(11-26-2013 11:27 PM)Pounce FTW Wrote:  

(11-26-2013 11:21 PM)fencereagle Wrote:  And for others on the thread, of course a good 3O team can come back from being down 14 points, as has been done many many times by GaSo. I'm too lazy to look it up but I would bet we've done it more times than Ga St has victories... (glass houses doncha know)

Jesus christ, how did this turn into a "rag on Georgia State" thread? Do you really think Panama was saying something that many other folks, who are fans of many other teams, haven't already said? Why so touchy about the triple option?

(11-26-2013 11:27 PM)Pounce FTW Wrote:  

(11-26-2013 11:21 PM)fencereagle Wrote:  And for others on the thread, of course a good 3O team can come back from being down 14 points, as has been done many many times by GaSo. I'm too lazy to look it up but I would bet we've done it more times than Ga St has victories... (glass houses doncha know)

Jesus christ, how did this turn into a "rag on Georgia State" thread? Do you really think Panama was saying something that many other folks, who are fans of many other teams, haven't already said? Why so touchy about the triple option?

Nice deflection, yeah it's all us horrible GaSo fans explaining the factual inaccuracies in the snarky troll bait piling on GaSt. If your brethren hadn't chimed I with his bit of snark the thread no doubt wouldn't have become a 'rag on GaSt' thread.

But you know ok, please accept my apologies. I recognize that not all GaSt fans spew snark and on more than one occasion I've agreed with Panama so I recognize he isn't snarky all the time. I'll refrain from continuing the snark since in general this is an interesting thread about an offense that most of us Eagles love passionately (and of course feel the need to passionately defend because it is tied to our identity.) If you really want to see this degrade into GaSo infighting try asking for differing opinions on running the 3O out of the shotgun... *ducks and covers*

(11-26-2013 11:21 PM)fencereagle Wrote:  

(11-26-2013 08:43 PM)chiefsfan Wrote:  The offense is never going to win any awards for the best two minute offense in the country. The advantages is that you can run clock, keep your defense off the field, and take advantages of games in which the opposing team might have more talent on the defensive side of the ball. It forces the defense to play assignment football...something that many defenses struggle with.

The downside is that an offense that commits a bunch of penalties will put themselves behind the 8 ball, and will struggle in passing downs. Thus, triple option teams have to know the offense front and back so they don't end up in long yardage situations

You're not completely accurate with regard to your point about 2 minute offenses. Yes conceptually a 3O team wants to grind out yards and play 'boring' football, but a good 3O team can easily move down the field in far less time than casual observers think they can. As evidence just look at the scoring drives against FL. 10 seconds (ok don't count that one), 2:36, 4:02, and 2:44. And remember that 2:44 score was with 5mins left in the game. The 3O can score faster than most assume it can.

Don't get me wrong your other points are pretty accurate my only issue is with the TOP. Generally we WANT to burn the clock but we don't HAVE to in order to win.

And for others on the thread, of course a good 3O team can come back from being down 14 points, as has been done many many times by GaSo. I'm too lazy to look it up but I would bet we've done it more times than Ga St has victories... (glass houses doncha know)

Yes, but that 2:30 drive included a 50 yard plus run to set it up. I am talking a true 2 minute drill. 2 minutes left, down by 4. Gotta score a TD to win, how does your offense get down the field? No coach is going to run it every play that drive.

(11-26-2013 11:36 PM)chiefsfan Wrote:  

(11-26-2013 11:21 PM)fencereagle Wrote:  

(11-26-2013 08:43 PM)chiefsfan Wrote:  The offense is never going to win any awards for the best two minute offense in the country. The advantages is that you can run clock, keep your defense off the field, and take advantages of games in which the opposing team might have more talent on the defensive side of the ball. It forces the defense to play assignment football...something that many defenses struggle with.

The downside is that an offense that commits a bunch of penalties will put themselves behind the 8 ball, and will struggle in passing downs. Thus, triple option teams have to know the offense front and back so they don't end up in long yardage situations

You're not completely accurate with regard to your point about 2 minute offenses. Yes conceptually a 3O team wants to grind out yards and play 'boring' football, but a good 3O team can easily move down the field in far less time than casual observers think they can. As evidence just look at the scoring drives against FL. 10 seconds (ok don't count that one), 2:36, 4:02, and 2:44. And remember that 2:44 score was with 5mins left in the game. The 3O can score faster than most assume it can.

Don't get me wrong your other points are pretty accurate my only issue is with the TOP. Generally we WANT to burn the clock but we don't HAVE to in order to win.

