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(06-01-2014 05:17 PM)MajorHoople Wrote:  

Quote:Sadly, EMU had more talent on the field than us. It doesn't even take a crowd of 200 EMU fans to see that.

They played better than we did. Doesn't mean they had more talent on the FIELD than us.

Get a clue yourself.

I suppose it's also a coincidence that WMU was THE ONLY SCHOOL IN THE MAC not to have at least one player taken in the draft or even so much as signed as a free agent.

Get a clue, again.

Yeah, I would listen to the accomplished professional before some apple polisher of everything PJ.

Do you fight all of his battles?

You guys are cute.

Oh so it's a "battle" for you? Very telling.

Johnson was totally worth the risk.

I suspect that few of you know that Freddie Bishop had an MSU offer pulled because he hadn't passed his ACT. We offered contingent on him passing it. He did in May and ended up signing with us. Turned into a pretty solid DE.

Greg Jennings was rejected by UM because he had clearing house issues. We stuck with him and they were eventually resolved. Seems like that was a worthwhile gamble.

JC Harrison had questionable academic issues coming out of JC. We passed on him and he went to Washington State, where he became the top rusher in the PAC 10.

It's not as if this Lonnie Johnson thing is something we haven't seen before.

I know Sims is confirmed, but has it even been confirmed yet that Johnson is not eligible?

(06-02-2014 09:51 AM)Chipdip2 Wrote:  Johnson was totally worth the risk.

I suspect that few of you know that Freddie Bishop had an MSU offer pulled because he hadn't passed his ACT. We offered contingent on him passing it. He did in May and ended up signing with us. Turned into a pretty solid DE.

Greg Jennings was rejected by UM because he had clearing house issues. We stuck with him and they were eventually resolved. Seems like that was a worthwhile gamble.

JC Harrison had questionable academic issues coming out of JC. We passed on him and he went to Washington State, where he became the top rusher in the PAC 10.

It's not as if this Lonnie Johnson thing is something we haven't seen before.

That flies in the face of anyone who thinks we are being inefficient by recruiting players who may not qualify academically. Or, more importantly, it fuels the fire for anyone anti Fleck.

Bottom line...going after players who may not qualify academically happens at most FBS schools. Let's not pretend we are above it just because our coach went 1-11 last year and his "style" is a bit controversial (for lack of better term).

I agree with you EA that this happens at most FBS schools. And I really don't want to jump into the middle of the argument with Hoek and Major.

Here is my question though. Will we ever actually hear about any of these guys that don't qualify? Or will it just get swept away like nothing ever happened. We heard all about how great this class was and Johnson specifically was one of the crown jewels. So while I agree that it is still a great class. Taking away a player of his apparent caliber is a big deal. And now I come back to my b!tch for the last several years. Its ALWAYS about spin and how great and rosy everything is at WMU Football. When in REALITY, its never even close to the story we always get.

(06-02-2014 10:48 AM)WheresWaldo42 Wrote:  I agree with you EA that this happens at most FBS schools. And I really don't want to jump into the middle of the argument with Hoek and Major.

Here is my question though. Will we ever actually hear about any of these guys that don't qualify? Or will it just get swept away like nothing ever happened. We heard all about how great this class was and Johnson specifically was one of the crown jewels. So while I agree that it is still a great class. Taking away a player of his apparent caliber is a big deal. And now I come back to my b!tch for the last several years. Its ALWAYS about spin and how great and rosy everything is at WMU Football. When in REALITY, its never even close to the story we always get.

Certainly not disagreeing with you. I would only add that I think if one were to read the message boards, most would have a thread similar to this one. Difference is that our second year HC coach went 1-11 last season AND did a lot of talking from Jan. till Nov.

To answer your question: I don't know. But frankly, I don't really care if we hear about them or not. I care about winning football games, specifically the West and then the MACC...in that order. I will be happy for whatever situations play out (recruiting, game day strategy, player depth, coaches, etc...) in regards to reaching those two goals.

While I was not a fan of PJ's "style" the first 12 months he was on the job, he certainly has toned it down the last 6 months. That cannot be denied. That shows he is learning, at the very least. Short of winning more games and talking a bit too much, he's done A LOT of things right in the last 18 months. I'm hopeful the infusion of talent and the experience he's gained will help WMU win more games this season. Getting to 6 wins while playing in the MAC is not tough.

(06-02-2014 11:27 AM)EA3 Wrote:  

(06-02-2014 10:48 AM)WheresWaldo42 Wrote:  I agree with you EA that this happens at most FBS schools. And I really don't want to jump into the middle of the argument with Hoek and Major.

