(04-24-2013 10:04 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(04-24-2013 10:01 AM)DonnyMost Wrote:  You didn't get "screwed". There is no conspiracy against you.

Fair point. So how about we say that UConn, USF, and Cincy were the biggest losers in realignment, that we lost the most relative to what we had before?

Pretty much on point. It sucks, and I feel you.

If you want to see a case study of "screwed", look at TCU/UH/Rice/SMU vis-a-vis the SWC breakup and formation of the Big 12.

(04-24-2013 10:01 AM)DonnyMost Wrote:  You didn't get "screwed". There is no conspiracy against you.

BTW, to a certain extend there is a ACC political "conspiracy" of sorts against UCONN and USF.

USF or UCF for that matter, will never get have a chance to join the ACC as long as FSU and UM are members. Even if our schools win a national championship and become AAU schools. For as much as geography helps USF from a recruiting perspective geography kills us b/c the most logical conference for us is blocked off politically.

Similarly, while Boston College doesn't carry the same clout as an FSU it did successfully dampen and ultimately block consideration of UCONN.

At the end of the day this is futile thread. Unless the Big 12 is given the financial incentive to increase membership there is not going to be any additional realignment.

I think the irony that is lost is that John Swofford has the distinction of being responsible for kicking off expansion (2003) and effectively eliminating the threat with his ability to get all ACC schools to sign a grant of rights. His name is not often discussed as a power player like the commissioners of the SEC or B1G but in terms of impact...Swofford has certainly established a strong legacy in college football. Not for the best IMO....but disruptive nonetheless.

(04-24-2013 09:32 AM)BullsFanInTX Wrote:  I felt the same way as the OP. But, what's done is done. Nothing can be done about it now, except what you can control. The only thing you can do is win, win big, and win often and hope you get a chair in the next shakeup. And there will be another shakeup. There always is and always will be. I expect USF to skyrocket under Coach Willie T. Maybe I am optimistic, maybe not. Just win or you will get passed by.

Winning from 2008-now didn't seem to matter in this round of realignment. Why would it be based on performance next time around?

I love this thread. The OP should try to be an SMU or Houston fan, being kicked out of the Big 16 merger because of a lack of political power. After working hard to get back (and SMU effectively being vanquished again by the schools that invited us to the WAC), we finally get an offer from an AQ conference called the Big East.

But before we even become full members of the Big East, the WAC is decimated and dies and the other AQ conferences no longer need the Big East's vote to make their vote block a majority in FBS. The Big East loses their AQ.

No problem, though, because both schools are investing heavily in basketball and the Big East will be a premier basketball conference. Oh, wait, the seven basketball schools use their voting power to invite Tulane, whom they only planned to use as an excuse for the C7 to leave and form their own conference.

So now SMU and Houston are essentially back where we started. Meanwhile, both schools' traditional rivals are making untold riches and have a permanent recruiting advantage over us.

We don't deserve this. SMU has won a national title (or 4 depending on how you want to claim them), and Houston has done some great stuff both in football and hoops.

All this being said, the Cincy fan complaining = LOLOLOLOLOL. You have no idea what it could be like.

How about we take these lemons and make lemonade?

(04-24-2013 09:17 AM)BearcatMan Wrote:  

(04-24-2013 09:07 AM)panicstricken Wrote:  UC has a losing record to Miami but lets not worry about petty little details about that.

My only addition to this thread, because I hate talking about things that cannot be changed such as conference realignment, so I tend to skim by it most times. Seeing this is laughable however. Historical records are useless in my eyes, its about what you've seen, not what happened in the 1910's-1930's. Since I've been alive, UC has been cruising in their games against Miami with the exception of the Roethlisberger years. Just stop with the historical records already, they don't matter to people who live in the here and now...just people who live in the past.

Isn't the last 5 years now historical records? Anyway, things always revert to the mean eventually and Miami will once again dominate wanna-be UC especially with your huge debt levels and expenses all on a $2 million a year revenue stream. That doesn't even pay for your coach's salary. UC will realize too late they are just another also-ran in the Group of 5 and will get in financial problems trying to keep up with the Joneses.

Miami will dominate UC again, that I'm sure of. There have been multi-year streaks where UC had success against Miami, but Miami will always come back and own UC because in the end thats what Miami does.

Does your $2 million a year TV deal pay for the costs of all the flowers, chocolates, and cards you send the ACC? LOL, desperate and pathetic.

.

Those saying that Houston/SMU got over it after having the same thing happen.... you guys realize that was almost 20 years ago compared to us getting this news 2 days ago? Ya, I'm guessing we'll be over it a little better in 17 years.

I'm also guessing Houston/SMU fan bases weren't thrilled the week they were booted.

