(02-03-2013 11:03 PM)WinOrLoseEAGLE Wrote:  

(02-03-2013 02:13 PM)EagleRockCafe Wrote:  

(02-03-2013 02:01 PM)GoGold Wrote:  

(02-03-2013 10:16 AM)AndreWhere Wrote:  He has a doctorate in education from Tennessee State. To me, that says "candidate for high school principal," not "university president."

Good grief....what a stupid statement. At what point did our fanbase become so ignorant?

Believe me, that guy is no representative of our fan base.

Actually, unfortunately, he seems to be a representative of a clear majority of posters on the USM message boards. Sad, but true.

He is representative of a significant number of poster, but not a majority of them.

(02-04-2013 07:31 PM)cyc46 Wrote:  Its tough reading this thread. I really thought Southern Miss graduated people who understood that sometimes all you need is a chance in life to prove yourselves. Apparently when some of us werent looking some Ole Miss creeped in on us and set about spreading a sense of academic entitlement.

And what's more surprising: most of these people knocking him for lack of experience are the same ones that supported Hammond, asking others to give him a chance.

(02-05-2013 10:17 AM)Funslinger Wrote:  

(02-04-2013 07:31 PM)cyc46 Wrote:  Its tough reading this thread. I really thought Southern Miss graduated people who understood that sometimes all you need is a chance in life to prove yourselves. Apparently when some of us werent looking some Ole Miss creeped in on us and set about spreading a sense of academic entitlement.

And what's more surprising: most of these people knocking him for lack of experience are the same ones that supported Hammond, asking others to give him a chance.

I opposed Hammond as less than qualified and I've carried the same high expectations into this discussion... there's no inconsistency on my part.

Sometimes people do need a chance to prove themselves. President of USM ought to be a job for the already proven.

(02-05-2013 10:11 AM)Funslinger Wrote:  

(02-03-2013 11:03 PM)WinOrLoseEAGLE Wrote:  

(02-03-2013 02:13 PM)EagleRockCafe Wrote:  

(02-03-2013 02:01 PM)GoGold Wrote:  

(02-03-2013 10:16 AM)AndreWhere Wrote:  He has a doctorate in education from Tennessee State. To me, that says "candidate for high school principal," not "university president."

Good grief....what a stupid statement. At what point did our fanbase become so ignorant?

Believe me, that guy is no representative of our fan base.

Actually, unfortunately, he seems to be a representative of a clear majority of posters on the USM message boards. Sad, but true.

He is representative of a significant number of poster, but not a majority of them.

I agree with this.

In all fairness we do refer to Tennessee St as the Clown College, but he does have a great undergrad and graduate degrees.

Perhaps he (like most) wanted that in state tuition. I could have gone just about anywhere I wanted for grad school (accepted to Northwestern Business School and Dukie) but that in-state tuition (plus most of it paid for by working as a G/A in the athletic dept) sealed the deal. Sometimes, there's more to the story.

I do know this. I went through the same MBA program he did and it's legit...very underrated. I had three Vandy grads in the program with me and all three said the same thing. It was much more challenging than anything they did at Vandy so take it FWIW.

(02-05-2013 10:50 AM)ThreeifbyLightning Wrote:  In all fairness we do refer to Tennessee St as the Clown College, but he does have a great undergrad and graduate degrees.

Perhaps he (like most) wanted that in state tuition. I could have gone just about anywhere I wanted for grad school (accepted to Northwestern Business School and Dukie) but that in-state tuition (plus most of it paid for by working as a G/A in the athletic dept) sealed the deal. Sometimes, there's more to the story.

I do know this. I went through the same MBA program he did and it's legit...very underrated. I had three Vandy grads in the program with me and all three said the same thing. It was much more challenging than anything they did at Vandy so take it FWIW.

I didn't really look askance at the two degrees from MTSU. I do think that someone who aspires to leading a major university ought to do more at the doctoral level. Or, show me the relevant experience instead; someone who succeeded at a slightly lower level (e.g. president of TSU) would be a good candidate. Maybe what this guy did at UGA was bigger than I'm giving him credit for.

