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Transformation vs Incrementalism
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WRCisforgotten79 Offline
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Post: #701
RE: Transformation vs Incrementalism
(11-14-2018 07:22 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  
(11-14-2018 02:40 AM)WRCisforgotten79 Wrote:  
(11-13-2018 07:24 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  
(11-13-2018 06:48 PM)WRCisforgotten79 Wrote:  Bloomgren is an unmitigated disaster.
So whom would you like to see instead?
Simply pointing out the obvious will not obligate me to coming up with an alternative.

Perhaps not, but it is kind of chicken**** to criticize so stridently without even pretending to have an alternative. Or maybe your approach is just to piss and moan about everything without bothering to try to be constructive.

At least I go to games, rather than ignorantly pontificate from Huntsville, as do some "know-it-all" posters.
11-14-2018 10:22 AM
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Owl 69/70/75 Offline
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Post: #702
RE: Transformation vs Incrementalism
(11-14-2018 10:22 AM)WRCisforgotten79 Wrote:  
(11-14-2018 07:22 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  
(11-14-2018 02:40 AM)WRCisforgotten79 Wrote:  
(11-13-2018 07:24 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  
(11-13-2018 06:48 PM)WRCisforgotten79 Wrote:  Bloomgren is an unmitigated disaster.
So whom would you like to see instead?
Simply pointing out the obvious will not obligate me to coming up with an alternative.
Perhaps not, but it is kind of chicken**** to criticize so stridently without even pretending to have an alternative. Or maybe your approach is just to piss and moan about everything without bothering to try to be constructive.
At least I go to games, rather than ignorantly pontificate from Huntsville, as do some "know-it-all" posters.

Who pontificates from Huntsville? If you are going to make an accusation, at least get your facts right.

And you don't have to go to games to know that this year sucks, just like 2017 and 2016 and for that matter 2015. When they put a product on the field worth driving down for, I'll be there. But the last four times I've been, I had to leave after a quarter because I just could not stand to watch such sloppiness.

Hell, I've said all along that I didn't think "pound the rock" would work. I figured you would at least agree with that.
(This post was last modified: 11-14-2018 01:55 PM by Owl 69/70/75.)
11-14-2018 11:52 AM
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ruowls Offline
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Post: #703
RE: Transformation vs Incrementalism
(11-13-2018 02:27 PM)GoodOwl Wrote:  
(11-13-2018 02:11 PM)GoodOwl Wrote:  One gets the feeling not many of the current players would have been recruited by Coach Bloom.


Here's an interesting line of questioning for the board's analysis/perspective:

Many of you are former players--some recent and some longer ago. How many of you, in ANY sport, experienced a head coaching change during your tenure at Rice? What was that like for you, personally, and in your opinion for others you played with, and for your team(s) overall? In light of your answers to the above, how does that color what you are seeing currently with our various new coaches? Thanks!

Coaches are irrational.
11-14-2018 12:56 PM
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Hootnhowln Offline
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Post: #704
RE: Transformation vs Incrementalism
(11-14-2018 02:40 AM)WRCisforgotten79 Wrote:  
(11-13-2018 07:24 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  
(11-13-2018 06:48 PM)WRCisforgotten79 Wrote:  Bloomgren is an unmitigated disaster.

So whom would you like to see instead?

Simply pointing out the obvious will not obligate me to coming up with an alternative.

As I referenced before, the rosters of conference teams are not filled with 4 and 5 star recruits. In a situation such as this, there is a relatively even playing field when it comes to talent (particularly when compared with the talent level of a typical P5 team).

Therefore, in this league, coaching makes a world of difference. But, when a team such as ODU can defeat North Texas, it becomes clear that to there is not a great gulf in talent level. With that in mind, it is astonishing that Rice not only has not won a conference game, but with the exception of a portion of the second half against lowly UTEP, has not been at all competitive.

