Hey Pitt fans: I attended the 2005 Fiesta Bowl-Pitt v Utah-and I remember being shocked at how few of you guys showed up for the game and I'm curious to know why. It's the last major bowl game I've attended and I always remember it fondly for many reasons other than the game itself; I would like to get some feedback from Pitt fans about your memories/thoughts about that game. First off, I was at the Fiesta Bowl that year by total accident. My sister was living in Phoenix at the time and I went out there to visit her for Christmas and New Years and had a total blast! At the last second we decided to go to the Fiesta Bowl and I couldn't help but notice the lack of Pitt fans at the game. I'd say the stadium was 3/4 full of Utah fans with the majority of the rest being locals. After the game we partied at a club right next to the stadium in Tempe called The Library Bar or something like that. I guess most of the Utah fans were Mormons because I didn't see too many on the Tempe strip after the game that night. I should add that we did end up meeting a really cool Utah fan at the game who partied with us afterwards. The game was somewhat boring as Utah won pretty easily and the crowd seemed a bit subdued for a game of that magnitude. Anyway, that night was such a fun and memorable night for me and I think about it every time bowl season starts creeping up. I was really looking for some people from Pitt to hang with that night but couldn't find any...My question for Pitt fans is why weren't more of you at that game? Was it the distance? Was it the opponent? Thanks for any info from anyone who was either at the game that night, or who remembers the reasons why they didn't attend and what they thought of going to the Fiesta Bowl that year.

(11-16-2013 03:48 AM)billybobby777 Wrote:  Hey Pitt fans: I attended the 2005 Fiesta Bowl-Pitt v Utah-and I remember being shocked at how few of you guys showed up for the game and I'm curious to know why. It's the last major bowl game I've attended and I always remember it fondly for many reasons other than the game itself; I would like to get some feedback from Pitt fans about your memories/thoughts about that game. First off, I was at the Fiesta Bowl that year by total accident. My sister was living in Phoenix at the time and I went out there to visit her for Christmas and New Years and had a total blast! At the last second we decided to go to the Fiesta Bowl and I couldn't help but notice the lack of Pitt fans at the game. I'd say the stadium was 3/4 full of Utah fans with the majority of the rest being locals. After the game we partied at a club right next to the stadium in Tempe called The Library Bar or something like that. I guess most of the Utah fans were Mormons because I didn't see too many on the Tempe strip after the game that night. I should add that we did end up meeting a really cool Utah fan at the game who partied with us afterwards. The game was somewhat boring as Utah won pretty easily and the crowd seemed a bit subdued for a game of that magnitude. Anyway, that night was such a fun and memorable night for me and I think about it every time bowl season starts creeping up. I was really looking for some people from Pitt to hang with that night but couldn't find any...My question for Pitt fans is why weren't more of you at that game? Was it the distance? Was it the opponent? Thanks for any info from anyone who was either at the game that night, or who remembers the reasons why they didn't attend and what they thought of going to the Fiesta Bowl that year.

I was there but that was probably the worst season of any team to ever get a BCS invite. Pitt's coach was basically fired after the game was over and nobody at Pitt was celebrating that season so it was difficult to motivate anyone to fly across country and buy tickets for a game against Utah, who at the time was not considered a major opponent. I do think more people would have showed up to the Orange or Sugar or if the opponent was different.

I was at that game too and here are my thoughts:

1.) That was really a bizarre year. It was the year after the ACC's initial raid on the BE and there were only seven BE teams that season. Four of those seven teams finished 4-2, tied for first place.

Pitt won the tiebreaker but absolutely nobody was deluded into believing that we were somehow good. We all knew that the overwhelming likelihood was that we'd be blown out by no matter who we'd play in whichever bowl we played in.

2.) To add to the bizarreness of it all, we had basically fired Walt Harris before that game, further dampening any spirits people may have otherwise had. How many teams in the history of the BCS fired their coach before their BCS game? We did that because we're just that incompetent.

3.) Pitt has traditionally traveled poorly to all bowls. We're very much like Boston College and Syracuse in that regard.

4.) A game against a Mountain West team excited nobody. Those of us that really follow CFB knew that the Utes were very good but most casual fans did not and therefore had no interest in flying across the country to watch that game.

