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Which conferences will Not survive current realignment?
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Wedge Offline
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Post: #61
RE: Which conferences will Not survive current realignment?
(03-30-2013 09:16 PM)billings Wrote:  Leaving
Iowa State
TCU
Baylor
Kansas St

Can Kansas really move without Kansas State? The politics would be messy, like Oklahoma trying to move without Oklahoma State.

Does the prospect of getting the three programs they really want (Texas, Oklahoma, Kansas) make it worth enough money for three little brothers (Texas Tech, Oklahoma State, Kansas State) to tag along? It might, but whether it makes "dollars and sense" is a question for the consultants to answer. Larry Scott doesn't think 16 is a maximum number for conferences, but we don't know whether the Pac CEOs would agree with him on that.
03-30-2013 11:10 PM
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He1nousOne Offline
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Post: #62
RE: Which conferences will Not survive current realignment?
(03-30-2013 11:10 PM)Wedge Wrote:  
(03-30-2013 09:16 PM)billings Wrote:  Leaving
Iowa State
TCU
Baylor
Kansas St

Can Kansas really move without Kansas State? The politics would be messy, like Oklahoma trying to move without Oklahoma State.

Does the prospect of getting the three programs they really want (Texas, Oklahoma, Kansas) make it worth enough money for three little brothers (Texas Tech, Oklahoma State, Kansas State) to tag along? It might, but whether it makes "dollars and sense" is a question for the consultants to answer. Larry Scott doesn't think 16 is a maximum number for conferences, but we don't know whether the Pac CEOs would agree with him on that.

Likely the situation has changed so that if there was ever any desire by Texas in crew to move to the PAC in the near future, they would have to do so with 8 schools.

The time for 16's came and passed. Everything has gotten much more complicated. We have GoR's, we have cultural complications in the East.

The 16 ideal just isn't realistic anymore, if it ever was.
03-30-2013 11:39 PM
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billings Online
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Post: #63
RE: Which conferences will Not survive current realignment?
(03-30-2013 11:10 PM)Wedge Wrote:  
(03-30-2013 09:16 PM)billings Wrote:  Leaving
Iowa State
TCU
Baylor
Kansas St

Can Kansas really move without Kansas State? The politics would be messy, like Oklahoma trying to move without Oklahoma State.

Does the prospect of getting the three programs they really want (Texas, Oklahoma, Kansas) make it worth enough money for three little brothers (Texas Tech, Oklahoma State, Kansas State) to tag along? It might, but whether it makes "dollars and sense" is a question for the consultants to answer. Larry Scott doesn't think 16 is a maximum number for conferences, but we don't know whether the Pac CEOs would agree with him on that.


and would Iowa be forced to try and save Iowa State who is an AAU school? Only TCU and Baylor would have no possible champions to try and keep them in the inner circle. No Gov of Texas connections to save Baylor this time

Like I said a fine mess it would be if the Big 12 is the one hit from the PAC and Big sides
03-30-2013 11:39 PM
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He1nousOne Offline
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Post: #64
RE: Which conferences will Not survive current realignment?
(03-30-2013 11:39 PM)billings Wrote:  
(03-30-2013 11:10 PM)Wedge Wrote:  
(03-30-2013 09:16 PM)billings Wrote:  Leaving
Iowa State
TCU
Baylor
Kansas St

Can Kansas really move without Kansas State? The politics would be messy, like Oklahoma trying to move without Oklahoma State.

Does the prospect of getting the three programs they really want (Texas, Oklahoma, Kansas) make it worth enough money for three little brothers (Texas Tech, Oklahoma State, Kansas State) to tag along? It might, but whether it makes "dollars and sense" is a question for the consultants to answer. Larry Scott doesn't think 16 is a maximum number for conferences, but we don't know whether the Pac CEOs would agree with him on that.


and would Iowa be forced to try and save Iowa State who is an AAU school? Only TCU and Baylor would have no possible champions to try and keep them in the inner circle. No Gov of Texas connections to save Baylor this time

Like I said a fine mess it would be if the Big 12 is the one hit from the PAC and Big sides

Nah, the GoR insures that the only way anyone moves is if the conference is dissolved. That requires 8 votes. The easiest solution to that would be 8 teams going out west to form a 20 team merged conference with the PAC and then two other teams going to the SEC to help that conference get closer to 20.

The GoR has done a great job of insuring that Iowa State is much more secure going forward.
03-31-2013 08:40 AM
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CPslograd Offline
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Post: #65
RE: Which conferences will Not survive current realignment?
(03-30-2013 05:37 PM)billings Wrote:  
(03-30-2013 05:34 PM)jdgaucho Wrote:  
(03-30-2013 05:22 PM)BruceMcF Wrote:  
(03-30-2013 05:03 PM)jdgaucho Wrote:  I believe Denver is the key to the remaining moves out west. I don't expect them to stay in the Summit League very long. If the Missouri Valley does not invite them I believe they are either WCC or Big West bound.
I knew there was a school I was forgetting. Denver moving to either makes it that much less likely that conference will need a warm body reload from the WAC.

For the non-FB division, when you are not an at large bid conference, the finances encourage sharing the NCAA unit revenue and NCAA conference payment among fewer schools. The difficulties of scheduling Home and Away games and risk of losing a school encourage staying a bit above the minimum seven for an AQ bid to the NCAA tournament.

The WCC is set. Even assuming that BYU leaves, the conference will at least have 9 or add Denver/Seattle. Bringing back Pacific ensures their viability and future.