And for others on the thread, of course a good 3O team can come back from being down 14 points, as has been done many many times by GaSo. I'm too lazy to look it up but I would bet we've done it more times than Ga St has victories... (glass houses doncha know)

Yes, but that 2:30 drive included a 50 yard plus run to set it up. I am talking a true 2 minute drill. 2 minutes left, down by 4. Gotta score a TD to win, how does your offense get down the field? No coach is going to run it every play that drive.

FWIW chiefsfan, this is a big reason why both GT, Navy, GS are looking at installing more packages that open up the offense a bit. In reality though it comes down to the ability of the QB. We have lost more games than I'm willing to admit because we were forced to run a 2 min offense and couldn't execute properly.

On the flip side, we have won more games than I can count because we are REALLY good at running down the clock when we have a lead in the 4th quarter. So really its a wash in the long run, IMO.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I777 using Tapatalk 2

(11-26-2013 11:36 PM)chiefsfan Wrote:  

(11-26-2013 11:21 PM)fencereagle Wrote:  

(11-26-2013 08:43 PM)chiefsfan Wrote:  The offense is never going to win any awards for the best two minute offense in the country. The advantages is that you can run clock, keep your defense off the field, and take advantages of games in which the opposing team might have more talent on the defensive side of the ball. It forces the defense to play assignment football...something that many defenses struggle with.

The downside is that an offense that commits a bunch of penalties will put themselves behind the 8 ball, and will struggle in passing downs. Thus, triple option teams have to know the offense front and back so they don't end up in long yardage situations

You're not completely accurate with regard to your point about 2 minute offenses. Yes conceptually a 3O team wants to grind out yards and play 'boring' football, but a good 3O team can easily move down the field in far less time than casual observers think they can. As evidence just look at the scoring drives against FL. 10 seconds (ok don't count that one), 2:36, 4:02, and 2:44. And remember that 2:44 score was with 5mins left in the game. The 3O can score faster than most assume it can.

Don't get me wrong your other points are pretty accurate my only issue is with the TOP. Generally we WANT to burn the clock but we don't HAVE to in order to win.

And for others on the thread, of course a good 3O team can come back from being down 14 points, as has been done many many times by GaSo. I'm too lazy to look it up but I would bet we've done it more times than Ga St has victories... (glass houses doncha know)

Yes, but that 2:30 drive included a 50 yard plus run to set it up. I am talking a true 2 minute drill. 2 minutes left, down by 4. Gotta score a TD to win, how does your offense get down the field? No coach is going to run it every play that drive.

Yes that is true but those big plays happen pretty often if the 3O is clicking. In fact I was just reading a response to an UF 'why we lost' article on sbnation that describes it nicely. The 3O works to manufacture those big plays and sometimes you can do it in 2 mins some times you can't.

Here is the sbnation 'article' Alligator Army's analysis is mediocre and about what one should expect who doesn't watch a lot of 3O BUT in the comments there is a dude Called 'Thanks for this' he knows his stuff.

http://www.alligatorarmy.com/2013/11/26/...e#comments

We rarely run the wishbone. We run the flexbone primarily.

Sent from my XT907 using Tapatalk 2

The big fallacy is that we need to pass. We are 11-0 all time when not completing a pass. Thus season was derailed by trying to run the triple option from the shotgun. Horrible idea, and when the chips are down we always abandon it for what we do best. Just look at the last 3 games this season and every playoff run. Shotgun goes almost completely away. Hopefully Monken realizes that using so many formations is hampering our growth. Not needed.

(11-26-2013 09:32 PM)GATA Wrote:  

(11-26-2013 09:30 PM)Wild Bill Kelso Wrote:  Was at App back in the mid 70's when we ran the Wishbone. In 1975 App rushed for 3450 yards and threw - yes threw out of the wishbone - for 1175, in an 11 game schedule. The Mountaineers were 7th in the nation in total offense, 8th in scoring offense and 9th in rushing offense. That was long before 1-aa. I love the TO. When that offense is clicking there ain't nothin prettier to watch. Didn't know the Eagles fumbled inside the 5 on another drive. Love McKinnon knocking the ball out of the park on the last TD.

Here you are then

For some reason those highlights - from the Gator network - doesn't show that part of the run. Thanks for posting.

(11-27-2013 07:28 AM)Ole Sleepy Wrote:  We rarely run the wishbone. We run the flexbone primarily.

Sent from my XT907 using Tapatalk 2

Well aware of that. The point is they are both triple option offenses.

(11-26-2013 08:05 PM)panama Wrote:  Because if you fall behind by two TDs you have less than zero chance of winning.

