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Transformation vs Incrementalism
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illiniowl Offline
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Post: #881
RE: Transformation vs Incrementalism
(03-13-2020 11:39 PM)InterestedX Wrote:  
(03-13-2020 07:32 PM)GoodOwl Wrote:  the good news for our athletes is that they have a real school to attend once classes start back. Can't imagine what some others at other schools will do when it actually dawns on them the purpose of college is to go to class. Maybe some will begin attending just to see what it is like.

This is exactly what makes people hate Rice fans.

It's cute that you think anyone cares enough to hate Rice fans.
03-14-2020 09:57 AM
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Tomball Owl Offline
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Post: #882
RE: Transformation vs Incrementalism
(03-14-2020 09:57 AM)illiniowl Wrote:  
(03-13-2020 11:39 PM)InterestedX Wrote:  
(03-13-2020 07:32 PM)GoodOwl Wrote:  the good news for our athletes is that they have a real school to attend once classes start back. Can't imagine what some others at other schools will do when it actually dawns on them the purpose of college is to go to class. Maybe some will begin attending just to see what it is like.

This is exactly what makes people hate Rice fans.

It's cute that you think anyone cares enough to hate Rice fans.

+1!

If anything, the few that know we exist feel sorry for us.
03-14-2020 01:15 PM
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GoodOwl Offline
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Post: #883
RE: Transformation vs Incrementalism
[Image: executives-dream_big-corporate_giant-slo...07_low.jpg]
04-01-2020 10:54 PM
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GoodOwl Offline
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Post: #884
Exclamation RE: Transformation vs Incrementalism
Well, we may well finally get Transformed, but perhaps by forces outside our school's athletic leadership:

link to SI article today:
'We’re All Effed. There’s No Other Way to Look at This, Is There?'

Quote:Administrators and insiders weigh in as the Coronavirus threatens the College Football season—and explain why the entire NCAA system could hang in the balance.

[Image: rev-comparison.png]
CLICK FOR EXPANDED IMAGE. Not every athletic department is created equal. Power 5 and Group of Five programs get their revenue from vastly different sources. Here's a side-by-side look at 2018 revenue from the SEC and Conference USA. Look at the striking differences. While the two biggest revenue-generators for an SEC school are conference distribution/media rights and ticket sales, Conference USA's two revenue-producers are from student fees and state funding. All four revenue-generators—distribution/media rights, ticket sales, student fees and state funding—will be significantly impacted by the coronavirus's adverse effect on the economy.
(This post was last modified: 04-08-2020 01:37 PM by GoodOwl.)
04-08-2020 01:25 PM
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illiniowl Offline
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Post: #885
RE: Transformation vs Incrementalism
(04-08-2020 01:25 PM)GoodOwl Wrote:  Well, we may well finally get Transformed, but perhaps by forces outside our school's athletic leadership:

link to SI article today:
'We’re All Effed. There’s No Other Way to Look at This, Is There?'

Quote:Administrators and insiders weigh in as the Coronavirus threatens the College Football season—and explain why the entire NCAA system could hang in the balance.

[Image: rev-comparison.png]
CLICK FOR EXPANDED IMAGE. Not every athletic department is created equal. Power 5 and Group of Five programs get their revenue from vastly different sources. Here's a side-by-side look at 2018 revenue from the SEC and Conference USA. Look at the striking differences. While the two biggest revenue-generators for an SEC school are conference distribution/media rights and ticket sales, Conference USA's two revenue-producers are from student fees and state funding. All four revenue-generators—distribution/media rights, ticket sales, student fees and state funding—will be significantly impacted by the coronavirus's adverse effect on the economy.

Somewhat perversely, Rice is actually in better position than most if not all G5 schools, and certainly all of the other CUSA schools, in that we're a private school (and an ostensibly rich one at that) that is, for better or worse, committed to subsidizing the athletic program in perpetuity and essentially isn't dependent on elastic sources of revenue (at least in terms of keeping the program going; having it be successful is obviously a different story). Tuition revenue isn't going down because we could fill every seat in the incoming class twenty-plus times over as it is, so even if applications drop and we have to admit a few more kids to keep enrollment the same we certainly have room to do that. And our endowment income will be fine in the long run and obviously dwarfs nearly everyone else at this level.

I am not at all convinced we are looking at a mass extinction event for G5 public-school athletic departments -- I wouldn't underestimate the willingness of schools/states to sacrifice in lots of areas (including academics) to keep athletics going and/or raise taxes (including student fees) -- but if we are and there ends up being consolidation and contraction, I'd have to think there might be opportunities for Rice to move up or at least improve its neighborhood.

