AIR FORCE IS NOT GOING TO THE AAC!!!!! God, how many times do I have to tell you guys? They have so much history with most MWC schools and play Army and Navy every year. No need to move. Get that through your heads.

(09-09-2013 10:10 PM)UNLVFan90 Wrote:  AIR FORCE IS NOT GOING TO THE AAC!!!!! God, how many times do I have to tell you guys? They have so much history with most MWC schools and play Army and Navy every year. No need to move. Get that through your heads.

If the AAC had a clue Air Force would be long gone. The AAC couldn't get it through theirs thick heads that a true western division was required to make it all work. If they had not been so tentative and timid, it would have happened.

(09-09-2013 09:48 AM)CougarRed Wrote:  In two recent interviews, American commish Mike Aresco has mentioned the possibility of going to 14 schools.

Army's TV deal with CBS Sports expires after 2014. With Navy joining the American in 2015, here's how the cookie might crumble:

Army and Air Force to the American
MWC replaces Air Force with UTEP
CUSA replaces UTEP with a Sun Belt school

I wonder how many times Air Force has to say no before the stupid rumors stop

(09-09-2013 11:05 PM)billings Wrote:  

(09-09-2013 09:48 AM)CougarRed Wrote:  In two recent interviews, American commish Mike Aresco has mentioned the possibility of going to 14 schools.

Army's TV deal with CBS Sports expires after 2014. With Navy joining the American in 2015, here's how the cookie might crumble:

Army and Air Force to the American
MWC replaces Air Force with UTEP
CUSA replaces UTEP with a Sun Belt school

I wonder how many times Air Force has to say no before the stupid rumors stop

There is no rumor. Speculation at best.

(09-10-2013 12:40 AM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(09-09-2013 11:05 PM)billings Wrote:  

(09-09-2013 09:48 AM)CougarRed Wrote:  In two recent interviews, American commish Mike Aresco has mentioned the possibility of going to 14 schools.

Army's TV deal with CBS Sports expires after 2014. With Navy joining the American in 2015, here's how the cookie might crumble:

Army and Air Force to the American
MWC replaces Air Force with UTEP
CUSA replaces UTEP with a Sun Belt school

I wonder how many times Air Force has to say no before the stupid rumors stop

There is no rumor. Speculation at best.

True. And the basis for the speculation: Aresco last Saturday in Philly

"Internally, we're happy with 12 teams. … There are a couple of schools -- I'm not going to name them, you probably know how they are -- who could probably add something to our conference down the road, if we wanted to go 14.

"But they would have to be teams that add value in terms of, one, academics, that would have value in terms of competition, and, three, that would have TV value. Because what we don't want to do, obviously, is diminish the value of our existing schools."

This is in contrast with what he said to the Philly media back in May - that we were happy at 12 and have no plans to expand.

In August 2012, Aresco specifically mentioned Air Force and BYU as expansion candidates. I'm not sure he has specifically ever mentioned Army.

But Army's TV deal is up in 2014. And the BYU ship has sailed. So I am putting 2+2 together and concluding we are making a play for Army and Air Force. They both have TV value. And academic value. And Air Force has competitive value.

(09-10-2013 01:16 AM)CougarRed Wrote:  

(09-10-2013 12:40 AM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(09-09-2013 11:05 PM)billings Wrote:  

(09-09-2013 09:48 AM)CougarRed Wrote:  In two recent interviews, American commish Mike Aresco has mentioned the possibility of going to 14 schools.

Army's TV deal with CBS Sports expires after 2014. With Navy joining the American in 2015, here's how the cookie might crumble:

Army and Air Force to the American
MWC replaces Air Force with UTEP
CUSA replaces UTEP with a Sun Belt school

I wonder how many times Air Force has to say no before the stupid rumors stop

There is no rumor. Speculation at best.

True. And the basis for the speculation: Aresco last Saturday in Philly

"Internally, we're happy with 12 teams. … There are a couple of schools -- I'm not going to name them, you probably know how they are -- who could probably add something to our conference down the road, if we wanted to go 14.

