Don't think I saw this posted here previously

http://www.toledoblade.com/Education/201...-fall.html

Ouch. That stinks. Sounds like BGSU officials are figuring out how to spin this.

How many consultants, advisors, and administrators are being let go?

Just wait until the professors start blaming the athletic department for spending too much money on the football team.

(01-24-2013 01:39 PM)Love and Honor Wrote:  How many consultants, advisors, and administrators are being let go?

Probably none. Administrators who make cuts are always loathe to cut into their own immediate staff or their administrative "management team", rather they cut those further down the food chain (who by virtue of not being administrators in some cases may actually be involved in productive activities)----its just human nature and is characteristic of most organizations, not just universities.

The pre-"politically-correct" era expression used to describe situations like this was "too many Chiefs and not enough Indians".

And how much of a pay raise is the president receiving? Probably enough to save 1 position.

The Indians are all teaching math....

There is a breaking point that is coming where schools are going to have to significantly change their business models to adapt to reduced demand.

The value of a general college education has diminished to industry which now prefers specialized certification and accreditation. Its very dificult also for the individual to play the certification game due to the costs associated.

Its sad because college has changed from an investment for people to a high stakes poker game where one can rack up 200,000 in school debt without an ability to pay it back.

(01-24-2013 05:08 PM)Louis Kitton Wrote:  There is a breaking point that is coming where schools are going to have to significantly change their business models to adapt to reduced demand.

The value of a general college education has diminished to industry which now prefers specialized certification and accreditation. Its very dificult also for the individual to play the certification game due to the costs associated.

Its sad because college has changed from an investment for people to a high stakes poker game where one can rack up 200,000 in school debt without an ability to pay it back.

I think we're heading towards that breaking point sooner rather than later, you're right on the money. Colleges, especially second-tier public schools like the MAC ones, need to realize that they can't sustain an underwater basket weaving program and realistically hold on to their current model. Students need to realize not to major in underwater basket weaving, or know when trade school or something else is a better fit for them than racking up debt in college. People in general should err on the side of caution when it comes to for-profit institutions like ITT Tech or Sanford-Brown, many people come out with unaccredited degrees and mounds of loans to pay off. Our government should reform certain policies that allow for the costs to lower to reasonable levels, although I'm not getting into politics here.

Point is that colleges like us, as well as ultra-small liberal arts colleges, are being squeezed by this mess, while flagships like OSU don't have their present university structure in jeopardy.

(01-24-2013 05:46 PM)Love and Honor Wrote:  Point is that colleges like us, as well as ultra-small liberal arts colleges, are being squeezed by this mess, while flagships like BUFFALO don't have their present university structure in jeopardy.

Fall 2012 -UB Welcomes 85 new faculty

At the end of the next five years, this tuition and fee policy [SUNY2020] will enable UB to add 100 Medical School faculty and 300 Medical School support and clinical staff to occupy the new downtown facilities and another 170 faculty and 300 staff across the university to achieve UB 2020 academic objectives and economic impact.

The SUNY 2020 bill also makes law:
*All state funding for each University Center must be maintained for at least the amounts from the prior year by law;
*Increases tuition in steps to better match other flagship u's, and uses the addition $100M for each school for hiring profs, investing in programs, and financial aid improvements;
*Eases regulations at University Centers to better leverage pubic-private economic development;
*Creates a competitive pool of funds for major projects each Center (UB got $215M to help fund our new medical school building).

Definately good to be a flagship

(01-24-2013 07:35 PM)RecoveringHillbilly Wrote:  

(01-24-2013 05:46 PM)Love and Honor Wrote:  Point is that colleges like us, as well as ultra-small liberal arts colleges, are being squeezed by this mess, while flagships like BUFFALO don't have their present university structure in jeopardy.

Fall 2012 -UB Welcomes 85 new faculty

At the end of the next five years, this tuition and fee policy [SUNY2020] will enable UB to add 100 Medical School faculty and 300 Medical School support and clinical staff to occupy the new downtown facilities and another 170 faculty and 300 staff across the university to achieve UB 2020 academic objectives and economic impact.

The SUNY 2020 bill also makes law:
*All state funding for each University Center must be maintained for at least the amounts from the prior year by law;
*Increases tuition in steps to better match other flagship u's, and uses the addition $100M for each school for hiring profs, investing in programs, and financial aid improvements;
*Eases regulations at University Centers to better leverage pubic-private economic development;
*Creates a competitive pool of funds for major projects each Center (UB got $215M to help fund our new medical school building).

Definately good to be a flagship

That's great to hear, it'll be good for the school, the Bulls, and the community, I'd have to think that any good news for the city of Buffalo is welcome at this point. We've said it here before that the SUNY system is envied here in Ohio, this just proves it a little more.

