Did the C7 underestimate the impact of the loss of Notre Dame on their national TV appeal?

Seems like ND might have diverted millions of Catholic eyeballs nationally from the Big East to the ACC.

(03-23-2014 12:07 AM)CougarRed Wrote:  Did the C7 underestimate the impact of the loss of Notre Dame on their national TV appeal?

Seems like ND might have diverted millions of Catholic eyeballs nationally from the Big East to the ACC.

The C7 is not a national brand without ND and D1 Football. The C7 / BE is a regional brand build around the I-95 corridor. The national part of the Old BE was not just built on ND alone. From its beginning the national brand part of the of the BE was build on Syracuse BB and FB, Pitt FB then the growth of their BB, and finally the acceptance of Miami FB and ND's independent FB brand while building their BB and Olympic sports.

Winning back to back National Championships with Georgetown and then Villanova beating Georgetown in the finals helped raise the BE recognition but the BB and past FB talents of Syracuse with Pitt FB of the seventies, Miami FB and their National FB Championships coupled with the Irish National brand, and then coupled with those BB Championships built the Old BE into a National Brand.

I don't think the C7 over estimated themselves. They acted out of frustration and desperation after Syracuse, ND, BC, and Pitt dumped them for the ACC. They just happened to land a good initial contract out of a start up sports channel from a major TV player but that happened before with ESPN in their infant years. They tired of constant FB realignment and decided to go on their own without FB and get back to the original I-95 theme but with Midwestern BB schools without FB to retrench themselves in BB only and March Madness credits again. In the end without FB to keep the conference in the National Eyes from late August through March Madness in April the New BE will slip back to mid major regional status like the local A-10 again from the once mighty National Brand they were able to build with FB, Syracuse, Pitt, BC, Miami, and ND in years gone by. Basketball alone will not carry the New BE as a National Brand.

(03-23-2014 05:54 PM)carolinaknights Wrote:  

(03-23-2014 12:07 AM)CougarRed Wrote:  Did the C7 underestimate the impact of the loss of Notre Dame on their national TV appeal?

Seems like ND might have diverted millions of Catholic eyeballs nationally from the Big East to the ACC.

The C7 is not a national brand without ND and D1 Football. The C7 / BE is a regional brand build around the I-95 corridor. The national part of the Old BE was not just built on ND alone. From its beginning the national brand part of the of the BE was build on Syracuse BB and FB, Pitt FB then the growth of their BB, and finally the acceptance of Miami FB and ND's independent FB brand while building their BB and Olympic sports.

Winning back to back National Championships with Georgetown and then Villanova beating Georgetown in the finals helped raise the BE recognition but the BB and past FB talents of Syracuse with Pitt FB of the seventies, Miami FB and their National FB Championships coupled with those BB Championships built the BE into a National Brand.

I don't think the C7 over estimated themselves. They acted out of frustration and desperation after Syracuse, ND, BC, and Pitt dumped them for the ACC. They just happened to land a good initial contract out of a start up sports channel from a major TV player but that happened before with ESPN in their infant years. They tired of constant FB realignment and decided to go on their own without FB and get back to the original I-95 theme but with Midwestern BB schools without FB to retrench themselves in BB only and March Madness credits again. In the end without FB to keep the conference in the National Eyes from late August through March Madness in April the BE will slip back to mid major status like the local A-10 again.

The Big East at its most dominant didn't sponsor football and was built around the I95 corridor. Its a different era but I think they will be a fine going forward. Never be what it was but still relevant. You are underestimating some of the programs within the Big East like Georgetown and Villanova.

(03-23-2014 06:07 PM)SecureDaBall Wrote:  

(03-23-2014 05:54 PM)carolinaknights Wrote:  

(03-23-2014 12:07 AM)CougarRed Wrote:  Did the C7 underestimate the impact of the loss of Notre Dame on their national TV appeal?

Seems like ND might have diverted millions of Catholic eyeballs nationally from the Big East to the ACC.

The C7 is not a national brand without ND and D1 Football. The C7 / BE is a regional brand build around the I-95 corridor. The national part of the Old BE was not just built on ND alone. From its beginning the national brand part of the of the BE was build on Syracuse BB and FB, Pitt FB then the growth of their BB, and finally the acceptance of Miami FB and ND's independent FB brand while building their BB and Olympic sports.

Winning back to back National Championships with Georgetown and then Villanova beating Georgetown in the finals helped raise the BE recognition but the BB and past FB talents of Syracuse with Pitt FB of the seventies, Miami FB and their National FB Championships coupled with those BB Championships built the BE into a National Brand.