5.) I really think this last point is often overlooked but by playing in a pro town, and sharing a market with arguably the NFL's most popular franchise, we are always directly impacted by what is going on with the Steelers. Also, the Steelers fans - who are usually also Pitt fans (with some PSU, WVU, OSU and ND fans sprinkled in) - travel as well or better than any other NFL franchise.

Well, that year the Steelers were on their way to the fifth of their NFL record six Super Bowl championships and most of the people that I tried to talk into joining me in Tempe declined reasoning that they were saving their money/time off work for road playoff games and/or a Super Bowl trip (which was in Detroit that year - just six hours from PGH).

As a Houston resident you probably understand this last point better than most but it is a major part of our reality and it always will be.

(11-16-2013 11:27 AM)Dr. Isaly von Yinzer Wrote:  I was at that game too and here are my thoughts:

1.) That was really a bizarre year. It was the year after the ACC's initial raid on the BE and there were only seven BE teams that season. Four of those seven teams finished 4-2, tied for first place.

Pitt won the tiebreaker but absolutely nobody was deluded into believing that we were somehow good. We all knew that the overwhelming likelihood was that we'd be blown out by no matter who we'd play in whichever bowl we played in.

2.) To add to the bizarreness of it all, we had basically fired Walt Harris before that game, further dampening any spirits people may have otherwise had. How many teams in the history of the BCS fired their coach before their BCS game? We did that because we're just that incompetent.

3.) Pitt has traditionally traveled poorly to all bowls. We're very much like Boston College and Syracuse in that regard.

4.) A game against a Mountain West team excited nobody. Those of us that really follow CFB knew that the Utes were very good but most casual fans did not and therefore had no interest in flying across the country to watch that game.

5.) I really think this last point is often overlooked but by playing in a pro town, and sharing a market with arguably the NFL's most popular franchise, we are always directly impacted by what is going on with the Steelers. Also, the Steelers fans - who are usually also Pitt fans (with some PSU, WVU, OSU and ND fans sprinkled in) - travel as well or better than any other NFL franchise.

Well, that year the Steelers were on their way to the fifth of their NFL record six Super Bowl championships and most of the people that I tried to talk into joining me in Tempe declined reasoning that they were saving their money/time off work for road playoff games and/or a Super Bowl trip (which was in Detroit that year - just six hours from PGH).

As a Houston resident you probably understand this last point better than most but it is a major part of our reality and it always will be.

Hey, we travel!

(11-16-2013 02:50 PM)nzmorange Wrote:  

(11-16-2013 11:27 AM)Dr. Isaly von Yinzer Wrote:  I was at that game too and here are my thoughts:

1.) That was really a bizarre year. It was the year after the ACC's initial raid on the BE and there were only seven BE teams that season. Four of those seven teams finished 4-2, tied for first place.

Pitt won the tiebreaker but absolutely nobody was deluded into believing that we were somehow good. We all knew that the overwhelming likelihood was that we'd be blown out by no matter who we'd play in whichever bowl we played in.

2.) To add to the bizarreness of it all, we had basically fired Walt Harris before that game, further dampening any spirits people may have otherwise had. How many teams in the history of the BCS fired their coach before their BCS game? We did that because we're just that incompetent.

3.) Pitt has traditionally traveled poorly to all bowls. We're very much like Boston College and Syracuse in that regard.

4.) A game against a Mountain West team excited nobody. Those of us that really follow CFB knew that the Utes were very good but most casual fans did not and therefore had no interest in flying across the country to watch that game.

5.) I really think this last point is often overlooked but by playing in a pro town, and sharing a market with arguably the NFL's most popular franchise, we are always directly impacted by what is going on with the Steelers. Also, the Steelers fans - who are usually also Pitt fans (with some PSU, WVU, OSU and ND fans sprinkled in) - travel as well or better than any other NFL franchise.

Well, that year the Steelers were on their way to the fifth of their NFL record six Super Bowl championships and most of the people that I tried to talk into joining me in Tempe declined reasoning that they were saving their money/time off work for road playoff games and/or a Super Bowl trip (which was in Detroit that year - just six hours from PGH).

