(01-03-2013 08:04 AM)Big Dub Wrote:  Decisions based on pride can be dangerous.

There's a lot of truth in "be careful what you wish for, you just may get it".

It appears to me the MWC might be the ones making a decision based on pride. Their comments make it seem like they want to humiliate SDSU to exact revenge over some lines the AD fed reporters. It is not the best approach for them either. Why should SDSU crawl on their knees while BSU gets a limo?

(01-04-2013 10:55 AM)Lolly Popp Wrote:  

(01-03-2013 08:04 AM)Big Dub Wrote:  Decisions based on pride can be dangerous.

There's a lot of truth in "be careful what you wish for, you just may get it".

It appears to me the MWC might be the ones making a decision based on pride. Their comments make it seem like they want to humiliate SDSU to exact revenge over some lines the AD fed reporters. It is not the best approach for them either. Why should SDSU crawl on their knees while BSU gets a limo?

Well its really bad form to pizz off people you may have to do business with. Apparently the admin folks at SDSU have been good at dissing their counterparts in the MWC over the last few months. Noting also that SDSU was only in the nBE discussion because of BSU, they should have taken the same "keep quiet" approach during all this that BSU did. SDSU really has no leverage at all now that BSU is back unless BSU decides to give them further help. All SDSU did was grab BSU's coat tail. We will know by the end of this month how it all works out. SDSU may well decide to stay with the nBE out of pride. I have no sympathy for SDSU at all.

(01-04-2013 11:11 AM)MinerInWisconsin Wrote:  

(01-04-2013 10:55 AM)Lolly Popp Wrote:  

(01-03-2013 08:04 AM)Big Dub Wrote:  Decisions based on pride can be dangerous.

There's a lot of truth in "be careful what you wish for, you just may get it".

It appears to me the MWC might be the ones making a decision based on pride. Their comments make it seem like they want to humiliate SDSU to exact revenge over some lines the AD fed reporters. It is not the best approach for them either. Why should SDSU crawl on their knees while BSU gets a limo?

Well its really bad form to pizz off people you may have to do business with. Apparently the admin folks at SDSU have been good at dissing their counterparts in the MWC over the last few months. Noting also that SDSU was only in the nBE discussion because of BSU, they should have taken the same "keep quiet" approach during all this that BSU did. SDSU really has no leverage at all now that BSU is back unless BSU decides to give them further help. All SDSU did was grab BSU's coat tail. We will know by the end of this month how it all works out. SDSU may well decide to stay with the nBE out of pride. I have no sympathy for SDSU at all.

It is a great theory, but the reality is that Sterk has only had a couple of comments.

Full Steam Ahead

and

We are not going backwards

The later one is what has set off the free range free loaders, as they are justifiably sensitive to comments that they conjure to be that they are lesser than, because they are insecure about being lesser than.

So to say that those comments were anything more than what they are worth on face value is insane, but that is the Range. Where they leach off of others money because they have no media markets. They even have the brass nuts for years to take swipes at USU, called them small markets and trash. I guess that even though their media market is bigger than theirs, it is not enough to leach off of, so why bring in another grazer.

In any event, I don't think State is all too worried about the MW and whether they let us in or not. We will save at least $1.0M in travel for our olys and collect at least $500K in media rights from the BW, we could make more even in a depleted Big East. So if we go, it will be on mutual Terms, if not, we stay with the BE.

The MW did nothing to stabilize the league, sure they dropped trou for Boise to get them back in the fold and could do the same for BYU. But that does nothing for the other members. They will still be earning $800K in tv media rights a year. The teams with no options, the free range free loaders get to keep on keep on grazing. $800K is more than they could ever get for their rights for 10 years let alone 1, But Hawaii (Who can generate $2.5M in PPV alone), Fresno, UNLV, and UNR have to be sitting there wondering what the hell just happened.

Who the hell made sdsu important? What have they ever done to justify their ego?

I hope they crash and burn. It might happen if byu goes back to the MWC.

(01-04-2013 12:37 PM)YA! Wrote:  Who the hell made sdsu important? What have they ever done to justify their ego?

I hope they crash and burn. It might happen if byu goes back to the MWC.

Yo, it is about eye balls. We bring them in SD, the #28DMA.

We have a top 25 basketball team.

We are in a 1M household DMA.

By joining the BW in basketball the Tier 2 contract with fox went from the BW paying to be on TV to Fox paying $1.5M per annum. Why you ask? Well because FOXSD ponied up the money so they could get a mininum of 12 SDSU basketball games.

So, ya, we are a big deal in SD.

(01-04-2013 12:37 PM)YA! Wrote:  Who the hell made sdsu important? What have they ever done to justify their ego?

I hope they crash and burn. It might happen if byu goes back to the MWC.

