(04-05-2013 02:07 PM)Marge Schott Wrote:  

(04-05-2013 12:05 PM)JunkYardCard Wrote:  In isolation, FSU to the B1G looks just like WVU to the Big 12. We'll see how that turns out, but so far it doesn't look good.

How does your comment even make any sense?

You sound JUST LIKE the typical Big East fan ridiculing any more-than-12-month-old ACC member that's eyeing its exit strategy.

If WVU stayed in the Big East and rebuked the Big 12 overtures do you not think UL would've gone to the Big 12 instead? Or, do you forget your own legislator(s) tried to halt WVU's entrance to the Big 12 so that you could take it instead? Don't be so foolish. You know the ACC is a weak ship. But you know that it's better than the Big East. You also know that you'd jump at any chance for a Big Ten or SEC offer.

So quit the B.S.

Sometimes it seems like literally everyone on this board is just looking for a fight. Soooooo many responses to quoted posts are argumentative and challenging. They all read like you'd be willing to throw a punch over this topic if we were in the same room. It's tiresome. It's a shame this is the only expansion board with traffic.

Look, I have no problem with what WVU did in going to the Big 12. NONE. NO PROBLEM. Zip, zero, zilch, nada. Louisville would have taken the same deal. At the time, it was all that was believed to be available for the indefinite future. We absolutely LUCKED into an ACC offer.

BUT, that doesn't mean WVU's move to the Big 12 is all rainbows and unicorns for your athletic department. The travel will take its toll. We'll see if it affects recruiting. Getting kids from FL, OH or PA to move to WVU so they can play football in the plain states is going to be difficult. Switching your recruiting base to Texas might be even more difficult. It's an improvement over the Big East of course, but still a tremendous challenge.

The point of my comment that you quoted is that if I'm FSU, I want the WVU situation to play out before I make any B1G decision. All these expansion decisions are being made like fantasy football picks - like chemistry and cohesion don't matter, like geography doesn't matter. Well, those factors DO matter.

(04-05-2013 02:22 PM)SeaBlue Wrote:  

(04-05-2013 11:46 AM)JunkYardCard Wrote:  What recruit in Florida would want to be stuck traveling that far for literally every single game? Maryland is the closest now. It's nuts.

Louisville, for example, is not within 6 hours of anyone in the ACC. I assume the same would hold for Miami (save FSU). And as for FSU, the new ACC kids on the block would also be long trip.
http://cardinalsportszone.com/2012/11/28...c-schools/

As a fan, seems to me that once you hit the 4-5 hour mark by car it might as well be 6-10 hours; not many are going to travel. The athletes will be flying.

As for traveling to Florida, I would think there's a psychological "plus" when heading to Florida in the winter.

I'm not arguing that. I think it all sucks and that geography is being sacrificed for media-driven expediency. But the B1G schools are a helluva lot farther away from FSU than the current ACC schools. Surely that isn't in dispute. It doesn't matter for football really, but try scheduling your other 53 teams.

And it matters for elite recruiting. Having to truck your ass to Minnesota, Wisconsin, Pennsylvania, Illinois, Ohio and New Jersey will make the Gators look a lot better by comparison.

Look, all I'm saying is that there is a reason they haven't made the move, or they would have done it already.

JYC, the B12 plans to address the travel issue for WVU. But travel doesn't really affect the football team. It's the minor sports that have that problem, mainly due to the B12's rule on traveling back to campus after every away game. If WVU is able to stay on the road when they have multiple road games, it will solve the majority of the problem...

As for recruiting, I don't think it will have as much impact as you think, with the possible exception of making it more difficult to get NYC area recruits in basketball. But even that may not be as much of a problem as some think. There will probably always be kids who want a change of scenery, or a chance get out of the big city and change their life. So I doubt it will change matters as much as you seem to think...

Bit, you may very well be correct. I'm just saying that if I'm FSU, I want to see how all that plays out. I want to be able to factor a few years of WVU's experience into my decision. Recruiting is guesswork. But surely you can see how it could have a negative impact on recruiting. If I'm FSU, I'd like to see what happens first before jumping into the B1G.