Only a poorly coached team could have results this bad, especially in the worst conference in FBS football.
You nailed it! Give or take a few exceptional players, the talent level on all the CUSA teams is comparable. The Owl players were all super-stars(granted not 4-5 recruits) in high school and probably have experienced more losses in one season at Rice then they did in their entire football careers including pop warner days. They obviously have heart--ie, UH and Hawaii games as well as some strong comeback performances. Coaching or lack thereof is key difference. Guess we all expected so much more with the new coaches and there were definite signs of improvement in the first three games. Since then, there's been few adjustments to offensive or defensive game plan with the answer seemingly to be put in the freshman. That'd be great if they were 4-5 star recruits but they aren't and we are still losing. Since CUSA players don't typically have the talent of 4-5 star recruits, the way to win is through smart coaching and smart players who've played some college ball because you're probably not going to "out-athlete" the opposition. Is the new O-line any better with the freshman? Granted, the defense has looked slightly better but that has as much to do with them playing further off the line and not giving up as many big plays as it does with the interceptions. Pretty sure the "old" upperclassman could've done the same but they were obviously told to play tight man coverage. While Tyner has his faults, he seemed much more confident and less panicked than Stankavage who seems overwhelmed most of the time even when the line has provided ample time. Just so frustrating to watch and could go on ad naseum.....
11-14-2018 12:57 PM
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Ourland Offline
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Post: #705
RE: Transformation vs Incrementalism
(11-14-2018 11:52 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  
(11-14-2018 10:22 AM)WRCisforgotten79 Wrote:  
(11-14-2018 07:22 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  
(11-14-2018 02:40 AM)WRCisforgotten79 Wrote:  
(11-13-2018 07:24 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  So whom would you like to see instead?
Simply pointing out the obvious will not obligate me to coming up with an alternative.
Perhaps not, but it is kind of chicken**** to criticize so stridently without even pretending to have an alternative. Or maybe your approach is just to piss and moan about everything without bothering to try to be constructive.
At least I go to games, rather than ignorantly pontificate from Huntsville, as do some "know-it-all" posters.

Who pontificates from Huntsville? If you are going to make an accusation, at least get your facts right.

And you don't have to go to games to know that this year sucks, just like 2017 and 2016 and for that matter 2015. When they put a product on the field worth driving down for, I'll be there. But the last four times I've been, I had to leave after a quarter because I just could not stand to watch such sloppiness.

Hell, I've said all along that I didn't think "pound the rock" would work. I figured you would at least agree with that.

Both you guys are right. It's been an awful season. Not even the lowest expectations were met. Painful as hell. There's plenty wrong with the entire program right now.
11-14-2018 04:44 PM
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GoodOwl Offline
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Post: #706
Exclamation RE: Transformation vs Incrementalism
(11-14-2018 12:56 PM)ruowls Wrote:  
(11-13-2018 02:27 PM)GoodOwl Wrote:  
(11-13-2018 02:11 PM)GoodOwl Wrote:  One gets the feeling not many of the current players would have been recruited by Coach Bloom.


Here's an interesting line of questioning for the board's analysis/perspective:

Many of you are former players--some recent and some longer ago. How many of you, in ANY sport, experienced a head coaching change during your tenure at Rice? What was that like for you, personally, and in your opinion for others you played with, and for your team(s) overall? In light of your answers to the above, how does that color what you are seeing currently with our various new coaches? Thanks!

Coaches are irrational.

Thank you, RUOwls for at least attempting an answer. I thought such a discussion among several former players, both recent and more didstant, from various sports at Rice would shed some as-yet unheard light to the subject.

Also: wish you'd get a chance to see what you could do here.
11-15-2018 04:56 PM
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ruowls Offline
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Post: #707
RE: Transformation vs Incrementalism
(11-15-2018 04:56 PM)GoodOwl Wrote:  
(11-14-2018 12:56 PM)ruowls Wrote:  
(11-13-2018 02:27 PM)GoodOwl Wrote:  
(11-13-2018 02:11 PM)GoodOwl Wrote:  One gets the feeling not many of the current players would have been recruited by Coach Bloom.


Here's an interesting line of questioning for the board's analysis/perspective:

Many of you are former players--some recent and some longer ago. How many of you, in ANY sport, experienced a head coaching change during your tenure at Rice? What was that like for you, personally, and in your opinion for others you played with, and for your team(s) overall? In light of your answers to the above, how does that color what you are seeing currently with our various new coaches? Thanks!

