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MBB: Western Michigan at Toledo game thread
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cnyrocketfan Offline
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Post: #221
RE: MBB: Western Michigan at Toledo game thread
Agree about the replay. I'd need to see it again too.

And of course, it's just my opinion too. And you probably saw it better than I did.

Not that it matters now anyway.
01-17-2015 09:36 PM
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bcunn3128 Away
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Post: #222
RE: MBB: Western Michigan at Toledo game thread
Maybe we can learn something from karma--we lost to Central and Juice admits afterwards that we didn't take them seriously, and tonight we lose after Drummond arbitrarily decides that Western isn't likely to be the MAC champs again. How about we try to play 40 minutes of basketball and respect every opponent from here on out?
01-17-2015 09:38 PM
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adunifon Offline
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Post: #223
MBB: Western Michigan at Toledo game thread
(01-17-2015 09:38 PM)bcunn3128 Wrote:  Maybe we can learn something from karma--we lost to Central and Juice admits afterwards that we didn't take them seriously, and tonight we lose after Drummond arbitrarily decides that Western isn't likely to be the MAC champs again. How about we try to play 40 minutes of basketball and respect every opponent from here on out?

It's not gonna happen. This team is what it is. 5 individuals who rarely play as a unit. When they share the ball and move they're successful. They just don't do it often.
01-17-2015 09:42 PM
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MidnightBlueGold Offline
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Post: #224
RE: MBB: Western Michigan at Toledo game thread
(01-17-2015 09:20 PM)adunifon Wrote:  You know what sucks?

Our defense.

Oh, and some ball movement on offensr would be nice for a change.

You know what sucks? YOU.
01-17-2015 09:50 PM
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adunifon Offline
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Post: #225
MBB: Western Michigan at Toledo game thread
(01-17-2015 09:50 PM)MidnightBlueGold Wrote:  
(01-17-2015 09:20 PM)adunifon Wrote:  You know what sucks?

Our defense.

Oh, and some ball movement on offensr would be nice for a change.

You know what sucks? YOU.

Once again -- offer a rebuttal to the points. You never have.
01-17-2015 09:53 PM
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inductchuck16 Offline
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Post: #226
RE: MBB: Western Michigan at Toledo game thread
Pretty good crowd tonight, announced attendance was somewhere over 6,000. But when we keep losing games with these big crowds, these big crowds probably won't keep happening and we'll never get a sell out. I would love to see Savage sold out for a men's game. Place would be rocking (like the WNIT run). Nothing beats a sell out.
(This post was last modified: 01-18-2015 01:23 AM by inductchuck16.)
01-18-2015 01:23 AM
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H2Oville Rocket Offline
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Post: #227
RE: MBB: Western Michigan at Toledo game thread
(01-18-2015 01:23 AM)inductchuck16 Wrote:  Pretty good crowd tonight, announced attendance was somewhere over 6,000. But when we keep losing games with these big crowds, these big crowds probably won't keep happening and we'll never get a sell out. I would love to see Savage sold out for a men's game. Place would be rocking (like the WNIT run). Nothing beats a sell out.

Crowd for the Akron game was pretty good after a weak effort against CMU. Then it got even bigger last night(some sort of special deal, I think). A four loss BG team comes in next Saturday-I think we'll see another big crowd, although many will be wearing jailhouse jumpsuit colors.
01-18-2015 07:35 AM
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Rocket75 Offline
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Post: #228
RE: MBB: Western Michigan at Toledo game thread
I was at the game and we completely got outcoached.

WMU knew Brown and going to get the last shot so they smothered him. Can't we ever think up a last second play that does not involve Juice shooting from long range?

There were lots of other instances where WMU players were poised to pounce and UT was totally inept.
01-18-2015 09:35 AM
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MidnightBlueGold Offline
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Post: #229
Re: RE: MBB: Western Michigan at Toledo game thread
(01-18-2015 09:35 AM)Rocket75 Wrote:  I was at the game and we completely got outcoached.

WMU knew Brown and going to get the last shot so they smothered him. Can't we ever think up a last second play that does not involve Juice shooting from long range?

There were lots of other instances where WMU players were poised to pounce and UT was totally inept.

Actually, Lauf was getting the last shot. WMU just stopped it.
01-18-2015 09:43 AM
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gobaseline Offline
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Post: #230
RE: MBB: Western Michigan at Toledo game thread
I agree with comments regarding lack of cohesive team play and the offense resembling 5 individual parts not a unit.