I know football isn't the problem in terms of logistical issues with the travel, but the impact of travel on the non-revenue sports does matter. And isn't FSU really good in baseball? Endless trips into the cold could have an impact on that.


At any rate, that's my honest opinion. Maybe it's right, maybe it's wrong. But it's not trolling to p!ss people off or BS meant to make people mad.

(04-05-2013 03:20 PM)JunkYardCard Wrote:  Bit, you may very well be correct. I'm just saying that if I'm FSU, I want to see how all that plays out. I want to be able to factor a few years of WVU's experience into my decision. Recruiting is guesswork. But surely you can see how it could have a negative impact on recruiting. If I'm FSU, I'd like to see what happens first before jumping into the B1G.

I know football isn't the problem in terms of logistical issues with the travel, but the impact of travel on the non-revenue sports does matter. And isn't FSU really good in baseball? Endless trips into the cold could have an impact on that.

At any rate, that's my honest opinion. Maybe it's right, maybe it's wrong. But it's not trolling to p!ss people off or BS meant to make people mad.

I don't think WVU's situation would apply at all to FSU in the B1G. These are 2 completely different cases. FSU isn't in a small state with few recruits, dependent upon the rest of the nation for its recruits. FSU would get good recruits no matter where they played (ACC, B1G, B12, or SEC)...

The opportunity to play Ohio State, Penn State, and Michigan every year beats playing anything the ACC offers, and association with CIC schools is another big benefit the ACC doesn't offer. The increased TV money and exposure would boost their profile, keeping them on national TV almost every week, making FSU sports more attractive to local area recruits. The TV money offered by the B1G would more than offset the increased travel costs, and the increased attractiveness for recruiting could make FSU a challenger for B1G titles in most sports every year...

I don't see your point here. It doesn't hold water...

My point is there is a REASON why FSU didn't go to the B1G with or before Maryland and/or Rutgers. There is a reason why they haven't already made the move. My post is speculation as to why that is.

If it's such an epic and awesome move that makes perfect sense and will make everyone Brazilianaires, then why haven't they done it already?

(04-05-2013 04:10 PM)JunkYardCard Wrote:  then why haven't they done it already?

The "contiguous / AAU / top-market" rules complicate matters.

Also, B1G has yet to take more than 1 school from any conference. I don't think B1G makes the next move, but you never know.

And then there's that pesky Maryland v. ACC thing going on.

(04-05-2013 02:38 PM)USAFMEDIC Wrote:  

(04-05-2013 11:34 AM)Marge Schott Wrote:  But what I don't think you are considering is - I may be wrong, that most FSU fans are not excited by many of our current ACC matchups. Miami, GT, Clemson and VT are the only games that are assured to be of high interest in Tallahassee. Duke, BC, Wake, UVA and even Cuse and Pitt aren't likely to excite fans much. Cuse and Pitt may draw well for a few years before the novelty wears off. UL kind of falls in line with UNC and NC State, I think, as a school that will garner some interest, especially depending on the type of season they're having, but not the likes of the first 4 I mentioned.

So, would FSU fans mind switching out decent ACC schools for a shot at playing pretty good Big Ten schools that are out of our geographic area like Nebraska (significant history there), Michigan (some history here as well), Ohio State (more history) and Penn State (some history, too)? Um, I think FSU fans would be receptive of that. If that means they trade a Wake for a Minnesota or a Duke for an Indiana now and then I don't see how that changes things.

So you think playing Rutgers, Maryland, Indiana, Purdue, Northwestern, Minnesota, Michigan State, and Illinois will make Tallahassee party central? Not to knock those schools, but it just doesn't make for an exciting road trip for Florida folks. FSU hates playing cupcake conference teams. Boring, boring, boring...lot of empty seats at those Doak Campbell games. Same in the SEC. We don't like those walk over games you talk about being financially beneficial for revenue. I think the SEC fans actually do agree with me on this. Let them answer your question for me... FSU will maybe get big games with OSU, Penn State, and Michigan. How about in the SEC? Florida, SC, Georgia, Tennessee, Alabama, Aggies, LSU. Now that makes for a nice schedule. Very travel friendly too. Throw a couple Big XII or PAC teams OOC and that's awesome.