Of course, the next time Rice makes the right decision when faced with such opportunities will be the first.
04-08-2020 03:10 PM
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Intellectual_Brutality Offline
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Post: #886
RE: Transformation vs Incrementalism
Might be relevant to UH's finances: https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/...DQH_wnGiBY
(This post was last modified: 04-09-2020 03:20 PM by Intellectual_Brutality.)
04-09-2020 03:20 PM
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GoodOwl Offline
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Post: #887
Exclamation RE: Transformation vs Incrementalism
Saw this snippet from a column today on the possible return of various sports and how they might do it and it somehow reminded me of something familiar:

Quote:As for college sports: It remains unthinkable for schools to allow athletes to gather and travel and compete if campuses are closed for the fall. It remains unthinkable that, without a vaccine, those athletes would be asked to play in front of crowds of 80,000-plus, and what’s the point of college football if the Color & Pageantry is a backdrop of empty seats?

Playing for the athletes to play and compete against each other. Playing for the schools whether fans are present or not. Playing as college students who happen to be athletes--remember that, if ever? There IS a point in playing college sports again. Maybe the Transformation that could ahppen brings the rest of big-time sports back to the pack a little, and thus helps Rice sports in that way? The G-league, and some name and likeness rights and other developments necessitated by this current situation might perchance on its own help us out where we've been hard pressed to help ourselves? Will we grasp the chance to work fully within any new opportunities presented to finally get things back on track? Will it just be more of the same ol, same ol, both for us and for the rest of the college sports world?
04-29-2020 10:19 PM
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75src Offline
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Post: #888
RE: Transformation vs Incrementalism
If the campuses are not open, then college football would simply just be a minor league subordinate to the NFL. The NFL has better football but the colleges have better tradition and spirit.

(04-29-2020 10:19 PM)GoodOwl Wrote:  Saw this snippet from a column today on the possible return of various sports and how they might do it and it somehow reminded me of something familiar:

Quote:As for college sports: It remains unthinkable for schools to allow athletes to gather and travel and compete if campuses are closed for the fall. It remains unthinkable that, without a vaccine, those athletes would be asked to play in front of crowds of 80,000-plus, and what’s the point of college football if the Color & Pageantry is a backdrop of empty seats?

Playing for the athletes to play and compete against each other. Playing for the schools whether fans are present or not. Playing as college students who happen to be athletes--remember that, if ever? There IS a point in playing college sports again. Maybe the Transformation that could ahppen brings the rest of big-time sports back to the pack a little, and thus helps Rice sports in that way? The G-league, and some name and likeness rights and other developments necessitated by this current situation might perchance on its own help us out where we've been hard pressed to help ourselves? Will we grasp the chance to work fully within any new opportunities presented to finally get things back on track? Will it just be more of the same ol, same ol, both for us and for the rest of the college sports world?
04-30-2020 10:18 AM
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GoodOwl Offline
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Post: #889
Exclamation RE: Transformation vs Incrementalism
In the SWAC, the main source of revenue comes from putting fans in the stands, and their are no substitutes for that at schools that often have limited resources. Prairie View A&M, which is about 50 miles away from Houston, led all 107 HBCUs in sports revenue in 2018 by generating $18.6 million, according to the Knight Commission on Intercollegiate Athletics. That revenue ranks 149th among all college sports teams. To put it in perspective, the 21 Division I HBCUs generated about $214 million in revenue in 2018, while the University of Texas alone out-earned those schools, leading the nation in sports revenue with more than $219 million that year.

Wonder what the revenue numbers will be like post-Covid? Will their be realignment(s) related to the impact on revenue that the virus/shutdown have/will have on college sports?
05-27-2020 02:13 PM
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InterestedX Offline
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Post: #890
RE: Transformation vs Incrementalism
(05-27-2020 02:13 PM)GoodOwl Wrote:  In the SWAC, the main source of revenue comes from putting fans in the stands, and their are no substitutes for that at schools that often have limited resources. Prairie View A&M, which is about 50 miles away from Houston, led all 107 HBCUs in sports revenue in 2018 by generating $18.6 million, according to the Knight Commission on Intercollegiate Athletics. That revenue ranks 149th among all college sports teams. To put it in perspective, the 21 Division I HBCUs generated about $214 million in revenue in 2018, while the University of Texas alone out-earned those schools, leading the nation in sports revenue with more than $219 million that year.

Wonder what the revenue numbers will be like post-Covid? Will their be realignment(s) related to the impact on revenue that the virus/shutdown have/will have on college sports?

From the PVAMU site:

"Revenue categories include ticket sales, contributions, rights/licensing, student fees, and school funds."

A huge chunk of that $18.6 million comes from student fees and other institutional support, not ticket sales or sponsorships, etc.
05-27-2020 11:48 PM
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Post: #891
RE: Transformation vs Incrementalism
The time for incrementalism is likely over. The P5 is going to move on, and the NCAA as we know it will be history. And Rice is going to have to decide if it's worth it or not, if it isn't able to make the jump in the post-NCAA world.