Here is my question though. Will we ever actually hear about any of these guys that don't qualify? Or will it just get swept away like nothing ever happened. We heard all about how great this class was and Johnson specifically was one of the crown jewels. So while I agree that it is still a great class. Taking away a player of his apparent caliber is a big deal. And now I come back to my b!tch for the last several years. Its ALWAYS about spin and how great and rosy everything is at WMU Football. When in REALITY, its never even close to the story we always get.

Certainly not disagreeing with you. I would only add that I think if one were to read the message boards, most would have a thread similar to this one. Difference is that our second year HC coach went 1-11 last season AND did a lot of talking from Jan. till Nov.

To answer your question: I don't know. But frankly, I don't really care if we hear about them or not. I care about winning football games, specifically the West and then the MACC...in that order. I will be happy for whatever situations play out (recruiting, game day strategy, player depth, coaches, etc...) in regards to reaching those two goals.

While I was not a fan of PJ's "style" the first 12 months he was on the job, he certainly has toned it down the last 6 months. That cannot be denied. That shows he is learning, at the very least. Short of winning more games and talking a bit too much, he's done A LOT of things right in the last 18 months. I'm hopeful the infusion of talent and the experience he's gained will help WMU win more games this season. Getting to 6 wins while playing in the MAC is not tough.

I agree with pretty much everything you have said here. The fact that he has seemingly toned things down at least shows that either someone got to him and explained how he was being perceived. Or he realized that it was time to shut up and put up.

The thing I agree with you most about however is that I just want to see them winning games. That's been my thought all along. My problem goes back to the stop telling me about it and start doing it. And Ive been saying that for 20 years.

I take offense to the credit PJ is given for things that ever coach does like working in the community and grades, I am sure I am leaving things out. He should get credit for recruiting well but they still need to show up. Cubit would always have a few that didn't show up. But the HYPE PJ put behind this class he can't lose too many more of the marquee players and make the same claims. I am all for taking chances on kids but you have to balance that with solid academic kids. Did anyone really think Lonnie Johnson would make it here? He spent a year getting high as a rapper. Did he goto school at all? Couldn't he have taken care of this in the last 6 months? They don't need to be rocket scientists to graduate high school in good standing.

(06-02-2014 01:46 PM)Kimbosucks Wrote:  I take offense to the credit PJ is given for things that ever coach does like working in the community and grades, I am sure I am leaving things out. He should get credit for recruiting well but they still need to show up. Cubit would always have a few that didn't show up. But the HYPE PJ put behind this class he can't lose too many more of the marquee players and make the same claims. I am all for taking chances on kids but you have to balance that with solid academic kids. Did anyone really think Lonnie Johnson would make it here? He spent a year getting high as a rapper. Did he goto school at all? Couldn't he have taken care of this in the last 6 months? They don't need to be rocket scientists to graduate high school in good standing.

Jay Harris was the rapper.

the last 23 years we have had 14 winning or 500 seasons and 9 losing seasons. We need consistency and to win a championship and a bowl game soon or we will become irrelevant.

(06-02-2014 01:49 PM)Chipdip2 Wrote:  

(06-02-2014 01:46 PM)Kimbosucks Wrote:  I take offense to the credit PJ is given for things that ever coach does like working in the community and grades, I am sure I am leaving things out. He should get credit for recruiting well but they still need to show up. Cubit would always have a few that didn't show up. But the HYPE PJ put behind this class he can't lose too many more of the marquee players and make the same claims. I am all for taking chances on kids but you have to balance that with solid academic kids. Did anyone really think Lonnie Johnson would make it here? He spent a year getting high as a rapper. Did he goto school at all? Couldn't he have taken care of this in the last 6 months? They don't need to be rocket scientists to graduate high school in good standing.

Jay Harris was the rapper.

Doh... will he make it? what about seabury?

(06-02-2014 01:46 PM)Kimbosucks Wrote:  I take offense to the credit PJ is given for things that ever coach does like working in the community and grades, I am sure I am leaving things out. He should get credit for recruiting well but they still need to show up. Cubit would always have a few that didn't show up. But the HYPE PJ put behind this class he can't lose too many more of the marquee players and make the same claims. I am all for taking chances on kids but you have to balance that with solid academic kids. Did anyone really think Lonnie Johnson would make it here? He spent a year getting high as a rapper. Did he goto school at all? Couldn't he have taken care of this in the last 6 months? They don't need to be rocket scientists to graduate high school in good standing.

I think your first sentence is spot on from your standpoint. I think we (stampede members) end up talking about it because that's what we do...talk about everything and anything that has to do with the program. Working in the community and graduating kids are expected at WMU. It just makes people feel good to talk about those things. I don't think those things differentiate PJ from the rest of the coaching world.