have done is reprehensible and frankly didn't even justify an official response.

The crime on and off campus is clearly a much bigger issue and Broderick should be held responsible for not dealing with it more successfully.

I am a local high school teacher and know dozens of students who live on campus AND my two daughters go to school (nursing and speech-language pathology). One of my ex students was shot (deflected bulled) when the student whose uncle is a representative in Md (Bunting??) was killed. It's pretty embarrassing and makes it much more difficult for my AP students to even consider ODU.

This is a perception issue however, and Broderick did handle it correctly. We all know what happens at college, but it can't be advertised so blatantly at a school with a questionable history as a party school with a lot of crime.

I would ask those that thing this is much ado about nothing to first watch The Hunting Ground -- really watch it -- before being so dismissive about the ODU signs. As the father of two daughters who went to Kempsville then Va Tech and only now tell stories of the sexual innuendo, unwanted frottage, etc., that occurred, the film hits home with me. The signs tell women that as far as these guys are concerned they are pieces of meat to be used as the men see fit.

Anyway, watch the movie then see if your opinion isn't a bit different. Once these guys are found out they should be publicly expelled from the university. The message would clearly be sent: We don't tolerate this behavior at a place where all are here to learn in a safe, welcoming environment.

We've got a few women on this board. What say you?

Can we get back to football and basketball talk?

Plenty of threads for that elsewhere on here. You're not being deprived of anything

We live in a different day and time now. Social media is the watchful eye of any and all behavior. If this happened back in the 80's when I was at school, nobody but the folks who saw the signs would know about it. This does not excuse the behavior. Nobody is being hunted for this. They put it out there in plain view. It was a stupid prank. I work as a public school administrator and we have to take any and all things posted online, written, or verbally said as serious even it is a harmless threat. Let something happen that could have been prevented, and see how much news coverage you get from that.
We may never know the outcome of the disciplinary action of these students, even if they are students. However they made the behavior public so their consequences should be displayed. president Broderick did what he had to do, and any University President would have done the same thing.

I can certainly see the point of view that insists on raising consciousness of sexual assault and harassment. I agree we as a whole need to be more sensitive to this issue. My concern is making sure the reaction by admin is appropriate to the violation, and not excessive to placate some. Youth, poor judgement, excitement about starting school, chemistry all need to be taken into account. I hope the kids responsible will be given an opportunity to express some understanding of how they were inappropriate and this become a teaching moment, not a punitive one.
We need to make sure we don't overreact to incidents. It can be self defeating to be to punishing and critical of transgressors. That only causes people to become resentful and more clever at hiding their real feelings. Open discussion should always be a goal.

I tend to find my views on as liberal of the side of an argument as you can find. I have been blasted on these boards for talking about how sometimes amongst the recruiting scene some people will be asked to "take one for the team." I have no problem with that and found being to be quite prudish for not understanding.

I have argued that I was ok with BT lowering his standards to get someone with talent into school. My argument was/is that I do not look to the student athletes to be a role model or a beacon of goodness in life. I hope they represent my school well, but mostly, I hope they perform well on the field/court.

I saw this on Saturday morning and for whatever reason, I found it to be tasteless. Whether it is a student conduct violation or not is not up top me. The one thing I would say is throughout life, people will learn lessons. I have found the best lessons to be the ones that are learned the hard way. If President Broderick says this is an issue worth escalating, then so be it. The kids involved will have to learn from their actions.

If this is brushed aside, the kids will take whatever lessons have come from the public outcry and it will help shape their life.

I don't think we should make more out of this than what it is. A stupid joke. At the same point, we don't need to simply brush it aside of the powers to be feel that it is a cause worth fighting.

Well, good news and bad news on this from the state of Maryland. News of our ridiculous student behavior with the whole freshman drop off thing has made it up here too. In fact, people are razzing me about it as they know I'm an ODU guy. So thats the bad news. The good news is most people have chuckled, said it was classless and in poor taste, but just written it off as stupid college ridiculousness and not taken it as an indictment on our schools stance on crime and sexual assault etc.

Kids do stupid things. Probably should be some sort of punishment, but shouldn't alter their lives. Community service and/or counseling. I'm sure this was more a case of trying to be funny rather than an advertisement for rape which some are making it out to be.

On Fox News Front page !! Stupid decision? ..yes, ODU leadership handle this appropriately?..yes, will there be a punishment?....TBD
Finally...my hope is this brings more of a focus on the environment around campus and ensuring that all events are scrutinized with the same filter. One test will be homecoming.

(08-24-2015 09:43 AM)Old Dominion Wrote:  I can certainly see the point of view that insists on raising consciousness of sexual assault and harassment. I agree we as a whole need to be more sensitive to this issue. My concern is making sure the reaction by admin is appropriate to the violation, and not excessive to placate some. Youth, poor judgement, excitement about starting school, chemistry all need to be taken into account. I hope the kids responsible will be given an opportunity to express some understanding of how they were inappropriate and this become a teaching moment, not a punitive one.
We need to make sure we don't overreact to incidents. It can be self defeating to be to punishing and critical of transgressors. That only causes people to become resentful and more clever at hiding their real feelings. Open discussion should always be a goal.

Well put

(08-24-2015 10:24 AM)Mr.BigBlue Wrote:  On Fox News Front page !! Stupid decision? ..yes, ODU leadership handle this appropriately?..yes, will there be a punishment?....TBD
Finally...my hope is this brings more of a focus on the environment around campus and ensuring that all events are scrutinized with the same filter. One test will be homecoming.

This would not have been front page of Fox News if Broderick had kept his mouth shut. He created a firestorm. I knew this would be the result.

I'll probably get blasted, but I thought it was funny. I'm 42, have a daughter, and might have even tried to drop my wife off there.

Also, this is definitely not the first time something like this happened at a school...

Now on front page of Huffington Post site. Not the way I want my school portrayed.