(10-25-2013 12:52 PM)I45owl Wrote:  

(10-25-2013 11:06 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  George, I think your story pretty well captures what I was taught to think of as irony back when I was in school. Judging from what gets called irony on here lots of times, the definition seems to have shifted quite a bit in the intervening years. I think that was your intended point, and I agree.

I'm partial to Houston Owl's definition.

But, isn't the purpose of ATMs (1) to reduce manpower (salary) requirements at banks, and (2) to provide value-added service in terms of off-site/off-hours access to cash? My guess would be in that order.

From the bank's POV, yes. My question is, why do people line up for the ATMs instead of going inside? I think most do because either they think it saves time or they think it is too much trouble to get out of and back into their car.

I go in for several reasons. In no particular order, free coffee, exercise, see people, save gas. Lifetime, I have used an ATM twice.

(10-25-2013 12:52 PM)I45owl Wrote:  

(10-25-2013 11:06 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  George, I think your story pretty well captures what I was taught to think of as irony back when I was in school. Judging from what gets called irony on here lots of times, the definition seems to have shifted quite a bit in the intervening years. I think that was your intended point, and I agree.

I'm partial to Houston Owl's definition.

But, isn't the purpose of ATMs (1) to reduce manpower (salary) requirements at banks, and (2) to provide value-added service in terms of off-site/off-hours access to cash? My guess would be in that order.

I would wager to guess that the initial reasons for the introduction of ATMs was probably the reverse order - someone saw it as an opportunity to differentiate from other banks (get and deposit your money at all hours!), then they really discovered the value of reducing overhead costs by driving more traffic there. It's really a longer-term benefit of reducing costs. But currently, I would suggest that ATMs are more looked at for #1 than #2.

Mobile banking has a similar business case now, with service differentiation being the primary/initial reason, with the hope for eventual recurring cost savings.

My kids bank accounts don't charge them a monthly fee unless they use a teller.

(10-25-2013 01:19 PM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  I go in for several reasons. In no particular order, free coffee, exercise, see people, save gas.

In the last ten or so years of his life, going to the bank was one of my Dad's favorite rituals. He went several times a week, and he manufactured reasons to do so. I am pretty sure that your third reason was his first. The bankers at his branch were always very kind to him, which he enjoyed and which I enjoy remembering.

(10-25-2013 11:06 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  George, I think your story pretty well captures what I was taught to think of as irony back when I was in school. Judging from what gets called irony on here lots of times, the definition seems to have shifted quite a bit in the intervening years. I think that was your intended point, and I agree.

When I was in school, the irony I was taught only applied to literature. So taking George's story with himself as the author and protagonist, it doesn't fit what I was taught is irony -- a situation in which the audience knows more than the character, particularly with tragic consequences for the character. Since we learned everything concurrently with the protagonist in George's story, it doesn't meet what I was classically taught as irony.

It does, however, feel like it fit one of the more common/current definitions of irony, where something occurs that's directly opposite what conventional wisdom would suggest. In this case, that going into the bank actually saved time, rather than costing time as one would expect. However, I'd say that more modern usage is most typically employed when there are tragicomic consequences for the principal, which wasn't the case for George since he came out ahead.

(10-25-2013 12:19 PM)exowlswimmer Wrote:  

(10-25-2013 11:50 AM)RiceLad15 Wrote:  This conversation would only ever happen on a Rice sports message board...

Ironic, but the best record of a Rice "football" team this year is not the women's soccer team, our Owl varsity team, but instead our club soccer team who plays Lamar U on Saturday at 4 p.m. RiceLad15, not wanting to call you out but how about an update on our most successful "football" team this year?

The 15 refers to jersey number, not year.

I've been seeing the updates all year and it's been good to see. We haven't played in the big boys league since '06 or '07, and it would have been nice to see them move back up this year (they did pretty well last year if I remember correctly).

(10-25-2013 12:19 PM)exowlswimmer Wrote:  

(10-25-2013 11:50 AM)RiceLad15 Wrote:  This conversation would only ever happen on a Rice sports message board...

Ironic, but the best record of a Rice "football" team this year is not the women's soccer team, our Owl varsity team, but instead our club soccer team who plays Lamar U on Saturday at 4 p.m. RiceLad15, not wanting to call you out but how about an update on our most successful "football" team this year?

Hmmm, my ladies play Lamar this Saturday as well. I guess I'm hoping for a bad "football" day for Lamar. Afraid I can't claim that we're our most successful "football" team, although we are doing pretty well so far.

(10-25-2013 04:37 PM)JOwl Wrote:  

(10-25-2013 11:06 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  George, I think your story pretty well captures what I was taught to think of as irony back when I was in school. Judging from what gets called irony on here lots of times, the definition seems to have shifted quite a bit in the intervening years. I think that was your intended point, and I agree.

When I was in school, the irony I was taught only applied to literature. So taking George's story with himself as the author and protagonist, it doesn't fit what I was taught is irony -- a situation in which the audience knows more than the character, particularly with tragic consequences for the character. Since we learned everything concurrently with the protagonist in George's story, it doesn't meet what I was classically taught as irony.
It does, however, feel like it fit one of the more common/current definitions of irony, where something occurs that's directly opposite what conventional wisdom would suggest. In this case, that going into the bank actually saved time, rather than costing time as one would expect. However, I'd say that more modern usage is most typically employed when there are tragicomic consequences for the principal, which wasn't the case for George since he came out ahead.

And I would flip flop the two in my experience, where the early school training taught irony as something very much against the run of play, tragic or comic, whereas the literary definition you give came much later.

Does help clear up some posts on here.

(10-25-2013 02:40 PM)georgewebb Wrote:  

(10-25-2013 01:19 PM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  I go in for several reasons. In no particular order, free coffee, exercise, see people, save gas.

In the last ten or so years of his life, going to the bank was one of my Dad's favorite rituals. He went several times a week, and he manufactured reasons to do so. I am pretty sure that your third reason was his first. The bankers at his branch were always very kind to him, which he enjoyed and which I enjoy remembering.

When I was in business, I went every day, and went in rather than use drive-thrus because I felt it was good for my bankers, especially the loan officers and top management, to see me in there depositing money every day. When you see people every day, and chat a bit with them, it becomes social. One of my best friends was a bank officer who I did not previously know outside the bank, but shared interests in SWC football (he was a Longhorn booster, although a UNT grad) and sons the same age led to a 20 year friendship. When ATMs came in, I continued the practice. I am retired now, and only visit the bank about 1-2 times a week, but it is still worth it to go in, get a cup of coffee, and say hi to people. The minimal amount of exercise and gasoline savings are just bonuses. But lots of times, I go in, get my coffee, make my deposits, say hi to friends, and when I go back out to my car, the car that was last in line at the ATM is just now up to it.