Coaches are irrational.

Thank you, RUOwls for at least attempting an answer. I thought such a discussion among several former players, both recent and more didstant, from various sports at Rice would shed some as-yet unheard light to the subject.

Also: wish you'd get a chance to see what you could do here.

Ok
Long answer:
I came in with Brown and saw the change to Berndt but fortunately did not play for him or Willingham, the receiver coach. As you know, Brown tried to change the culture. Brown pissed off a lot of players. We went 1-10 our first year after 0-11 the year before I got there. I was supposed to be a scout team player at Rice but their jaws dropped after the first week of practice. Receiver coach told me things over the course of my time at Rice that made me think "what the heck". He told me that the coaches were trying to find a way to make me the starter for the first game but they didn't know how to do it without me starting over the other players that had been there and were supposed to be better than me. One got hurt and that was the excuse they used to start me against Minnesota. Later in the year, I got benched when they went to the younger more athletic receiver. They later told me they thought I had a bad day in practice and had lost all my ability to play. Another WTH moment. Won the job back and played Baylor and UH. Won the job in the spring and fall camp but didn't start against Miami my senior year. Started the second game but split series with the younger guy. Went on to lead the SWC in TD receptions, was second in catches and yards and 4th in yards per catch. Was honorable mention AP All-American and All-SWC. Had a higher GPA and stats were equal to the 2 Academic All-Americans COMBINED that year but wasn't nominated by Rice's SID for the award. Went to a spring practice after Brown left and Berndt came. Willingham was running a drill on how to carry the football and not fumble. It had to be exactly like he said. I held it differently and would have been berated by Willingham. He went off on the receivers. I would have told him he was full of it and probably got run off. To me, it was stupid because receivers had to do it exactly his way, the right way. It was to change the culture and do the little things that would let you win games. How many fumbles did I have at Rice....ZERO. NONE. NOT ONE.
So, I have seen some pretty ridged behavior from coaches including ABO behavior 30+ years before this ABO I and II stuff. And I have seen them insist on their way. I once told Christophel to tell Brown a way we could do things that might be worth trying. He told me there was no way in hell he would tell Brown how to do anything and that I should try it and see what happens.
11-15-2018 06:41 PM
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texowl2 Offline
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Post: #708
RE: Transformation vs Incrementalism
sigh, but probably warranted. 8th worse stadium in the country

https://moneywise.com/a/ch-b/worst-stadi...l+Stadiums
11-18-2018 10:17 PM
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Antarius Offline
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Post: #709
RE: Transformation vs Incrementalism
(11-18-2018 10:17 PM)texowl2 Wrote:  sigh, but probably warranted. 8th worse stadium in the country

https://moneywise.com/a/ch-b/worst-stadi...l+Stadiums

I'm iffy on this list. If they are counting game day experience and empty stadiums, then sure. But Hawaii's stadium and the Alamodome are hardly bottom 10 venues. And ours looks old, but truly has some incredible sightlines (although given the product, maybe the less you see the better?)

Legion Field, IMO, should top the list. Total dump.
(This post was last modified: 11-19-2018 12:27 AM by Antarius.)
11-19-2018 12:26 AM
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ExcitedOwl18 Online
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Post: #710
RE: Transformation vs Incrementalism
(11-19-2018 12:26 AM)Antarius Wrote:  
(11-18-2018 10:17 PM)texowl2 Wrote:  sigh, but probably warranted. 8th worse stadium in the country

https://moneywise.com/a/ch-b/worst-stadi...l+Stadiums

I'm iffy on this list. If they are counting game day experience and empty stadiums, then sure. But Hawaii's stadium and the Alamodome are hardly bottom 10 venues.

Legion Field, IMO, should top the list. Total dump.

Hawaii’s Stadium is pretty terrible. The thing is rusting out.