The key IMO is running your O through Boothe.

Great passer out of either post. Unselfish. Can shoot putting pressure on his defender to choose to contest or play a lane.

Wouldn't take away from any of the highly skilled perimeter types. They can still dribble but when they know that they'll be getting back ... or simply use him as the screen.

Think of the hub of a wheel with everything spinning fast around it. The hub doesn't have to cover the ground the tire tread does but without it the tread on it's own is less effective.
01-18-2015 09:45 AM
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bcunn3128 Away
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Post: #231
RE: MBB: Western Michigan at Toledo game thread
(01-18-2015 09:45 AM)gobaseline Wrote:  I agree with comments regarding lack of cohesive team play and the offense resembling 5 individual parts not a unit.

The key IMO is running your O through Boothe.

Great passer out of either post. Unselfish. Can shoot putting pressure on his defender to choose to contest or play a lane.

Wouldn't take away from any of the highly skilled perimeter types. They can still dribble but when they know that they'll be getting back ... or simply use him as the screen.

Think of the hub of a wheel with everything spinning fast around it. The hub doesn't have to cover the ground the tire tread does but without it the tread on it's own is less effective.

I couldn't really remember how Boothe did against Western last season when they had Whittington so I went back and looked. In 3 games, he went 6 pts/3 rebs, 13 pts/8 rebs, and 4 pts/3 rebs, and fouled out of all 3 (averaged about 25 minutes in the floor each game). Whittington went 25/13, 20/13 and 10/10. Boothe's best game was the one we won in OT in Savage.

Now, Whittington was a beast. I really expected Boothe, with his experience, to be more of a factor against Western's true freshman center Lamont--not just as the "hub" you speak of but actually scoring points, and was surprised at how timid Boothe seemed to play against him, but perhaps Coach didn't want him down in the low post much?

Another interesting stat I found: Boothe is a great FT shooter--90% this season so far--but that's on 17/19 shooting. Basically 1 FT attempt a game. Last season, he shot 87%, but still only about 2 FT attempts a game. Would be nice to put him in better position to score at the FT line more often?
01-18-2015 10:08 AM
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rocket 51 Offline
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Post: #232
RE: MBB: Western Michigan at Toledo game thread
Was at the game and have some thoughts...
Boothe is never going to be the type of inside post guy that a lot of people were hoping for.

Very interesting that at this weeks DCA TK got a little perturbed with the question, "Whats up with Nathan?"...he kind of bristled saying he is having a great year, he was pleased with him. NB is very soft and we have to realize that 2 and 2 w 5 fouls is possible any night.
obvious statement here...We are very lacking on D. How many backdoors did they run before we got a clue? I agree with JD's comment in the Blah...WMU is a good team that we respect and we will see again. Drummond is way off base with his comments and would hope one of the assistants would help him get that figured out.

This is not a team with passion. We are a good team but the early season hype was way over selling.

A lot of hope and high expectations came at the start and Im not sure if this group will be able to get back on track for the run they will need both at home and certainly on the road to get back in contention for the season everyone was hoping for.

Think we got out coached to a degree tonight and I cant help but feel the assistant coach carousel is hurting coach K.

But lets face it. That western team reminded me of UT back in the day. Nothing flashy but tough as hell and smarter than most all other teams. Go on the road expecting to win...win...get on the bus and go home. Just that simple...no TOLEDO TOUGH needed.
01-18-2015 11:10 AM
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bcunn3128 Away
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Post: #233
RE: MBB: Western Michigan at Toledo game thread
"Toledo back in the day"...Tava reminds me of a Brett Fedak or Dick Miller.
01-18-2015 11:15 AM
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bcunn3128 Away
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RE: MBB: Western Michigan at Toledo game thread
Another thing about Boothe being a "hub" at the high post. You may have noticed that teams are playing softer D on Boothe when he floats out to the free throw line, and his defender-usually someone as tall or taller--has a hand in the passing lane. Suggests to me that they know what Boothe's value to our offense is. Maybe if Boothe can hit a jumper or two early in the game opponents will need to play him tighter which may open the key for us a bit more?
01-18-2015 11:20 AM
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DetroitRocket Online
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Post: #235
RE: MBB: Western Michigan at Toledo game thread
Boothe is Boothe. He is what he is, as Coach K has said.
01-18-2015 11:43 AM
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gobaseline Offline
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Post: #236
RE: MBB: Western Michigan at Toledo game thread
(01-18-2015 10:08 AM)bcunn3128 Wrote:  
(01-18-2015 09:45 AM)gobaseline Wrote:  I agree with comments regarding lack of cohesive team play and the offense resembling 5 individual parts not a unit.

