A good movie to see while the Owls are off for a few days.

My only complaint was with Harrison Ford's portrayal of Branch Rickey.

[Edit: to change the title to reflect evolution of thread]

Quote:My only complaint was with Harrison Ford's portrayal of Branch Rickey.

In what way? (Hopefully you can answer this without any spoilers - been meaning to see it)

(04-23-2013 02:39 PM)Antarius Wrote:  

Quote:My only complaint was with Harrison Ford's portrayal of Branch Rickey.

In what way? (Hopefully you can answer this without any spoilers - been meaning to see it)

He "hams" it up playing Branch Rickey. Maybe it's a good portrayal of Rickey...I have no idea what he sounded like or how he acted, but HF is obviously "acting." Doesn't disappear into his character.

It reflected some of what I knew about Branch Rickey
1. Very religious
2. Very interested in the bottom line (money)
3. a great innovator in baseball and one of its best thinkers

(04-23-2013 02:57 PM)grol Wrote:  

(04-23-2013 02:39 PM)Antarius Wrote:  

Quote:My only complaint was with Harrison Ford's portrayal of Branch Rickey.

In what way? (Hopefully you can answer this without any spoilers - been meaning to see it)

He "hams" it up playing Branch Rickey. Maybe it's a good portrayal of Rickey...I have no idea what he sounded like or how he acted, but HF is obviously "acting." Doesn't disappear into his character.

One of the credits mentioned an actor playing Eddie Dyer who was the Cardinal manager. I do not remember what happened to involve the Cardinal manager. Dyer played for Rice in the early 1920s.

(04-23-2013 02:34 PM)grol Wrote:  A good movie to see while the Owls are off for a few days.

My only complaint was with Harrison Ford's portrayal of Branch Rickey.

(04-23-2013 02:34 PM)grol Wrote:  A good movie to see while the Owls are off for a few days.

My only complaint was with Harrison Ford's portrayal of Branch Rickey.

I look forward to seeing it.

There is a very high standard to meet. "Soul of the Game" produced by HBO was superb.

(04-23-2013 06:03 PM)75src Wrote:  One of the credits mentioned an actor playing Eddie Dyer who was the Cardinal manager. I do not remember what happened to involve the Cardinal manager. Dyer played for Rice in the early 1920s.

The movie shows the story about a possible Cardinals strike to protest Jackie's playing. Dyer was the Cards' manager in the late 40's.

From what I know of Rickey, Ford did a good job. While undoubtedly brilliant, Rickey was known to be quite eccentric and tight with a buck.

(04-23-2013 09:50 PM)NolaOwl Wrote:  

(04-23-2013 06:03 PM)75src Wrote:  One of the credits mentioned an actor playing Eddie Dyer who was the Cardinal manager. I do not remember what happened to involve the Cardinal manager. Dyer played for Rice in the early 1920s.

The movie shows the story about a possible Cardinals strike to protest Jackie's playing. Dyer was the Cards' manager in the late 40's.

From what I know of Rickey, Ford did a good job. While undoubtedly brilliant, Rickey was known to be quite eccentric and tight with a buck.

Robinson and the Cardinals:
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB117529030001654993.html

I haven't seen 42. The 'Jackie Robinson Story' is one of my favorite movies.

George Will has said one can argue that Jackie Robinson is second only to MLK as a civil rights icon.

(04-24-2013 07:56 AM)JSA Wrote:  

(04-23-2013 09:50 PM)NolaOwl Wrote:  

(04-23-2013 06:03 PM)75src Wrote:  One of the credits mentioned an actor playing Eddie Dyer who was the Cardinal manager. I do not remember what happened to involve the Cardinal manager. Dyer played for Rice in the early 1920s.

The movie shows the story about a possible Cardinals strike to protest Jackie's playing. Dyer was the Cards' manager in the late 40's.

From what I know of Rickey, Ford did a good job. While undoubtedly brilliant, Rickey was known to be quite eccentric and tight with a buck.

Robinson and the Cardinals:
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB117529030001654993.html

I haven't seen 42. The 'Jackie Robinson Story' is one of my favorite movies.