Are you kidding me? Read what I said.

(04-05-2013 02:22 PM)SeaBlue Wrote:  

(04-05-2013 11:46 AM)JunkYardCard Wrote:  What recruit in Florida would want to be stuck traveling that far for literally every single game? Maryland is the closest now. It's nuts.

Louisville, for example, is not within 6 hours of anyone in the ACC. I assume the same would hold for Miami (save FSU). And as for FSU, the new ACC kids on the block would also be long trip.
http://cardinalsportszone.com/2012/11/28...c-schools/

As a fan, seems to me that once you hit the 4-5 hour mark by car it might as well be 6-10 hours; not many are going to travel. The athletes will be flying.

As for traveling to Florida, I would think there's a psychological "plus" when heading to Florida in the winter.

Holy crap. A Michigan fan is a smart person? You gotta be kidding me. I never would've thought that. (Total sarcasm.)

But, you're telling me after a certain number of miles/hours ALL games are plane trips for the school? No...way. That's incnredible. So you're telling me that the only schools that FSU actually drives to are MAYBE the GT games? No...way. How do you know so much. Our BASEBALL team even flew to Miami for our weekend series THIS weekend. Maybe not ALL of our sports would fly to Miami (I honestly don't know) but many/most would.

So the distance doesn't mean sh*t. And how many kids live in NY, VA and NC compared to OH, MI, IL, etc? I think it's pretty damn even. So FSU would lose the interest of some kids and gain it right back in others.

I hope Michigan does well in the Final Four. Good friend of mine went there AND I also hate Ohio State (both he and I grew up in Ohio).

(04-05-2013 03:47 PM)bitcruncher Wrote:  

(04-05-2013 03:20 PM)JunkYardCard Wrote:  Bit, you may very well be correct. I'm just saying that if I'm FSU, I want to see how all that plays out. I want to be able to factor a few years of WVU's experience into my decision. Recruiting is guesswork. But surely you can see how it could have a negative impact on recruiting. If I'm FSU, I'd like to see what happens first before jumping into the B1G.

I know football isn't the problem in terms of logistical issues with the travel, but the impact of travel on the non-revenue sports does matter. And isn't FSU really good in baseball? Endless trips into the cold could have an impact on that.

At any rate, that's my honest opinion. Maybe it's right, maybe it's wrong. But it's not trolling to p!ss people off or BS meant to make people mad.

I don't think WVU's situation would apply at all to FSU in the B1G. These are 2 completely different cases. FSU isn't in a small state with few recruits, dependent upon the rest of the nation for its recruits. FSU would get good recruits no matter where they played (ACC, B1G, B12, or SEC)...

The opportunity to play Ohio State, Penn State, and Michigan every year beats playing anything the ACC offers, and association with CIC schools is another big benefit the ACC doesn't offer. The increased TV money and exposure would boost their profile, keeping them on national TV almost every week, making FSU sports more attractive to local area recruits. The TV money offered by the B1G would more than offset the increased travel costs, and the increased attractiveness for recruiting could make FSU a challenger for B1G titles in most sports every year...

I don't see your point here. It doesn't hold water...

Have you noticed the biggest backlash to FSU in the Big Ten is coming from new ACC members like UL, Pitt and Cuse? Because I have. Those are the biggest FSU (and ACC-hater) haters on the ACC board on this site. Most of those people are pathetic.

(04-05-2013 05:01 PM)Marge Schott Wrote:  So the distance doesn't mean sh*t. And how many kids live in NY, VA and NC compared to OH, MI, IL, etc? I think it's pretty damn even. So FSU would lose the interest of some kids and gain it right back in others.

I hope Michigan does well in the Final Four. Good friend of mine went there AND I also hate Ohio State (both he and I grew up in Ohio).

I doesn't when it suits my cause and I'm not the one flying.