Big West is largely set as well. Even if Hawaii leaves and membership goes down to 8, the conference assumes they pretty much have Bakersfield in their back pocket and can bring them in at any time. UCSD may get a call up from the D2 ranks. Less likely to happen, but Seattle may get a ring too. Cal Poly and UC Davis may consider a move up to FBS but they're going to keep their other sports here.


I don't think either moves but if cal poly or UC Davis moe to FBS they won't leave the oly sports in the BW


If MW invited UC Davis for example it would be for all sports. Granted the MWC would have to get hit pretty hard for that to happen.

I'm not sure about that. Davis is the only FCS team I can see getting invited to the MWC unless a bunch of teams left. And they are a decade away. Any move to the MWC would be for all sports. Maybe Montana too, but I think Davis would be ahead of them.

It's theoretically possible in the future that the SunBelt becomes the everybody else FBS league. In that case I could see Davis and or Poly in the Belt for football only. But again, this is years and years away.
03-31-2013 10:45 AM
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BruceMcF Offline
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Post: #66
RE: Which conferences will Not survive current realignment?
(03-31-2013 10:45 AM)CPslograd Wrote:  It's theoretically possible in the future that the SunBelt becomes the everybody else FBS league. In that case I could see Davis and or Poly in the Belt for football only. But again, this is years and years away.
This is why I was looking at the question in terms of follow-on impacts of shocks that have already hit and might hit in the near term future.

When I reckon the west is going to be pretty stable in terms of the survival of the conferences, that is for the medium term future, and can be mostly traced back, either more or less directly, to the Big12 GOR and the collapse of the "Big East of Reno" experiment, which saw the MWC kind of "accidentally" go to 12 with a CCG and quite reasonable divisions, leaving no obvious change at the top.

Then with the New Big East only raiding one team west of the Mississippi, from the MVC, and no obvious further raids likely, and the FBS Mid-Major activity following the Old Big East collapse focused in Texas and east of the Mississippi, the Mountain West and Pacific Coast is relatively sheltered.

Stuff rolls downhill in conference realignment, so if another conference goes out of existence, as the unworkable 5-team trans-American Great West is finishing the process of doing, I'd expect it to be in the lower ranks, and somewhere in the Plains through to the Eastern US.

All of that is speculative, of course, but its speculation that has some structure to it based on the current alignment and current status rankings of conferences. As far as a decade from now when the Big12 GoR is getting close enough to its expiration for a Big Conference to consider wearing the impaired rights for a few years if a school meets a need ... too much depends on the speculation about what happens in the intervening decade to lend any structure to the speculation.

Really, just specify some assumption, and you can play all sorts of bizarre speculative games. I could speculate that runaway global warming and the collapse of cable in favor of online streaming has meant that all conferences have restructured to footprints that can be covered in an electric bus or electric train trip, so the "big" conferences are connected by electric overnight sleeper train routes. Then I spend a long detour to guess where those train routes are, and then sketch out the four Majors of 2025 after travel costs and collapsing media revenues forced the SEC to split.

Flip it around and go all Jetsons, with every school having automated driverless buses going 150mph on an upgraded driverless car interstates, and the possibilities of "a bus conference/division" switch around.

And that's just assumptions that transport and media changes compared to today. Regulatory changes in football from concussions, changes in federal funding of education, ... the list could go on.

Guessing 2025 could be fun, but it would just be a widely ranging set of Science Fiction stories that all just happen to be talking about conference alignment and set a decade ahead.
03-31-2013 12:19 PM
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bitcruncher Offline
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Post: #67
RE: Which conferences will Not survive current realignment?
(03-31-2013 12:19 PM)BruceMcF Wrote:  Guessing 2025 could be fun, but it would just be a widely ranging set of Science Fiction stories that all just happen to be talking about conference alignment and set a decade ahead.
Some sci-fi stories turn out to be more prophetic than anyone dreamed of at the time they were written...
03-31-2013 12:45 PM
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BruceMcF Offline
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Post: #68
RE: Which conferences will Not survive current realignment?
(03-31-2013 12:45 PM)bitcruncher Wrote:  
(03-31-2013 12:19 PM)BruceMcF Wrote:  Guessing 2025 could be fun, but it would just be a widely ranging set of Science Fiction stories that all just happen to be talking about conference alignment and set a decade ahead.
Some sci-fi stories turn out to be more prophetic than anyone dreamed of at the time they were written...
True, and others have people traveling in outer space and taking film movies of events, transmitting the movies across a videophone network by setting the videophone to record at 60:1 speed (just read one when I was at a conference, on my Android 4.3" player that also let me watch streaming video on the conference hotel lobby free WiFi).

I reckon that people who build 2025 scenarios assuming that media economics and cable subscription deals in particular will be largely the same as they are today are kind of like that.
03-31-2013 01:11 PM
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ChrisLords Offline
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Post: #69
RE: Which conferences will Not survive current realignment?
(03-30-2013 05:13 AM)giesing Wrote:  My uneducated guess.
Most conferences in danger. Summit League, CAA and WAC. Hope everyone survives,in whichever configuration.

I could see the CAA going away. They barely have enough teams to qualify as a league having lost GMU and are having trouble attracting new teams. I could easily see W&M to the Patriot, the northern teams to the NEC and A10, JMU to the Sunbelt or MAC and the rest getting picked up by the Big South and So Con.
03-31-2013 09:16 PM
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