(05-24-2014 10:44 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(05-24-2014 09:46 AM)apex_pirate Wrote:  ECU doesn't have history with Cincy? We have more of that than we do with USF.

My mistake, you certainly do. I misread the "historical scores" chart.

Curious: In north/south divisions I posted (see below - with Tulsa going to the division that ECU does not go to), do ECU fans prefer to be in the south or north?

North: Cincy, Temple, UConn, Navy, Memphis

South: UCF, USF, Tulane, Houston, SMU

If forced to choose from those groups, I would prefer the North. Like the others said, I'd also prefer UCF be in our group. No offense to anyone...but personally, I think the ECU/UCF "rivalry" game is better than and has more potential for the American than the Houston/SMU game.

(05-24-2014 01:37 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(05-24-2014 11:30 AM)FAUAEPi Wrote:  I never liked North South divisions in college football along the East coast. Too many goods teams occupy the South compared to the North. This is why the ACC didn't split into North South divisions, could you have imagined Miami, Florida St, Georgia Tech, Clemson, North Carolina, NC St, and Duke in a division for football basketball and baseball. Because football is the main breadwinner, I can see the American doing something like the ACC did.
If they didn't, here's how I would organize the North South divisions if done to shorten travel time for student athletes and to embrace regional rivalries:
North:
UConn
Temple
Navy
Cincy
ECU
Memphis

South:
USF
UCF
Tulane
Houston
SMU
Tulsa

For football, that is about as even as it can get. For basketball, this is an injustice.


Just an outsider's two cents

I hate virtually every divisional alignment because they all have Houston in a division that looks like we never left CUSA. I'd much rather have no divisions than be tied to a CUSA schedule EVERY singe year. Houston really has no ties to any CUSA schools except maybe SMU---never did. Personally, a continuous round robin is far more appealing to me. The more variety, the better. I'd much rather have different schools like Navy, UConn, and Cinci showing up on the schedule more often. That wont happen with a division that marries a school to 5 CUSA games every year. We would play many years against all ex-CUSA teams with that alignment.

Nine of the 12 teams in this league are ex-CUSA. It's hard to avoid them, lol.

Not to mention, I doubt we ever have divisions.

(05-24-2014 07:51 AM)pesik Wrote:  

(05-24-2014 07:01 AM)carolinaknights Wrote:  

(05-22-2014 02:26 PM)UofMemphis Wrote:  West: Houston, SMU, Tulsa, Tulane, Memphis, Cincy
East: UCF, USF, ECU, Temple, UConn, Navy

^ that makes sense, but we all know how Cincy loves to complain, so I bet the Florida twins get split up.

West: Houston, SMU, Tulsa, Tulane, Memphis, NAVY
East: UCF, USF, ECU, Temple, UConn, Cinn

Go 5 and 3 - no permanent crossovers. Gives Navy more of a National look and split their 3 game crossover pods as (UCF, Temple, & Cinn) and USF, ECU, and UConn). Gives them a NE and Florida opponent every year. The Army game and the regular Rutgers series will also give them 2 NE games to go along with the ND and and Air Force annual rivalry games. If and when Navy wants or needs another National Game they can use the Rutgers spot in the rotation. When they play ND on the east coast they should play Cinn away and reverse that to keep one game in the Midwest per year. The same scheduling should be done for for Memphis if it can be arranged.

we arent sending navy want, because weaweak arguments there isn't a legitimate reason why they would want that or why we'd force that on them

playing the 3/4 of the worst attended teams in our league doesnt give them a more national look in any way

if the smu game is that important (honestly really isnt) smu-navy can be cross-divisional rivals

Actually Navy already plays Tulane, SMU, and Tulsa on a regular basis. Playing in Texas once a year, Louisiana and Oklahoma every other year,
at Air force every other year, in Florida pretty much every other year, and Indiana / Tennessee / Ohio every other year pretty much gives them national recruiting for the ACADEMY. They already have the NE covered with UConn, Temple, Army, and OOC with Rutgers, and the Mid Atlantic and Tidal region covered with their own presence and games with ECU. The only area not covered with them in the west division is the west coast and the could be covered rotating opponents out of conference with Rutgers. The Navel Academy not only recruits national for football - it also likes to spread its schedule out for midshipman recruits too. Navy as a FB only would work out very well in the western division. Otherwise Cinn is going to be put there.

