How volatile is the Big 12? Does Johnny Manziel pull eyeballs to the SEC that would otherwise throw dollars at longhorn and sooner entertainment? I think so. I don't think that there's any doubt that UT and OU could make bigger $ elsewhere. How long they resist that pull is anybody's guess.

(07-03-2013 02:03 PM)BigEastHomer Wrote:  

(07-03-2013 09:40 AM)CardFan1 Wrote:  Had the Big 12 added Louisville, Cincinnati, WVU, TCU, USF, Rutgers, UConn as a package They could have created an Eastern wing that would have made themselves very formidable for B1G competition on National viewing coverage. But it's Our gain to be in the ACC where many years of great competition lie ahead.

LMAO. in basketball...

In football? Not so much.

Wow Homer, looks like You get 3 chances at Louisville this year in Football and Basketball.

(07-03-2013 02:31 PM)jaminandjachin Wrote:  

(07-03-2013 02:03 PM)BigEastHomer Wrote:  

(07-03-2013 09:40 AM)CardFan1 Wrote:  Had the Big 12 added Louisville, Cincinnati, WVU, TCU, USF, Rutgers, UConn as a package They could have created an Eastern wing that would have made themselves very formidable for B1G competition on National viewing coverage. But it's Our gain to be in the ACC where many years of great competition lie ahead.

LMAO. in basketball...

In football? Not so much.

I had to jump in here. Are you saying ACC football isn't more competitive than AAC football?

AAC football should be very competitive, but that isn't saying much. A pee-wee league for 10 year olds can be very competitive, in the sense that all the teams are about equal in strength and so every game goes down the wire.

That said, let's face it: Despite the ACC stealing VT and Miami, from 2004-2012 the Big East was still a better football league than the ACC. The ACC was a nationally-dreadful league most years and who could have predicted that?

Will the same be true of an AAC-ACC comparison years from now? Almost certainly not, but only because the AAC has gotten far worse, not because the ACC will be all that great. It hasn't been, ever.

I think the Big 12 definitely lost out and the ACC definitely profited off of the Big 12's inability to think outside of their own individual little boxes. Oklahoma is looking forward because they see their own slow slide downwards.

It is so amusing to see the Texas folks covering their tracks now by trying to make it seem they were always pro-Louisville. No one is falling for that though. I wonder how Kansas felt. I wouldn't be surprised if they were a bit leary of Louisville coming in and challenging them for the basketball crown in the Big 12.

(07-03-2013 06:58 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(07-03-2013 02:31 PM)jaminandjachin Wrote:  

(07-03-2013 02:03 PM)BigEastHomer Wrote:  

(07-03-2013 09:40 AM)CardFan1 Wrote:  Had the Big 12 added Louisville, Cincinnati, WVU, TCU, USF, Rutgers, UConn as a package They could have created an Eastern wing that would have made themselves very formidable for B1G competition on National viewing coverage. But it's Our gain to be in the ACC where many years of great competition lie ahead.

LMAO. in basketball...

In football? Not so much.

I had to jump in here. Are you saying ACC football isn't more competitive than AAC football?

AAC football should be very competitive, but that isn't saying much. A pee-wee league for 10 year olds can be very competitive, in the sense that all the teams are about equal in strength and so every game goes down the wire.

That said, let's face it: Despite the ACC stealing VT and Miami, from 2004-2012 the Big East was still a better football league than the ACC. The ACC was a nationally-dreadful league most years and who could have predicted that?

Will the same be true of an AAC-ACC comparison years from now? Almost certainly not, but only because the AAC has gotten far worse, not because the ACC will be all that great. It hasn't been, ever.

How was the Big East a better football league? Just because of bowls? Surely there's more than that. Bowl season is just a few weeks of football and you play one game. How about an entire season? You still think Big East was better? Maybe 1 or 2 seasons, but the vast majority is was not and that's even with FSU and Miami being down. Guess what....now they're not.

(07-03-2013 10:55 AM)jam2112 Wrote:  

(07-03-2013 09:31 AM)CougarRed Wrote:  Coulda changed the whole fabric. Without Louisville available, who does the ACC replace Maryland with? UConn? That might have driven a wedge between the Southern football schools and the rest of the conference. Could been the beginning of the end of the ACC.