This! ^^^

And it must be that all games are televised in SD because that's probably why the fans are in front of their tvs instead of at the stadium. The year we played them in SD we almost had as many fans as they did and we had to travel 8 hours or more.
I give them props in bkb but they bring nothing to fb to brag about. Let them stay in the Little East and travel forever for their fb games.

(01-04-2013 01:39 AM)MU ATO Wrote:  I didn't need an explanation of the deal that a football power like Boise State was able to make. Boise has the power to pull deals like this because of what they have. Houston and SMU hardly have that. Boise can shop their home games and they will easily be picked up by many takers.

Houston & SMU? Yea ok.

Houston was one of the market prizes in the nBE with UCONN, Rutgers and Boise.

I'm not rubbing myself as a homer, I'm going off CBS and ESPN quoting the TV guys.

It helps sitting smack dab in the middle of the 4th largest city (10 TV wise) in arguably Football Central. Nobody thought the Texans would be worth more than the Packers 10 years ago. This city (state) lives/breathes Football. And god gave us the Oilers and Texans /sigh...alright off topic.

It would be hilarious if SDSU forces the issue and stays in the Big East.

There would be absolutely no benefit to anyone.

Right or wrong, the smart move would be for SDSU to suck up their pride and rejoin the MWC.

(01-04-2013 12:37 PM)YA! Wrote:  Who the hell made sdsu important? What have they ever done to justify their ego?

I hope they crash and burn. It might happen if byu goes back to the MWC.

Aztecs really do think their way to good for 3/4 of the MW. Its funny that TCU and Utah never thought that way yet they gained much more than SDSU ever will.

(01-04-2013 03:54 PM)dakar1 Wrote:  

(01-04-2013 12:37 PM)YA! Wrote:  Who the hell made sdsu important? What have they ever done to justify their ego?

I hope they crash and burn. It might happen if byu goes back to the MWC.

Aztecs really do think their way to good for 3/4 of the MW. Its funny that TCU and Utah never thought that way yet they gained much more than SDSU ever will.

Ya, where is TCU and Utah? GTFO.

(01-04-2013 03:57 PM)FULL_MONTY Wrote:  

(01-04-2013 03:54 PM)dakar1 Wrote:  

(01-04-2013 12:37 PM)YA! Wrote:  Who the hell made sdsu important? What have they ever done to justify their ego?

I hope they crash and burn. It might happen if byu goes back to the MWC.

Aztecs really do think their way to good for 3/4 of the MW. Its funny that TCU and Utah never thought that way yet they gained much more than SDSU ever will.

Ya, where is TCU and Utah? GTFO.

Hey Monty, pizzing contests are well and good but how about just a straight up question for you. Do you any inside or near inside info saying what SDSU's decision is or will be? Curious Miners want to know, really.

(01-04-2013 01:41 PM)FULL_MONTY Wrote:  

(01-04-2013 12:37 PM)YA! Wrote:  Who the hell made sdsu important? What have they ever done to justify their ego?

I hope they crash and burn. It might happen if byu goes back to the MWC.

Yo, it is about eye balls. We bring them in SD, the #28DMA.

We have a top 25 basketball team.

We are in a 1M household DMA.

By joining the BW in basketball the Tier 2 contract with fox went from the BW paying to be on TV to Fox paying $1.5M per annum. Why you ask? Well because FOXSD ponied up the money so they could get a mininum of 12 SDSU basketball games.

So, ya, we are a big deal in SD.

I don't know about this. Doesn't SDSU give away a lot of tickets to bring in fans to charger stadium. Two of my friends live in La Jolla and another who graduated from SDSU and all 3 say that there is only about 20k in the stands for the aztec games. The 2 who currently live there, do back up your claim about sdsu bball being popular right now, though

(01-04-2013 04:04 PM)MinerInWisconsin Wrote:  

(01-04-2013 03:57 PM)FULL_MONTY Wrote:  

(01-04-2013 03:54 PM)dakar1 Wrote:  

(01-04-2013 12:37 PM)YA! Wrote:  Who the hell made sdsu important? What have they ever done to justify their ego?

I hope they crash and burn. It might happen if byu goes back to the MWC.

Aztecs really do think their way to good for 3/4 of the MW. Its funny that TCU and Utah never thought that way yet they gained much more than SDSU ever will.

Ya, where is TCU and Utah? GTFO.

Hey Monty, pizzing contests are well and good but how about just a straight up question for you. Do you any inside or near inside info saying what SDSU's decision is or will be? Curious Miners want to know, really.