Alamodome is weird as it’s both pretty nice on the interior and can have a decent atmosphere with a good crowd.
11-19-2018 12:28 AM
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GoodOwl Offline
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Post: #711
Exclamation RE: Transformation vs Incrementalism
Well, thank goodness we didn't make ignoble history today. But for a smidge of perspective, here's a post by a WKU fan that sounds eerily familiar to some parliament postings (remember, WKU had Jeff Brohm for a while before he left them)

(11-24-2018 04:09 PM)dahbeed Wrote:  I’ve never been so disappointed in a Western win.

Turd Stewart and Goober will point to last two games and say “See....we good again”

Real fans wil say “Why in the mother******* **** weren’t we using Duncan and Lucky and Jernighan all ****ing year you ****ing stupid mother******?”

I know Duncan isn’t Doughty or White but he was by far the best option this year and Dummydick wouldn’t use him until he got scared he was losing his damn job.

I will not renew season tickets. For that matter I will not even go to a single game next year if Dummydick Junior Sanford is back. And I won’t be alone in that. I know too many people that are saying the same thing.

It’ll be the worst attendance since we became FBS. That’s the price Turd Stewart will pay for keeping ‘his boy’.
11-24-2018 04:27 PM
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Owlman49 Offline
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Post: #712
RE: Transformation vs Incrementalism
(11-14-2018 12:56 PM)ruowls Wrote:  
(11-13-2018 02:27 PM)GoodOwl Wrote:  
(11-13-2018 02:11 PM)GoodOwl Wrote:  One gets the feeling not many of the current players would have been recruited by Coach Bloom.


Here's an interesting line of questioning for the board's analysis/perspective:

Many of you are former players--some recent and some longer ago. How many of you, in ANY sport, experienced a head coaching change during your tenure at Rice? What was that like for you, personally, and in your opinion for others you played with, and for your team(s) overall? In light of your answers to the above, how does that color what you are seeing currently with our various new coaches? Thanks!

Coaches are irrational.

Went through 3 from 82-86, Alborn, Brown, and Berndt. Keep in mind when the Head Cheese changes so does the staff. So not only does the overall philosophy change so does the individual technique and approach by the position coaches. It was absolutely challenging all the way around. Each time a new guy shows up you have to prove yourself again and as you get closer to seniordome you can clearly feel they are looking for new blood. So as I look at Bloom, I say give the guy a chance, his philosophy is a clear and distinct change from the previous staff and it will take a couple of years for the guys to get it ingrained. The tell for him will be balancing recruiting and keeping the older guys engaged and committed to the cause. It all starts there.
11-24-2018 05:07 PM
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tanqtonic Offline
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Post: #713
RE: Transformation vs Incrementalism
(11-14-2018 12:56 PM)ruowls Wrote:  
(11-13-2018 02:27 PM)GoodOwl Wrote:  
(11-13-2018 02:11 PM)GoodOwl Wrote:  One gets the feeling not many of the current players would have been recruited by Coach Bloom.


Here's an interesting line of questioning for the board's analysis/perspective:

Many of you are former players--some recent and some longer ago. How many of you, in ANY sport, experienced a head coaching change during your tenure at Rice? What was that like for you, personally, and in your opinion for others you played with, and for your team(s) overall? In light of your answers to the above, how does that color what you are seeing currently with our various new coaches? Thanks!

Coaches are irrational.

That is why coaches are like pi.
11-24-2018 06:42 PM
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OptimisticOwl Offline
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Post: #714
RE: Transformation vs Incrementalism
(11-24-2018 06:42 PM)tanqtonic Wrote:  
(11-14-2018 12:56 PM)ruowls Wrote:  
(11-13-2018 02:27 PM)GoodOwl Wrote:  
(11-13-2018 02:11 PM)GoodOwl Wrote:  One gets the feeling not many of the current players would have been recruited by Coach Bloom.


Here's an interesting line of questioning for the board's analysis/perspective:

Many of you are former players--some recent and some longer ago. How many of you, in ANY sport, experienced a head coaching change during your tenure at Rice? What was that like for you, personally, and in your opinion for others you played with, and for your team(s) overall? In light of your answers to the above, how does that color what you are seeing currently with our various new coaches? Thanks!

Coaches are irrational.

That is why coaches are like pi.

I am pretty sure our former coach liked pie, just from looking at him.
11-24-2018 08:23 PM
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