The key IMO is running your O through Boothe.

Great passer out of either post. Unselfish. Can shoot putting pressure on his defender to choose to contest or play a lane.

Wouldn't take away from any of the highly skilled perimeter types. They can still dribble but when they know that they'll be getting back ... or simply use him as the screen.

Think of the hub of a wheel with everything spinning fast around it. The hub doesn't have to cover the ground the tire tread does but without it the tread on it's own is less effective.

I couldn't really remember how Boothe did against Western last season when they had Whittington so I went back and looked. In 3 games, he went 6 pts/3 rebs, 13 pts/8 rebs, and 4 pts/3 rebs, and fouled out of all 3 (averaged about 25 minutes in the floor each game). Whittington went 25/13, 20/13 and 10/10. Boothe's best game was the one we won in OT in Savage.

Now, Whittington was a beast. I really expected Boothe, with his experience, to be more of a factor against Western's true freshman center Lamont--not just as the "hub" you speak of but actually scoring points, and was surprised at how timid Boothe seemed to play against him, but perhaps Coach didn't want him down in the low post much?

Another interesting stat I found: Boothe is a great FT shooter--90% this season so far--but that's on 17/19 shooting. Basically 1 FT attempt a game. Last season, he shot 87%, but still only about 2 FT attempts a game. Would be nice to put him in better position to score at the FT line more often?

What Nathan Boothe did against Shayne Whittington is irrelevant.

How Kowalcyk chooses to use him offensively is the gear that drives this wheel.

By your own research NB is effective in shooting, the few times he has. Shoots more? I'd expect the % to drop but the fact is that being a good shooter is just that. Enlarge the sample size and his efficiency still will stand out as excellent.

Now adding a cutting Drummond, Brown, William, Lauf, etc. Being very athletic they can get open. NB can deliver the pill. Once, twice, now they go whirling by and NB shows the ball as he checks his defender, defender cheats to cutter, NB drops steps with a hook or power move. Post defender now has two things to worry about. Right now the ball stays in the hands of positions 1-3 and rarely comes out. NB is relegated to an obtuse option. He still has to defend usually trying to cover up for others. So to get 2 pts and 5 fouls is to be expected.

The very reason Connar Tava is so effective is that he can deliver the pill and Hawkins expects the offense to run through him. He isn't a great outside shooter but inside he is a whirling dervish who if he can get his shoulders past the defender will at least draw the foul. Why, because Hawkins has made it a priority. Deliver the pill, make the shot, what else do you need on offense?
(This post was last modified: 01-18-2015 12:09 PM by gobaseline.)
01-18-2015 12:06 PM
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gobaseline Offline
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Post: #237
RE: MBB: Western Michigan at Toledo game thread
(01-18-2015 11:43 AM)DetroitRocket Wrote:  Boothe is Boothe. He is what he is, as Coach K has said.

Genetically, yes.

Coached up and used properly .... an excuse by the header. He's your header. I'm happy for you.
01-18-2015 12:11 PM
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gobaseline Offline
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Post: #238
RE: MBB: Western Michigan at Toledo game thread
(01-18-2015 11:20 AM)bcunn3128 Wrote:  Another thing about Boothe being a "hub" at the high post. You may have noticed that teams are playing softer D on Boothe when he floats out to the free throw line, and his defender-usually someone as tall or taller--has a hand in the passing lane. Suggests to me that they know what Boothe's value to our offense is.

Ding ding ding, we have a winner! 04-rock
01-18-2015 12:12 PM
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FMRocket Offline
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Post: #239
RE: MBB: Western Michigan at Toledo game thread
(01-18-2015 11:15 AM)bcunn3128 Wrote:  "Toledo back in the day"...Tava reminds me of a Brett Fedak or Dick Miller.

YEP !!! - Not much cockiness. They just went out and got the job done...
(This post was last modified: 01-18-2015 12:33 PM by FMRocket.)
01-18-2015 12:31 PM
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