The Calculus is not easy. State is uniquely positioned to take advantage of the BW proximity. Having your teams travel almost exclusively in SoCal would save at least $1.0M in travel. The BW just got $1.5M per year for BW tier 2 rights from FOXSD (This was to get State) which evenly spreads to a net benefit of $1.150M

The MW all in payout is $2.0M media Rights and Tourney credits versus $1.15M as outlined above without the following:

BW Tier 1 rights.
Tier 3 rights are retained by BW members
BE Media Revenue
BE Bowl Revenue

As you can see Economically it is impossible for State not to choose the BE. But that is just the economics, there are other matters to be addressed.

Competiveness - Is the BW basketball that bad to kill the hoops team
Stability - Is anyone jumping to the ACC
Exposure - play in Laramie or Phily or Dallas
etc...

So, it boils down to how much more from the BE/BW is worth playing hoops in the BW or if the MW would provide a Boise Lite deal. State's Media value is excluded from the CBS contract as well as Boise's right now as well. Would the BW, say we got nothing from tier 2 last time, we are willing to give you all $1.5M to stay and split Tier 1 evenly? That would be damn interesting as well.

So it is not as clear cut as most would make it out to be.....

It is a complex decision.

(01-04-2013 04:52 PM)randaddyminer Wrote:  

(01-04-2013 01:41 PM)FULL_MONTY Wrote:  

(01-04-2013 12:37 PM)YA! Wrote:  Who the hell made sdsu important? What have they ever done to justify their ego?

I hope they crash and burn. It might happen if byu goes back to the MWC.

Yo, it is about eye balls. We bring them in SD, the #28DMA.

We have a top 25 basketball team.

We are in a 1M household DMA.

By joining the BW in basketball the Tier 2 contract with fox went from the BW paying to be on TV to Fox paying $1.5M per annum. Why you ask? Well because FOXSD ponied up the money so they could get a mininum of 12 SDSU basketball games.

So, ya, we are a big deal in SD.

I don't know about this. Doesn't SDSU give away a lot of tickets to bring in fans to charger stadium. Two of my friends live in La Jolla and another who graduated from SDSU and all 3 say that there is only about 20k in the stands for the aztec games. The 2 who currently live there, do back up your claim about sdsu bball being popular right now, though

We averaged 25K in football this year, but the TV ratings exceeded the Padre ratings for the year. The Q is a 70K beheamoth.

As for Basketball, this is season 2 of being sold out before the season started.

big difference between exceeded and better.

SD does not pull their market

In the year and a half i lived there i couldn't get any tix for basketball but i got tix for free for every football game but one, i payed $6, but the school gives tix to the military for free. The Murf is massive and even if they had 40+ it still looked like only 20 because of the size. They have descent support about as much as the other SD teams, always lots of empty seats. The largest crowd I've ever seen was for Boise last season. It's not good when the booing is louder then the cheering when the Aztecs took the field.

(01-04-2013 03:27 PM)Big Dub Wrote:  Right or wrong, the smart move would be for SDSU to suck up their pride and rejoin the MWC.

Not if doing so means being treated like second class citizens. Conferences can't add or bring back schools on bad terms. It needs to be a clean reset.

(01-04-2013 01:41 PM)FULL_MONTY Wrote:  

(01-04-2013 12:37 PM)YA! Wrote:  Who the hell made sdsu important? What have they ever done to justify their ego?

I hope they crash and burn. It might happen if byu goes back to the MWC.

Yo, it is about eye balls. We bring them in SD, the #28DMA.

We have a top 25 basketball team.

We are in a 1M household DMA.

By joining the BW in basketball the Tier 2 contract with fox went from the BW paying to be on TV to Fox paying $1.5M per annum. Why you ask? Well because FOXSD ponied up the money so they could get a mininum of 12 SDSU basketball games.

So, ya, we are a big deal in SD.

.

Apparently SD St isn't that big of a deal if they are having to beg to be accepted back.

(01-04-2013 07:10 PM)FULL_MONTY Wrote:  

(01-04-2013 04:04 PM)MinerInWisconsin Wrote:  

(01-04-2013 03:57 PM)FULL_MONTY Wrote:  

(01-04-2013 03:54 PM)dakar1 Wrote:  

(01-04-2013 12:37 PM)YA! Wrote:  Who the hell made sdsu important? What have they ever done to justify their ego?

I hope they crash and burn. It might happen if byu goes back to the MWC.

Aztecs really do think their way to good for 3/4 of the MW. Its funny that TCU and Utah never thought that way yet they gained much more than SDSU ever will.

Ya, where is TCU and Utah? GTFO.

Hey Monty, pizzing contests are well and good but how about just a straight up question for you. Do you any inside or near inside info saying what SDSU's decision is or will be? Curious Miners want to know, really.