As a Houston resident you probably understand this last point better than most but it is a major part of our reality and it always will be.

Hey, we travel!

We selectively travel...south along I-95 yes...going to the Fiesta Bowl No.

SU travels better than BC and Pitt though.

(11-16-2013 03:45 PM)TexanMark Wrote:  

(11-16-2013 02:50 PM)nzmorange Wrote:  

(11-16-2013 11:27 AM)Dr. Isaly von Yinzer Wrote:  I was at that game too and here are my thoughts:

1.) That was really a bizarre year. It was the year after the ACC's initial raid on the BE and there were only seven BE teams that season. Four of those seven teams finished 4-2, tied for first place.

Pitt won the tiebreaker but absolutely nobody was deluded into believing that we were somehow good. We all knew that the overwhelming likelihood was that we'd be blown out by no matter who we'd play in whichever bowl we played in.

2.) To add to the bizarreness of it all, we had basically fired Walt Harris before that game, further dampening any spirits people may have otherwise had. How many teams in the history of the BCS fired their coach before their BCS game? We did that because we're just that incompetent.

3.) Pitt has traditionally traveled poorly to all bowls. We're very much like Boston College and Syracuse in that regard.

4.) A game against a Mountain West team excited nobody. Those of us that really follow CFB knew that the Utes were very good but most casual fans did not and therefore had no interest in flying across the country to watch that game.

5.) I really think this last point is often overlooked but by playing in a pro town, and sharing a market with arguably the NFL's most popular franchise, we are always directly impacted by what is going on with the Steelers. Also, the Steelers fans - who are usually also Pitt fans (with some PSU, WVU, OSU and ND fans sprinkled in) - travel as well or better than any other NFL franchise.

Well, that year the Steelers were on their way to the fifth of their NFL record six Super Bowl championships and most of the people that I tried to talk into joining me in Tempe declined reasoning that they were saving their money/time off work for road playoff games and/or a Super Bowl trip (which was in Detroit that year - just six hours from PGH).

As a Houston resident you probably understand this last point better than most but it is a major part of our reality and it always will be.

Hey, we travel!

We selectively travel...south along I-95 yes...going to the Fiesta Bowl No.

"Pitt has traditionally traveled poorly to all bowls. We're very much like Boston College and Syracuse in that regard."
That is factually not true. SU travels very well to some bowls, poorly to others, and about average to most (given the distance). We aren't bad on the road. There's a reason the most recent Pinstripe Bowl was SU-WVU, even though the Backyard Brawl is probably bigger than the Schwartzwalter Trophy. Are we Ohio State? No. But we aren't Northwestern, either. To put things in perspective, our Pinstripe Bowls averaged more fans that RU's and 1. RU is actually located in the NYC area, and 2. we had really, really bad weather, whereas they has a (warm - I think) sunny day.

I was at the Fiesta Bowl. Actually, I've been at every Pitt bowl since the 1997 Liberty Bowl with the exception of the 2nd BBVA bowl.

The poor fan showing at the Fiesta Bowl was predictable, and some reasons have been touched on above.

1. There was little buzz for the team and Walt Harris was a lame duck coach. Pitt backed into the BCS tie breaker on the last weekend of the season when Syracuse scored a major season ending upset of BC on the road. No one expected or was mentally prepared to be be ready to travel to Arizona. Pitt was 8-3 with a stripped down Big East schedule, and was coming off a disappointing finish to the Larry Fitzgerald-led teams the year before. Heck, Pitt needed overtime to beat IAA Furman early in the season. Bottom line, Pitt fans knew the team was average at best and the dower atmosphere surrounding Harris' firing didn't help.

2. The opponent. Utah, I believe, was the first non-BCS school to play in a BCS bowl. The perspective of playing Utah, at the time, was no different than, say, playing Colorado State.

3. The location. Pitt had been to the Insight Bowl in Phoenix in 2000 and 2002. There was travel fatigue for Phoenix. In addition, you can't really pick a location more difficult to get to for the vast majority of Pitt's fan base. Pitt likely wouldn't ever travel well to the Fiesta Bowl unless they were playing for a national championship.