I don't think the C7 over estimated themselves. They acted out of frustration and desperation after Syracuse, ND, BC, and Pitt dumped them for the ACC. They just happened to land a good initial contract out of a start up sports channel from a major TV player but that happened before with ESPN in their infant years. They tired of constant FB realignment and decided to go on their own without FB and get back to the original I-95 theme but with Midwestern BB schools without FB to retrench themselves in BB only and March Madness credits again. In the end without FB to keep the conference in the National Eyes from late August through March Madness in April the BE will slip back to mid major status like the local A-10 again.

The Big East at its most dominant didn't sponsor football and was built around the I95 corridor. Its a different era but I think they will be a fine going forward. Never be what it was but still relevant. You are underestimating some of the programs within the Big East like Georgetown and Villanova.

i dont want to be a di*k but hes also over estimating syracuse fb

(03-23-2014 08:54 PM)gosports1 Wrote:  

(03-23-2014 06:07 PM)SecureDaBall Wrote:  

(03-23-2014 05:54 PM)carolinaknights Wrote:  

(03-23-2014 12:07 AM)CougarRed Wrote:  Did the C7 underestimate the impact of the loss of Notre Dame on their national TV appeal?

Seems like ND might have diverted millions of Catholic eyeballs nationally from the Big East to the ACC.

The C7 is not a national brand without ND and D1 Football. The C7 / BE is a regional brand build around the I-95 corridor. The national part of the Old BE was not just built on ND alone. From its beginning the national brand part of the of the BE was build on Syracuse BB and FB, Pitt FB then the growth of their BB, and finally the acceptance of Miami FB and ND's independent FB brand while building their BB and Olympic sports.

Winning back to back National Championships with Georgetown and then Villanova beating Georgetown in the finals helped raise the BE recognition but the BB and past FB talents of Syracuse with Pitt FB of the seventies, Miami FB and their National FB Championships coupled with those BB Championships built the BE into a National Brand.

I don't think the C7 over estimated themselves. They acted out of frustration and desperation after Syracuse, ND, BC, and Pitt dumped them for the ACC. They just happened to land a good initial contract out of a start up sports channel from a major TV player but that happened before with ESPN in their infant years. They tired of constant FB realignment and decided to go on their own without FB and get back to the original I-95 theme but with Midwestern BB schools without FB to retrench themselves in BB only and March Madness credits again. In the end without FB to keep the conference in the National Eyes from late August through March Madness in April the BE will slip back to mid major status like the local A-10 again.

The Big East at its most dominant didn't sponsor football and was built around the I95 corridor. Its a different era but I think they will be a fine going forward. Never be what it was but still relevant. You are underestimating some of the programs within the Big East like Georgetown and Villanova.

i dont want to be a di*k but hes also over estimating syracuse fb

maybe over estimating syracuse FB but not syracuse in general. that school was the regional power when it came to "the total package"

as for the c7 split

you can argue that it was a huge mistake, you can argue that it was a necessary move that ultimately had to be done and be correct in both arguments.

if they left because they wanted a better cultural fit & stability ==> it was a great move

if they left because they were high on their own ego's and were mad that they were losing their political power within the conference ==> it is the top 5 dumbest conference realignment moves of all time

I think the C-7 acted too fast. I think they feared the unknown in what Aresco would deliver with the television contract and they jumped at the $3.5-5 million per school potential from Fox and didn't think about any of the details.

The new Big East is a great little basketball centric conference of like minded institutions. If the stability of that alone is what they wanted, then they've got it - but if wanting to remain big-time and at top of awareness in the basketball world was the point; well the jury is still out, but there are a bunch of warning signs from still not having a permanent office more than a year after announcing the conference. There is also attendance and non-existent television ratings, even at the conference tourney.

Losing Louisville, Syracuse, Pitt, Cincinnati, UConn, West Virginia and Notre Dame cooked your goose!

Who needs Notre Dame when you have Creighton. Oh wait...
I still say if they somehow found a way to add Notre Dame and UConn instead of Creighton and Butler they still would be in better shape than they are now.

The biggest mistake was the immediate departure of the C7. Had They tried to transition like Louisville, Rutgers, Syracuse, Pittsburgh did They may have found out the New Guys also had very respectable programs to offer and maybe could have made the Big East viable year round without being 2 separate conferences. Hope things work out in the long run. Thanks for the Great Years Louisville was able to share with Big East schools. Both of Us gained from the Beast.

I remain disappointed that the non-football schools departed. I very much looked forward to sharing a conference with Georgetown, Villanova, and Marquette for sure. I understand why they left but wish they had not.

I wonder if UMass had been selected instead of Tulane for that spot, if they had stayed. Regardless, I don't understand why the addition of Tulane was supposedly the final straw for the C-7. The votes were not there for Tulane's admission without the C-7's consent. So, from the outside, it appears they voted "Yes" and then claimed victimhood over their own consent.