I have changed my tune a little on travel as I've watched Notre Dame, 'Cuse and others not think twice about it.

Go Blue!

(04-05-2013 05:05 PM)Marge Schott Wrote:  

(04-05-2013 03:47 PM)bitcruncher Wrote:  

(04-05-2013 03:20 PM)JunkYardCard Wrote:  Bit, you may very well be correct. I'm just saying that if I'm FSU, I want to see how all that plays out. I want to be able to factor a few years of WVU's experience into my decision. Recruiting is guesswork. But surely you can see how it could have a negative impact on recruiting. If I'm FSU, I'd like to see what happens first before jumping into the B1G.

I know football isn't the problem in terms of logistical issues with the travel, but the impact of travel on the non-revenue sports does matter. And isn't FSU really good in baseball? Endless trips into the cold could have an impact on that.

At any rate, that's my honest opinion. Maybe it's right, maybe it's wrong. But it's not trolling to p!ss people off or BS meant to make people mad.

I don't think WVU's situation would apply at all to FSU in the B1G. These are 2 completely different cases. FSU isn't in a small state with few recruits, dependent upon the rest of the nation for its recruits. FSU would get good recruits no matter where they played (ACC, B1G, B12, or SEC)...

The opportunity to play Ohio State, Penn State, and Michigan every year beats playing anything the ACC offers, and association with CIC schools is another big benefit the ACC doesn't offer. The increased TV money and exposure would boost their profile, keeping them on national TV almost every week, making FSU sports more attractive to local area recruits. The TV money offered by the B1G would more than offset the increased travel costs, and the increased attractiveness for recruiting could make FSU a challenger for B1G titles in most sports every year...

I don't see your point here. It doesn't hold water...

Have you noticed the biggest backlash to FSU in the Big Ten is coming from new ACC members like UL, Pitt and Cuse? Because I have. Those are the biggest FSU (and ACC-hater) haters on the ACC board on this site. Most of those people are pathetic.

I counted exactly 3 Acc fans who offered a negative opinion about the rumor of FSU leaving for the Big 10. A Syracuse fan, a Louisville fan and a North Carolina fan. They basically said "it doesnt make sense," not reaaly negative. The other 5 non FSU, Acc fans who commented in this thread either commented on other subjects, or they think it makes sense.

(04-05-2013 05:05 PM)Marge Schott Wrote:  

(04-05-2013 03:47 PM)bitcruncher Wrote:  

(04-05-2013 03:20 PM)JunkYardCard Wrote:  Bit, you may very well be correct. I'm just saying that if I'm FSU, I want to see how all that plays out. I want to be able to factor a few years of WVU's experience into my decision. Recruiting is guesswork. But surely you can see how it could have a negative impact on recruiting. If I'm FSU, I'd like to see what happens first before jumping into the B1G.

I know football isn't the problem in terms of logistical issues with the travel, but the impact of travel on the non-revenue sports does matter. And isn't FSU really good in baseball? Endless trips into the cold could have an impact on that.

At any rate, that's my honest opinion. Maybe it's right, maybe it's wrong. But it's not trolling to p!ss people off or BS meant to make people mad.

I don't think WVU's situation would apply at all to FSU in the B1G. These are 2 completely different cases. FSU isn't in a small state with few recruits, dependent upon the rest of the nation for its recruits. FSU would get good recruits no matter where they played (ACC, B1G, B12, or SEC)...

The opportunity to play Ohio State, Penn State, and Michigan every year beats playing anything the ACC offers, and association with CIC schools is another big benefit the ACC doesn't offer. The increased TV money and exposure would boost their profile, keeping them on national TV almost every week, making FSU sports more attractive to local area recruits. The TV money offered by the B1G would more than offset the increased travel costs, and the increased attractiveness for recruiting could make FSU a challenger for B1G titles in most sports every year...

I don't see your point here. It doesn't hold water...

Have you noticed the biggest backlash to FSU in the Big Ten is coming from new ACC members like UL, Pitt and Cuse? Because I have. Those are the biggest FSU (and ACC-hater) haters on the ACC board on this site. Most of those people are pathetic.

