11 Colleges Even Its Alumni Wouldn't Recommend

UTEP #3 WTF?!?

Good name for that, whatever it is, mag?

Johnson and Wales doesn't surprise me one bit.

(02-17-2014 04:52 PM)49RFootballNow Wrote:  Johnson and Wales doesn't surprise me one bit.

$27k/yr to learn how to cook so graduates can go to work at Applebees' and MAYBE make $27k/yr if they are lucky.

(02-17-2014 04:52 PM)49RFootballNow Wrote:  Johnson and Wales doesn't surprise me one bit.

It does me. The chances are that they got responses from people who went there for their non-bread-and-butter majors. If you go to JWU for Culinary Arts, hospitality management, and, to some extent, accounting (among others), then you're going to do very well and would be hard pressed to find a better school for the first two (especially in the region). If you're going to JWU for something else, then you probably chose poorly. As someone with a wife who has a degree from JWU for Culinary Arts (now VCU for accounting), she had a plethora of opportunities in the field (yes, well above that stated salary, though culinary is low-paying and their students don't often consider that) and was extremely well-prepared for a career in that field, had she wished to continue in it. I think that this survey is probably greatly unfair in that respect. She and I would both highly recommend the school, but only for very specific things and only if you realized that you were getting into it for the love of the career rather than trying to get rich or simply get a degree. As someone who has far too much schooling (and debt), there are a ton of schools I wouldn't recommend for various things (and only for very specific things). I think that this is a completely simplistic and pretty crappy survey from that point of view.

1. This is a survey that is on the Motley Fool.
2. UTEP has some extremely passionate fans and I can't think of a grad (though I only know of roughly 10) that wouldn't recommend it.
3. Based on their methodology, it doesn't shock me at the inclusion of some of those schools.

(02-17-2014 04:42 PM)olliebaba Wrote:  Good name for that, whatever it is, mag?

It's a pretty well regarded investment website.

One of my brothers friends writes and produces stock investment videos for them.

(02-17-2014 04:57 PM)TribeNiner Wrote:  

(02-17-2014 04:52 PM)49RFootballNow Wrote:  Johnson and Wales doesn't surprise me one bit.

It does me. The chances are that they got responses from people who went there for their non-bread-and-butter majors. If you go to JWU for Culinary Arts, hospitality management, and, to some extent, accounting (among others), then you're going to do very well and would be hard pressed to find a better school for the first two (especially in the region). If you're going to JWU for something else, then you probably chose poorly. As someone with a wife who has a degree from JWU for Culinary Arts (now VCU for accounting), she had a plethora of opportunities in the field (yes, well above that stated salary, though culinary is low-paying and their students don't often consider that) and was extremely well-prepared for a career in that field, had she wished to continue in it. I think that this survey is probably greatly unfair in that respect. She and I would both highly recommend the school, but only for very specific things and only if you realized that you were getting into it for the love of the career rather than trying to get rich or simply get a degree. As someone who has far too much schooling (and debt), there are a ton of schools I wouldn't recommend for various things (and only for very specific things). I think that this is a completely simplistic and pretty crappy survey from that point of view.

1. This is a survey that is on the Motley Fool.
2. UTEP has some extremely passionate fans and I can't think of a grad (though I only know of roughly 10) that wouldn't recommend it.
3. Based on their methodology, it doesn't shock me at the inclusion of some of those schools.

I worked with a bunch of people at a country club that went to Johnson and Wales when I was in college. They hated it because they quickly realized that they were paying big dollars to work ****** restaurant kitchen jobs with terrible hours, low pay, and no holidays.

Sure, some of them become a head chef somewhere nice or start their own successful restaurant and make a good living, but most do not.

I'm still friends with a few of them on Facebook. They're now 5-8 years out of school and still poor with terrible jobs.

I do know one guy that did very well for himself though, but not in the kitchen. He is the district manager for all of the Cookouts in Tennessee.

(02-17-2014 05:11 PM)Niner National Wrote:  

(02-17-2014 04:57 PM)TribeNiner Wrote:  

(02-17-2014 04:52 PM)49RFootballNow Wrote:  Johnson and Wales doesn't surprise me one bit.