(04-24-2013 10:19 AM)CalallenStang Wrote:  I love this thread. The OP should try to be an SMU or Houston fan, being kicked out of the Big 16 merger because of a lack of political power. After working hard to get back (and SMU effectively being vanquished again by the schools that invited us to the WAC), we finally get an offer from an AQ conference called the Big East.

But before we even become full members of the Big East, the WAC is decimated and dies and the other AQ conferences no longer need the Big East's vote to make their vote block a majority in FBS. The Big East loses their AQ.

No problem, though, because both schools are investing heavily in basketball and the Big East will be a premier basketball conference. Oh, wait, the seven basketball schools use their voting power to invite Tulane, whom they only planned to use as an excuse for the C7 to leave and form their own conference.

So now SMU and Houston are essentially back where we started. Meanwhile, both schools' traditional rivals are making untold riches and have a permanent recruiting advantage over us.

We don't deserve this. SMU has won a national title (or 4 depending on how you want to claim them), and Houston has done some great stuff both in football and hoops.

All this being said, the Cincy fan complaining = LOLOLOLOLOL. You have no idea what it could be like.

How about we take these lemons and make lemonade?

SMU and Houston can appreciate what USF, UC and UCONN are going through.

Life is not fair....and the only thing we can do is work hard to make the new conference prosper. However, let's not delude ourselves....being the 6th best conference has a completely different meaning in the new world order. Completely different.

(04-24-2013 09:40 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(04-24-2013 08:51 AM)Frank the Tank Wrote:  

(04-24-2013 08:09 AM)Wilkie01 Wrote:  You know what fellers'? Winning and good management will cure all your problems. So win and up grade your facilities. The only variable that is hard to control is your fan support, which requires constant attention.
"So just win Baby!"

To be fair, both Cincinnati and UConn *did* win. Cincinnati made it to 2 BCS bowls, would have made the College Football Playoff in 2009 had it existed then, and shared 2 other conference titles even after Brian Kelly left for Notre Dame. UConn made it to a BCS bowl and won 3 national championships in basketball in the BCS era. That's why it's more than justifiable that it's beyond frustrating for them. They *did* win at the highest level yet were still passed over by some schools with fewer recent accomplishments because of factors like location and perceived tradition.

...........

They did everything that people asked them to do (invest in football, build new facilities and just win), yet they're worse off today than they were a year ago.

Using this logic, Boise deserves to be the most frustrated school of all, because they managed to win more than UConn or Cincy, and they did it without the benefit of being in an AQ conference, and yet they still stuck on the outside of the P5 looking in.

But I don't buy the logic because I don't think there was any promise made by the BCS, either implicit or explicit, that if you invest, build facilities, and win, that this secures your place at the AQ table. AQ has always been about brand image and tradition. UConn and Cincy were only AQ because back in 1991 Miami joined the Big East, and Miami was so powerful a brand that it was impossible to exclude any conference they were in from AQ status.

Heck, when Miami left in 2003, UConn even sued them (or threatened to sue?) on the grounds that they invested in football with the expectation that Miami would carry them on their backs to big media dollars! UConn and Cincy inherited AQ from Miami.

That's why it is wrong to say UConn and Cincy got screwed worse than USF. We all had the same thing happen to us, and for the same reason.

I agree that a lot of being at the AQ level has been about brand image and tradition. No doubt about that. I've written that many times. That being said, it's also not as if though UConn and Cincinnati are out in a geographic wilderness like Boise State, either. They also don't have the perceived stigma (whether it's fair or not) of being "directional schools", which is something that USF was going to have to contend with. There was an expectation that schools like Louisville and Cincinnati were on the precipice of AQ status back in 2003, but USF definitely was a big surprise pick by the Big East (so the perception is that they got a gift of AQ status). UConn is a flagship school located in between NYC and Boston, while Cincinnati is in a major market and surrounded by a bounty of football recruits (at least for a Northern state). Even by the off-the-field metrics of conference realignment, they were offering quite a bit (whereas Boise State's appeal is almost solely based on on-the-field performance over the past 10 years).

Now, that doesn't mean that I don't understand why other Big East schools moved up over them. Louisville and West Virginia had more loyal fan bases, Pitt and Syracuse had more tradition, and Rutgers had the ultimate location. All of that makes sense when performing a comparison. However, I'm just saying that I understand why they are particularly angry at their situation.

(04-24-2013 10:22 AM)Miami (Oh) Yeah ! Wrote:  

(04-24-2013 09:17 AM)BearcatMan Wrote:  

(04-24-2013 09:07 AM)panicstricken Wrote:  UC has a losing record to Miami but lets not worry about petty little details about that.