Man, you must be a real peach at parties. You're just such a pleasant, happy person.

Whatever. Back to reality. I don't hate on anything. I'm simply offering some conjecture as to why this FSU to the B1G move hasn't already happened despite ample opportunity for it to happen. I mean, according to you, any ******* moron with a room temperature IQ knows they should have done it already. So - you're obviously the smartest person in the room - let's hear from you why they haven't done it.

(04-05-2013 05:23 PM)cuseroc Wrote:  I counted exactly 3 Acc fans who offered a negative opinion about the rumor of FSU leaving for the Big 10. A Syracuse fan, a Louisville fan and a North Carolina fan. They basically said "it doesnt make sense" The other 5 non FSU, Acc fans who commented in this thread either commented on other subjects, or they think it makes sense.

I hope you're not counting me as the Louisville fan with the negative opinion. FSU can do what it wants. It's a free country. I'm asking what the hold up is. Why did they put up the big fight when Maryland left? Why not just go with them if it's so obvious that the B1G wants FSU and FSU wants the B1G?

(04-05-2013 05:26 PM)JunkYardCard Wrote:  

(04-05-2013 05:23 PM)cuseroc Wrote:  I counted exactly 3 Acc fans who offered a negative opinion about the rumor of FSU leaving for the Big 10. A Syracuse fan, a Louisville fan and a North Carolina fan. They basically said "it doesnt make sense" The other 5 non FSU, Acc fans who commented in this thread either commented on other subjects, or they think it makes sense.

I hope you're not counting me as the Louisville fan with the negative opinion. FSU can do what it wants. It's a free country. I'm asking what the hold up is. Why did they put up the big fight when Maryland left? Why not just go with them if it's so obvious that the B1G wants FSU and FSU wants the B1G?

Then that leaves only 2 Acc fans who think it doesnt make sense.

(04-05-2013 05:24 PM)JunkYardCard Wrote:  

(04-05-2013 05:05 PM)Marge Schott Wrote:  

(04-05-2013 03:47 PM)bitcruncher Wrote:  

(04-05-2013 03:20 PM)JunkYardCard Wrote:  Bit, you may very well be correct. I'm just saying that if I'm FSU, I want to see how all that plays out. I want to be able to factor a few years of WVU's experience into my decision. Recruiting is guesswork. But surely you can see how it could have a negative impact on recruiting. If I'm FSU, I'd like to see what happens first before jumping into the B1G.

I know football isn't the problem in terms of logistical issues with the travel, but the impact of travel on the non-revenue sports does matter. And isn't FSU really good in baseball? Endless trips into the cold could have an impact on that.

At any rate, that's my honest opinion. Maybe it's right, maybe it's wrong. But it's not trolling to p!ss people off or BS meant to make people mad.

I don't think WVU's situation would apply at all to FSU in the B1G. These are 2 completely different cases. FSU isn't in a small state with few recruits, dependent upon the rest of the nation for its recruits. FSU would get good recruits no matter where they played (ACC, B1G, B12, or SEC)...

The opportunity to play Ohio State, Penn State, and Michigan every year beats playing anything the ACC offers, and association with CIC schools is another big benefit the ACC doesn't offer. The increased TV money and exposure would boost their profile, keeping them on national TV almost every week, making FSU sports more attractive to local area recruits. The TV money offered by the B1G would more than offset the increased travel costs, and the increased attractiveness for recruiting could make FSU a challenger for B1G titles in most sports every year...

I don't see your point here. It doesn't hold water...

Have you noticed the biggest backlash to FSU in the Big Ten is coming from new ACC members like UL, Pitt and Cuse? Because I have. Those are the biggest FSU (and ACC-hater) haters on the ACC board on this site. Most of those people are pathetic.

Man, you must be a real peach at parties. You're just such a pleasant, happy person.

Whatever. Back to reality. I don't hate on anything. I'm simply offering some conjecture as to why this FSU to the B1G move hasn't already happened despite ample opportunity for it to happen. I mean, according to you, any ******* moron with a room temperature IQ knows they should have done it already. So - you're obviously the smartest person in the room - let's hear from you why they haven't done it.