(05-24-2014 01:37 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(05-24-2014 11:30 AM)FAUAEPi Wrote:  I never liked North South divisions in college football along the East coast. Too many goods teams occupy the South compared to the North. This is why the ACC didn't split into North South divisions, could you have imagined Miami, Florida St, Georgia Tech, Clemson, North Carolina, NC St, and Duke in a division for football basketball and baseball. Because football is the main breadwinner, I can see the American doing something like the ACC did.
If they didn't, here's how I would organize the North South divisions if done to shorten travel time for student athletes and to embrace regional rivalries:
North:
UConn
Temple
Navy
Cincy
ECU
Memphis

South:
USF
UCF
Tulane
Houston
SMU
Tulsa

For football, that is about as even as it can get. For basketball, this is an injustice.


Just an outsider's two cents

I hate virtually every divisional alignment because they all have Houston in a division that looks like we never left CUSA. I'd much rather have no divisions than be tied to a CUSA schedule EVERY singe year. Houston really has no ties to any CUSA schools except maybe SMU---never did. Personally, a continuous round robin is far more appealing to me. The more variety, the better. I'd much rather have different schools like Navy, UConn, and Cinci showing up on the schedule more often. That wont happen with a division that marries a school to 5 CUSA games every year. We would play many years against all ex-CUSA teams with that alignment.

most ignorant statement you have ever made. and you have made a lot of them. ...if it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, you are a duck.

(05-25-2014 08:26 AM)carolinaknights Wrote:  

(05-24-2014 07:51 AM)pesik Wrote:  

(05-24-2014 07:01 AM)carolinaknights Wrote:  

(05-22-2014 02:26 PM)UofMemphis Wrote:  West: Houston, SMU, Tulsa, Tulane, Memphis, Cincy
East: UCF, USF, ECU, Temple, UConn, Navy

^ that makes sense, but we all know how Cincy loves to complain, so I bet the Florida twins get split up.

West: Houston, SMU, Tulsa, Tulane, Memphis, NAVY
East: UCF, USF, ECU, Temple, UConn, Cinn

Go 5 and 3 - no permanent crossovers. Gives Navy more of a National look and split their 3 game crossover pods as (UCF, Temple, & Cinn) and USF, ECU, and UConn). Gives them a NE and Florida opponent every year. The Army game and the regular Rutgers series will also give them 2 NE games to go along with the ND and and Air Force annual rivalry games. If and when Navy wants or needs another National Game they can use the Rutgers spot in the rotation. When they play ND on the east coast they should play Cinn away and reverse that to keep one game in the Midwest per year. The same scheduling should be done for for Memphis if it can be arranged.

we arent sending navy want, because weaweak arguments there isn't a legitimate reason why they would want that or why we'd force that on them

playing the 3/4 of the worst attended teams in our league doesnt give them a more national look in any way

if the smu game is that important (honestly really isnt) smu-navy can be cross-divisional rivals

Actually Navy already plays Tulane, SMU, and Tulsa on a regular basis. Playing in Texas once a year, Louisiana and Oklahoma every other year,
at Air force every other year, in Florida pretty much every other year, and Indiana / Tennessee / Ohio every other year pretty much gives them national recruiting for the ACADEMY. They already have the NE covered with UConn, Temple, Army, and OOC with Rutgers, and the Mid Atlantic and Tidal region covered with their own presence and games with ECU. The only area not covered with them in the west division is the west coast and the could be covered rotating opponents out of conference with Rutgers. The Navel Academy not only recruits national for football - it also likes to spread its schedule out for midshipman recruits too. Navy as a FB only would work out very well in the western division. Otherwise Cinn is going to be put there.