I do think it will probably be a long term error in their choice of Butler over both/either St. Louis and Dayton. VCU would be a fine choice but it appears they have no interest in picking up a state school. The only other "eastern" school that might fit their wish list is Richmond?

(03-24-2014 10:19 AM)CardFan1 Wrote:  The biggest mistake was the immediate departure of the C7. Had They tried to transition like Louisville, Rutgers, Syracuse, Pittsburgh did They may have found out the New Guys also had very respectable programs to offer and maybe could have made the Big East viable year round without being 2 separate conferences. Hope things work out in the long run. Thanks for the Great Years Louisville was able to share with Big East schools. Both of Us gained from the Beast.

I think there would have been too many fights if they stayed over the same stuff. And think about the fight on how to split the BB/FB revenue when it is at the level the AAC got. Best to just cut ties and for everyone to move on.

It just seems to me the ones that are most hurt about the C7 seperating and getting the Big East name are the new members of the AAC. Is it because they didn't get a chance to play the likes of Georgetown, Villanova, St. Johns, Marquette, Seton Hall, DePaul, and Providence???

i dont think Tulane was the last straw or in fact any straw, that forced the hand of the c7. Almost everything they had known from the FB side was out the door (or soon to be) and 2 of the remainng 3 were actively and vocally trying to do the same.
When (if) uconn and cincy leave what would have that meant for the c7? Unfortunatley times change and the BE of old will never be again. At least under the current setup they have control over their own destiny. like minded schools that wont have to be held to the whims or needs of FB 1st schools that they have different missions from
the offer from fox was there at the right time
if the p5 pull away from the rest of the ncaa and leave the American behind will the BE have been better served to remain a hybrid? im not convinced it would

(03-24-2014 05:55 PM)BamaScorpio69 Wrote:  It just seems to me the ones that are most hurt about the C7 seperating and getting the Big East name are the new members of the AAC. Is it because they didn't get a chance to play the likes of Georgetown, Villanova, St. Johns, Marquette, Seton Hall, DePaul, and Providence???

That's part of it. I also think they still haven't gotten over the fact that TV values our programs and not theirs.

And they're generally pretty mad about the way the football power conferences look down their noses at them, so when they think they can scoreboard us, they take the opportunity.

That said, having none of our 10 teams in the Sweet Sixteen for the first time since....2002...burns.

Also, ECU, Memphis and Temple fans blame the C-7 for keeping them out of the old, BCS-AQ football Big East from 2005-11. Which is actually pretty fair, we did do that.

lets call it like it is, some people for whatever reason, are jealous or envious of the BE and would take glee in its failure. Any hurdle or hicccup theBE might encounter will be immediately jumped upon and even distorted. even if that same "issue" was encountered by another league, it would get more play if it was the BE

(03-24-2014 05:55 PM)BamaScorpio69 Wrote:  It just seems to me the ones that are most hurt about the C7 seperating and getting the Big East name are the new members of the AAC. Is it because they didn't get a chance to play the likes of Georgetown, Villanova, St. Johns, Marquette, Seton Hall, DePaul, and Providence???

Yes we can't sleep at night because we did not get a chance to play Georgetown,Villanova,St Johns,Marquette,Seton Hall,Depaul and Providence.

(03-24-2014 08:07 PM)pearland1 Wrote:  

(03-24-2014 05:55 PM)BamaScorpio69 Wrote:  It just seems to me the ones that are most hurt about the C7 seperating and getting the Big East name are the new members of the AAC. Is it because they didn't get a chance to play the likes of Georgetown, Villanova, St. Johns, Marquette, Seton Hall, DePaul, and Providence???

Yes we can't sleep at night because we did not get a chance to play Georgetown,Villanova,St Johns,Marquette,Seton Hall,Depaul and Providence.

I didn't say anything about sleeping. I said new members of the AAC got their feelings hurt. What does that has to do with sleeping?

Well anyway goodnight big east see you guys in november. Oh yeah gtown,nova when you guys wake up we may have a life raft for you two,,, hey we all make mistakes. Sleep tight now ya hear.

(03-24-2014 07:41 PM)johnbragg Wrote:  Also, ECU, Memphis and Temple fans blame the C-7 for keeping them out of the old, BCS-AQ football Big East from 2005-11. Which is actually pretty fair, we did do that.

But were we alone? I don't recall a burning desire by the FB schools to bring them in.

We were willing to go to 20 and throw a life line to Kansas, Missouri, Iowa St. and Kansas St. if the Big XII imploded when the Texoma group had a Pac 10 offer, so we did care about the FB schools. We accepted TCU when asked. Did the FB-8 ever really push for ECU, Memphis or Temple until the second ACC raid?