(01-20-2014 05:00 PM)dmacfour Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 04:57 PM)Jedi Master Sipho-Dyas Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 04:54 PM)dmacfour Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 04:46 PM)Jedi Master Sipho-Dyas Wrote:  The bible prophesied in great detail about Alexander the Great over 2 centuries before he was even born.

It covered his conquering of the Persian empire, the fact the he was the ruler of the world, the details of his death and how his kingdom was split up into 4 parts.

If you understand history, its a breathtaking prophecy.

How specific is the prophesy? You could prophecise anything if it's vague enough and you think there's a reasonable chance that it could happen.

One of the most specific and detailed prophecies ever written in ANY book.

You don;t have to know the bible at all, but if you are history buff, the prophecy is just mind blowing.

The Mongolian empire fractured into 4 competing states.

lol

I had a pizza last night and split it into 4 parts too.

Your going to need a bit more than that.

If you are really interested in this, you will need to read up a good big on Alexander first.

(01-20-2014 05:02 PM)Jedi Master Sipho-Dyas Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 05:00 PM)dmacfour Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 04:57 PM)Jedi Master Sipho-Dyas Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 04:54 PM)dmacfour Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 04:46 PM)Jedi Master Sipho-Dyas Wrote:  The bible prophesied in great detail about Alexander the Great over 2 centuries before he was even born.

It covered his conquering of the Persian empire, the fact the he was the ruler of the world, the details of his death and how his kingdom was split up into 4 parts.

If you understand history, its a breathtaking prophecy.

How specific is the prophesy? You could prophecise anything if it's vague enough and you think there's a reasonable chance that it could happen.

One of the most specific and detailed prophecies ever written in ANY book.

You don;t have to know the bible at all, but if you are history buff, the prophecy is just mind blowing.

The Mongolian empire fractured into 4 competing states.

lol

Your going to need a bit more than that.

Well I have no idea what prophesy you're referring to, but it seems likely that it's pretty vague. Just calling someone the ruler of the world isn't good enough; there have been many of those. A kingdom fracturing is also pretty common.

Romans 10:9-13

Because, if you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. For with the heart one believes and is justified, and with the mouth one confesses and is saved. For the Scripture says, “Everyone who believes in him will not be put to shame.” For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek; for the same Lord is Lord of all, bestowing his riches on all who call on him. For “everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.”

(01-20-2014 05:00 PM)dmacfour Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 04:57 PM)Jedi Master Sipho-Dyas Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 04:54 PM)dmacfour Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 04:46 PM)Jedi Master Sipho-Dyas Wrote:  The bible prophesied in great detail about Alexander the Great over 2 centuries before he was even born.

It covered his conquering of the Persian empire, the fact the he was the ruler of the world, the details of his death and how his kingdom was split up into 4 parts.

If you understand history, its a breathtaking prophecy.

How specific is the prophesy? You could prophecise anything if it's vague enough and you think there's a reasonable chance that it could happen.

One of the most specific and detailed prophecies ever written in ANY book.

You don;t have to know the bible at all, but if you are history buff, the prophecy is just mind blowing.

The Mongolian empire fractured into 4 competing states.

Alexander was mid-third century BC.

When was the book of Daniel written? I can't find anything older than ~160BC [LINK]

It's not a prophecy if it was written two hundred years after the events.

(01-20-2014 05:03 PM)dmacfour Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 05:02 PM)Jedi Master Sipho-Dyas Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 05:00 PM)dmacfour Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 04:57 PM)Jedi Master Sipho-Dyas Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 04:54 PM)dmacfour Wrote:  How specific is the prophesy? You could prophecise anything if it's vague enough and you think there's a reasonable chance that it could happen.

One of the most specific and detailed prophecies ever written in ANY book.

You don;t have to know the bible at all, but if you are history buff, the prophecy is just mind blowing.

The Mongolian empire fractured into 4 competing states.

lol

Your going to need a bit more than that.

Well I have no idea what prophesy you're referring to, but it seems likely that it's pretty vague. Just calling someone the ruler of the world isn't good enough; there have been many of those. A kingdom fracturing is also pretty common.

Are you even reading what I am typing?

LMAO

You've not read a single passage on it but you are already declaring it a "vague" prophecy with no details.

Now THAT is funny.

