(01-23-2013 02:24 PM)aughnanure Wrote:  

(01-23-2013 01:24 PM)johnbragg Wrote:  

(01-23-2013 01:08 PM)aughnanure Wrote:  

(01-23-2013 12:59 PM)johnbragg Wrote:  You keep dumping on VCU, but who do you take instead? And for God's sakes, why?

Creighton easily, and I'd still pick Dayton and SLU - as all have invested more in their programs than VCU ever has.

Do you not like VCU's arena? Is that the problem?

ARe you talking about basketball budgets? Because this is from the Syracuse fan's spreadsheet.

Butler $3,924,026
Creighton $4,404,350
Dayton $3,978,866
Gonzaga $6,138,269
Richmond $3,971,226
Saint Louis $3,101,169
St.Joseph's $3,089,503
VCU $3,803,913
Wichita $4,644,724
Xavier $4,707,053

That has VCU spending more than SLU, and effectively the same as Butler or Dayton. Schools can play all kinds of games with these numbers, but they're in the same ballpark.

Quote:VCU has ONE fluke run to the second weekend ever! You want us to take VCU because of one reason -a Final 4 and that's it.

I don't worship NCAA tourney success as the end all be all of a team or program's success. My team plays in the Big East and our season doesn't start in March.

VCU has plenty of regular season success, too. 60% win percentage, a bunch of conference regular season titles. (Sun Belt, CAA).

Quote:1st - Did your school build an $80 million practice facility? No. Do all those schools have larger arenas and better facilities? Yes. And Dayton and Creighton have been investing in their program long before VCU had their one year - so it's nice to be around for a few years, but they've been doing it for a long time now.

Your CAA/Sun Belt success is cute, but that isn't even in the same universe as the intensity, and fun, that playing in the Big East is. Even before the Big East, we were playing Louisville, Cincy under Huggins, and Memphis.

We're not kicking out Marquette, you know.

Quote:You want everyone to ignore that more than half of all your NCAA wins came from one tournament that you were lucky to be even invited to. You want us to only look at your one year and ignore everyone else's 50+ years. I get your SLU argument, that's fair, but don't try to push down Creighton.

Did you miss the post where I set aside VCU's 2011 tournament wins, and they still came out even with Creighton over the last forty years?

Or is the fact that VCU has only been a U for forty years the real problem?

Quote:Xavier's never been to a Final 4...does that make your program better? NO! And the same goes for Butler.

Ok. not sure anymore if you're saying that VCU can't carry Butler's jock, or that Butler can't carry XAvier's jock.

(01-23-2013 01:08 PM)aughnanure Wrote:  

(01-23-2013 12:59 PM)johnbragg Wrote:  

(01-23-2013 12:33 PM)aughnanure Wrote:  

(01-23-2013 12:11 PM)stever20 Wrote:  I don't see any way VCU gets left out if they have another big March run. Don't see them left out to include a St Louis or Dayton that have done nowhere near what VCU has done. It would be a MASSIVE mistake I believe.... As was said on a different thread- the new conference has to hit the ground running. can't afford to have 1st few years with only 2-3 NCAA spots and not really go that far. Heck, has to in a lot of ways do better than the fb teams- if we had only 3 spots, while the fb schools had 4 spots- that wouldn't be good for us at all.

Considering VCU has only gone on one run...ever, the odds aren't in their favor. If Marquette, Georgetown, Villanova, St. John's and Xavier are who they're supposed to be, this league will be more than fine without VCU.

They're resume doesn't compare to most of the C-7, but that's not who they're competing with. If you're only looking at 8 teams, no they don't bump Xavier or Butler.

But who would you put in as No. 10 instead of them?

Using your "they've only gone on one run--ever" criteria?

Creighton hasn't been to a Sweet Sixteen since 1974.
Dayton hasn't been since 1984.
Saint Louis hasn't been to a Sweet Sixteen since 1957.

So who do you want? Richmond? St Joes? Wichita State? UAB? Who?

You keep dumping on VCU, but who do you take instead? And for God's sakes, why?

Creighton easily, and I'd still pick Dayton and SLU - as all have invested more in their programs than VCU ever has. VCU has ONE fluke run to the second weekend ever! You want us to take VCU because of one reason -a Final 4 and that's it.

I don't worship NCAA tourney success as the end all be all of a team or program's success. My team plays in the Big East and our season doesn't start in March.

So to that point for me it is really what seed do you come in as. that shows strength over time not just did you get hot and make a run.

(01-23-2013 04:48 PM)Sactowndog Wrote:  So to that point for me it is really what seed do you come in as. that shows strength over time not just did you get hot and make a run.

So go ahead and go to wikipedia and add up the seeds that Wichita and whoever you want to compare to are over the past 10 years. Just don't forget to account for years the school wasn't in the tournament.

(01-23-2013 05:42 PM)johnbragg Wrote:  

(01-23-2013 04:48 PM)Sactowndog Wrote:  So to that point for me it is really what seed do you come in as. that shows strength over time not just did you get hot and make a run.

So go ahead and go to wikipedia and add up the seeds that Wichita and whoever you want to compare to are over the past 10 years. Just don't forget to account for years the school wasn't in the tournament.

That has excel spread sheet written all over it!!!

(01-23-2013 05:42 PM)johnbragg Wrote:  

(01-23-2013 04:48 PM)Sactowndog Wrote:  So to that point for me it is really what seed do you come in as. that shows strength over time not just did you get hot and make a run.

So go ahead and go to wikipedia and add up the seeds that Wichita and whoever you want to compare to are over the past 10 years. Just don't forget to account for years the school wasn't in the tournament.

Easier to do average RPI and for me only the last 5 years really matter. Everything else is ancient history. However no matter what the numbers look like your opinion won't change so why bother.

(01-23-2013 06:52 PM)Sactowndog Wrote:  

(01-23-2013 05:42 PM)johnbragg Wrote:  

(01-23-2013 04:48 PM)Sactowndog Wrote:  So to that point for me it is really what seed do you come in as. that shows strength over time not just did you get hot and make a run.

So go ahead and go to wikipedia and add up the seeds that Wichita and whoever you want to compare to are over the past 10 years. Just don't forget to account for years the school wasn't in the tournament.

Easier to do average RPI and for me only the last 5 years really matter. Everything else is ancient history. However no matter what the numbers look like your opinion won't change so why bother.

Only the last 5 years really matter. So the Shockers' 2006 Sweet 16 run is no longer relevant? Good to know.