Pick up to 5

I admit I haven't paid very close attention to this. But I'm hearing that Butler, Creighton, Dayton, and Xavier are all either sure-things or almost-sure-things. Is that actually the case?

(01-09-2013 06:42 PM)Native Georgian Wrote:  I admit I haven't paid very close attention to this. But I'm hearing that Butler, Creighton, Dayton, and Xavier are all either sure-things or almost-sure-things. Is that actually the case?

That's been reported, so that's the best information the journalists have.

Does that mean that decisions have been 90% made, and decision-makers have talked to journalists?

Or does it mean that journalists are making very educated guesses, and the decision-makers have barely started to put their information together?

I would've thought that Creighton was just too far away.

(01-09-2013 09:46 PM)Native Georgian Wrote:  I would've thought that Creighton was just too far away.

Not that far from the mid-west schools.

Creighton used to play Marquette every year, usually near the end of the season, in the 60s and 70s. Similar I think to the way PC and St John's used to play at the end of each season back then too. Creighton played DePaul each year from around 78 to 87. Creighton also played the Friars for 4 or 5 years in a row from like 68 thru 72. Point being that Creighton has some good history with the C7.

(01-09-2013 11:18 PM)billyjack Wrote:  Creighton used to play Marquette every year, usually near the end of the season, in the 60s and 70s. Similar I think to the way PC and St John's used to play at the end of each season back then too. Creighton played DePaul each year from around 78 to 87. Creighton also played the Friars for 4 or 5 years in a row from like 68 thru 72. Point being that Creighton has some good history with the C7.

Recently in the last 5-10 years, we've had home and home series w/Depaul, Xavier and Dayton.

Duquesne for the Pittsburgh Market.

(01-10-2013 11:02 AM)curtis0620 Wrote:  Duquesne for the Pittsburgh Market.

Unfortunately, Duquesne has sucked at basketball forever and play 3rd string behind Pitt and Penn State in Pittsburgh so no way.

Saint Joe's and George Mason have zero shot of being invited. Not sure why everyone is leaving off Gonzaga. From at least a basketball only perspective they are reported to be interested. Which I find more credible than the George Mason reference which appeared to be a typo in 1 article.

(01-10-2013 12:39 PM)nathanhm Wrote:  Saint Joe's and George Mason have zero shot of being invited. Not sure why everyone is leaving off Gonzaga. From at least a basketball only perspective they are reported to be interested. Which I find more credible than the George Mason reference which appeared to be a typo in 1 article.

You can't be BBall only. The conference you place your BBall in is your home conference according to the NCAA.

(01-10-2013 01:11 PM)NJRedMan Wrote:  

(01-10-2013 12:39 PM)nathanhm Wrote:  Saint Joe's and George Mason have zero shot of being invited. Not sure why everyone is leaving off Gonzaga. From at least a basketball only perspective they are reported to be interested. Which I find more credible than the George Mason reference which appeared to be a typo in 1 article.

You can't be BBall only. The conference you place your BBall in is your home conference according to the NCAA.

Yup.

I've been puzzled by VCU. Being a public school while the rest are privates seems an odd fit. Not saying it can't work, and not saying VCU hasn't earned the right to be in an elite conference (they have), it just seems like the first choice would be a conference of like-minded schools. If you have a mix of the two it usually works (A-10, CAA, MVC), but being a lone outlier where the school's mission is quite different from the rest seems like it could lead to problems.

(01-10-2013 02:36 PM)Lord2FLI Wrote:  I've been puzzled by VCU. Being a public school while the rest are privates seems an odd fit. Not saying it can't work, and not saying VCU hasn't earned the right to be in an elite conference (they have), it just seems like the first choice would be a conference of like-minded schools. If you have a mix of the two it usually works (A-10, CAA, MVC), but being a lone outlier where the school's mission is quite different from the rest seems like it could lead to problems.

See: Connecticut, University of

(01-10-2013 12:39 PM)nathanhm Wrote:  Saint Joe's and George Mason have zero shot of being invited. Not sure why everyone is leaving off Gonzaga. From at least a basketball only perspective they are reported to be interested. Which I find more credible than the George Mason reference which appeared to be a typo in 1 article.

My bad for leaving Gonzaga off of the list. Apologies also to Wichita. Both deserved to be on the ballot.

(01-10-2013 03:12 PM)thegalen Wrote:  

(01-10-2013 02:36 PM)Lord2FLI Wrote:  I've been puzzled by VCU. Being a public school while the rest are privates seems an odd fit. Not saying it can't work, and not saying VCU hasn't earned the right to be in an elite conference (they have), it just seems like the first choice would be a conference of like-minded schools. If you have a mix of the two it usually works (A-10, CAA, MVC), but being a lone outlier where the school's mission is quite different from the rest seems like it could lead to problems.

See: Connecticut, University of

Sure, but UConn also had Pitt, and that's not even addressing all the animosity those two schools hold towards the Catholic schools (and maybe vice versa).

(01-10-2013 03:26 PM)Lord2FLI Wrote:  

(01-10-2013 03:12 PM)thegalen Wrote:  

(01-10-2013 02:36 PM)Lord2FLI Wrote:  I've been puzzled by VCU. Being a public school while the rest are privates seems an odd fit. Not saying it can't work, and not saying VCU hasn't earned the right to be in an elite conference (they have), it just seems like the first choice would be a conference of like-minded schools. If you have a mix of the two it usually works (A-10, CAA, MVC), but being a lone outlier where the school's mission is quite different from the rest seems like it could lead to problems.