I think you already know the details go just a bit deeper than a "world ruler and fractured empire"

By the way, there have only been 4 world rulers, and two of them are in this prophecy. That kind of narrows is down.

(01-20-2014 05:06 PM)Hitch Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 05:00 PM)dmacfour Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 04:57 PM)Jedi Master Sipho-Dyas Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 04:54 PM)dmacfour Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 04:46 PM)Jedi Master Sipho-Dyas Wrote:  The bible prophesied in great detail about Alexander the Great over 2 centuries before he was even born.

It covered his conquering of the Persian empire, the fact the he was the ruler of the world, the details of his death and how his kingdom was split up into 4 parts.

If you understand history, its a breathtaking prophecy.

How specific is the prophesy? You could prophecise anything if it's vague enough and you think there's a reasonable chance that it could happen.

One of the most specific and detailed prophecies ever written in ANY book.

You don;t have to know the bible at all, but if you are history buff, the prophecy is just mind blowing.

The Mongolian empire fractured into 4 competing states.

Alexander was mid-third century BC.

When was the book of Daniel written? I can't find anything older than ~160BC [LINK]

It's not a prophecy if it happened two hundred years after the fact.

(01-20-2014 05:07 PM)Jedi Master Sipho-Dyas Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 05:03 PM)dmacfour Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 05:02 PM)Jedi Master Sipho-Dyas Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 05:00 PM)dmacfour Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 04:57 PM)Jedi Master Sipho-Dyas Wrote:  One of the most specific and detailed prophecies ever written in ANY book.

You don;t have to know the bible at all, but if you are history buff, the prophecy is just mind blowing.

The Mongolian empire fractured into 4 competing states.

lol

Your going to need a bit more than that.

Well I have no idea what prophesy you're referring to, but it seems likely that it's pretty vague. Just calling someone the ruler of the world isn't good enough; there have been many of those. A kingdom fracturing is also pretty common.

LMAO

So you've not read a single passage on it but you are already declaring it a "vague" prophecy with no details.

Now THAT is funny.

That's usually how this goes.

(01-20-2014 05:06 PM)Hitch Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 05:00 PM)dmacfour Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 04:57 PM)Jedi Master Sipho-Dyas Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 04:54 PM)dmacfour Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 04:46 PM)Jedi Master Sipho-Dyas Wrote:  The bible prophesied in great detail about Alexander the Great over 2 centuries before he was even born.

It covered his conquering of the Persian empire, the fact the he was the ruler of the world, the details of his death and how his kingdom was split up into 4 parts.

If you understand history, its a breathtaking prophecy.

How specific is the prophesy? You could prophecise anything if it's vague enough and you think there's a reasonable chance that it could happen.

One of the most specific and detailed prophecies ever written in ANY book.

You don;t have to know the bible at all, but if you are history buff, the prophecy is just mind blowing.

The Mongolian empire fractured into 4 competing states.

Alexander was mid-third century BC.

When was the book of Daniel written? I can't find anything older than ~160BC [LINK]

It's not a prophecy if it happened two hundred years after the fact.

Your facts are just wrong here.

The oldest record of the complete text survives in a Greek translation called the Septuagint, dating to the 4th century CE (Codex Sinaiticus).

Its a silly point anyway. The prophecy was being taught along with all of Daniels teachings and writings well before that as well.

(01-20-2014 05:08 PM)dmacfour Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 05:06 PM)Hitch Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 05:00 PM)dmacfour Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 04:57 PM)Jedi Master Sipho-Dyas Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 04:54 PM)dmacfour Wrote:  How specific is the prophesy? You could prophecise anything if it's vague enough and you think there's a reasonable chance that it could happen.

One of the most specific and detailed prophecies ever written in ANY book.

You don;t have to know the bible at all, but if you are history buff, the prophecy is just mind blowing.

The Mongolian empire fractured into 4 competing states.

Alexander was mid-third century BC.

When was the book of Daniel written? I can't find anything older than ~160BC [LINK]

It's not a prophecy if it happened two hundred years after the fact.

Make up your mind.

You went from pretending it a vague, incoherent prophecy without even reading it, then you claim its written a century after the fact.

(01-20-2014 05:14 PM)Jedi Master Sipho-Dyas Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 05:08 PM)dmacfour Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 05:06 PM)Hitch Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 05:00 PM)dmacfour Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 04:57 PM)Jedi Master Sipho-Dyas Wrote:  One of the most specific and detailed prophecies ever written in ANY book.