George Will has said one can argue that Jackie Robinson is second only to MLK as a civil rights icon.

MLK himself reversed the order.

(04-24-2013 11:13 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  George Will has said one can argue that Jackie Robinson is second only to MLK as a civil rights icon.

MLK himself reversed the order.
[/quote]

I see them as playing different roles.

The quest for equality is a long journey with milestones.

Integration of baseball--along with integration of the armed forces--was a critical milestone. Jackie Robinson was a singular heroic figure. I don't think there is an equivalent "first black private to serve in same company as a white private" because there were likely thousands or tens of thousands of them.

Rosa Parks and Carl Brashear (Men of Honor) are other singularly heroic figures.

Martin Luther King was an activist or moral authority who propelled the journey along and gave it ethical and intellectual structure. To my mind, he belongs on a list with Frederick Douglas, Harriet Beecher Stowe, Thurgood Marshall, and countless others.

There was a synergy between heroes and activists, but I don't think they are directly comparable.

btw, Barack Obama, IMHO, belongs on the Jackie Robinson list, not the MLK list.

Interesting points.
Someone who I think also deserves credit - Happy Chandler.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oeInu9bcA6E

(04-24-2013 02:23 PM)JSA Wrote:  Interesting points.
Someone who I think also deserves credit - Happy Chandler.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oeInu9bcA6E

As a white southerner, Chandler is probably the guy I identify with most, and I've always hoped that if put in his shoes I would have made the same decision. I know my father would have, and so would I.

A couple of other people that I think get lost in the shuffle.

Walter O'Malley - Rickey was the front man, and liked the limelight and attention. But O'Malley was the lawyer who crossed a lot of the T's and dotted a lot of the I's behind the scenes to make it happen. He did a lot more of the heavy lifting than he gets credit for. I have not yet seen the movie, this has been a bad week for me, how is he treated in it--if at all? He didn't have Rickey's craving for the limelight, and he got pretty vilified by the New York media for moving the Dodgers to LA, so he never got much credit. I thought it was incredible that it took so long for a man who pioneered probably the two greatest developments in baseball in the middle of the 20th century--integration and nationwide expansion--to get to the Hall of Fame. But the prejudices of the New York writers died hard.

Larry Doby--Bill Veeck was always insistent that Doby didn't get enough credit for being the first in the American League, in midsummer after Robinson in April. And the AL went to a few places that were maybe more racist than anywhere in the NL. I have thought it might be a good thing with the move to the AL for the Astros to retire Doby's number--14 when he broke in and for most of his career. At worst, it might be a way to recover at least a minimum of PR goodwill from what has overall been a PR problem.

(04-24-2013 03:46 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  [quote='JSA' pid='9265522' dateline='1366831403']

Walter O'Malley - Rickey was the front man, and liked the limelight and attention. But O'Malley was the lawyer who crossed a lot of the T's and dotted a lot of the I's behind the scenes to make it happen. He did a lot more of the heavy lifting than he gets credit for. I have not yet seen the movie, this has been a bad week for me, how is he treated in it--if at all? He didn't have Rickey's craving for the limelight, and he got pretty vilified by the New York media for moving the Dodgers to LA, so he never got much credit. I thought it was incredible that it took so long for a man who pioneered probably the two greatest developments in baseball in the middle of the 20th century--integration and nationwide expansion--to get to the Hall of Fame. But the prejudices of the New York writers died hard.

Not too many folks have a good memory of O"'Malley. He is hated in New York, especially in Brooklyn. He and Rickey parted ways quite nastily. He often referred to Robinson as "Rickey's prima donna." And of course he played a role in the Dodgers attempt to trade Jackie to the Giants which led to his retirement.

The Cleveland Indians have already retired number 14 for Doby. i think it is rather too much to have numbers retired by teams that someone never played for because that cuts down on the numbers available for other players. Doby and Robinson had already retired by the time the Astros (Colt 45s) were established in 1962. Doby is in the Baseball Hall of Fame.