Maybe the ACC takes West Virginia...

the ACC leadership has made it quite clear they want nothing to do with WVU and the feeling is pretty much mutual

We're happy in the Big 12; we're in the 2nd best conference after the SEC; the athletic department will be making more money than it ever has been; we're getting ready to break ground on a new baseball stadium; we're adding men's golf as a new sport

the partnership between the Big 12 and WVU is good for everyone

(07-03-2013 11:25 AM)esayem Wrote:  

(07-03-2013 11:00 AM)Frog in the Kitchen Sink Wrote:  

(07-03-2013 10:48 AM)Marge Schott Wrote:  

(07-03-2013 09:08 AM)Frog in the Kitchen Sink Wrote:  Louisville (or any then available school for that matter) is not going to make or break the Big 12, and focusing on them misses the big picture. Adding the "hot" or "right" team or missing out on the "hot" or "right" team isn't going to be a lasting factor in the success or failure of the Big 12. The success or failure is going to depend on the effectiveness of its model to maintain revenue, or it the Big 10 or SEC (or PAC-12) can convince current members their models are better. The presence or absence of Louisville (or any other team) makes no difference in that regard.

Just funny a TCU fan is saying that UL wasn't a necessary add and that adding the "hot" team isn't important. A TCU fan.

I'd make the same point about any team, including TCU, FWIW. I'll be the first to admit that like teams like TCU and any of the real or potential Big 12 expansion targets are just all pawns in the game the Big 12 is playing; OU and UT and the King and Queen. In the big picture, the pawns aren't critical to the success or failure of the Big 12.

No reason to be condescending.

I tend to agree here, but with BYU as an exception. They're more of a bishop (or whatever Mormons have). I believe BYU/UNLV to be the best combo for the Big XII. UNLV basketball is on the rise and if they finally get an on-campus stadium that would be huge.

you're funny although I don't think you're doing it on purpose though

(07-03-2013 09:51 PM)Theodoresdaddy Wrote:  

(07-03-2013 10:55 AM)jam2112 Wrote:  

(07-03-2013 09:31 AM)CougarRed Wrote:  Coulda changed the whole fabric. Without Louisville available, who does the ACC replace Maryland with? UConn? That might have driven a wedge between the Southern football schools and the rest of the conference. Could been the beginning of the end of the ACC.

Maybe the ACC takes West Virginia...

the ACC leadership has made it quite clear they want nothing to do with WVU and the feeling is pretty much mutual

We're happy in the Big 12; we're in the 2nd best conference after the SEC; the athletic department will be making more money than it ever has been; we're getting ready to break ground on a new baseball stadium; we're adding men's golf as a new sport

the partnership between the Big 12 and WVU is good for everyone

What makes the Big 12 the second best conference? I assume you mean football only.

(07-03-2013 09:55 PM)Theodoresdaddy Wrote:  you're funny although I don't think you're doing it on purpose though

BYU football championships: 1

UNLV basketball championships: 1

WVU football championships: 0

WVU basketball championships: 0

hardy har har

(07-03-2013 09:29 PM)He1nousOne Wrote:  I think the Big 12 definitely lost out and the ACC definitely profited off of the Big 12's inability to think outside of their own individual little boxes. Oklahoma is looking forward because they see their own slow slide downwards.

It is so amusing to see the Texas folks covering their tracks now by trying to make it seem they were always pro-Louisville. No one is falling for that though. I wonder how Kansas felt. I wouldn't be surprised if they were a bit leary of Louisville coming in and challenging them for the basketball crown in the Big 12.

Texas also ignored a proposed Louisville/Memphis combo in the early '90's to replace Arkansas in the SWC. After Tulane was voted down.

BTW, I am most leery about Louisville for the same reason.

(07-03-2013 10:48 PM)esayem Wrote:  

(07-03-2013 09:29 PM)He1nousOne Wrote:  I think the Big 12 definitely lost out and the ACC definitely profited off of the Big 12's inability to think outside of their own individual little boxes. Oklahoma is looking forward because they see their own slow slide downwards.

It is so amusing to see the Texas folks covering their tracks now by trying to make it seem they were always pro-Louisville. No one is falling for that though. I wonder how Kansas felt. I wouldn't be surprised if they were a bit leary of Louisville coming in and challenging them for the basketball crown in the Big 12.

Texas also ignored a proposed Louisville/Memphis combo in the early '90's to replace Arkansas in the SWC. After Tulane was voted down.

BTW, I am most leery about Louisville for the same reason.

The ACC has plenty of threats though and even more upcoming in the future. You guys arent in the same position in the ACC as Kansas is in the Big 12. They are the unarguable Kings of the Big 12 at basketball where as you guys have pretty much shared that title with Duke. Now with Syracuse and Louisville coming in, you are going to have a lot of potential King Programs all vying for the spot. The ACC is going to be a very interesting basketball conference.

