(05-16-2013 09:14 AM)Wolfman Wrote:  Woohoo! Another MSG thread!!!!

Seriously though, if it is done right, from a fans perspective it doesn't matter where it is held (within reason). The ACC should also be looking at airline and hotel partners to offer discounts, upgrades, transportation (not as big of a deal in NYC). How many people can or are willing to layout $6-$10k to go to NYC for a week?

They should also limit Syracuse to 1,000 fans at any one game.

LOL

What?

Why?

(05-15-2013 09:39 PM)CrazyPaco Wrote:  Off the top of my head, just throwing this out there as a potential compromise with tradition.

With the 15 team Big East, the tourney was set up with 4 teams getting double byes and spread over five days.

What if the ACC took the first two days with 9 teams and held them at Greensboro Tuesday and Wednesday, took a day off, and then the eight teams in the quarterfinals advanced to MSG for Friday, Saturday and the championship game on Sunday.

Too difficult of logistics? Perhaps, it would be hard for fans to travel from one to the other. Bad idea? Probably. Just an idea. Tell me why it would suck.

I like that one since it would allow for more people to watch the games live rather than have just the same people day after day. I also like the day off except I'd put it before the final for my example below for travel.

I still prefer a split tourney where the final is held at one of the two locations on a rotating basis or just "home" court for the top seed.

Ex. Duke is the top seed so everyone on that side of the bracket plays in Greensboro and the 2nd seed Syracuse plays their side of the bracket in MSG and if Duke meets Syracuse in the final they play in Greensboro if Syracuse plays 4 seed UNC then the final is held at MSG.

At worst Miami/FSU will go to NY for 3 days then to Greensboro for 2 days and be set for the NCAA tournament.

Of course this would work better if they had divisions in basketball.

(05-16-2013 09:01 AM)TexanMark Wrote:  

(05-16-2013 06:35 AM)Ragu Wrote:  

(05-15-2013 07:48 PM)XLance Wrote:  It would be OK to hold the tournament in MSG once every 6-8 years. Anything more often that that is just crazy talk.

It absolutely nuts for the major title games to be held out of North Carolina. Crazy talk

Ok we'll remember you supported this thought...so all sports tournaments need to be held in NC?

Yep this conference needs more Carolina and not less.

Who needs a city like NYC for basketsball when you had the great city of Greensboro

(05-16-2013 10:11 AM)cuseroc Wrote:  

(05-16-2013 09:14 AM)Wolfman Wrote:  Seriously though, if it is done right, from a fans perspective it doesn't matter where it is held (within reason). The ACC should also be looking at airline and hotel partners to offer discounts, upgrades, transportation (not as big of a deal in NYC). How many people can or are willing to layout $6-$10k to go to NYC for a week?

What?

ACC schools are farther away from MSG. If the ACC wants to keep attendance up they need to work on the travel cost and distribution of tickets.

(05-16-2013 10:11 AM)cuseroc Wrote:  

(05-16-2013 09:14 AM)Wolfman Wrote:  They should also limit Syracuse to 1,000 fans at any one game.

Why?

A subtle reference to the zeal that Syracuse fans have for MSG hosting the tournament.

I'd bump Syracuse to 2,000 fans if they wear Georgetown shirts (nothing negative either!).

(05-16-2013 02:25 PM)Wolfman Wrote:  

(05-16-2013 10:11 AM)cuseroc Wrote:  

(05-16-2013 09:14 AM)Wolfman Wrote:  Seriously though, if it is done right, from a fans perspective it doesn't matter where it is held (within reason). The ACC should also be looking at airline and hotel partners to offer discounts, upgrades, transportation (not as big of a deal in NYC). How many people can or are willing to layout $6-$10k to go to NYC for a week?

What?

ACC schools are farther away from MSG. If the ACC wants to keep attendance up they need to work on the travel cost and distribution of tickets.

(05-16-2013 10:11 AM)cuseroc Wrote:  

(05-16-2013 09:14 AM)Wolfman Wrote:  They should also limit Syracuse to 1,000 fans at any one game.

Why?

A subtle reference to the zeal that Syracuse fans have for MSG hosting the tournament.

I'd bump Syracuse to 2,000 fans if they wear Georgetown shirts (nothing negative either!).

Tickets allotted to each school generally go to the big donors first. They can easily afford the trip to NYC. Most have to travel to Charlotte anyway, so they are already paying for a trip.

Joe six pack fans don't generally get tourney tickets except via the secondary markets. Those that do are willing to make th trip and pay the costs.