1) the last time they navy played tulane 8 years ago, only played tulsa twice in school history, and despite a "rivalry" with smu and a trophy have only played 8 times total in the last 50 years

2) you realize navy gives no damn about recruinting ground, you realize they cant even recruit normally, and the kids they recruit are coming regardless of of where they play

3) looking at navys last 5 years schedules theyve only played an average 2 teams a years even remotely west (and 1 is a home game and 1 is airforce). and havent been to oklahoma at all besides that 1 time they played tulsa in the last 30 years, and have only been to Louisiana once in the last 10 years, (where are you getting your information from) . i have no clue what makes you think looking from their schedules they want to play 5 west conference teams a plus airforce every year (not even mentioning when they are matched up with the florida's as cross divisional or they schedule a western team as their OOC)

4) most of our other sports have 9 or 10 members some the full 11 but we non of those require divisions, their will only be divisions in football, so navy being football only and cincy being a full member has nothing to do with it

if smu/texas is that important to they can be schedule as a permanent cross-divisional game

keep in mind a major reason the wac 16 broke up was because they tried to air force in a division in it didnt want and they threatend to go indy.
navy is the only school with options aka the only east team with leverage. i honestly dont see them going west at all

(05-24-2014 02:11 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(05-24-2014 02:03 PM)ElectricCoogaloo Wrote:  Seems like it boils down to these options.

Option 1)

North: UConn, Cinci, Memphis, ECU, Navy, Temple
South: Houston, SMU, UCF, USF, Tulane, Tulsa

Option 2)

East: UConn, USF/UCF, ECU, Navy, Temple, Cinci
West: Houston, SMU, USF/UCF, Tulane, Tulsa, Memphis

w/ permanent crossovers
Memphis-Cinci
USF-UCF
Temple-Houston
Navy-Tulane
Tulsa-ECU
SMU-UConn

Option 3)

East: UConn, USF, UCF, ECU, Navy, Temple
West: Houston, SMU, Cinci, Tulane, Tulsa, Memphis

Maybe we should start a poll.

Oh HELL NO. Why do we need to give everyone permanent crossovers? You only do that to protect rivalries. There's one---maybe two rivalries in the conference. No need to have contrived rivalry pairs. Give USF-UCF a crossover if needed to protect that rivalry. Maybe Houston and SMU. Beyond that, none are really needed. Sorry Electric--not banging on you---the automatic crossover game is just a pet peave of mine. Im fine with protecting a real rivalry. But theres no reason to go beyond that.

While UCF/USF has the makings of a rivalry,they've only played a couple of times. Meanwhile, SMU and Navy play for a trophy.

And while Houston has played SMU and Tulsa quite a bit in our history, their fan bases don't really show up when we play there, and don't travel well here.

Meanwhile, USF desperately wants to continue its series with Cincy and UConn. And ECU desperately wants to play UCF every year and continue their budding rivalry from CUSA East days.

So you can keep repeating "There's one---maybe two rivalries in the conference. USF-UCF; maybe Houston and SMU" all you want, but it won't be any truer the next time than it was months ago when you first said it.

Nor does it sum up what certain teams want from their league schedule in this conference.

(05-24-2014 01:37 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  Houston really has no ties to any CUSA schools except maybe SMU---

never did.

We've played Tulsa 38 times. They beat us in the first game at the Dome in 1965. We beat them three years later 100-6. We were rivals in the Missouri Valley before that.

In CUSA West, it was usually either Houston or Tulsa. Our fan base got a lot more excited about Tulsa than we ever did about SMU in our CUSA days.

So I would disagree on both counts.

(05-27-2014 01:15 PM)CougarRed Wrote:  

(05-24-2014 01:37 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  Houston really has no ties to any CUSA schools except maybe SMU---

never did.

We've played Tulsa 38 times. They beat us in the first game at the Dome in 1965. We beat them three years later 100-6. We were rivals in the Missouri Valley before that.

In CUSA West, it was usually either Houston or Tulsa. Our fan base got a lot more excited about Tulsa than we ever did about SMU in our CUSA days.

So I would disagree on both counts.

That's why we were excited. Tulsa was good, we were good, and the division was on the line. That's not a rivalry. A rivalry game is important even in years you both suck. We played Tulsa a grand total of 6 times over a 30 year period (between 1975 and 2005 where we did not share a conference). How is that a "rivalry"? I respect the CUSA schools, their situations are much like our own. Im just saying there is no special connection to any of them in terms of rivalry--probably because we are all so spread out. That's just a fact.