If I was a UNC fan I would be most worried about that triple threat combo of Duke/Syracuse/Louisville. That is a very ugly triple threat beatdown should those teams get the best of you guys during a season.

I strongly feel that the Big XII should have added WVU, UL, and UC and gone to 12. That would have made a nice northern group with the possibility of forming a strong 3 way rivalry. They also all field competitive basketball and football teams.

And, I know the Big XII claims left and right that they don't want a championship game because that makes undefeated seasons harder and means splitting playoff money more ways, but I do think that it would be worth it in this case. I think that even though the Big XII had bad luck with their conference championship game, they are good things.

It's widely known here in Dallas OU wanted Louisville and Bevo wanted West Virginia but at the end of the day even if those two wanted Louisville, WVU or both, it was the TV networks that said WVU brought more value to the Big XII. Louisville wasn't too far removed from the Kragthorpe (sp?) years and WVU was the best and highest profile football program in the Big East so I'm sure that played a big factor for the networks in choosing WVU over UL.

I'll say it again and again, Louisville fans will never get over the fact they got rejected by the Big XII. I completely understand, rejection is hard to swallow by most human beings and that rejection will sting for a long time even though the ACC is the "best thing" that ever happened to Louisville according to its fans. It's too early to tell what league got it right but five years from now it will be a good metric to say which league got the best school.

(07-04-2013 01:48 AM)UTEPDallas Wrote:  It's widely known here in Dallas OU wanted Louisville and Bevo wanted West Virginia but at the end of the day even if those two wanted Louisville, WVU or both, it was the TV networks that said WVU brought more value to the Big XII. Louisville wasn't too far removed from the Kragthorpe (sp?) years and WVU was the best and highest profile football program in the Big East so I'm sure that played a big factor for the networks in choosing WVU over UL.

I'll say it again and again, Louisville fans will never get over the fact they got rejected by the Big XII. I completely understand, rejection is hard to swallow by most human beings and that rejection will sting for a long time even though the ACC is the "best thing" that ever happened to Louisville according to its fans. It's too early to tell what league got it right but five years from now it will be a good metric to say which league got the best school.

Actually we are over it....trust me...and for our needs while @ the time in 2011 we wanted in the Big XII this in regards to Academic Profile for the school, Football Competitivenes & Natural Recruiting Base, Basketball and flat out accessibility to games makes the Big XII Rejection a Delayed Blessing for Louisville.

Football it is to our advantage because it made us a bigger player in our recruiting areas of Georgia & especially Florida. Also you might not know this we are much more familar with FSU, Georgia Tech, Virginia Tech, Syracuse, Pitt & Notre Dame for the simple readon we have been in conferences with each of those schools. As of right now not one league could pry us out of the ACC...not even the B1G or SEC...the fan base prefers the ACC but more importantly our President has ties to both Duke & UNC.

While we are a decent Football school our bread and butter is hoops...it is much better to play UNC, Syracuse, Duke, Pitt, ND & NC State then in regards in the Big XII with just KU. In Football it is easier to be very competitive and the overall Bowl Lineup is more attractive for Louisville fans then the Big XII Bowls. Nothing wrong with the Big XII Bowls just.from our perspective more attractive destinations & easier to reach.

We are just laughing about the remorse articles coming out of the Big XII now...this one we knew OU wanted us...but what Dodds said is laughable.

(07-04-2013 02:29 AM)Maize Wrote:  

(07-04-2013 01:48 AM)UTEPDallas Wrote:  It's widely known here in Dallas OU wanted Louisville and Bevo wanted West Virginia but at the end of the day even if those two wanted Louisville, WVU or both, it was the TV networks that said WVU brought more value to the Big XII. Louisville wasn't too far removed from the Kragthorpe (sp?) years and WVU was the best and highest profile football program in the Big East so I'm sure that played a big factor for the networks in choosing WVU over UL.

I'll say it again and again, Louisville fans will never get over the fact they got rejected by the Big XII. I completely understand, rejection is hard to swallow by most human beings and that rejection will sting for a long time even though the ACC is the "best thing" that ever happened to Louisville according to its fans. It's too early to tell what league got it right but five years from now it will be a good metric to say which league got the best school.

Actually we are over it....trust me...and for our needs while @ the time in 2011 we wanted in the Big XII this in regards to Academic Profile for the school, Football Competitivenes & Natural Recruiting Base, Basketball and flat out accessibility to games makes the Big XII Rejection a Delayed Blessing for Louisville.