I don't go to many ACC parties so yea, I s'pose folk think I'm mighty peachy.

(04-05-2013 04:50 PM)SeaBlue Wrote:  

(04-05-2013 04:10 PM)JunkYardCard Wrote:  then why haven't they done it already?

The "contiguous / AAU / top-market" rules complicate matters.

Also, B1G has yet to take more than 1 school from any conference. I don't think B1G makes the next move, but you never know.

And then there's that pesky Maryland v. ACC thing going on.

Those are all possibilities. But as far as the contiguity, AAU and top-market issues are concerned, they are what they are. They won't change. So what is their answer? It's either yes or no. Or do they want to ponder indefinitely?

The same could be said for the 1 school per conference rule, if it exists. The B1G expansion process was always going to be impossible to conclude without breaking that rule. So if it's a problem, why even start?

I still think if FSU and GT end up in the B1G, then why not just have the entire PAC join the B1G too? Let's just form one big 64 school conference.

(04-05-2013 04:54 PM)Marge Schott Wrote:  

(04-05-2013 02:38 PM)USAFMEDIC Wrote:  

(04-05-2013 11:34 AM)Marge Schott Wrote:  But what I don't think you are considering is - I may be wrong, that most FSU fans are not excited by many of our current ACC matchups. Miami, GT, Clemson and VT are the only games that are assured to be of high interest in Tallahassee. Duke, BC, Wake, UVA and even Cuse and Pitt aren't likely to excite fans much. Cuse and Pitt may draw well for a few years before the novelty wears off. UL kind of falls in line with UNC and NC State, I think, as a school that will garner some interest, especially depending on the type of season they're having, but not the likes of the first 4 I mentioned.

So, would FSU fans mind switching out decent ACC schools for a shot at playing pretty good Big Ten schools that are out of our geographic area like Nebraska (significant history there), Michigan (some history here as well), Ohio State (more history) and Penn State (some history, too)? Um, I think FSU fans would be receptive of that. If that means they trade a Wake for a Minnesota or a Duke for an Indiana now and then I don't see how that changes things.

So you think playing Rutgers, Maryland, Indiana, Purdue, Northwestern, Minnesota, Michigan State, and Illinois will make Tallahassee party central? Not to knock those schools, but it just doesn't make for an exciting road trip for Florida folks. FSU hates playing cupcake conference teams. Boring, boring, boring...lot of empty seats at those Doak Campbell games. Same in the SEC. We don't like those walk over games you talk about being financially beneficial for revenue. I think the SEC fans actually do agree with me on this. Let them answer your question for me... FSU will maybe get big games with OSU, Penn State, and Michigan. How about in the SEC? Florida, SC, Georgia, Tennessee, Alabama, Aggies, LSU. Now that makes for a nice schedule. Very travel friendly too. Throw a couple Big XII or PAC teams OOC and that's awesome.

Are you kidding me? Read what I said.

I did. You were bragging about the big match ups in the B1G. I have just compared the FSU match ups vs, all three conferences. ACC, B1G and SEC. There are many more attractive big games for FSU as an SEC member. Birds do not fly north in the fall.

I think the problem here is that I think expansion in general is simply bad all around for the game of college football. It seems most everyone here thinks otherwise. I'm glad Louisville is in the ACC because of the circumstances that caused it. But the reality is that Louisville in the ACC is silly. Syracuse and Pitt in the ACC may be even sillier. Rutgers in the Big Ten is silly. Maryland in the Big Ten is even sillier. aTm in the SEC is blasphemy. Missouri in the SEC is just dumber than owl ch1t. Utah and Colorado in the PAC are idiotic.

So I'm not quaking in fear over here. I'm just trying to keep up with what is going on and get some insight into the direction things are heading. It's a very interesting topic from a business standpoint.

(04-05-2013 05:31 PM)Marge Schott Wrote:  I don't go to many ACC parties so yea, I s'pose folk think I'm mighty peachy.

You remind me a lot of my wife's ex husband.