It does me. The chances are that they got responses from people who went there for their non-bread-and-butter majors. If you go to JWU for Culinary Arts, hospitality management, and, to some extent, accounting (among others), then you're going to do very well and would be hard pressed to find a better school for the first two (especially in the region). If you're going to JWU for something else, then you probably chose poorly. As someone with a wife who has a degree from JWU for Culinary Arts (now VCU for accounting), she had a plethora of opportunities in the field (yes, well above that stated salary, though culinary is low-paying and their students don't often consider that) and was extremely well-prepared for a career in that field, had she wished to continue in it. I think that this survey is probably greatly unfair in that respect. She and I would both highly recommend the school, but only for very specific things and only if you realized that you were getting into it for the love of the career rather than trying to get rich or simply get a degree. As someone who has far too much schooling (and debt), there are a ton of schools I wouldn't recommend for various things (and only for very specific things). I think that this is a completely simplistic and pretty crappy survey from that point of view.

1. This is a survey that is on the Motley Fool.
2. UTEP has some extremely passionate fans and I can't think of a grad (though I only know of roughly 10) that wouldn't recommend it.
3. Based on their methodology, it doesn't shock me at the inclusion of some of those schools.

I worked with a bunch of people at a country club that went to Johnson and Wales when I was in college. They hated it because they quickly realized that they were paying big dollars to work ****** restaurant kitchen jobs with terrible hours, low pay, and no holidays.

Sure, some of them become a head chef somewhere nice or start their own successful restaurant and make a good living, but most do not.

I'm still friends with a few of them on Facebook. They're now 5-8 years out of school and still poor with terrible jobs.

I do know one guy that did very well for himself though, but not in the kitchen. He is the district manager for all of the Cookouts in Tennessee.

That's the real crux of it- culinary is a rough career even if you are a successful chef, owner, etc. Holidays, nights, and weekends are some of your biggest earning nights and the margins are often pretty low. You have to get into it because you love cooking. With that said, my wife had a lot of opportunities, and was even with Hilton briefly while still in school there. Ultimately, she parlayed her degree into working in gourmet foods and wine for several years following graduation (for less money but a better lifestyle- it supported us while I was in law school). They definitely set her up to be successful in that world; I just don't think that many people understand that success in that world doesn't mean food network chef, it means working your arse off for a long time, paying your dues, and working to make it pay off in the end. A lot of students, especially in high school, aren't thinking about ROI when they go to school. They really should. Of course, ROI is only part of the equation- because a degree that breaks you into the field you want is the most important- but it should be a bigger part of the equation for a lot of students. Especially those who aren't sure what they want to do.

Curiously, Anthony Bourdain wrote that Johnson & Wales was one of a few schools worth going to if you have legitimate chef ambitions: http://ruhlman.com/2010/09/so-you-wanna-...ourdain-2/

Quote:But let’s say you’re determined. You’re planning on taking out a student loan and taking on a huge amount of debt. In many cases, from lenders associated with—or recommended by—your local culinary school. Ask yourself first: is this culinary school even any good? If you’re not going to the Culinary Institute of America, Johnson and Wales, or the French Culinary Institute, you should investigate this matter even more intently, because the fact is, when you graduate from the Gomer County Technical College of Culinary Arts, nobody hiring in the big leagues is going to give a sh*t. A degree from the best culinary schools is no guarantee of a good job. A degree from anywhere less than the best schools will probably be less helpful than the work experience you could have had, had you been out there in the industry all that time.

Now if you got a culinary degree at Johnson and Whales, you'd do OK in Alaska and the Canadian Maritimes, but that's about it.

UTEP... That is not good.

No press is better than negative press.

I far more agree with and prefer this publication's opinion and ranking of UTEP academically: http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/college...y_rank.php

I won't waste my time with the "Motley Fool" from here on out.

(02-17-2014 05:19 PM)TribeNiner Wrote:  

(02-17-2014 05:11 PM)Niner National Wrote:  

(02-17-2014 04:57 PM)TribeNiner Wrote:  

(02-17-2014 04:52 PM)49RFootballNow Wrote:  Johnson and Wales doesn't surprise me one bit.

It does me. The chances are that they got responses from people who went there for their non-bread-and-butter majors. If you go to JWU for Culinary Arts, hospitality management, and, to some extent, accounting (among others), then you're going to do very well and would be hard pressed to find a better school for the first two (especially in the region). If you're going to JWU for something else, then you probably chose poorly. As someone with a wife who has a degree from JWU for Culinary Arts (now VCU for accounting), she had a plethora of opportunities in the field (yes, well above that stated salary, though culinary is low-paying and their students don't often consider that) and was extremely well-prepared for a career in that field, had she wished to continue in it. I think that this survey is probably greatly unfair in that respect. She and I would both highly recommend the school, but only for very specific things and only if you realized that you were getting into it for the love of the career rather than trying to get rich or simply get a degree. As someone who has far too much schooling (and debt), there are a ton of schools I wouldn't recommend for various things (and only for very specific things). I think that this is a completely simplistic and pretty crappy survey from that point of view.