"But they would have to be teams that add value in terms of, one, academics, that would have value in terms of competition, and, three, that would have TV value. Because what we don't want to do, obviously, is diminish the value of our existing schools."

This is in contrast with what he said to the Philly media back in May - that we were happy at 12 and have no plans to expand.

In August 2012, Aresco specifically mentioned Air Force and BYU as expansion candidates. I'm not sure he has specifically ever mentioned Army.

But Army's TV deal is up in 2014. And the BYU ship has sailed. So I am putting 2+2 together and concluding we are making a play for Army and Air Force. They both have TV value. And academic value. And Air Force has competitive value.

Reading that in more context, it sounds more like an eventual possibility than something they are really looking at right now. I've misread before, but I don't think the more recent quote contradicts the older one at all.

Army and BYU would be really sweet for the Americans.

But there is no smoke regarding both though

(09-09-2013 10:10 PM)UNLVFan90 Wrote:  AIR FORCE IS NOT GOING TO THE AAC!!!!! God, how many times do I have to tell you guys? They have so much history with most MWC schools and play Army and Navy every year. No need to move. Get that through your heads.

If Army joined it makes incredible sense for them. Why would Air Force want to confine itself to the MWC when there are only 4 teams that have been in the conference with them for more than 18 years and 6 have been members 3 years or less. Air Force would prefer a national schedule. Being in the AAC with Army and Navy gives them 4 free games instead of 2 in the MWC and 8 conference games in a broader geographic range.

But it is dependent on Army wanting to do it. It really does make sense for Army. Many of those AAC schools are the types of schools they would schedule anyways.

Probably wont be adding until our TV renegotiating in 6 years.

(09-10-2013 08:28 AM)bullet Wrote:  

(09-09-2013 10:10 PM)UNLVFan90 Wrote:  AIR FORCE IS NOT GOING TO THE AAC!!!!! God, how many times do I have to tell you guys? They have so much history with most MWC schools and play Army and Navy every year. No need to move. Get that through your heads.

If Army joined it makes incredible sense for them. Why would Air Force want to confine itself to the MWC when there are only 4 teams that have been in the conference with them for more than 18 years and 6 have been members 3 years or less. Air Force would prefer a national schedule. Being in the AAC with Army and Navy gives them 4 free games instead of 2 in the MWC and 8 conference games in a broader geographic range.

But it is dependent on Army wanting to do it. It really does make sense for Army. Many of those AAC schools are the types of schools they would schedule anyways.

There is the non-football issue. I don't know exactly the thinking at Air Force, but the Mountain West seems like a good home for their non-football sports and I'd be hesitant about leaving it. Beyond that, if they turned down the offer when the Big East had AQ status, I'm not convinced they'd be more willing to move now. It could happen, but would require a change in leadership viewpoint.

(09-09-2013 01:58 PM)CougarRed Wrote:  How did we get on Ohio?

The American has a meager TV pie and plenty of mouths to feed aleady. It needs teams that help make the TV contract bigger. And help with bowls.

Assuming BYU is out of the picture, Army and Air Force are about the only schools out there that help us on both the bowl and TV front.

Not UMass. Not Old Dominion. Not Ohio. Not Southern Miss.

It's either Air Force/Army or bust. Which means it may be bust. The secret would be Army. Get them to join Navy, and I think AF would follow.

I think your spot on CougarRed. The combination of Navy and Army make it attractive from a revenue standpoint to add Army. The potential increase in value to the networks having all 3 service academies plays into the whole "American Conference" perception.

Adding anyone else just doesn't make sense. If Army was willing to come i would say hold at 13 with the hope that AFA reconsiders and enjoy the financial benefits of the Army / Navy game. Anyone else besides AFA would just take more from the revenue pie then they would add so it wouldn't make sense.

(09-10-2013 10:09 AM)ohio1317 Wrote:  

(09-10-2013 08:28 AM)bullet Wrote:  

(09-09-2013 10:10 PM)UNLVFan90 Wrote:  AIR FORCE IS NOT GOING TO THE AAC!!!!! God, how many times do I have to tell you guys? They have so much history with most MWC schools and play Army and Navy every year. No need to move. Get that through your heads.