(05-16-2013 10:47 PM)HtownOrange Wrote:  

(05-16-2013 02:25 PM)Wolfman Wrote:  

(05-16-2013 10:11 AM)cuseroc Wrote:  

(05-16-2013 09:14 AM)Wolfman Wrote:  Seriously though, if it is done right, from a fans perspective it doesn't matter where it is held (within reason). The ACC should also be looking at airline and hotel partners to offer discounts, upgrades, transportation (not as big of a deal in NYC). How many people can or are willing to layout $6-$10k to go to NYC for a week?

What?

ACC schools are farther away from MSG. If the ACC wants to keep attendance up they need to work on the travel cost and distribution of tickets.

(05-16-2013 10:11 AM)cuseroc Wrote:  

(05-16-2013 09:14 AM)Wolfman Wrote:  They should also limit Syracuse to 1,000 fans at any one game.

Why?

A subtle reference to the zeal that Syracuse fans have for MSG hosting the tournament.

I'd bump Syracuse to 2,000 fans if they wear Georgetown shirts (nothing negative either!).

Tickets allotted to each school generally go to the big donors first. They can easily afford the trip to NYC. Most have to travel to Charlotte anyway, so they are already paying for a trip.

Joe six pack fans don't generally get tourney tickets except via the secondary markets. Those that do are willing to make th trip and pay the costs.

Hotels in NY are more expensive than Charlotte. Most of the ACC can drive to NC too.

(05-16-2013 07:31 AM)XLance Wrote:  

(05-15-2013 11:39 PM)Cardinals Wrote:  

(05-15-2013 11:07 PM)tj_2009 Wrote:  I think ESPN would probably push for MSG and perhaps would provide more $$$ if the tournament was there. It might also be good for the ACC Network to get good publicity by being in the number 1 media market in the country New York City.

This was going to be my question. if the conference is lukewarm on the MSG idea, but ESPN is gung-ho, can we not use this as a bargaining chip to get more money for the basketball side of our TV contract? It certainly sounds like it's worth money to me.

I also agree with tj that an MSG tourney would be a great selling-point for the future ACC network in several media markets.

What you would gain in TV money, you would lose in fan/partner support, not to mention conference credibility.

MSG did not submit a bid to host the ACC tournament by the required (conference) deadline. If the conference would take MSG as a tournament location now, it would be a slap in the face to every venue that bid on the tournament by the ACC.

I guess it depends on how much money ESPN might pay for this. Plus they are the partner in the ACC Network so I think they have quite a bit of influence in this decision. I am not so sure the other schools do not have fans in the New York city area. I think Duke and North Carolina may have quite a few fans in NYC. I think the old Big East tournament was quite profitable for ESPN because they had prime time slots on Thursday, Friday and Saturday nights that they probably charged a lot for.

(05-16-2013 09:14 AM)Wolfman Wrote:  Woohoo! Another MSG thread!!!!

Seriously though, if it is done right, from a fans perspective it doesn't matter where it is held (within reason). The ACC should also be looking at airline and hotel partners to offer discounts, upgrades, transportation (not as big of a deal in NYC). How many people can or are willing to layout $6-$10k to go to NYC for a week?

They should also limit Syracuse to 1,000 fans at any one game.

Its not that expensive to stay in New Jersey. It just across the river for New York city and there are plenty of transportation options. Its not that dangerous if you know where to avoid. Not so sure you will be able to limit Syracuse to 1000 fans though.

(05-16-2013 10:12 AM)Ragu Wrote:  

(05-16-2013 09:01 AM)TexanMark Wrote:  

(05-16-2013 06:35 AM)Ragu Wrote:  

(05-15-2013 07:48 PM)XLance Wrote:  It would be OK to hold the tournament in MSG once every 6-8 years. Anything more often that that is just crazy talk.

It absolutely nuts for the major title games to be held out of North Carolina. Crazy talk

Ok we'll remember you supported this thought...so all sports tournaments need to be held in NC?

Yep this conference needs more Carolina and not less.

Who needs a city like NYC for basketsball when you had the great city of Greensboro

lol, I take it that you are not a big fan of North Carolina. I guess I have a lot to learn about the ACC. I noticed that there are quite a few fans on this board that are not big fans of North Carolina. Is it the state, the school North Carolina, or the 4 Norht Carolina schools or all of the above?

Pittsburgh and Louisville are far from New York and the fans still have a strong affinity for MSG so it's not like it's a Syracuse hometown bias. The atmosphere for the Big East tournament really was incredible and it was not just because of fanbases close by. Pitt, Louisville, Notre Dame, Georgetown etc. all brought large contingents of fans (though Syracuse does always have the most). Plus, the locals seem to really get into it as well. There's something about the buzz that made it seem like one of the sporting events of the year. The Georgetown/Syracuse game this year really was electric and I had no rooting interest.