https://www.cbssports.com/college-footba...m-the-fbs/

I wouldn't be surprised if that P5 proposal for baseball scheduling fits nicely into a world where the P5 (and a lucky couple of dozen - maybe) move to a new post-amateurism minor league model for all of the big sports (at least).
(This post was last modified: 05-28-2020 08:37 PM by gsloth.)
05-28-2020 10:16 AM
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Post: #892
RE: Transformation vs Incrementalism
(05-27-2020 11:48 PM)InterestedX Wrote:  
(05-27-2020 02:13 PM)GoodOwl Wrote:  In the SWAC, the main source of revenue comes from putting fans in the stands, and their are no substitutes for that at schools that often have limited resources. Prairie View A&M, which is about 50 miles away from Houston, led all 107 HBCUs in sports revenue in 2018 by generating $18.6 million, according to the Knight Commission on Intercollegiate Athletics. That revenue ranks 149th among all college sports teams. To put it in perspective, the 21 Division I HBCUs generated about $214 million in revenue in 2018, while the University of Texas alone out-earned those schools, leading the nation in sports revenue with more than $219 million that year.
Wonder what the revenue numbers will be like post-Covid? Will their be realignment(s) related to the impact on revenue that the virus/shutdown have/will have on college sports?
From the PVAMU site:
"Revenue categories include ticket sales, contributions, rights/licensing, student fees, and school funds."
A huge chunk of that $18.6 million comes from student fees and other institutional support, not ticket sales or sponsorships, etc.

They're not getting a huge chuck of any $18.6 million from ticket sales, that's for sure.
(This post was last modified: 05-28-2020 10:45 AM by Owl 69/70/75.)
05-28-2020 10:45 AM
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illiniowl Offline
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Post: #893
RE: Transformation vs Incrementalism
(05-28-2020 10:45 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  
(05-27-2020 11:48 PM)InterestedX Wrote:  
(05-27-2020 02:13 PM)GoodOwl Wrote:  In the SWAC, the main source of revenue comes from putting fans in the stands, and their are no substitutes for that at schools that often have limited resources. Prairie View A&M, which is about 50 miles away from Houston, led all 107 HBCUs in sports revenue in 2018 by generating $18.6 million, according to the Knight Commission on Intercollegiate Athletics. That revenue ranks 149th among all college sports teams. To put it in perspective, the 21 Division I HBCUs generated about $214 million in revenue in 2018, while the University of Texas alone out-earned those schools, leading the nation in sports revenue with more than $219 million that year.
Wonder what the revenue numbers will be like post-Covid? Will their be realignment(s) related to the impact on revenue that the virus/shutdown have/will have on college sports?
From the PVAMU site:
"Revenue categories include ticket sales, contributions, rights/licensing, student fees, and school funds."
A huge chunk of that $18.6 million comes from student fees and other institutional support, not ticket sales or sponsorships, etc.

They're not getting a huge chuck of any $18.6 million from ticket sales, that's for sure.

Yep, as best I can glean from PVAMU's online FY20 budget, "sales and services" revenue for football was budgeted at about $2.17MM, MBK at $640K, WBK at $140K, and all other sports combined at $110K, which adds up to $3.06 million. There was also "athletics administration" sales-and-service revenue of $775K, which brings the total to $3.835 million. Guarantees for away non-conference games in FB (played at UH last year) and MBK undoubtedly are included in either the sports or the admin. line items.

The rest of their "revenue" is passive: student fees ($3 million) and subsidies from elsewhere in the budget.
05-28-2020 01:01 PM
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InterestedX Offline
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Post: #894
RE: Transformation vs Incrementalism
(05-28-2020 01:01 PM)illiniowl Wrote:  
(05-28-2020 10:45 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  
(05-27-2020 11:48 PM)InterestedX Wrote:  
(05-27-2020 02:13 PM)GoodOwl Wrote:  In the SWAC, the main source of revenue comes from putting fans in the stands, and their are no substitutes for that at schools that often have limited resources. Prairie View A&M, which is about 50 miles away from Houston, led all 107 HBCUs in sports revenue in 2018 by generating $18.6 million, according to the Knight Commission on Intercollegiate Athletics. That revenue ranks 149th among all college sports teams. To put it in perspective, the 21 Division I HBCUs generated about $214 million in revenue in 2018, while the University of Texas alone out-earned those schools, leading the nation in sports revenue with more than $219 million that year.
Wonder what the revenue numbers will be like post-Covid? Will their be realignment(s) related to the impact on revenue that the virus/shutdown have/will have on college sports?
From the PVAMU site:
"Revenue categories include ticket sales, contributions, rights/licensing, student fees, and school funds."
A huge chunk of that $18.6 million comes from student fees and other institutional support, not ticket sales or sponsorships, etc.

They're not getting a huge chuck of any $18.6 million from ticket sales, that's for sure.

Yep, as best I can glean from PVAMU's online FY20 budget, "sales and services" revenue for football was budgeted at about $2.17MM, MBK at $640K, WBK at $140K, and all other sports combined at $110K, which adds up to $3.06 million. There was also "athletics administration" sales-and-service revenue of $775K, which brings the total to $3.835 million. Guarantees for away non-conference games in FB (played at UH last year) and MBK undoubtedly are included in either the sports or the admin. line items.

The rest of their "revenue" is passive: student fees ($3 million) and subsidies from elsewhere in the budget.

Best I could discern, they are at about $85K in football ticket sales.
05-28-2020 01:40 PM
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