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Elon to CAA?
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The Cutter of Bish Offline
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Post: #61
RE: Elon to CAA?
It wouldn't surprise me if the MAC's lack of action has something to do with what happens with the AAC if it's killed before it ever starts. Like, does it become a parking lot once again for Temple or UConn's football?

I don't like the future of the CAA. The average school profile is small and private, and without football. If Albany or Stony can't crack it now, they never will.
05-27-2013 08:15 PM
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AuricGoldfinger Offline
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Post: #62
RE: Elon to CAA?
Can someone explain to me why the SoCon is taking VMI back into the conference? Are they that desperate for a football-playing member so they can retain their auto bid to the FCS playoffs? Is it because it represents an "academic" fit/replacement for schools like Davidson and Elon? Is it to placate The Citadel? Or are there just a lot of nostalgic feelings for VMI?

Mercer and ETSU seem like a natural fit with the SoCon, even though it may be a while before either is able to put a competitive product on the football field. But VMI hasn't even been able to do that in the Big South. I'm just surprised--I figured Coastal Carolina, Jacksonville State, or even Liberty would have been more likely.
05-28-2013 09:38 AM
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bluesox Offline
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Post: #63
RE: Elon to CAA?
I dont' really know why VMI and wofford don't move to D3. Well, big money supporters probably demand d1 but those school's would be better off playing d3. My guess is VMI has friends in citadel and all the privates in the southern conference to get an invite to rejoin.
05-28-2013 09:47 AM
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ETSUfan1 Offline
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Post: #64
RE: Elon to CAA?
The Citadel wanted VMI before they would agree to ETSU and Mercer, so the SoCon threw the 'dogs a bone.
05-28-2013 12:29 PM
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hapapp Offline
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Post: #65
RE: Elon to CAA?
Remember VMI was a 70+ year member before they went to the Big South. A very unpopular move with the alumni.

Why would Wofford drop to D3? They have a very successful FCS program and their basketball team made several NCAA trips in recent years. Despite their small size they are able to compete.
05-28-2013 03:36 PM
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Sultan of Euphonistan Offline
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Post: #66
RE: Elon to CAA?
(05-27-2013 08:21 AM)GoApps70 Wrote:  Everyone has ideas of what the MAC can do or will do or should do, but yet the MAC does very little ever.
They seem pretty set with what they have. Even with calls to even out the MAC do not seem to bring any reaction from the MAC.
Would be really surprised then to see them do anything radical.

That is what happens when a conference is not desperate and there are no absolute slam dunks around (with a possibility for some better options if things fall their way).

Most of the rest of alignment has been filled with conferences that either wanted somebody badly (and could get it) for some reason or they needed somebody NOW. The MAC is the odd one with neither at the moment.
05-28-2013 09:48 PM
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Kaplony Offline
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Post: #67
RE: Elon to CAA?
(05-28-2013 09:47 AM)bluesox Wrote:  I dont' really know why VMI and wofford don't move to D3.

In Wofford's case it is because despite their small size they can compete in DI in numerous sports.


As for VMI, I guess it is just ego. God knows they can't compete at the DI level.
05-28-2013 10:21 PM
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BirdstheWord Offline
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Post: #68
RE: Elon to CAA?
(05-28-2013 10:21 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  
(05-28-2013 09:47 AM)bluesox Wrote:  I dont' really know why VMI and wofford don't move to D3.

In Wofford's case it is because despite their small size they can compete in DI in numerous sports.


As for VMI, I guess it is just ego. God knows they can't compete at the DI level.

And why would you go from Division I to Division III?
05-29-2013 08:51 AM
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BruceMcF Offline
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Post: #69
RE: Elon to CAA?
(05-28-2013 09:48 PM)Sultan of Euphonistan Wrote:  That is what happens when a conference is not desperate and there are no absolute slam dunks around (with a possibility for some better options if things fall their way).

Quite. Wouldn't a MAC conference commissioner that rushed to add a football cellar dweller in 2015 look like a fool if in 2015 a slam dunk became available?

The MAC surely wants to even the football conference out. On the other hand, they hold one of the few ~ possibly only two ~ tickets into the FBS for the balance of the decade, so it makes no sense to make a move just because a school looks like "the best one available right now". Much better could well emerge over the next two to five years.

Which suggests that when the MAC moves, it'll be a school that the MAC Presidents is good for them, full stop, that happened to become available.
05-29-2013 10:01 AM
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bigblueblindness Offline
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Post: #70
RE: Elon to CAA?
(05-29-2013 10:01 AM)BruceMcF Wrote:  
(05-28-2013 09:48 PM)Sultan of Euphonistan Wrote:  That is what happens when a conference is not desperate and there are no absolute slam dunks around (with a possibility for some better options if things fall their way).

Quite. Wouldn't a MAC conference commissioner that rushed to add a football cellar dweller in 2015 look like a fool if in 2015 a slam dunk became available?

The MAC surely wants to even the football conference out. On the other hand, they hold one of the few ~ possibly only two ~ tickets into the FBS for the balance of the decade, so it makes no sense to make a move just because a school looks like "the best one available right now". Much better could well emerge over the next two to five years.

Which suggests that when the MAC moves, it'll be a school that the MAC Presidents is good for them, full stop, that happened to become available.