You don;t have to know the bible at all, but if you are history buff, the prophecy is just mind blowing.

The Mongolian empire fractured into 4 competing states.

Alexander was mid-third century BC.

When was the book of Daniel written? I can't find anything older than ~160BC [LINK]

It's not a prophecy if it happened two hundred years after the fact.

You are factually wrong according to almost every scholar out there, but don't let that get in the way of your agenda.

I don't have an agenda. I'm just automatically skeptical of supernatural claims of any kind.

(01-20-2014 05:17 PM)dmacfour Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 05:14 PM)Jedi Master Sipho-Dyas Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 05:08 PM)dmacfour Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 05:06 PM)Hitch Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 05:00 PM)dmacfour Wrote:  The Mongolian empire fractured into 4 competing states.

Alexander was mid-third century BC.

When was the book of Daniel written? I can't find anything older than ~160BC [LINK]

It's not a prophecy if it happened two hundred years after the fact.

You are factually wrong according to almost every scholar out there, but don't let that get in the way of your agenda.

I don't have an agenda. I'm just automatically skeptical of supernatural claims of any kind.

You are always free to believe what you wish.

It makes me no difference.

Greek, Roman and Egyptian histories are an interest of mine and I know a lot about those areas.

There is nothing vague about what I am telling you and it has been being debated and studied for over 2000 years now. I'm sure someone here arrogantly thinks they can debunk it with a 3 minute google search and a link, but there is just a bit more to it than that.

(01-20-2014 05:23 PM)Jedi Master Sipho-Dyas Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 05:17 PM)dmacfour Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 05:14 PM)Jedi Master Sipho-Dyas Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 05:08 PM)dmacfour Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 05:06 PM)Hitch Wrote:  Alexander was mid-third century BC.

When was the book of Daniel written? I can't find anything older than ~160BC [LINK]

It's not a prophecy if it happened two hundred years after the fact.

You are factually wrong according to almost every scholar out there, but don't let that get in the way of your agenda.

I don't have an agenda. I'm just automatically skeptical of supernatural claims of any kind.

You are always free to believe what you wish.

It makes me no difference.

Greek, Roman and Egyptian histories are an interest of mine and I know a lot about those ares.

There is nothing vague about what I am telling you and it has been being debated and studied for over 2000 years now. I'm sure someone here arrogantly thinks they can debunk it with a 3 minute google search and a link, but there is just a bit more to it than that.

A 3 minute Google search brings up more disagreement than answers.

(01-20-2014 05:11 PM)Jedi Master Sipho-Dyas Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 05:06 PM)Hitch Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 05:00 PM)dmacfour Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 04:57 PM)Jedi Master Sipho-Dyas Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 04:54 PM)dmacfour Wrote:  How specific is the prophesy? You could prophecise anything if it's vague enough and you think there's a reasonable chance that it could happen.

One of the most specific and detailed prophecies ever written in ANY book.

You don;t have to know the bible at all, but if you are history buff, the prophecy is just mind blowing.

The Mongolian empire fractured into 4 competing states.

Alexander was mid-third century BC.

When was the book of Daniel written? I can't find anything older than ~160BC [LINK]

It's not a prophecy if it happened two hundred years after the fact.

Your facts are just wrong here.

The oldest record of the complete text survives in a Greek translation called the Septuagint, dating to the 4th century CE (Codex Sinaiticus).

Its a silly point anyway. The prophecy was being taught along with all of Daniels teachings and writings well before that as well.

http://www.codexsinaiticus.org/en/

I can't find the book of Daniel among the contents of the Codex Sinaiticus. Can you point me in the right direction? I'd like to see the oldest known text and corresponding date.

(01-20-2014 05:33 PM)dmacfour Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 05:23 PM)Jedi Master Sipho-Dyas Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 05:17 PM)dmacfour Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 05:14 PM)Jedi Master Sipho-Dyas Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 05:08 PM)dmacfour Wrote:  

You are factually wrong according to almost every scholar out there, but don't let that get in the way of your agenda.

I don't have an agenda. I'm just automatically skeptical of supernatural claims of any kind.

You are always free to believe what you wish.

It makes me no difference.