Now that said, I will disagree with Yinzer above about Pitt never being able to travel. I've seen Pitt travel decently to away games. The problem with Pitt's bowl game outings is that...

1) Pitt has rarely taken much excitement heading into the post season (probably the 97 Liberty and 08 Sun were the only ones that really had real positive buzz or momentum). Most of the time, Pitt is stumbling disappointingly to the finish line with dashed expectations.

2) The locations of its bowls have been extremely unfavorable: Phoenix 3X, Birmingham 3X, El Paso (extremely difficult to fly into). Thats 7 of 11 bowl locations since '97 that were simply in some of the worst locations you could imagine for Pitt fans to get to as far as ease.

3) The dates of its bowls have also sucked. The 2001 Tangerine Bowl, although a great location, was on December 20th, not to mention Pitt was a 6-5 team. The 2009 Meineke bowl was on the day after Christmas and it followed one of the most disappointing losses in Pitt's history in which Pitt blew a 21 point 3rd quarter lead to Cincinnati and lost what everyone expected was to be a BE Championship and Sugar Bowl berth. Try convincing anyone to switch the Christmas plans around to go see Pitt play in Charlotte after expecting New Orleans over New Years. The Insight Bowls fell on the 27 and 28th. BBVA Bowls on the January weekends the week after New Years.

However, if there is positive momentum heading in the post season, and the travel is reasonable...meaning on the Eastern US and not in somewhere like Birmingham, and not right after Christmas... Pitt would travel decently. I saw that at the Liberty Bowl. I've seen that at regular season away games, particularly Navy in 2008. For the Sun Bowl, Pitt travel surprisingly well. Pitt has as many or more fans than Oregon State did at the Sun Bowl, and El Paso is an absolute terrible location to try to get to. Pitt fans generally won't make the effort to travel to joke bowls though, and hence, such an attitude feeds into Pitt's reputation for a poor traveling fan base.

[quote='Dr. Isaly von Yinzer' pid='10013937' dateline='1384619265']
I was at that game too and here are my thoughts:

1.) That was really a bizarre year. It was the year after the ACC's initial raid on the BE and there were only seven BE teams that season. Four of those seven teams finished 4-2, tied for first place.

Pitt won the tiebreaker but absolutely nobody was deluded into believing that we were somehow good. We all knew that the overwhelming likelihood was that we'd be blown out by no matter who we'd play in whichever bowl we played in.

2.) To add to the bizarreness of it all, we had basically fired Walt Harris before that game, further dampening any spirits people may have otherwise had. How many teams in the history of the BCS fired their coach before their BCS game? We did that because we're just that incompetent.

3.) Pitt has traditionally traveled poorly to all bowls. We're very much like Boston College and Syracuse in that regard.

4.) A game against a Mountain West team excited nobody. Those of us that really follow CFB knew that the Utes were very good but most casual fans did not and therefore had no interest in flying across the country to watch that game.

5.) I really think this last point is often overlooked but by playing in a pro town, and sharing a market with arguably the NFL's most popular franchise, we are always directly impacted by what is going on with the Steelers. Also, the Steelers fans - who are usually also Pitt fans (with some PSU, WVU, OSU and ND fans sprinkled in) - travel as well or better than any other NFL franchise.

Well, that year the Steelers were on their way to the fifth of their NFL record six Super Bowl championships and most of the people that I tried to talk into joining me in Tempe declined reasoning that they were saving their money/time off work for road playoff games and/or a Super Bowl trip (which was in Detroit that year - just six hours from PGH).

As a Houston resident you probably understand this last point better than most but it is a major part of our reality and it always will be.


Yeah I definitely know what you are saying. Although the mere fact that Houston is located in college football crazy Texas may make the Houston situation a bit different than yours. Pittsburgh is an NFL city through and through and has been for at least 4 decades. But there are comparisons other than having an NFL team in both markets to compete with worth noting. Pitt has Penn St and Notre Dame to compete with for fan support as well as the NFL....Just like Houston has Texas A&M and Texas. Thanks everyone for educating me on the Pitt perspective of that game.....Like I said before, every time bowl season creeps up I start thinking about the blast I had at the 2005 Fiesta Bowl.