I don't have any problem with the fact that he won some sort of gay pride award... anyone who has a problem with that should probably stay away from any college campus other than Liberty, BYU, or Oral Roberts.

(02-05-2013 10:17 AM)Funslinger Wrote:  

(02-04-2013 07:31 PM)cyc46 Wrote:  Its tough reading this thread. I really thought Southern Miss graduated people who understood that sometimes all you need is a chance in life to prove yourselves. Apparently when some of us werent looking some Ole Miss creeped in on us and set about spreading a sense of academic entitlement.

And what's more surprising: most of these people knocking him for lack of experience are the same ones that supported Hammond, asking others to give him a chance.

Disagree Fun... at least the General had "highest level" Leadership experience in the military. Did we know if it would transfer over to the AD position? Nope. But he had leadership experience.

The original resume of Dr. Bennett didn't (to what was made available to us) have that other than his fundraising abilities. Unless you know what else the VP for Student Affairs position entailed? (the second article helped define it a little more)

Here are the issues I have:

1) If we were going to hire a VP of Student Affairs, it should have been our current VP of Student Affairs, Dr. Joe Paul. He has been working at Southern Miss in some capacity since the late 70s/early 80s. He is very well liked by a majority of students, alumni, faculty and staff and was the unanimous choice by the Alumni Advisory Committee. However, the Mississippi IHL has a history of doing things to the detriment of Southern Miss and doing things against our wishes, and that is what happened in this case. All 3 of the USM graduates who are on the IHL Board voted against Dr. Bennett in the original "informal" vote.

2) I believe the current system is flawed. The MS IHL Board is made up of appointees by the Governor. Currently USM has 3 graduates on the Board, as do Ole Miss and MSU. My issue is that graduates of in-state competing Universities should not be involved in the hiring of other Universities' Presidents. This should be done by the Alumni, Students, Faculty and Staff of USM or that particular University. In this case, our Board members' voices were ignored and basically our President was chosen, against popular demand, by graduates of other Universities in Mississippi.

(02-05-2013 12:32 PM)EaglehasLanded Wrote:  Here are the issues I have:

1) If we were going to hire a VP of Student Affairs, it should have been our current VP of Student Affairs, Dr. Joe Paul. He has been working at Southern Miss in some capacity since the late 70s/early 80s. He is very well liked by a majority of students, alumni, faculty and staff and was the unanimous choice by the Alumni Advisory Committee. However, the Mississippi IHL has a history of doing things to the detriment of Southern Miss and doing things against our wishes, and that is what happened in this case. All 3 of the USM graduates who are on the IHL Board voted against Dr. Bennett in the original "informal" vote.

2) I believe the current system is flawed. The MS IHL Board is made up of appointees by the Governor. Currently USM has 3 graduates on the Board, as do Ole Miss and MSU. My issue is that graduates of in-state competing Universities should not be involved in the hiring of other Universities' Presidents. This should be done by the Alumni, Students, Faculty and Staff of USM or that particular University. In this case, our Board members' voices were ignored and basically our President was chosen, against popular demand, by graduates of other Universities in Mississippi.

I agree with most of that. I wasn't aware Joe Paul was a serious candidate, but I think he would have been a good compromise pick. My concerns are 1) we don't want another Shelby Thames, i.e. someone polarizing and 2) we don't want someone who's enthusiastic but unqualified. I'm afraid that we've made both mistakes here.

Generally I think IHL is on our side, i.e. this is not a UAB situation... at least, it wasn't when we built MM Roberts, when we hired Horace Fleming, etc. Those were pro-USM moves. I'm not sure if this has changed... Shelby's attempt to claim #1 status in enrollment may have ruffled some feathers belonging to people who had not previously seen us as a threat. Those "BCS ranked" billboards could have lost us some friends... I don't know. But this does look like a punishment, and the latest sad step in our precipitous decline.