That being said, I understand the frustration of the old members who want to continue holding it in NC. I could only imagine the anger if schools were added to the Big East and tried to get the league to move the game from New York. So I guess what I'm saying is I'd prefer for it to be in New York but if it stays in North Carolina permanently I'd completely understand and wouldn't be upset with the decision.

Maybe the new members should give the ACC tournament a chance as members before declaring that it can only be special in MSG.

(05-16-2013 11:02 PM)tj_2009 Wrote:  I guess it depends on how much money ESPN might pay for this. Plus they are the partner in the ACC Network so I think they have quite a bit of influence in this decision. I am not so sure the other schools do not have fans in the New York city area. I think Duke and North Carolina may have quite a few fans in NYC. I think the old Big East tournament was quite profitable for ESPN because they had prime time slots on Thursday, Friday and Saturday nights that they probably charged a lot for.

Dunno why the TV partner really cares as they have broadcast rights no matter where it is played.

I love how you guys just ignore the fact that the Big East has a contract with MSG through 2026 and that when given the opportunity neither MSG nor Barclays even submitted a bid for the ACC tournament.

MSG didn't give any indication that they are even interested in dropping the Big East just MONTHS after signing a long term deal. This is nothing more than ESPN spin. In the Big East the schools buy all the tickets and then sell them to their fan bases. MSG will get it's money and have zero reason to try and get out of it's contract. They will find themselves in court for breach of contract.

This is the ACC tournament in driving distance to most of the league. Are you telling me that they will now travel FARTHER?



Lot's of empty seats.



Turnstile numbers have been down for the ACC tournament.

http://www.indyweek.com/triangleoffense/...the-luster

Just a hunch...it would not surprise me if it is mutual interest with MSG/ACC...Let just say this, what is more attractive for MSG, UNC, Duke, Syracuse, Notre Dame & Louisville or Saint John's, Georgetown, Villanova, Marquette & Butler....remember they signed that deal when they thought they still had UConn & Louisville with the BIG EAST...

(05-17-2013 02:39 AM)NJRedMan Wrote:  I love how you guys just ignore the fact that the Big East has a contract with MSG through 2026 and that when given the opportunity neither MSG nor Barclays even submitted a bid for the ACC tournament.

MSG didn't give any indication that they are even interested in dropping the Big East just MONTHS after signing a long term deal. This is nothing more than ESPN spin. In the Big East the schools buy all the tickets and then sell them to their fan bases. MSG will get it's money and have zero reason to try and get out of it's contract. They will find themselves in court for breach of contract.

This is the ACC tournament in driving distance to most of the league. Are you telling me that they will now travel FARTHER?


Lot's of empty seats.


Turnstile numbers have been down for the ACC tournament.

http://www.indyweek.com/triangleoffense/...the-luster

LOL, that is very sad attendance. But things will be different once you have an infusion of Syracuse, Louisville, Pitt and ND. Those schools, along with the other large bb traveling fan bases like Duke, UNC and NC State etc.. will certainly help restore some excitement to the ACC Tourney.

That article, that you linked, zoning in on Acc Tourney attendance issues, could be the very reason that Acc leaders are now seriously considering NYC for their tourney. The Acc seems to be slowly adapting to the new reality for college sports and is looking for ways to get the utmost exposure and not get left behind. In many cases, that means abandoning some traditions. We have already seen it with the round robin play going away do to expansion. More will come.

But Redman, you should not discount this as not happening or that nothing is going to come of it. Too many Acc folks have commented on the negotiations for nothing to be happening. If the Acc would commit to having their tourney played at MSG annually for the next 8 or 10 years, MSG would have already signed the deal with the Acc.

If they do this I do hope for a "shared" arrangement with MSG/Greensboro. No greater stage then "The World's Most Famous Arena" but want to keep the tradition that is Greensboro. Maybe 3 years in MSG & 3 year in Greensboro.

(05-17-2013 02:39 AM)NJRedMan Wrote:  I love how you guys just ignore the fact that the Big East has a contract with MSG through 2026 and that when given the opportunity neither MSG nor Barclays even submitted a bid for the ACC tournament.

MSG didn't give any indication that they are even interested in dropping the Big East just MONTHS after signing a long term deal. This is nothing more than ESPN spin. In the Big East the schools buy all the tickets and then sell them to their fan bases. MSG will get it's money and have zero reason to try and get out of it's contract. They will find themselves in court for breach of contract.