That's incorrect.





Start at 15:30

(11-26-2013 11:36 PM)fencereagle Wrote:  

(11-26-2013 11:27 PM)Pounce FTW Wrote:  

(11-26-2013 11:21 PM)fencereagle Wrote:  And for others on the thread, of course a good 3O team can come back from being down 14 points, as has been done many many times by GaSo. I'm too lazy to look it up but I would bet we've done it more times than Ga St has victories... (glass houses doncha know)

Jesus christ, how did this turn into a "rag on Georgia State" thread? Do you really think Panama was saying something that many other folks, who are fans of many other teams, haven't already said? Why so touchy about the triple option?

Nice deflection, yeah it's all us horrible GaSo fans explaining the factual inaccuracies in the snarky troll bait piling on GaSt. If your brethren hadn't chimed I with his bit of snark the thread no doubt wouldn't have become a 'rag on GaSt' thread.

But you know ok, please accept my apologies. I recognize that not all GaSt fans spew snark and on more than one occasion I've agreed with Panama so I recognize he isn't snarky all the time. I'll refrain from continuing the snark since in general this is an interesting thread about an offense that most of us Eagles love passionately (and of course feel the need to passionately defend because it is tied to our identity.) If you really want to see this degrade into GaSo infighting try asking for differing opinions on running the 3O out of the shotgun... *ducks and covers*

Someone asked a question as to why more schools do not run the 3O. I answered the question factually. There was zero snark. Out of 126 FBS schools there are like 5 3O teams. So why not try answering the original question instead of deflecting. Because three posts in there was no pointingat GaSouthern and no demeaning comments.

Thats how we can come back with a passing QB down 28-6 against some scrub FCS team for a championship

(11-27-2013 09:37 AM)panama Wrote:  

(11-26-2013 11:36 PM)fencereagle Wrote:  

(11-26-2013 11:27 PM)Pounce FTW Wrote:  

(11-26-2013 11:21 PM)fencereagle Wrote:  And for others on the thread, of course a good 3O team can come back from being down 14 points, as has been done many many times by GaSo. I'm too lazy to look it up but I would bet we've done it more times than Ga St has victories... (glass houses doncha know)

Jesus christ, how did this turn into a "rag on Georgia State" thread? Do you really think Panama was saying something that many other folks, who are fans of many other teams, haven't already said? Why so touchy about the triple option?

Nice deflection, yeah it's all us horrible GaSo fans explaining the factual inaccuracies in the snarky troll bait piling on GaSt. If your brethren hadn't chimed I with his bit of snark the thread no doubt wouldn't have become a 'rag on GaSt' thread.

But you know ok, please accept my apologies. I recognize that not all GaSt fans spew snark and on more than one occasion I've agreed with Panama so I recognize he isn't snarky all the time. I'll refrain from continuing the snark since in general this is an interesting thread about an offense that most of us Eagles love passionately (and of course feel the need to passionately defend because it is tied to our identity.) If you really want to see this degrade into GaSo infighting try asking for differing opinions on running the 3O out of the shotgun... *ducks and covers*

Someone asked a question as to why more schools do not run the 3O. I answered the question factually. There was zero snark. Out of 126 FBS schools there are like 5 3O teams. So why not try answering the original question instead of deflecting. Because three posts in there was no pointingat GaSouthern and no demeaning comments.

some start viewing any comment against the school or offense as a direct offense. But also certain posters bring out the worst in certain fans. In the past you have been known to poke fun at GS any chance you got and now it's a reaction to anything you post even if it isn't meant to be that offensive. your reputation proceeds you

(11-27-2013 09:37 AM)panama Wrote:  

(11-26-2013 11:36 PM)fencereagle Wrote:  

(11-26-2013 11:27 PM)Pounce FTW Wrote:  

(11-26-2013 11:21 PM)fencereagle Wrote:  And for others on the thread, of course a good 3O team can come back from being down 14 points, as has been done many many times by GaSo. I'm too lazy to look it up but I would bet we've done it more times than Ga St has victories... (glass houses doncha know)

Jesus christ, how did this turn into a "rag on Georgia State" thread? Do you really think Panama was saying something that many other folks, who are fans of many other teams, haven't already said? Why so touchy about the triple option?

Nice deflection, yeah it's all us horrible GaSo fans explaining the factual inaccuracies in the snarky troll bait piling on GaSt. If your brethren hadn't chimed I with his bit of snark the thread no doubt wouldn't have become a 'rag on GaSt' thread.