1. This is a survey that is on the Motley Fool.
2. UTEP has some extremely passionate fans and I can't think of a grad (though I only know of roughly 10) that wouldn't recommend it.
3. Based on their methodology, it doesn't shock me at the inclusion of some of those schools.

I worked with a bunch of people at a country club that went to Johnson and Wales when I was in college. They hated it because they quickly realized that they were paying big dollars to work ****** restaurant kitchen jobs with terrible hours, low pay, and no holidays.

Sure, some of them become a head chef somewhere nice or start their own successful restaurant and make a good living, but most do not.

I'm still friends with a few of them on Facebook. They're now 5-8 years out of school and still poor with terrible jobs.

I do know one guy that did very well for himself though, but not in the kitchen. He is the district manager for all of the Cookouts in Tennessee.

That's the real crux of it- culinary is a rough career even if you are a successful chef, owner, etc. Holidays, nights, and weekends are some of your biggest earning nights and the margins are often pretty low. You have to get into it because you love cooking. With that said, my wife had a lot of opportunities, and was even with Hilton briefly while still in school there. Ultimately, she parlayed her degree into working in gourmet foods and wine for several years following graduation (for less money but a better lifestyle- it supported us while I was in law school). They definitely set her up to be successful in that world; I just don't think that many people understand that success in that world doesn't mean food network chef, it means working your arse off for a long time, paying your dues, and working to make it pay off in the end. A lot of students, especially in high school, aren't thinking about ROI when they go to school. They really should. Of course, ROI is only part of the equation- because a degree that breaks you into the field you want is the most important- but it should be a bigger part of the equation for a lot of students. Especially those who aren't sure what they want to do.

Not much different than an accountant that opens his own firm vs one that works for H&R Block, or a public defendent vs a corporate lawyer. Timing, work ethic, contacts, and a million other factor come into play. However if the costs are that high I would think there would be more demand for their graduates and a good job placement infrastructure for graduates. If neither of those are present then I couldn't justify the cost, either.

Hard to blame Motley Fool, apparently the source of the data came from each school based on their own surveys.

(02-17-2014 05:08 PM)Niner National Wrote:  

(02-17-2014 04:42 PM)olliebaba Wrote:  Good name for that, whatever it is, mag?

It's a pretty well regarded investment website.

No it's not. It might be entertaining to read some articles, but it isn't a highly regarded investment website.

(02-17-2014 08:50 PM)randaddyminer Wrote:  

(02-17-2014 05:08 PM)Niner National Wrote:  

(02-17-2014 04:42 PM)olliebaba Wrote:  Good name for that, whatever it is, mag?

It's a pretty well regarded investment website.

No it's not. It might be entertaining to read some articles, but it isn't a highly regarded investment website.

+1

(02-17-2014 04:32 PM)THE NC Herd Fan Wrote:  11 Colleges Even Its Alumni Wouldn't Recommend

UTEP #3 WTF?!?

UTEP is in good company. It's a bogus list if CUNY City College is on it--at no. 10.

City College:

"City's academic excellence and status as a working-class school earned it the titles "Harvard of the Proletariat," "the poor man's Harvard," and "Harvard-on-the-Hudson." Even today, no other public college has produced as many graduates who went on to win Nobel Prizes; like City students today, they were the children of immigrants and the working class, and often the first of their families to go to College."

http://www.ccny.cuny.edu/about/history.cfm

(02-17-2014 10:14 PM)cotton1991 Wrote:  

(02-17-2014 04:32 PM)THE NC Herd Fan Wrote:  11 Colleges Even Its Alumni Wouldn't Recommend

UTEP #3 WTF?!?

UTEP is in good company. It's a bogus list if CUNY City College is on it--at no. 10.

City College:

"City's academic excellence and status as a working-class school earned it the titles "Harvard of the Proletariat," "the poor man's Harvard," and "Harvard-on-the-Hudson." Even today, no other public college has produced as many graduates who went on to win Nobel Prizes; like City students today, they were the children of immigrants and the working class, and often the first of their families to go to College."

http://www.ccny.cuny.edu/about/history.cfm

Agreed CCNY is a good school. They probably just listed these because of the poorer student bodies.

Do we still get to host the tourney?

yes, but this year we will not have the conference logo on the court

Let Nashville have it then.