(04-24-2013 03:46 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  

(04-24-2013 02:23 PM)JSA Wrote:  Interesting points.
Someone who I think also deserves credit - Happy Chandler.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oeInu9bcA6E

As a white southerner, Chandler is probably the guy I identify with most, and I've always hoped that if put in his shoes I would have made the same decision. I know my father would have, and so would I.

A couple of other people that I think get lost in the shuffle.

Walter O'Malley - Rickey was the front man, and liked the limelight and attention. But O'Malley was the lawyer who crossed a lot of the T's and dotted a lot of the I's behind the scenes to make it happen. He did a lot more of the heavy lifting than he gets credit for. I have not yet seen the movie, this has been a bad week for me, how is he treated in it--if at all? He didn't have Rickey's craving for the limelight, and he got pretty vilified by the New York media for moving the Dodgers to LA, so he never got much credit. I thought it was incredible that it took so long for a man who pioneered probably the two greatest developments in baseball in the middle of the 20th century--integration and nationwide expansion--to get to the Hall of Fame. But the prejudices of the New York writers died hard.

Larry Doby--Bill Veeck was always insistent that Doby didn't get enough credit for being the first in the American League, in midsummer after Robinson in April. And the AL went to a few places that were maybe more racist than anywhere in the NL. I have thought it might be a good thing with the move to the AL for the Astros to retire Doby's number--14 when he broke in and for most of his career. At worst, it might be a way to recover at least a minimum of PR goodwill from what has overall been a PR problem.

Rickey went off to Pittsburgh where he obtained many of the players that would later win the 1960 World Series.

Some of the blame for the Dodger move should be placed upon Robert Moses who blocked the Dodgers from getting a new stadium site in Brooklyn (near where the Nets are now) because he wanted them to go to the Queens Flushing Meadows site where the Mets where later located.

(04-24-2013 05:20 PM)NolaOwl Wrote:  

(04-24-2013 03:46 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  [quote='JSA' pid='9265522' dateline='1366831403']

Walter O'Malley - Rickey was the front man, and liked the limelight and attention. But O'Malley was the lawyer who crossed a lot of the T's and dotted a lot of the I's behind the scenes to make it happen. He did a lot more of the heavy lifting than he gets credit for. I have not yet seen the movie, this has been a bad week for me, how is he treated in it--if at all? He didn't have Rickey's craving for the limelight, and he got pretty vilified by the New York media for moving the Dodgers to LA, so he never got much credit. I thought it was incredible that it took so long for a man who pioneered probably the two greatest developments in baseball in the middle of the 20th century--integration and nationwide expansion--to get to the Hall of Fame. But the prejudices of the New York writers died hard.

Not too many folks have a good memory of O"'Malley. He is hated in New York, especially in Brooklyn. He and Rickey parted ways quite nastily. He often referred to Robinson as "Rickey's prima donna." And of course he played a role in the Dodgers attempt to trade Jackie to the Giants which led to his retirement.

(04-25-2013 02:54 PM)75src Wrote:  The Cleveland Indians have already retired number 14 for Doby. i think it is rather too much to have numbers retired by teams that someone never played for because that cuts down on the numbers available for other players. Doby and Robinson had already retired by the time the Astros (Colt 45s) were established in 1962. Doby is in the Baseball Hall of Fame.

I'm just trying to think of something that the Astros could do to offest all the negative PR that they've gotten from the move to the AL, and that was one thing that came to mind. I actually think it might be something that the AL could look at doing as a league.

The best thing they can do is improve the product on the field with their rebuilding process. I enjoyed going to see them beat Seattle 10-3 yesterday afternoon. I understand that McLane left the minors starved for talent so the rebuilding is going to take several years. I like the NL better because of the tradition of seeing certain teams over the years. Houston had a NL team since 1962 and a Cardinal farm team before that starting in 1921 so the Houston tradition had been NL for almost a century. Since you are a Cardinal fan, I will mention a Colt 45 game fifty years where the loudest applause was for Stan the Man in his final year. I prefer not to have the DH but I still get about 95% of the enjoyment going to a game with it. I am not going to stay from Rice or AL games because they have the DL.