This is the ACC tournament in driving distance to most of the league. Are you telling me that they will now travel FARTHER?



Lot's of empty seats.



Turnstile numbers have been down for the ACC tournament.

http://www.indyweek.com/triangleoffense/...the-luster

This is highly misleading. That picture is one of those afternoon sessions on Thursday when people are still at work. Every tourney has those on the first day including the Big East.

for those who make a argument about attendance need to do a little research before you open your mouth, first & foremost the ACC DOES NOT SELL TICKETS TO THE GENERAL PUBLIC & has not since 1964. second these tickets are already sold but the fans that own them choose not to watch mediocre teams play in the early rounds. this will likely change with the 4 new teams that have better bball programs & travel well

(05-16-2013 11:13 PM)tj_2009 Wrote:  

(05-16-2013 10:12 AM)Ragu Wrote:  

(05-16-2013 09:01 AM)TexanMark Wrote:  

(05-16-2013 06:35 AM)Ragu Wrote:  

(05-15-2013 07:48 PM)XLance Wrote:  It would be OK to hold the tournament in MSG once every 6-8 years. Anything more often that that is just crazy talk.

It absolutely nuts for the major title games to be held out of North Carolina. Crazy talk

Ok we'll remember you supported this thought...so all sports tournaments need to be held in NC?

Yep this conference needs more Carolina and not less.

Who needs a city like NYC for basketsball when you had the great city of Greensboro

lol, I take it that you are not a big fan of North Carolina. I guess I have a lot to learn about the ACC. I noticed that there are quite a few fans on this board that are not big fans of North Carolina. Is it the state, the school North Carolina, or the 4 Norht Carolina schools or all of the above?

The state is fine. I have family in NC. Nothing special about it and too rural in a lot of areas and I wouldn't ever live there but nothing against the state.

(05-16-2013 10:49 PM)4x4hokies Wrote:  

(05-16-2013 10:47 PM)HtownOrange Wrote:  

(05-16-2013 02:25 PM)Wolfman Wrote:  

(05-16-2013 10:11 AM)cuseroc Wrote:  

(05-16-2013 09:14 AM)Wolfman Wrote:  Seriously though, if it is done right, from a fans perspective it doesn't matter where it is held (within reason). The ACC should also be looking at airline and hotel partners to offer discounts, upgrades, transportation (not as big of a deal in NYC). How many people can or are willing to layout $6-$10k to go to NYC for a week?

What?

ACC schools are farther away from MSG. If the ACC wants to keep attendance up they need to work on the travel cost and distribution of tickets.

(05-16-2013 10:11 AM)cuseroc Wrote:  

(05-16-2013 09:14 AM)Wolfman Wrote:  They should also limit Syracuse to 1,000 fans at any one game.

Why?

A subtle reference to the zeal that Syracuse fans have for MSG hosting the tournament.

I'd bump Syracuse to 2,000 fans if they wear Georgetown shirts (nothing negative either!).

Tickets allotted to each school generally go to the big donors first. They can easily afford the trip to NYC. Most have to travel to Charlotte anyway, so they are already paying for a trip.

Joe six pack fans don't generally get tourney tickets except via the secondary markets. Those that do are willing to make th trip and pay the costs.

Hotels in NY are more expensive than Charlotte. Most of the ACC can drive to NC too.

HM, the people who get first shot at the tickets can afford to attend a tourney anywhere in the world. They are the big donors. The rest of us watch it on TV.

As for driving distances, most of the donors don't spend a lot of time on long drives (golf courses excepted), they fly everywhere. Besides, most of the conference must still fly into Charlotte, just as they would to NYC.

I don't care where the ACC tourney is, I'm just saying that NYC has far more benefits. Also, once the ACC fans experience NYC, there will likely be a transition to "Charlotte, why hold the tournament there?" mentality.

PRO NYC:
It's New York City
Great hotels, moderate hotels
Great night life
Great shopping (for the wives or girl friends)
Great entertainment
Media capital of the world
TV partner wants it
Many ACC schools want it (including Duke and other long time ACC schools, not just the new teams)
Great food (including Barbecue)
Driving distance to several schools
Three major airports for easy transportation
World class museums of all sorts (intellectual offerings)
Many world class universities if you want to visit them
Great history in and around the city itself

PRO CHARLOTTE:
Tradition (NYC can be a great tradition)
Cheap (Not really applicable since the tickets generally go to big money people)
Carolina schools can drive to it (Neutralized by the facts that several schools can drive to NYC and that most fans will fly if it is more than a few hours drive)
Barbecue (NYC has it, too, and much, much more, in all styles, ranges, etc.)

This is my opinion, nothing more.