Greek, Roman and Egyptian histories are an interest of mine and I know a lot about those ares.

There is nothing vague about what I am telling you and it has been being debated and studied for over 2000 years now. I'm sure someone here arrogantly thinks they can debunk it with a 3 minute google search and a link, but there is just a bit more to it than that.

A 3 minute Google search brings up more questions than answers.

You can google and find people who think the earth is flat, Aliens are here and we are all on mars, too.

The fact is almost all scholars have agreed on the authenticity of this for WAY over a thousand years now.

Again, I'm not asking you to believe a single thing. Just point something out.

Do with it what you please.

(01-20-2014 05:38 PM)Jedi Master Sipho-Dyas Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 05:33 PM)dmacfour Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 05:23 PM)Jedi Master Sipho-Dyas Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 05:17 PM)dmacfour Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 05:14 PM)Jedi Master Sipho-Dyas Wrote:  You are factually wrong according to almost every scholar out there, but don't let that get in the way of your agenda.

I don't have an agenda. I'm just automatically skeptical of supernatural claims of any kind.

You are always free to believe what you wish.

It makes me no difference.

Greek, Roman and Egyptian histories are an interest of mine and I know a lot about those ares.

There is nothing vague about what I am telling you and it has been being debated and studied for over 2000 years now. I'm sure someone here arrogantly thinks they can debunk it with a 3 minute google search and a link, but there is just a bit more to it than that.

A 3 minute Google search brings up more questions than answers.

You can google and find people who think the earth is flat, Aliens are here and we are all on mars, too.

The fact is almost all scholars have agreed on the authenticity of this for WAY over a thousand of years now.

That's not what I've read. I read that it is generally agreed that half of Daniel is traditional legend, and that the rest was written by anonymous authors in the 2nd century. Of course, Christian sources are saying the naturalists are biased.

(01-20-2014 05:36 PM)Hitch Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 05:11 PM)Jedi Master Sipho-Dyas Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 05:06 PM)Hitch Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 05:00 PM)dmacfour Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 04:57 PM)Jedi Master Sipho-Dyas Wrote:  One of the most specific and detailed prophecies ever written in ANY book.

You don;t have to know the bible at all, but if you are history buff, the prophecy is just mind blowing.

The Mongolian empire fractured into 4 competing states.

Alexander was mid-third century BC.

When was the book of Daniel written? I can't find anything older than ~160BC [LINK]

It's not a prophecy if it happened two hundred years after the fact.

Your facts are just wrong here.

The oldest record of the complete text survives in a Greek translation called the Septuagint, dating to the 4th century CE (Codex Sinaiticus).

Its a silly point anyway. The prophecy was being taught along with all of Daniels teachings and writings well before that as well.

http://www.codexsinaiticus.org/en/

I can't find the book of Daniel among the contents of the Codex Sinaiticus. Can you point me in the right direction? I'd like to see the oldest known text and corresponding date.

Again hitch, you are off base here.

We don't even need an original copy from before Alexander. IT'S NOT THE ONLY WRITTEN ACCOUNT OF DANIEL AND HIS TEACHINGS THAT PRE-DATE Alexander.

There are thousands of other Jewish writings on Daniel and his teachings LONG before Alexander was even born.

You are also discounting the oral traditions of Daniles teachings that pre-date Alexander as well.

You are going to be debunking thousands of Jewish writing and teachings for the rest of your natural life if you are going to discredit that prophecy.

Here's an interesting discussion I found:

http://hermeneutics.stackexchange.com/qu...-of-daniel

(01-20-2014 05:43 PM)Jedi Master Sipho-Dyas Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 05:36 PM)Hitch Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 05:11 PM)Jedi Master Sipho-Dyas Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 05:06 PM)Hitch Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 05:00 PM)dmacfour Wrote:  The Mongolian empire fractured into 4 competing states.

Alexander was mid-third century BC.

When was the book of Daniel written? I can't find anything older than ~160BC [LINK]

It's not a prophecy if it happened two hundred years after the fact.

Your facts are just wrong here.

The oldest record of the complete text survives in a Greek translation called the Septuagint, dating to the 4th century CE (Codex Sinaiticus).

Its a silly point anyway. The prophecy was being taught along with all of Daniels teachings and writings well before that as well.

http://www.codexsinaiticus.org/en/

I can't find the book of Daniel among the contents of the Codex Sinaiticus. Can you point me in the right direction? I'd like to see the oldest known text and corresponding date.