Yeah, I agree with that. Outside of a new Big East school like Georgetown or Villanova deciding to invest in football or an Ivy League school having a drastic shift in priorities, the bell cows seem to be Army, James Madison, and Delaware, all of which would make great additions for the MAC.
05-29-2013 10:09 AM
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bluesox Offline
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Post: #71
RE: Elon to CAA?
I am big fan of D3, so i don't see anything wrong with going to d3 for some school's. I'm sure the coaches don't like it cause its a lot less pay, ditto the scholarship players cause d3 is much more of a hassle, i.e. you can get lots of Aid but not as clean cut as full ride. Than add in the donors who want their school to play against the big boys for the ego kick, its a tough move to get a school to go d3 from d1. Yet, why should school's like wofford, vmi, davidson etc chase the d1 train? THe profile of those school's would be fine at the d3 level. What's the difference between davidson and depauw, pretty much nothing. Lot less headache going d3 and more playing experience for the students.
(This post was last modified: 05-29-2013 10:48 AM by bluesox.)
05-29-2013 10:44 AM
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Sultan of Euphonistan Offline
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Post: #72
RE: Elon to CAA?
(05-29-2013 10:09 AM)bigblueblindness Wrote:  
(05-29-2013 10:01 AM)BruceMcF Wrote:  
(05-28-2013 09:48 PM)Sultan of Euphonistan Wrote:  That is what happens when a conference is not desperate and there are no absolute slam dunks around (with a possibility for some better options if things fall their way).

Quite. Wouldn't a MAC conference commissioner that rushed to add a football cellar dweller in 2015 look like a fool if in 2015 a slam dunk became available?

The MAC surely wants to even the football conference out. On the other hand, they hold one of the few ~ possibly only two ~ tickets into the FBS for the balance of the decade, so it makes no sense to make a move just because a school looks like "the best one available right now". Much better could well emerge over the next two to five years.

Which suggests that when the MAC moves, it'll be a school that the MAC Presidents is good for them, full stop, that happened to become available.

Yeah, I agree with that. Outside of a new Big East school like Georgetown or Villanova deciding to invest in football or an Ivy League school having a drastic shift in priorities, the bell cows seem to be Army, James Madison, and Delaware, all of which would make great additions for the MAC.

Army I can see them waiting for and Delaware would be likely on the Presidents' point of view. JMU would be the pick for those who like fan support and for possible bowl support. Not sure how much those are considered in the MAC. I think the MAC is also willing to wait to see how this AAC thing shakes out. Everybody in it wants out so all it takes is a small spark to light the fuse and there are schools there that the MAC would like to take if a school was in trouble after a separation. The trick of course is if and when that spark comes (and of course where that spark lands).
05-29-2013 10:56 PM
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NoDak Offline
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Post: #73
RE: Elon to CAA?
(05-29-2013 08:51 AM)BirdstheWord Wrote:  
(05-28-2013 10:21 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  
(05-28-2013 09:47 AM)bluesox Wrote:  I dont' really know why VMI and wofford don't move to D3.

In Wofford's case it is because despite their small size they can compete in DI in numerous sports.


As for VMI, I guess it is just ego. God knows they can't compete at the DI level.

And why would you go from Division I to Division III?
Financial reasons and academics.

Over the years, there has been a steady trickle of DI schools that have moved to DIII. Recently, Centenary, Birmingham Southern, and New Orleans all moved toward DIII classification after being DI. New Orleans reversed course back to DII and then DI. But the reverse is also true, DIII moving up to DII and then later DI.
05-30-2013 12:29 AM
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solohawks Offline
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Post: #74
RE: Elon to CAA?
Schools like Davidson and wake forest would be much different without their d1 athletics. Particularly Wake Forest, ACC membership is their lifeblood. Without that they are just another small southern private school
05-30-2013 06:58 AM
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bluesox Offline
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Post: #75
RE: Elon to CAA?
Wake forest is a lot different since they are in the acc + have football. I don't think davidson, wofford, or VMI student body profile would be any different if they went D3 though, i.e. see williams, wash and lee, and sewanee
(This post was last modified: 05-30-2013 08:40 AM by bluesox.)
05-30-2013 08:37 AM
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solohawks Offline
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Post: #76
RE: Elon to CAA?
(05-30-2013 08:37 AM)bluesox Wrote:  Wake forest is a lot different since they are in the acc + have football. I don't think davidson, wofford, or VMI student body profile would be any different if they went D3 though, i.e. see williams, wash and lee, and sewanee

But if Wake Forest had never been included in the ACC they would be no different than Davidson, Wofford, etc. Davidson and Co. want to be different than the other schools you listed and D1 athletics is one way to do that.
05-30-2013 03:02 PM
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ErkSaidIWasTrueBlue Offline
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Post: #77
RE: Elon to CAA?
(05-28-2013 03:36 PM)hapapp Wrote:  Remember VMI was a 70+ year member before they went to the Big South. A very unpopular move with the alumni.

Why would Wofford drop to D3? They have a very successful FCS program and their basketball team made several NCAA trips in recent years. Despite their small size they are able to compete.

This.
06-05-2013 11:16 PM
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GoApps70 Offline
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Post: #78
RE: Elon to CAA?
Some schools manage to get it done without regards to size. Wofford is one of those.
06-10-2013 10:09 PM
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DaBigBlue Offline
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Post: #79
RE: Elon to CAA?
(05-30-2013 06:58 AM)solohawks Wrote:  Schools like Davidson and wake forest would be much different without their d1 athletics. Particularly Wake Forest, ACC membership is their lifeblood. Without that they are just another small southern private school

Think how many people would know about Notre Dame if they didn't have football.
06-10-2013 10:45 PM
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