If Army joined it makes incredible sense for them. Why would Air Force want to confine itself to the MWC when there are only 4 teams that have been in the conference with them for more than 18 years and 6 have been members 3 years or less. Air Force would prefer a national schedule. Being in the AAC with Army and Navy gives them 4 free games instead of 2 in the MWC and 8 conference games in a broader geographic range.

But it is dependent on Army wanting to do it. It really does make sense for Army. Many of those AAC schools are the types of schools they would schedule anyways.

There is the non-football issue. I don't know exactly the thinking at Air Force, but the Mountain West seems like a good home for their non-football sports and I'd be hesitant about leaving it. Beyond that, if they turned down the offer when the Big East had AQ status, I'm not convinced they'd be more willing to move now. It could happen, but would require a change in leadership viewpoint.

WAC would love them. WCC might be interested.

(09-10-2013 10:47 AM)bullet Wrote:  

(09-10-2013 10:09 AM)ohio1317 Wrote:  

(09-10-2013 08:28 AM)bullet Wrote:  

(09-09-2013 10:10 PM)UNLVFan90 Wrote:  AIR FORCE IS NOT GOING TO THE AAC!!!!! God, how many times do I have to tell you guys? They have so much history with most MWC schools and play Army and Navy every year. No need to move. Get that through your heads.

If Army joined it makes incredible sense for them. Why would Air Force want to confine itself to the MWC when there are only 4 teams that have been in the conference with them for more than 18 years and 6 have been members 3 years or less. Air Force would prefer a national schedule. Being in the AAC with Army and Navy gives them 4 free games instead of 2 in the MWC and 8 conference games in a broader geographic range.

But it is dependent on Army wanting to do it. It really does make sense for Army. Many of those AAC schools are the types of schools they would schedule anyways.

There is the non-football issue. I don't know exactly the thinking at Air Force, but the Mountain West seems like a good home for their non-football sports and I'd be hesitant about leaving it. Beyond that, if they turned down the offer when the Big East had AQ status, I'm not convinced they'd be more willing to move now. It could happen, but would require a change in leadership viewpoint.

WAC would love them. WCC might be interested.

True, but I think both would probably be considered a downgrade by Air Force. Remember part of what brought Boise State back to the Mountain West was the ability to keep all their teams in one conference and not have to put most sports in the WCC.

(09-10-2013 10:49 AM)ohio1317 Wrote:  

(09-10-2013 10:47 AM)bullet Wrote:  

(09-10-2013 10:09 AM)ohio1317 Wrote:  

(09-10-2013 08:28 AM)bullet Wrote:  

(09-09-2013 10:10 PM)UNLVFan90 Wrote:  AIR FORCE IS NOT GOING TO THE AAC!!!!! God, how many times do I have to tell you guys? They have so much history with most MWC schools and play Army and Navy every year. No need to move. Get that through your heads.

If Army joined it makes incredible sense for them. Why would Air Force want to confine itself to the MWC when there are only 4 teams that have been in the conference with them for more than 18 years and 6 have been members 3 years or less. Air Force would prefer a national schedule. Being in the AAC with Army and Navy gives them 4 free games instead of 2 in the MWC and 8 conference games in a broader geographic range.

But it is dependent on Army wanting to do it. It really does make sense for Army. Many of those AAC schools are the types of schools they would schedule anyways.

There is the non-football issue. I don't know exactly the thinking at Air Force, but the Mountain West seems like a good home for their non-football sports and I'd be hesitant about leaving it. Beyond that, if they turned down the offer when the Big East had AQ status, I'm not convinced they'd be more willing to move now. It could happen, but would require a change in leadership viewpoint.

WAC would love them. WCC might be interested.

True, but I think both would probably be considered a downgrade by Air Force. Remember part of what brought Boise State back to the Mountain West was the ability to keep all their teams in one conference and not have to put most sports in the WCC.

Does anyone have a link that talks about Aresco wanting to go to 14 teams?

Aresco has always been a fan of the service academies. He negotiated the CBS contracts with Army and Navy. I have no doubt his targets are Air Force for all sports and Army for football only.