(01-24-2013 07:35 PM)RecoveringHillbilly Wrote:  Definately good to be a flagship

Could you remind the politicians in Massachusetts?

(01-24-2013 05:46 PM)Love and Honor Wrote:  Point is that colleges like us, as well as ultra-small liberal arts colleges, are being squeezed by this mess, while flagships like OSU don't have their present university structure in jeopardy.

It all depends if universities can keep up with the trends and provide a product that students want.

Ohio just raised 413 million dollars or its fundraising campaign so I feel pretty confident as a quality public university we'll stay afloat.

http://www.ohio.edu/campaign/

(01-24-2013 10:46 PM)Louis Kitton Wrote:  

(01-24-2013 05:46 PM)Love and Honor Wrote:  Point is that colleges like us, as well as ultra-small liberal arts colleges, are being squeezed by this mess, while flagships like OSU don't have their present university structure in jeopardy.

It all depends if universities can keep up with the trends and provide a product that students want.

Ohio just raised 413 million dollars or its fundraising campaign so I feel pretty confident as a quality public university we'll stay afloat.

http://www.ohio.edu/campaign/

Very true, some hard work and creativity will keep us going strong, all the MAC schools have history behind them of being fine institutions for generations. Hopefully the economy rebounds, that'll ease the burden if it gets going again.

(01-24-2013 11:05 PM)Love and Honor Wrote:  

(01-24-2013 10:46 PM)Louis Kitton Wrote:  

(01-24-2013 05:46 PM)Love and Honor Wrote:  Point is that colleges like us, as well as ultra-small liberal arts colleges, are being squeezed by this mess, while flagships like OSU don't have their present university structure in jeopardy.

It all depends if universities can keep up with the trends and provide a product that students want.

Ohio just raised 413 million dollars or its fundraising campaign so I feel pretty confident as a quality public university we'll stay afloat.

http://www.ohio.edu/campaign/

Very true, some hard work and creativity will keep us going strong, all the MAC schools have history behind them of being fine institutions for generations. Hopefully the economy rebounds, that'll ease the burden if it gets going again.

What is the best case for the economy though in SE Michigan?

The financial bailouts have essentially have made the US government a private investor in the banking and automotive industries. Its a business friendly spin on what is basically nationalized ownership. The same can be said for the affordable health care act. It looks like its going to be a case in the future where our economy will have to be saved by government intervention. The government has opened a branch of the US Patent and Trademark Office in Detroit to help process patents of the Detroit automakers it helped to prop up.

I would say its going to be more changes than growth in the economy. Either people of the massive Midwest middle class are going to become highly skilled or they are going to struggle to get by on a living wage.

Quote:The Miami University Living Wage Campaign began after it became known that Miami University wage was 18-19% below the market value. In 2003 the members of the Miami University Fair Labor Coalition began marching for university staff wages. After negotiations fail with the university and the American Federation of State and County Municipal Employees (AFSCME), workers went on strike. For two weeks workers protested and students created a tent city as a way of showing support for the strikers. Eventually more students, faculty and community members came out to show support.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Living_wage

(01-24-2013 05:46 PM)Love and Honor Wrote:  

(01-24-2013 05:08 PM)Louis Kitton Wrote:  There is a breaking point that is coming where schools are going to have to significantly change their business models to adapt to reduced demand.

The value of a general college education has diminished to industry which now prefers specialized certification and accreditation. Its very dificult also for the individual to play the certification game due to the costs associated.

Its sad because college has changed from an investment for people to a high stakes poker game where one can rack up 200,000 in school debt without an ability to pay it back.

I think we're heading towards that breaking point sooner rather than later, you're right on the money. Colleges, especially second-tier public schools like the MAC ones, need to realize that they can't sustain an underwater basket weaving program and realistically hold on to their current model. Students need to realize not to major in underwater basket weaving, or know when trade school or something else is a better fit for them than racking up debt in college. People in general should err on the side of caution when it comes to for-profit institutions like ITT Tech or Sanford-Brown, many people come out with unaccredited degrees and mounds of loans to pay off. Our government should reform certain policies that allow for the costs to lower to reasonable levels, although I'm not getting into politics here.

Point is that colleges like us, as well as ultra-small liberal arts colleges, are being squeezed by this mess, while flagships like OSU don't have their present university structure in jeopardy.

I thought Ohio was the flagship?