My only addition to this thread, because I hate talking about things that cannot be changed such as conference realignment, so I tend to skim by it most times. Seeing this is laughable however. Historical records are useless in my eyes, its about what you've seen, not what happened in the 1910's-1930's. Since I've been alive, UC has been cruising in their games against Miami with the exception of the Roethlisberger years. Just stop with the historical records already, they don't matter to people who live in the here and now...just people who live in the past.

Isn't the last 5 years now historical records? Anyway, things always revert to the mean eventually and Miami will once again dominate wanna-be UC especially with your huge debt levels and expenses all on a $2 million a year revenue stream. That doesn't even pay for your coach's salary. UC will realize too late they are just another also-ran in the Group of 5 and will get in financial problems trying to keep up with the Joneses.

Miami will dominate UC again, that I'm sure of. There have been multi-year streaks where UC had success against Miami, but Miami will always come back and own UC because in the end thats what Miami does.

Does your $2 million a year TV deal pay for the costs of all the flowers, chocolates, and cards you send the ACC? LOL, desperate and pathetic.

.

Im pretty sure almost all of Miami's great athletes have been not to be racist but white. That doesn't seem to work anymore buddy. Miami is in the MAC. Maybe you will dominate OU and Akron again but your under OSU UC Xavier Dayton and Toledo just alone in Ohio buddy. Long way to catch back up to UC who is 2nd in Ohio.

(04-24-2013 09:07 AM)panicstricken Wrote:  UC has a losing record to Miami but lets not worry about petty little details about that.

Your post has nothing to do with the Miami troll post, or my reply to him.
Nice try to change the topic though. Since Dantonio was at UC, UC is
8-1 vs. Miami, average score UC 38 Miami 15.

Go back to the 1940's or whatever if that makes you feel better.

(04-24-2013 10:22 AM)Miami (Oh) Yeah ! Wrote:  Isn't the last 5 years now historical records? Anyway, things always revert to the mean eventually and Miami will once again dominate wanna-be UC especially with your huge debt levels and expenses all on a $2 million a year revenue stream. That doesn't even pay for your coach's salary. UC will realize too late they are just another also-ran in the Group of 5 and will get in financial problems trying to keep up with the Joneses.

Miami will dominate UC again, that I'm sure of. There have been multi-year streaks where UC had success against Miami, but Miami will always come back and own UC because in the end thats what Miami does.

We already know we have financial problems - that hasn't stopped this -

2006 - UC 24-10
2007 UC 47-10
2008 UC 45-20
2009 UC 37-13
2010 UC 45-3
2011 UC 27-0
2012 UC 52-14

(04-24-2013 10:22 AM)Miami (Oh) Yeah ! Wrote:  

(04-24-2013 09:17 AM)BearcatMan Wrote:  

(04-24-2013 09:07 AM)panicstricken Wrote:  UC has a losing record to Miami but lets not worry about petty little details about that.

My only addition to this thread, because I hate talking about things that cannot be changed such as conference realignment, so I tend to skim by it most times. Seeing this is laughable however. Historical records are useless in my eyes, its about what you've seen, not what happened in the 1910's-1930's. Since I've been alive, UC has been cruising in their games against Miami with the exception of the Roethlisberger years. Just stop with the historical records already, they don't matter to people who live in the here and now...just people who live in the past.

Isn't the last 5 years now historical records? Anyway, things always revert to the mean eventually and Miami will once again dominate wanna-be UC especially with your huge debt levels and expenses all on a $2 million a year revenue stream. That doesn't even pay for your coach's salary. UC will realize too late they are just another also-ran in the Group of 5 and will get in financial problems trying to keep up with the Joneses.

Miami will dominate UC again, that I'm sure of. There have been multi-year streaks where UC had success against Miami, but Miami will always come back and own UC because in the end thats what Miami does.

Does your $2 million a year TV deal pay for the costs of all the flowers, chocolates, and cards you send the ACC? LOL, desperate and pathetic.

.

You want to see pathetic, Miami of Ohio basketball attendance,
Average attendance this season was 1,493 fans, with some games
under 1,000 fans. Can it get any worse? Will Miami ever make it to
the ncaa tourney. UC will continue to dominate Miami in basketball
and football, and you know it. Miami is nothing.

(04-24-2013 10:41 AM)bearcatfan Wrote:  

(04-24-2013 10:22 AM)Miami (Oh) Yeah ! Wrote:  Isn't the last 5 years now historical records? Anyway, things always revert to the mean eventually and Miami will once again dominate wanna-be UC especially with your huge debt levels and expenses all on a $2 million a year revenue stream. That doesn't even pay for your coach's salary. UC will realize too late they are just another also-ran in the Group of 5 and will get in financial problems trying to keep up with the Joneses.

Miami will dominate UC again, that I'm sure of. There have been multi-year streaks where UC had success against Miami, but Miami will always come back and own UC because in the end thats what Miami does.