Nonetheless, I think Air Force is staying put. The MWC is a great fit for them and there is no realistic threat of losing Army and Navy as OOC games.

Unless Aresco is talking about adding Army and Air Force (BYU will never happen), then it's a waste of time to even discuss the AAC going to 14.

Now if Aresco is talking 14 with UMass and some other CUSA school, then I think he knows he's about to lose some programs soon. That would be devastating to the league in my opinion, and grounds for losing their tiny TV contract and all their "exposure" - winner of the G5 would be the MWC ultimately.

(09-10-2013 10:49 AM)ohio1317 Wrote:  

(09-10-2013 10:47 AM)bullet Wrote:  

(09-10-2013 10:09 AM)ohio1317 Wrote:  

(09-10-2013 08:28 AM)bullet Wrote:  

(09-09-2013 10:10 PM)UNLVFan90 Wrote:  AIR FORCE IS NOT GOING TO THE AAC!!!!! God, how many times do I have to tell you guys? They have so much history with most MWC schools and play Army and Navy every year. No need to move. Get that through your heads.

If Army joined it makes incredible sense for them. Why would Air Force want to confine itself to the MWC when there are only 4 teams that have been in the conference with them for more than 18 years and 6 have been members 3 years or less. Air Force would prefer a national schedule. Being in the AAC with Army and Navy gives them 4 free games instead of 2 in the MWC and 8 conference games in a broader geographic range.

But it is dependent on Army wanting to do it. It really does make sense for Army. Many of those AAC schools are the types of schools they would schedule anyways.

There is the non-football issue. I don't know exactly the thinking at Air Force, but the Mountain West seems like a good home for their non-football sports and I'd be hesitant about leaving it. Beyond that, if they turned down the offer when the Big East had AQ status, I'm not convinced they'd be more willing to move now. It could happen, but would require a change in leadership viewpoint.

WAC would love them. WCC might be interested.

True, but I think both would probably be considered a downgrade by Air Force. Remember part of what brought Boise State back to the Mountain West was the ability to keep all their teams in one conference and not have to put most sports in the WCC.

To be fair, Air Force probably wouldn't mind a down grade in their Olympic sports. They have investigated moving their Olympics in the interest of being more competitive.

(09-10-2013 11:48 AM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(09-10-2013 10:49 AM)ohio1317 Wrote:  

(09-10-2013 10:47 AM)bullet Wrote:  

(09-10-2013 10:09 AM)ohio1317 Wrote:  

(09-10-2013 08:28 AM)bullet Wrote:  If Army joined it makes incredible sense for them. Why would Air Force want to confine itself to the MWC when there are only 4 teams that have been in the conference with them for more than 18 years and 6 have been members 3 years or less. Air Force would prefer a national schedule. Being in the AAC with Army and Navy gives them 4 free games instead of 2 in the MWC and 8 conference games in a broader geographic range.

But it is dependent on Army wanting to do it. It really does make sense for Army. Many of those AAC schools are the types of schools they would schedule anyways.

There is the non-football issue. I don't know exactly the thinking at Air Force, but the Mountain West seems like a good home for their non-football sports and I'd be hesitant about leaving it. Beyond that, if they turned down the offer when the Big East had AQ status, I'm not convinced they'd be more willing to move now. It could happen, but would require a change in leadership viewpoint.

WAC would love them. WCC might be interested.

True, but I think both would probably be considered a downgrade by Air Force. Remember part of what brought Boise State back to the Mountain West was the ability to keep all their teams in one conference and not have to put most sports in the WCC.

To be fair, Air Force probably wouldn't mind a down grade in their Olympic sports. They have investigated moving their Olympics in the interest of being more competitive.

Yes, AFA did briefly consider moving football to the defunct Big East. But, there were two caveats. First, their other sports had to go to the Missouri Valley Conference and Army had to join the Big East for football. The MVC politely told AFA the could join slightly after hell froze over, and Army showed no interest. Why would AFA be interested in the WAC. It shows no signs of stability as a basketball conference. The WCC is composed of private, mostly small and Christian schools. AFA does not belong there at all.