Football it is to our advantage because it made us a bigger player in our recruiting areas of Georgia & especially Florida. Also you might not know this we are much more familar with FSU, Georgia Tech, Virginia Tech, Syracuse, Pitt & Notre Dame for the simple readon we have been in conferences with each of those schools. As of right now not one league could pry us out of the ACC...not even the B1G or SEC...the fan base prefers the ACC but more importantly our President has ties to both Duke & UNC.

While we are a decent Football school our bread and butter is hoops...it is much better to play UNC, Syracuse, Duke, Pitt, ND & NC State then in regards in the Big XII with just KU. In Football it is easier to be very competitive and the overall Bowl Lineup is more attractive for Louisville fans then the Big XII Bowls. Nothing wrong with the Big XII Bowls just.from our perspective more attractive destinations & easier to reach.

We are just laughing about the remorse articles coming out of the Big XII now...this one we knew OU wanted us...but what Dodds said is laughable.

I'm not disagreeing with you (except the part where not even the B1G or SEC could pry you out of the ACC). But that's the impression I get from some Louisville fans whether it's correct or not.

It's like the hot chick (Louisville) who got rejected by a guy on a date. That guy (Big XII) marries another hot girl (WVU) and moves on. So does the rejected hot chick and eventually she marries a nice guy with a good paying job and lives in a nice house in a wealthy neighborhood (ACC). The other guy and his trophy wife live in the same wealthy neighborhood and sometimes that guy wonders what if he had married her (UL) instead of his wife (WVU) but that doesn't necessarily means he made a mistake. It just one of those "what if" scenarios we all have but not one of doubt. OTOH, that hot chick (UL) makes sure she tells everyone (message boards) how happy her life is and how great her husband is and how she was lucky she married him (ACC) instead of the other guy (Big XII) and how he screwed himself by marrying the other girl (WVU), etc, etc, etc. Probably that's the case and she means it but she comes across as being either insecure and that's the reason for all the bragging or maybe she never got over the fact that guy (Big XII) rejected her in the first place because at that time he got other or perhaps better options. Most people around her think it's the latter not the former even thought she will never admit it.

That's how I see Louisville, West Virginia, the Big XII and the ACC. But at the end of the day, everybody is happy where they're at, right? Except if you're in the MWC, C-USA, MAC, AAC and Sun Belt.

(07-04-2013 03:32 AM)UTEPDallas Wrote:  

(07-04-2013 02:29 AM)Maize Wrote:  

(07-04-2013 01:48 AM)UTEPDallas Wrote:  It's widely known here in Dallas OU wanted Louisville and Bevo wanted West Virginia but at the end of the day even if those two wanted Louisville, WVU or both, it was the TV networks that said WVU brought more value to the Big XII. Louisville wasn't too far removed from the Kragthorpe (sp?) years and WVU was the best and highest profile football program in the Big East so I'm sure that played a big factor for the networks in choosing WVU over UL.

I'll say it again and again, Louisville fans will never get over the fact they got rejected by the Big XII. I completely understand, rejection is hard to swallow by most human beings and that rejection will sting for a long time even though the ACC is the "best thing" that ever happened to Louisville according to its fans. It's too early to tell what league got it right but five years from now it will be a good metric to say which league got the best school.

Actually we are over it....trust me...and for our needs while @ the time in 2011 we wanted in the Big XII this in regards to Academic Profile for the school, Football Competitivenes & Natural Recruiting Base, Basketball and flat out accessibility to games makes the Big XII Rejection a Delayed Blessing for Louisville.

Football it is to our advantage because it made us a bigger player in our recruiting areas of Georgia & especially Florida. Also you might not know this we are much more familar with FSU, Georgia Tech, Virginia Tech, Syracuse, Pitt & Notre Dame for the simple readon we have been in conferences with each of those schools. As of right now not one league could pry us out of the ACC...not even the B1G or SEC...the fan base prefers the ACC but more importantly our President has ties to both Duke & UNC.

While we are a decent Football school our bread and butter is hoops...it is much better to play UNC, Syracuse, Duke, Pitt, ND & NC State then in regards in the Big XII with just KU. In Football it is easier to be very competitive and the overall Bowl Lineup is more attractive for Louisville fans then the Big XII Bowls. Nothing wrong with the Big XII Bowls just.from our perspective more attractive destinations & easier to reach.

We are just laughing about the remorse articles coming out of the Big XII now...this one we knew OU wanted us...but what Dodds said is laughable.

I'm not disagreeing with you (except the part where not even the B1G or SEC could pry you out of the ACC). But that's the impression I get from some Louisville fans whether it's correct or not.