The American Association of Attorney-CPAs is offering a chance to go to Fenway For Red Sox against Padres on June 3 so I hope to go there again. I had seen one game at Fenway in 1975. Last year, I went to Seattle and saw the Red Sox against the Mariners. The year before I saw games in Baltimore and D.C.

(04-25-2013 03:56 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  

(04-25-2013 02:54 PM)75src Wrote:  The Cleveland Indians have already retired number 14 for Doby. i think it is rather too much to have numbers retired by teams that someone never played for because that cuts down on the numbers available for other players. Doby and Robinson had already retired by the time the Astros (Colt 45s) were established in 1962. Doby is in the Baseball Hall of Fame.

I'm just trying to think of something that the Astros could do to offest all the negative PR that they've gotten from the move to the AL, and that was one thing that came to mind. I actually think it might be something that the AL could look at doing as a league.

(04-25-2013 09:11 PM)75src Wrote:  The best thing they can do is improve the product on the field with their rebuilding process. I enjoyed going to see them beat Seattle 10-3 yesterday afternoon. I understand that McLane left the minors starved for talent so the rebuilding is going to take several years. I like the NL better because of the tradition of seeing certain teams over the years. Houston had a NL team since 1962 and a Cardinal farm team before that starting in 1921 so the Houston tradition had been NL for almost a century. Since you are a Cardinal fan, I will mention a Colt 45 game fifty years where the loudest applause was for Stan the Man in his final year. I prefer not to have the DH but I still get about 95% of the enjoyment going to a game with it. I am not going to stay from Rice or AL games because they have the DL.
The American Association of Attorney-CPAs is offering a chance to go to Fenway For Red Sox against Padres on June 3 so I hope to go there again. I had seen one game at Fenway in 1975. Last year, I went to Seattle and saw the Red Sox against the Mariners. The year before I saw games in Baltimore and D.C.

I think they are on the right track. They've gone from having the worst record in the minors three years out of four to having the best, in one season. I think they are back into the kind of player development mode they were in the 60s. Hopefully they won't trade away the Morgans, Staubs, Cuellars, and Wynns this time.

I won't be going to AAA-CPA this year because I'll be on a mission trip ton the DR. When I was stationed in Newport, I used to enjoy going to Fenway on Sunday afternoons.

When I did the TV work for the Rangers, I pretty much got into AL ball. I don't have strong feelings about the DH either way. The way I see it, the problem with pitchers hitting is that pitchers hitting is that pitchers aren't complete ballplayers, and the problem with the DH is that DH's aren't complete ballplayers either. The one thing I will say is that games with the DH seem to take forever.

If it were up to me, what I'd like to see is an 8-man batting order, omitting the pitcher altogether. Instead of giving AB's to a pitcher who can't hit or some washed up guy trying to accumulate career numbers, I'd rather see those AB's going to another trip through the middle of the lineup, but I realize we'll never do that.

I will enjoy the AL. I'll miss the Cardinals a lot, but I'll be happy to get the Yankees and Red Sox. I'd rather be in the strongest division in baseball than the weakest.

Where I think it is a mistake is the the NL now has no footprint in Texas. I think it would have made more geographic sense to move Colorado or Arizona, so both leagues have a team in Texas and a team in the intermountain west. From a marketing standpoint, I think baseball will lose a bit by not having exposure for both leagues in all regions.

I believe that the biggest problem with the AL forced move is the disrespect it showed to the fans. No one would ever force the Cardinals, Dodgers. Yankees or Red Sox to change leagues.

Some baseball fans will undoubtedly continue to support the Astros (or ALstros as some call them), but many have been permanently turned off and the only way to express displeasure is to stay away. It reminds of the way the Cowboys fired Tom Landry which turned off many old fans.

I'm a Cardinals fan who came over to Houston 2/3 times a year to watch them play the Stros. I won't be doing that any more as it turns my stomach to put any money in Crane's pocket.

Major League Baseball owners have never let respect for the fans stop them from doing anything.