There has been a lot of discussion on this board about schools on islands, and in this thread about increased travel costs to Ohio U if they joined the AAC. Take a look at a map and check out the travel distances from Colorado Springs to the AAC schools. Then check the distances to AFA's three nearest division rivals. Those are bus trips. Two of them under 4 hours.

(09-10-2013 01:33 PM)lew240z Wrote:  

(09-10-2013 11:48 AM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(09-10-2013 10:49 AM)ohio1317 Wrote:  

(09-10-2013 10:47 AM)bullet Wrote:  

(09-10-2013 10:09 AM)ohio1317 Wrote:  There is the non-football issue. I don't know exactly the thinking at Air Force, but the Mountain West seems like a good home for their non-football sports and I'd be hesitant about leaving it. Beyond that, if they turned down the offer when the Big East had AQ status, I'm not convinced they'd be more willing to move now. It could happen, but would require a change in leadership viewpoint.

WAC would love them. WCC might be interested.

True, but I think both would probably be considered a downgrade by Air Force. Remember part of what brought Boise State back to the Mountain West was the ability to keep all their teams in one conference and not have to put most sports in the WCC.

To be fair, Air Force probably wouldn't mind a down grade in their Olympic sports. They have investigated moving their Olympics in the interest of being more competitive.

Yes, AFA did briefly consider moving football to the defunct Big East. But, there were two caveats. First, their other sports had to go to the Missouri Valley Conference and Army had to join the Big East for football. The MVC politely told AFA the could join slightly after hell froze over, and Army showed no interest. Why would AFA be interested in the WAC. It shows no signs of stability as a basketball conference. The WCC is composed of private, mostly small and Christian schools. AFA does not belong there at all.

There has been a lot of discussion on this board about schools on islands, and in this thread about increased travel costs to Ohio U if they joined the AAC. Take a look at a map and check out the travel distances from Colorado Springs to the AAC schools. Then check the distances to AFA's three nearest division rivals. Those are bus trips. Two of them under 4 hours.

MWC is hardly a bus league. 3 schools are somewhat close to Air Force, 1 is a possible long bus ride and the rest are a long ways away.

(09-10-2013 11:48 AM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(09-10-2013 10:49 AM)ohio1317 Wrote:  

(09-10-2013 10:47 AM)bullet Wrote:  

(09-10-2013 10:09 AM)ohio1317 Wrote:  

(09-10-2013 08:28 AM)bullet Wrote:  If Army joined it makes incredible sense for them. Why would Air Force want to confine itself to the MWC when there are only 4 teams that have been in the conference with them for more than 18 years and 6 have been members 3 years or less. Air Force would prefer a national schedule. Being in the AAC with Army and Navy gives them 4 free games instead of 2 in the MWC and 8 conference games in a broader geographic range.

But it is dependent on Army wanting to do it. It really does make sense for Army. Many of those AAC schools are the types of schools they would schedule anyways.

There is the non-football issue. I don't know exactly the thinking at Air Force, but the Mountain West seems like a good home for their non-football sports and I'd be hesitant about leaving it. Beyond that, if they turned down the offer when the Big East had AQ status, I'm not convinced they'd be more willing to move now. It could happen, but would require a change in leadership viewpoint.

WAC would love them. WCC might be interested.

True, but I think both would probably be considered a downgrade by Air Force. Remember part of what brought Boise State back to the Mountain West was the ability to keep all their teams in one conference and not have to put most sports in the WCC.

To be fair, Air Force probably wouldn't mind a down grade in their Olympic sports. They have investigated moving their Olympics in the interest of being more competitive.

True: If Army and AF were conference members with Navy, AF could continue to play CSU annually and perhaps some of the other MWC traditional schools as well from time to time. But AF would get additional N/C games to play that would be good for their "brand" since they have a national following.

And for BB, an AAC with 14 members could divide basketball into two divisions and give each team 19 games. That would put AF with SMU, Tulsa, Tulane, UH and either Memphis and Cincy or USF and UCF.
AF could be competitive in either configuration.

I would never say never about this or any other potential move.

But Army holds the key. If they remain afraid to compete in D-1 conference, there is no reason to discuss AF.