We already know we have financial problems - that hasn't stopped this -

2006 - UC 24-10
2007 UC 47-10
2008 UC 45-20
2009 UC 37-13
2010 UC 45-3
2011 UC 27-0

2010, it was 45-3 at halftime and UC played their bench the entire second
half. I think Miami won the MAC that year

(04-24-2013 10:41 AM)bearcatfan Wrote:  

(04-24-2013 10:22 AM)Miami (Oh) Yeah ! Wrote:  Isn't the last 5 years now historical records? Anyway, things always revert to the mean eventually and Miami will once again dominate wanna-be UC especially with your huge debt levels and expenses all on a $2 million a year revenue stream. That doesn't even pay for your coach's salary. UC will realize too late they are just another also-ran in the Group of 5 and will get in financial problems trying to keep up with the Joneses.

Miami will dominate UC again, that I'm sure of. There have been multi-year streaks where UC had success against Miami, but Miami will always come back and own UC because in the end thats what Miami does.

We already know we have financial problems - that hasn't stopped this -

2006 - UC 24-10
2007 UC 47-10
2008 UC 45-20
2009 UC 37-13
2010 UC 45-3
2011 UC 27-0

2012 UC 52-14
fify

(04-24-2013 10:18 AM)CyberBull Wrote:  

(04-24-2013 10:01 AM)DonnyMost Wrote:  You didn't get "screwed". There is no conspiracy against you.

BTW, to a certain extend there is a ACC political "conspiracy" of sorts against UCONN and USF.

USF or UCF for that matter, will never get have a chance to join the ACC as long as FSU and UM are members. Even if our schools win a national championship and become AAU schools. For as much as geography helps USF from a recruiting perspective geography kills us b/c the most logical conference for us is blocked off politically.

Similarly, while Boston College doesn't carry the same clout as an FSU it did successfully dampen and ultimately block consideration of UCONN.

At the end of the day this is futile thread. Unless the Big 12 is given the financial incentive to increase membership there is not going to be any additional realignment.

I think the irony that is lost is that John Swofford has the distinction of being responsible for kicking off expansion (2003) and effectively eliminating the threat with his ability to get all ACC schools to sign a grant of rights. His name is not often discussed as a power player like the commissioners of the SEC or B1G but in terms of impact...Swofford has certainly established a strong legacy in college football. Not for the best IMO....but disruptive nonetheless.

LOL...a political conspiracy now?

So ECU has been equally as screwed as USF and UConn then, by your own criteria?

I don't think anyone is saying that Cincy/UConn/USF fans don't have a right to be upset. However it gets really old to constantly read how much we all suck and how they deserve so much better. How it's not fair and *some* of those fans don't even care about their program anymore because it's beneath them.

Then it never fails...the person gets trolled by the fans of the rest of the teams and someone comes in and tells us we need to take it easy on these poor guys. Take it easy on the guys trashing our programs, essentially...lol.

And to be fair, it's not all fans at all. There really aren't many USF fans at all (if any) doing the whole "omg you guys suck soooo bad" garbage, though they're still upset and disappointed. It is possible to be angry about your situation without being a douche to everyone else, believe it or not.

(04-24-2013 10:58 AM)ECPirate87 Wrote:  I don't think anyone is saying that Cincy/UConn/USF fans don't have a right to be upset. However it gets really old to constantly read how much we all suck and how they deserve so much better. How it's not fair and *some* of those fans don't even care about their program anymore because it's beneath them.

Then it never fails...the person gets trolled by the fans of the rest of the teams and someone comes in and tells us we need to take it easy on these poor guys. Take it easy on the guys trashing our programs, essentially...lol.

And to be fair, it's not all fans at all. There really aren't many USF fans at all (if any) doing the whole "omg you guys suck soooo bad" garbage, though they're still upset and disappointed. It is possible to be angry about your situation without being a douche to everyone else, believe it or not.

It does get old. Truth be told the football being played in the conference
will be solid. There are many good teams and programs, which is why I go to the Stadium every other Saturday.

Let's be real for a moment: If this conference had been given a TV deal for 12M/school each year you would NOT hear anyone crying.

ESPN bought a lot of potential in the AAC and paid virtually nothing for it. The basketball in this conference is worth the whole lump sum of the deal BY ITSELF. UConn, Memphis, Cincy, and Temple make for great TV in basketball.

poor poor cincy

the rest of us paid to join an AQ conference called the big east and ended up in a non-aq with the three runts no one else wanted.

Even as bad as it is for Cincinnati. With the exit fees and tournament credits the Bearcats will be bringing in about 1 million to 2 million more for the next five years. After that it will depend on our next TV deal or increase in the playoff revenue for every conference.

While USF, Cincinnati, and UConn lost the most. Everybody still is winning in college sports.