But you know ok, please accept my apologies. I recognize that not all GaSt fans spew snark and on more than one occasion I've agreed with Panama so I recognize he isn't snarky all the time. I'll refrain from continuing the snark since in general this is an interesting thread about an offense that most of us Eagles love passionately (and of course feel the need to passionately defend because it is tied to our identity.) If you really want to see this degrade into GaSo infighting try asking for differing opinions on running the 3O out of the shotgun... *ducks and covers*

Someone asked a question as to why more schools do not run the 3O. I answered the question factually. There was zero snark. Out of 126 FBS schools there are like 5 3O teams. So why not try answering the original question instead of deflecting. Because three posts in there was no pointingat GaSouthern and no demeaning comments.

The Flexbone, Wishbone, Triple Option offense is not THAT much different that all these schools that run the spread-read-option type offenses. We just happen to be one of the few schools that RUN IT UNDER CENTER MORE OFTEN THAN NOT.

It boggles my mind how people don't understand that.

No, we don't pass the ball much. We DO have EXCELLENT pass efficiency, and yards per catch.

It really pissed me off when Muschumps kept on reiterating how the TO 'negates talent' and that's why we run it. What about big-boy schools that run the hurry-up spread-read offenses? Them too.

Morons.

We trailed against App State and Furman by 14 in 2010 and won. I would think it's safe to say that most teams are going to struggle down that much, regardless of what kind of offense they run, simply because they probably got in that position due to a multitude of reasons to start with. I'll take our overall winning % and be happy, and chalk up the few losses where we were unable to come back to bad luck.

We were down 14 against ODU in the quarter finals last year and scored 28 straigh points to win it.

(11-27-2013 09:43 AM)trueeagle98 Wrote:  

(11-27-2013 09:37 AM)panama Wrote:  

(11-26-2013 11:36 PM)fencereagle Wrote:  

(11-26-2013 11:27 PM)Pounce FTW Wrote:  

(11-26-2013 11:21 PM)fencereagle Wrote:  And for others on the thread, of course a good 3O team can come back from being down 14 points, as has been done many many times by GaSo. I'm too lazy to look it up but I would bet we've done it more times than Ga St has victories... (glass houses doncha know)

Jesus christ, how did this turn into a "rag on Georgia State" thread? Do you really think Panama was saying something that many other folks, who are fans of many other teams, haven't already said? Why so touchy about the triple option?

Nice deflection, yeah it's all us horrible GaSo fans explaining the factual inaccuracies in the snarky troll bait piling on GaSt. If your brethren hadn't chimed I with his bit of snark the thread no doubt wouldn't have become a 'rag on GaSt' thread.

But you know ok, please accept my apologies. I recognize that not all GaSt fans spew snark and on more than one occasion I've agreed with Panama so I recognize he isn't snarky all the time. I'll refrain from continuing the snark since in general this is an interesting thread about an offense that most of us Eagles love passionately (and of course feel the need to passionately defend because it is tied to our identity.) If you really want to see this degrade into GaSo infighting try asking for differing opinions on running the 3O out of the shotgun... *ducks and covers*

Someone asked a question as to why more schools do not run the 3O. I answered the question factually. There was zero snark. Out of 126 FBS schools there are like 5 3O teams. So why not try answering the original question instead of deflecting. Because three posts in there was no pointingat GaSouthern and no demeaning comments.

some start viewing any comment against the school or offense as a direct offense. But also certain posters bring out the worst in certain fans. In the past you have been known to poke fun at GS any chance you got and now it's a reaction to anything you post even if it isn't meant to be that offensive. your reputation proceeds you

The above point is true Panama, your reputation precedes you and as a result you must sleep in the bed you made. Please take care to note however, that I indeed am willing to apologize and move past snark in an attempt to not derail this thread.

(11-26-2013 08:05 PM)panama Wrote:  Because if you fall behind by two TDs you have less than zero chance of winning.

not true

(11-27-2013 11:11 AM)mturn017 Wrote:  

(11-26-2013 08:05 PM)panama Wrote:  Because if you fall behind by two TDs you have less than zero chance of winning.

not true

They know first hand

(11-27-2013 11:15 AM)GATA Wrote:  

(11-27-2013 11:11 AM)mturn017 Wrote:  

(11-26-2013 08:05 PM)panama Wrote:  Because if you fall behind by two TDs you have less than zero chance of winning.

not true

They know first hand

And...I love it when things come full circle.

The idea of the TO "negating talent" confuses me, too. My impression has been that if a defense remains disciplined, sufficient athleticism will hold it in check. Thus, high school: very viable, FCS: successful niche, FBS: tough sell, NFL: worthless.