It's like the hot chick (Louisville) who got rejected by a guy on a date. That guy (Big XII) marries another hot girl (WVU) and moves on. So does the rejected hot chick and eventually she marries a nice guy with a good paying job and lives in a nice house in a wealthy neighborhood (ACC). The other guy and his trophy wife live in the same wealthy neighborhood and sometimes that guy wonders what if he had married her (UL) instead of his wife (WVU) but that doesn't necessarily means he made a mistake. It just one of those "what if" scenarios we all have but not one of doubt. OTOH, that hot chick (UL) makes sure she tells everyone (message boards) how happy her life is and how great her husband is and how she was lucky she married him (ACC) instead of the other guy (Big XII) and how he screwed himself by marrying the other girl (WVU), etc, etc, etc. Probably that's the case and she means it but she comes across as being either insecure and that's the reason for all the bragging or maybe she never got over the fact that guy (Big XII) rejected her in the first place because at that time he got other or perhaps better options. Most people around her think it's the latter not the former even thought she will never admit it.

That's how I see Louisville, West Virginia, the Big XII and the ACC. But at the end of the day, everybody is happy where they're at, right? Except if you're in the MWC, C-USA, MAC, AAC and Sun Belt.

In that regard with "some UofL" & "some WVU" fans in regards to the ACC/Big XII you got a point. But like you said it worked out for both and really both schools are in leagues that play to their strengths.

UofL fans look @ Dodds with an whatever attitude...the same with WVU fans with Swofford.

I don't think the remorse is about taking Louisville instead of WVU, I think it is about taking Louisville as well as WVU. That means someone else would have had to be taken though.

Personally for me, I don't think they need three teams in that area. I think a program like USF down in Florida has more upside for the Big 12 than Cinci does. Some success in the Big 12 would then put them on the same level as the other Florida schools.

(07-04-2013 01:48 AM)UTEPDallas Wrote:  I'll say it again and again, Louisville fans will never get over the fact they got rejected by the Big XII. I completely understand, rejection is hard to swallow by most human beings and that rejection will sting for a long time even though the ACC is the "best thing" that ever happened to Louisville according to its fans. It's too early to tell what league got it right but five years from now it will be a good metric to say which league got the best school.

LOL at the troll...UL is doing back-flips they are in an eastern looking conference. Playing UT and OU is awesome in FB and KU is awesome in BB but UL won their realignment lottery in the ACC.

I bet UL is happier than WV how things turned out. One team can bus to many games if desired...one team can't bus to any.

You are correct 5 and 10 year look ins will tell more...but the bottom-line joining the ACC for UL will be a boon academically to their university.

(07-04-2013 07:42 AM)He1nousOne Wrote:  I don't think the remorse is about taking Louisville instead of WVU, I think it is about taking Louisville as well as WVU. That means someone else would have had to be taken though.

Personally for me, I don't think they need three teams in that area. I think a program like USF down in Florida has more upside for the Big 12 than Cinci does. Some success in the Big 12 would then put them on the same level as the other Florida schools.

That would work too...if anyone goes to 16 (looking at you ACC or B1G) then the B12 might be boxed out for a long time.

The B12 taking USF/UCF would be a nice counter move. I know these P5 conferences are going to want to fill in gaps...I see 16 teams coming within 5 years.

(07-04-2013 08:52 AM)TexanMark Wrote:  

(07-04-2013 01:48 AM)UTEPDallas Wrote:  I'll say it again and again, Louisville fans will never get over the fact they got rejected by the Big XII. I completely understand, rejection is hard to swallow by most human beings and that rejection will sting for a long time even though the ACC is the "best thing" that ever happened to Louisville according to its fans. It's too early to tell what league got it right but five years from now it will be a good metric to say which league got the best school.

LOL at the troll...UL is doing back-flips they are in an eastern looking conference. Playing UT and OU is awesome in FB and KU is awesome in BB but UL won their realignment lottery in the ACC.

I bet UL is happier than WV how things turned out. One team can bus to many games if desired...one team can't bus to any.

You are correct 5 and 10 year look ins will tell more...but the bottom-line joining the ACC for UL will be a boon academically to their university.

Yes we are...many from the outside for the fan base we get to keep our budding rivalry with Syracuse in both Football & especially Basketball along with our rivalry with Notre Dame in Basketball.

Think about it...in our last game ever in Freedom Hall the Syracuse Orange was ranked #1....on our Senior Night on National TV we knock off #1 Syracuse...this past year we had a 12 Game win streak & Ranked #1 in the Nation...the Orange got payback by beating us in the Yum Center. As for UofL - ND in Basketball...I will almost guarantee you that it going multiple Overtime...