Coog fans see their rivals as UT, Tech, and A&M (I know---they don't see it the same way). Rice seems to get the campus amped up as well. I never got the Rice thing since the series was so lopsided, but they are close and were a SWC foe (plus the old rumor is they blocked us from the SWC for a long time--so maybe that's behind the animosity).

Houston and SMU have played 28 times. I think SMU would have been a rivalry in CUSA had they been more competitive. Now that they are, I am seeing more interest in the game develop (at least among those I talk to). Is SMU-Houston a true rivalry now? No. Could it be? Yeah, I think it can develop and is on its way as we have SWC history and played every year since they joined CUSA. Is SMU-Navy? No. They have played 14 times in their entire history. They have not played since 2011 and wont play again this year. The crowds for SMU-Navy are not larger than the crowds for any other SMU game. I just don't see that as a rivalry---trophy or not. Can it be one? Sure, over time I suppose anything is possible.

Here's another Pod solution. It involves three pods of four teams, with two permanent foes based on length and significance of the historical series. Then you rotate three out of the other six teams.

A couple of the permanent foes are contrived (especially involving Temple), but most make sense.

Pod A - permanent foes
UConn - Cincy, USF
Navy - SMU, Tulane
East Carolina - UCF, Houston
Temple - USF, SMU

The NE Pod keeps travel costs low.

UConn gets to keep playing Cincy and USF.

Navy has a trophy game with SMU, and has played Tulane the most out of any American school.

East Carolina and UCF have a budding CUSA East rivalry, and ECU/Houston played for a CUSA title once and had a nice competitive series.

Pod B - permanent foes
Tulsa - UCF, Cincy
Tulane - Memphis, Navy
SMU - Navy, Temple
Houston - East Carolina, Memphis

The SW pod keeps travel costs low and preserves some longstanding series (Tulsa-Houston, SMU-Houston). In addition, SMU and Tulsa have been in the same league nearly 20 years, as have Houston and Tulane.

Tulsa plays Cincy (31 game series) and UCF. Tulsa and UCF met 3 times in the CUSA title game.

Tulane plays Memphis (30 game series) and Navy (Navy's longest series).

SMU plays Navy (Trophy game) and Temple (contrived).

Houston plays ECU (competitive series, CUSA Title Game) and Memphis (same league for nearly 20 years).

Pod C - permanent foes
UCF - East Carolina, Tulsa
USF - UConn, Temple
Cincy - Tulsa, UConn
Memphis - Tulane, Houston

The USF/Temple game is contrived, but as described above everything else flows from length or significance of the historical series.

It has already been decided that the Divisions will be East/West. All that remains to be seen is whom is in which Division.

As for pods, you won't see them unless the conference goes to 16 teams and then there will most likely be a 9 game conference schedule with each team playing the three other teams in their conference and two teams of each of the other three pods yearly. So you would have a fixed conference schedule that would be reversed each year.

Pod A:
UConn, Navy, Temple, ECU

Pod B:
UC, USF, UCF, Tulane

Pod C:
UH, UM, SMU, TA

Pod D:
BYU, AFA, NM, UCol or UNLV.

The last 4 were expansion of course. But you would then have a schedule system that would be very easy.

UConn and Navy play the same schedule on rotation while ECU and Temple play the opposite schedule.

UConn plays ECU, Navy and Temple in Pod A. UC and UCF in Pod B. UH and UM in Pod C. BYU and UCol or UNLV in Pod D. ECU plays everyone in Pod A and the same schedule as UConn in the other pods.

Now Navy and Temple play all the teams in their pod and

USF and Tulane in Pod B. SMU and TA in Pod C. AFA and NM in Pod D.

The following year they rotate schdules. This can be done for each pod and everyone plays every team in the conference eavery two years.

Basketball could be east and west divisions and play roundrobin and some crossovers.

IMHO 16 yeams in the POD system is very simple to manage. But this is all imaginary anyway until it's actually relased.

SMU replaced by USM?

(05-27-2014 08:21 PM)Pony94 Wrote:  SMU replaced by USM?

Sorry slip of the typage. Fixed it.

(05-27-2014 01:43 PM)CougarRed Wrote:  Here's another Pod solution. It involves three pods of four teams, with two permanent foes based on length and significance of the historical series. Then you rotate three out of the other six teams.