(02-05-2013 01:02 PM)AndreWhere Wrote:  

(02-05-2013 12:32 PM)EaglehasLanded Wrote:  Here are the issues I have:

1) If we were going to hire a VP of Student Affairs, it should have been our current VP of Student Affairs, Dr. Joe Paul. He has been working at Southern Miss in some capacity since the late 70s/early 80s. He is very well liked by a majority of students, alumni, faculty and staff and was the unanimous choice by the Alumni Advisory Committee. However, the Mississippi IHL has a history of doing things to the detriment of Southern Miss and doing things against our wishes, and that is what happened in this case. All 3 of the USM graduates who are on the IHL Board voted against Dr. Bennett in the original "informal" vote.

2) I believe the current system is flawed. The MS IHL Board is made up of appointees by the Governor. Currently USM has 3 graduates on the Board, as do Ole Miss and MSU. My issue is that graduates of in-state competing Universities should not be involved in the hiring of other Universities' Presidents. This should be done by the Alumni, Students, Faculty and Staff of USM or that particular University. In this case, our Board members' voices were ignored and basically our President was chosen, against popular demand, by graduates of other Universities in Mississippi.

I agree with most of that. I wasn't aware Joe Paul was a serious candidate, but I think he would have been a good compromise pick. My concerns are 1) we don't want another Shelby Thames, i.e. someone polarizing and 2) we don't want someone who's enthusiastic but unqualified. I'm afraid that we've made both mistakes here.

Generally I think IHL is on our side, i.e. this is not a UAB situation... at least, it wasn't when we built MM Roberts, when we hired Horace Fleming, etc. Those were pro-USM moves. I'm not sure if this has changed... Shelby's attempt to claim #1 status in enrollment may have ruffled some feathers belonging to people who had not previously seen us as a threat. Those "BCS ranked" billboards could have lost us some friends... I don't know. But this does look like a punishment, and the latest sad step in our precipitous decline.

I disagree that IHL has generally been on our side.
The upgrade to MM Roberts Stadium in the 70s was a compromise to stop us from pursuing a law school.
They also fired Horace Fleming when they realized he was doing a good job.
They gave our role as the primary/lead Computer Science program in the State to MSU after they realized how successful it had become and after a consulting firm had told them it should stay with USM.
IHL has refused to allow Southern Miss to start any Professional Schools siting "duplication of programs" which is not allowed, but they allow OM and State to duplicate every program we have.
IHL refused to let Southern Miss start a program in casino management, so Tulane moved in on the Gulf Coast and took that role.

(02-05-2013 01:09 PM)EaglehasLanded Wrote:  

(02-05-2013 01:02 PM)AndreWhere Wrote:  

(02-05-2013 12:32 PM)EaglehasLanded Wrote:  Here are the issues I have:

1) If we were going to hire a VP of Student Affairs, it should have been our current VP of Student Affairs, Dr. Joe Paul. He has been working at Southern Miss in some capacity since the late 70s/early 80s. He is very well liked by a majority of students, alumni, faculty and staff and was the unanimous choice by the Alumni Advisory Committee. However, the Mississippi IHL has a history of doing things to the detriment of Southern Miss and doing things against our wishes, and that is what happened in this case. All 3 of the USM graduates who are on the IHL Board voted against Dr. Bennett in the original "informal" vote.

2) I believe the current system is flawed. The MS IHL Board is made up of appointees by the Governor. Currently USM has 3 graduates on the Board, as do Ole Miss and MSU. My issue is that graduates of in-state competing Universities should not be involved in the hiring of other Universities' Presidents. This should be done by the Alumni, Students, Faculty and Staff of USM or that particular University. In this case, our Board members' voices were ignored and basically our President was chosen, against popular demand, by graduates of other Universities in Mississippi.

I agree with most of that. I wasn't aware Joe Paul was a serious candidate, but I think he would have been a good compromise pick. My concerns are 1) we don't want another Shelby Thames, i.e. someone polarizing and 2) we don't want someone who's enthusiastic but unqualified. I'm afraid that we've made both mistakes here.

Generally I think IHL is on our side, i.e. this is not a UAB situation... at least, it wasn't when we built MM Roberts, when we hired Horace Fleming, etc. Those were pro-USM moves. I'm not sure if this has changed... Shelby's attempt to claim #1 status in enrollment may have ruffled some feathers belonging to people who had not previously seen us as a threat. Those "BCS ranked" billboards could have lost us some friends... I don't know. But this does look like a punishment, and the latest sad step in our precipitous decline.