(01-24-2013 11:52 PM)Louis Kitton Wrote:  

(01-24-2013 11:05 PM)Love and Honor Wrote:  

(01-24-2013 10:46 PM)Louis Kitton Wrote:  

(01-24-2013 05:46 PM)Love and Honor Wrote:  Point is that colleges like us, as well as ultra-small liberal arts colleges, are being squeezed by this mess, while flagships like OSU don't have their present university structure in jeopardy.

It all depends if universities can keep up with the trends and provide a product that students want.

Ohio just raised 413 million dollars or its fundraising campaign so I feel pretty confident as a quality public university we'll stay afloat.

http://www.ohio.edu/campaign/

Very true, some hard work and creativity will keep us going strong, all the MAC schools have history behind them of being fine institutions for generations. Hopefully the economy rebounds, that'll ease the burden if it gets going again.

What is the best case for the economy though in SE Michigan?

The financial bailouts have essentially have made the US government a private investor in the banking and automotive industries. Its a business friendly spin on what is basically nationalized ownership. The same can be said for the affordable health care act. It looks like its going to be a case in the future where our economy will have to be saved by government intervention. The government has opened a branch of the US Patent and Trademark Office in Detroit to help process patents of the Detroit automakers it helped to prop up.

I would say its going to be more changes than growth in the economy. Either people of the massive Midwest middle class are going to become highly skilled or they are going to struggle to get by on a living wage.

Quote:The Miami University Living Wage Campaign began after it became known that Miami University wage was 18-19% below the market value. In 2003 the members of the Miami University Fair Labor Coalition began marching for university staff wages. After negotiations fail with the university and the American Federation of State and County Municipal Employees (AFSCME), workers went on strike. For two weeks workers protested and students created a tent city as a way of showing support for the strikers. Eventually more students, faculty and community members came out to show support.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Living_wage

Are you Paul Ryan using "Love and Honor" as a screen name?

Ryan/GOP talking points.

Detroit has literally gone from a true basket case (say 4 years ago) to a city which is full of excitement and growth, both public AND private growth.

Dan Gilbert is buying up the CBD like crazy. He has bought in excess of 15 buildings, just buying controlling interest in the Greektown Hotel and Casino. A rail system from near the Detroit River to the New Center was approved last week (mostly private monies), the state is considering taking over Belle Isle and making it a state park, Ilitch is expected to build a new hockey arena near Woodward and the Fisher Freeway (couple of land options he owns), big CBD buildings have or will be rehabilitated as apartments and retail, etc.

Sometimes when a city hits bottom, real estate, etc. is dirt cheap and folks realize the business opportunity.

SE Michigan has a very strong base of highly educated workers from the many excellent universities in the state.

This notion of 'public ownership' of automobile companies and banks is a story which had a degree of truth THREE or FOUR YEARS AGO.

The U.S. only has some ownership left in GM which they want to unload when the 'price is right'.

The financial/economic collapse of 2008 has been undone and the economy is coming back. We avoided 1929.

S&P hit 1500 yesterday and not too far from an all time hire.

I've learned that politicians talk:

The U.S. is going to hell while the financial pros buy up equities (stock) like crazy.

Politicians, well some, are just scaring the people for partisan gain.

Financial pros were not convinced.

To paraphrase FDR: "The only thing we have to fear is (duplicitous politicians)...

In four years the S&P has more than doubled

P.S.: The biggest problems states like MI have isn't their local economic environment, per se, but growing out migration of the baby boomers who are leaving bitter temps for warmer temps.

That is the next big demographic trend and if the natural replacement (births minus deaths) is negative, then these states will lose population and decline.

Not to bring politics into this but the AFA is already forcing a lot of schools to drop full time status for adjunct professors and to trip FT administrative staff. Some of this might be in preparation for the phase in of that law.

I can see that this thread is going to get pretty far O/T, but...

The economic and financial viability of the state of Michigan is CRITICAL to the financial viability of the MAC's three Michigan based schools.

When the Michigan economy declined during the 1st decade of this century then funding for MI MAC schools suffered significantly.

EMU, e.g., does not have a really large endowment to sustain things when state funding declines significantly.

I should mention, Michigan, like most states are doing much, much better these days. Even California is expected to run a budget surplus I read in the Sacramento newspaper.

I hope things turn up for BG and all MAC schools.

(01-24-2013 05:46 PM)Love and Honor Wrote:  Point is that colleges like us, as well as ultra-small liberal arts colleges, are being squeezed by this mess, while flagships like OSU don't have their present university structure in jeopardy.

They most certainly do. ZSU's sociology and black studies majors aren't going to get non-existant jobs no matter how much they think being a Buckeye matters.

http://www.popecenter.org/commentaries/a...ml?id=2787

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/20...-jobs.html

It's not just certification. This is the big driver

http://techcrunch.com/2013/01/15/how-cal...e-know-it/