A couple of the permanent foes are contrived (especially involving Temple), but most make sense.

Pod A - permanent foes
UConn - Cincy, USF
Navy - SMU, Tulane
East Carolina - UCF, Houston
Temple - USF, SMU

The NE Pod keeps travel costs low.

UConn gets to keep playing Cincy and USF.

Navy has a trophy game with SMU, and has played Tulane the most out of any American school.

East Carolina and UCF have a budding CUSA East rivalry, and ECU/Houston played for a CUSA title once and had a nice competitive series.

Pod B - permanent foes
Tulsa - UCF, Cincy
Tulane - Memphis, Navy
SMU - Navy, Temple
Houston - East Carolina, Memphis

The SW pod keeps travel costs low and preserves some longstanding series (Tulsa-Houston, SMU-Houston). In addition, SMU and Tulsa have been in the same league nearly 20 years, as have Houston and Tulane.

Tulsa plays Cincy (31 game series) and UCF. Tulsa and UCF met 3 times in the CUSA title game.

Tulane plays Memphis (30 game series) and Navy (Navy's longest series).

SMU plays Navy (Trophy game) and Temple (contrived).

Houston plays ECU (competitive series, CUSA Title Game) and Memphis (same league for nearly 20 years).

Pod C - permanent foes
UCF - East Carolina, Tulsa
USF - UConn, Temple
Cincy - Tulsa, UConn
Memphis - Tulane, Houston

The USF/Temple game is contrived, but as described above everything else flows from length or significance of the historical series.

We could call the pods the "Red," the "White," and the "Blue," pods...
[/sarcasm]

(05-27-2014 08:26 PM)USFRamenu Wrote:  

(05-27-2014 08:21 PM)Pony94 Wrote:  SMU replaced by USM?

Sorry slip of the typage. Fixed it.

No worries.

(05-25-2014 09:27 AM)pablowow Wrote:  most ignorant statement you have ever made. and you have made a lot of them. ...if it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, you are a duck.

Ignorant? It's his opinion of what he likes. He's a great poster.

(05-27-2014 08:28 PM)BearcatJerry Wrote:  

(05-27-2014 01:43 PM)CougarRed Wrote:  Here's another Pod solution. It involves three pods of four teams, with two permanent foes based on length and significance of the historical series. Then you rotate three out of the other six teams.

A couple of the permanent foes are contrived (especially involving Temple), but most make sense.

Pod A - permanent foes
UConn - Cincy, USF
Navy - SMU, Tulane
East Carolina - UCF, Houston
Temple - USF, SMU

The NE Pod keeps travel costs low.

UConn gets to keep playing Cincy and USF.

Navy has a trophy game with SMU, and has played Tulane the most out of any American school.

East Carolina and UCF have a budding CUSA East rivalry, and ECU/Houston played for a CUSA title once and had a nice competitive series.

Pod B - permanent foes
Tulsa - UCF, Cincy
Tulane - Memphis, Navy
SMU - Navy, Temple
Houston - East Carolina, Memphis

The SW pod keeps travel costs low and preserves some longstanding series (Tulsa-Houston, SMU-Houston). In addition, SMU and Tulsa have been in the same league nearly 20 years, as have Houston and Tulane.

Tulsa plays Cincy (31 game series) and UCF. Tulsa and UCF met 3 times in the CUSA title game.

Tulane plays Memphis (30 game series) and Navy (Navy's longest series).

SMU plays Navy (Trophy game) and Temple (contrived).

Houston plays ECU (competitive series, CUSA Title Game) and Memphis (same league for nearly 20 years).

Pod C - permanent foes
UCF - East Carolina, Tulsa
USF - UConn, Temple
Cincy - Tulsa, UConn
Memphis - Tulane, Houston

The USF/Temple game is contrived, but as described above everything else flows from length or significance of the historical series.

We could call the pods the "Red," the "White," and the "Blue," pods...
[/sarcasm]

lol. Classic.

(05-24-2014 07:39 PM)Bearcats#1 Wrote:  UC belongs in the East

Why?

It,s no brainer, Travel cost have to be considered
splitting UCF & USF is the only thing that makes sence & 1 crossover game.
I would think they schools with most tenure get there pick
also like Metro & SWC as div names