I disagree that IHL has generally been on our side.
The upgrade to MM Roberts Stadium in the 70s was a compromise to stop us from pursuing a law school.
They also fired Horace Fleming when they realized he was doing a good job.
They gave our role as the primary/lead Computer Science program in the State to MSU after they realized how successful it had become and after a consulting firm had told them it should stay with USM.
IHL has refused to allow Southern Miss to start any Professional Schools siting "duplication of programs" which is not allowed, but they allow OM and State to duplicate every program we have.
IHL refused to let Southern Miss start a program in casino management, so Tulane moved in on the Gulf Coast and took that role.

In what sense is State the lead Computer Science program? Is that some kind of official thing?

I'm not sweating the casino management thing. It's not a very lucrative job by non-Biloxi standards, and any "casino" association has to have drawbacks. I'm fine with letting Tulane and their little Edgewater Mall trade school have that one.

I'm wondering the same thing as Andre on the CS degree. When did State take the "Computer Science" lead? When it comes to Computer Engineering, i hear "go to State", but when it came to computer programming/computer science, it's still "USM is the lead school in the state"

I disagree with Andre on the Casino Management program. The IHL had pretty much promised (at one point) before Casinos moved in Mississippi that USM would have the lead in any casino management programs, and then they pulled tha tone out from under us.

The rest of it, I agree with you on Landed.. the IHL has been against USM, it always has been and always will be a "good ol' boys network for State and Ole Piss".

Quote: I wasn't aware Joe Paul was a serious candidate

I'd heard/read he was still in the running until the last 3 (final cut) - don't know why he didn't make the final 3.

(02-05-2013 10:50 AM)ThreeifbyLightning Wrote:  In all fairness we do refer to Tennessee St as the Clown College

I've always said our AD is penny wise, pound foolish. So maybe we're the clown college.

Watch out for giant spiders!

I know for a fact we have a better construction management program than MSU.. We also had a great Masters program.. IHL had to cut either a bachelors from one of the two, keep both, or cut the Masters and offer a different Masters.. They cut the Masters and now USM offers a Masters in Logistics.

(02-05-2013 12:32 PM)EaglehasLanded Wrote:  Here are the issues I have:

1) If we were going to hire a VP of Student Affairs, it should have been our current VP of Student Affairs, Dr. Joe Paul. He has been working at Southern Miss in some capacity since the late 70s/early 80s. He is very well liked by a majority of students, alumni, faculty and staff and was the unanimous choice by the Alumni Advisory Committee. However, the Mississippi IHL has a history of doing things to the detriment of Southern Miss and doing things against our wishes, and that is what happened in this case. All 3 of the USM graduates who are on the IHL Board voted against Dr. Bennett in the original "informal" vote.

2) I believe the current system is flawed. The MS IHL Board is made up of appointees by the Governor. Currently USM has 3 graduates on the Board, as do Ole Miss and MSU. My issue is that graduates of in-state competing Universities should not be involved in the hiring of other Universities' Presidents. This should be done by the Alumni, Students, Faculty and Staff of USM or that particular University. In this case, our Board members' voices were ignored and basically our President was chosen, against popular demand, by graduates of other Universities in Mississippi.

1. I'd be willing to bet that Paul's USM connection hurt him. Given the chaos involving school leadership for the last several years, they were probably hellbent on taking an outsider. Right/wrong? I don't know. I can see both sides.

2. In principle, each school alone should determine their president, but that would lead to cronyism in the process (which IHL processes were especially sensitive to after the accreditation disaster in the 1930's). If left up to each university entirely, every president would be a "USM guy," "State guy," "Ole Miss guy," etc. who is not necessarily qualified (not to say Paul wasn't). Unfortunately, these processes have also led to USM repeatedly getting screwed over by our friends to the North--the Computer Science department being an especially damaging one for USM. Finally, you would be asking the state to cede control of the hiring process of the president of the university that the state owns. Not happening. The state built USM. The state funds USM. The state will control USM.

Glad we have a GREAT pres