Again hitch, you are off base here.

We don't even need an original copy from before Alexander. IT'S NOT THE ONLY WRITTEN ACCOUNT OF DANIEL AND HIS TEACHINGS THAT PRE-DATE Alexander.

There are thousands of other Jewish writings on Daniel and his teachings LONG before Alexander was even born.

You are also discounting the oral traditions that pre-date Alexander as well.

You are going to be debunking thousands of Jewish writing and teachings for the rest of your natural life if you are going to discredit that prophecy.

Great. What's the oldest one that contains the prophesy?

I'm not trying to be difficult. I really want to know how old these written accounts were.

(01-20-2014 05:50 PM)Hitch Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 05:43 PM)Jedi Master Sipho-Dyas Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 05:36 PM)Hitch Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 05:11 PM)Jedi Master Sipho-Dyas Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 05:06 PM)Hitch Wrote:  Alexander was mid-third century BC.

When was the book of Daniel written? I can't find anything older than ~160BC [LINK]

It's not a prophecy if it happened two hundred years after the fact.

Your facts are just wrong here.

The oldest record of the complete text survives in a Greek translation called the Septuagint, dating to the 4th century CE (Codex Sinaiticus).

Its a silly point anyway. The prophecy was being taught along with all of Daniels teachings and writings well before that as well.

http://www.codexsinaiticus.org/en/

I can't find the book of Daniel among the contents of the Codex Sinaiticus. Can you point me in the right direction? I'd like to see the oldest known text and corresponding date.

Again hitch, you are off base here.

We don't even need an original copy from before Alexander. IT'S NOT THE ONLY WRITTEN ACCOUNT OF DANIEL AND HIS TEACHINGS THAT PRE-DATE Alexander.

There are thousands of other Jewish writings on Daniel and his teachings LONG before Alexander was even born.

You are also discounting the oral traditions that pre-date Alexander as well.

You are going to be debunking thousands of Jewish writing and teachings for the rest of your natural life if you are going to discredit that prophecy.

Great. What's the oldest one that contains the prophesy?

I'm not trying to be difficult. I really want to know how old these written accounts were.

If you are REALLY interested in this issue, you will have to investigate it for yourself.

Th accounts begin right after the life of Daniel, who was revered as a great prophet in his day and even more right after his death.

There were 2 centuries of Jewish writings, oral history and teachings on Daniel and what he wrote before ATG was even born.

Just searching for the oldest surviving copy of his book is about as short sighted as it gets. There is a WHOLE lot more to it than that.

(01-20-2014 05:56 PM)Jedi Master Sipho-Dyas Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 05:50 PM)Hitch Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 05:43 PM)Jedi Master Sipho-Dyas Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 05:36 PM)Hitch Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 05:11 PM)Jedi Master Sipho-Dyas Wrote:  Your facts are just wrong here.

The oldest record of the complete text survives in a Greek translation called the Septuagint, dating to the 4th century CE (Codex Sinaiticus).

Its a silly point anyway. The prophecy was being taught along with all of Daniels teachings and writings well before that as well.

http://www.codexsinaiticus.org/en/

I can't find the book of Daniel among the contents of the Codex Sinaiticus. Can you point me in the right direction? I'd like to see the oldest known text and corresponding date.

Again hitch, you are off base here.

We don't even need an original copy from before Alexander. IT'S NOT THE ONLY WRITTEN ACCOUNT OF DANIEL AND HIS TEACHINGS THAT PRE-DATE Alexander.

There are thousands of other Jewish writings on Daniel and his teachings LONG before Alexander was even born.

You are also discounting the oral traditions that pre-date Alexander as well.

You are going to be debunking thousands of Jewish writing and teachings for the rest of your natural life if you are going to discredit that prophecy.

Great. What's the oldest one that contains the prophesy?

I'm not trying to be difficult. I really want to know how old these written accounts were.

If you are REALLY interested in this issue, you will have to investigate it for yourself.

Th accounts begin right after the life of Daniel, who was revered as a great prophet in his day and even more right after his death.

There were 2 centuries of Jewish writings, oral history and teachings on Daniel and what he wrote before ATG was even born.

So you're just leaving me high and dry here?