See: Connecticut, University of

Sure, but UConn also had Pitt, and that's not even addressing all the animosity those two schools hold towards the Catholic schools (and maybe vice versa).

What animosity?


What

(01-10-2013 05:08 PM)gosports1 Wrote:  

(01-10-2013 03:26 PM)Lord2FLI Wrote:  

(01-10-2013 03:12 PM)thegalen Wrote:  

(01-10-2013 02:36 PM)Lord2FLI Wrote:  I've been puzzled by VCU. Being a public school while the rest are privates seems an odd fit. Not saying it can't work, and not saying VCU hasn't earned the right to be in an elite conference (they have), it just seems like the first choice would be a conference of like-minded schools. If you have a mix of the two it usually works (A-10, CAA, MVC), but being a lone outlier where the school's mission is quite different from the rest seems like it could lead to problems.

See: Connecticut, University of

Sure, but UConn also had Pitt, and that's not even addressing all the animosity those two schools hold towards the Catholic schools (and maybe vice versa).

What animosity?


What

I'm with you, what animosity?

(01-10-2013 05:12 PM)NJRedMan Wrote:  

(01-10-2013 05:08 PM)gosports1 Wrote:  

(01-10-2013 03:26 PM)Lord2FLI Wrote:  

(01-10-2013 03:12 PM)thegalen Wrote:  

(01-10-2013 02:36 PM)Lord2FLI Wrote:  I've been puzzled by VCU. Being a public school while the rest are privates seems an odd fit. Not saying it can't work, and not saying VCU hasn't earned the right to be in an elite conference (they have), it just seems like the first choice would be a conference of like-minded schools. If you have a mix of the two it usually works (A-10, CAA, MVC), but being a lone outlier where the school's mission is quite different from the rest seems like it could lead to problems.

See: Connecticut, University of

Sure, but UConn also had Pitt, and that's not even addressing all the animosity those two schools hold towards the Catholic schools (and maybe vice versa).

What animosity?


What

I'm with you, what animosity?

Honestly, I don't know, UConn I picked up from UConn people and what their women's basketball coach said while the administration didn't even offer an apology. Pitt, I can't put a finger on exactly what it was they did, was shortly after they were invited to the ACC. Regardless, doesn't look like anyone wants to discuss my query anyway, looks like it's just add VCU and hope nothing happens I guess. I'll slink off back to where I came from.

(01-10-2013 05:34 PM)Lord2FLI Wrote:  

(01-10-2013 05:12 PM)NJRedMan Wrote:  

(01-10-2013 05:08 PM)gosports1 Wrote:  

(01-10-2013 03:26 PM)Lord2FLI Wrote:  

(01-10-2013 03:12 PM)thegalen Wrote:  See: Connecticut, University of

Sure, but UConn also had Pitt, and that's not even addressing all the animosity those two schools hold towards the Catholic schools (and maybe vice versa).

What animosity?


What

I'm with you, what animosity?

Honestly, I don't know, UConn I picked up from UConn people and what their women's basketball coach said while the administration didn't even offer an apology. Pitt, I can't put a finger on exactly what it was they did, was shortly after they were invited to the ACC. Regardless, doesn't look like anyone wants to discuss my query anyway, looks like it's just add VCU and hope nothing happens I guess. I'll slink off back to where I came from.

I'm probably the biggest non-affiliated VCU backer around here, so I'll take it.

There is an idea that "fit" is terribly important in conference formation and management. A lot of it trickles down from the SEC and Big Ten and PAC, where they have the luxury of passing over good candidates because, well, they don't really fit the profile of what we're looking for as an institution. See PAC-BYU, see Notre Dame rebuffing the Big Ten, see Big Ten requiring AAU membership. But even at that level, you have your Vanderbilts and USCs and Northwesterns.

Fit also plays a big role at the bottom of the ladder. In the Big West or WCC, there's no money anyway, so why bother with an awkward mix? Just affiliate with like-minded institutions--religious and privates over here, UC's and Cal State's over there.

But I think it plays much less of a role in the middle range. I believe that, from the relaunch of the league through the first few seasons, we're going to be fighting a propaganda/PR battle over whether we are a "midmajor" or not. Butler and Xavier cut against the midmajor perception--they're major programs in midmajor or minor conferences. Dayton, Saint Louis and Creighton are arguable. VCU, with their shiny new Final Four banner, helps us there. And, looking at their track record, I think the Final Four is a reflection of a strong program over time, not just lightning in a bottle.

I actually think having a non-Catholic, non-private helps with some important audiences. We're working on a three-level audience. Alumni and boosters, t-shirt fans and general basketball fans. For the last two groups, I think it's a disadvantage to be tagged closely as a "Catholic league." The more "Catholic" the league is, the fewer a Protestants in Philadelphia buy Villanova gear. The more "Catholic" the league is, the less interest a non-Catholic basketball fan outside the northeast is going to be interested in watching.

As for the UConn women's coach, I don't think that was a pre-existing animosity--it was a reaction to teams leaving, good riddance, get out, we don't need you.