The Calculus is not easy. State is uniquely positioned to take advantage of the BW proximity. Having your teams travel almost exclusively in SoCal would save at least $1.0M in travel. The BW just got $1.5M per year for BW tier 2 rights from FOXSD (This was to get State) which evenly spreads to a net benefit of $1.150M

The MW all in payout is $2.0M media Rights and Tourney credits versus $1.15M as outlined above without the following:

BW Tier 1 rights.
Tier 3 rights are retained by BW members
BE Media Revenue
BE Bowl Revenue

As you can see Economically it is impossible for State not to choose the BE. But that is just the economics, there are other matters to be addressed.

Competiveness - Is the BW basketball that bad to kill the hoops team
Stability - Is anyone jumping to the ACC
Exposure - play in Laramie or Phily or Dallas
etc...

So, it boils down to how much more from the BE/BW is worth playing hoops in the BW or if the MW would provide a Boise Lite deal. State's Media value is excluded from the CBS contract as well as Boise's right now as well. Would the BW, say we got nothing from tier 2 last time, we are willing to give you all $1.5M to stay and split Tier 1 evenly? That would be damn interesting as well.

So it is not as clear cut as most would make it out to be.....

It is a complex decision.

I actually think SDSU will make out fine either way they go. The non-FB sports are taken care of as long as BW basketball is good. With Hawaii, LBSU and Irvine you have some traditionally decent basketball schools but nothing like you have in the MWC. If the nBE will give you the number of strong OOC games you want in basketball then that would help. Playing Memphis, Temple, Cincy and UConn would be a good draw in San Diego.

Football, at least the strength of it, is just not improved for you, imho, in the nBE. They added some decent football schools in ECU, UCF and Houston but even those schools are up and down, not year in and year out strong.

So I guess it comes down to money and guessing on what the long range holds. Maybe SDSU admins are thinking that even if the nBE doesn't work in the long run, you will always have the MWC to fall back on. Don't know if that will remain true but it might.

Oh, and if you need an additional school or 2 to join you in the nBE if Houston and/or SMU leave for the MWC, I'm pretty sure Tulsa, USM and Marshall would be up for the challenge.

Good luck to your school. Hopefully fence mending is going on and this will get resolved soon.

The Now Defunct Southwest Conference:

The future MWC I think could end up being like the old Southwest Conference and as Frank Broyles described it in an old Dallas Times-Herald article I remember reading years ago. In that Times-Herald article I remember then Arkansas AD Frank Broyles saying this;

"You have 2 rivalries in the SWC: UT and Arkansas versus................... everybody else."

Broyles then added how the SWC private schools only drew good crowds when the big state schools came to their campus stadiums and that they had quit drawing good crowds among each other long ago; that is, once the Cowboys came to Dallas and the Oilers to Houston. NOTE: In less than 2 years after that article came out Broyles would pull his Hogs out of the SWC and into the SEC.
______________________________________

The MWC versus CUSA

The MWC could very well have the same scenario as the now defunct SWC did especially if BYU comes back to the MWC but then it would probably be:

You'd have 2 rivalries in the MWC: Boise and BYU versus.........everybody else.

Most every school in the Gang of 5 (except maybe the MAC schools) are almost like Homer's Odysseus with the very tempting Song of the Sirens, ie, the female creatures from greek mythology, who attracted sailors with their chants. They had to turn a deaf ear to their female temptors (or rather put wax in their ears) to avoid potential disaster.

How many schools are inviting potential disaster today because they cannot refuse the $ong of the $iren$? Still, few among our Gang of 5 can resist the temptations once another conference (perceived to be a cut above) starts throwing all those endless bouquets of nice words toward said school--mostly based on what many of those schools did over 70 years ago. But what the heck, it's difficult to throw cold water on those saying nice things about you, now isn't it?

I have vascillated on the MWC versus the CUSA as far as our school (UNT) is concerned and only thought the MWC would be right for North Texas if 3 other Texas schools plus (maybe) Tulsa came along for the ride; but upon further review, I am just not that sure. I now hope that all in CUSA will hang in there together and just resist the songs of the Gang of 5 Sirens. Funny thing is how I think all the present CUSA presidents will want to do the same thing no matter what is said on these conference smack boards; after all, they are the ones who have to deal with the bottom line.

Plus, Texas-based public universities would have their Board of Regents to deal with and cutting budget cost has now become a major theme in the state of Texas among public universities. Trips for all men and women's varsity teams to the MWC region I don't think they'd see as cost cutters long term plus I think they also know what part of the USA the all important population momentum will be.

I really think it highly probable that future CUSA TV packages will trump any future MWC TV package (as it does now) even with Boise and BYU in their league and I base that solely based on where the population of the USA is still growing with warp speed compared to the geographical location of the MWC.

AND...if BYU and San Diego State rejoin Boise they will all 3 undoubtedly get higher cuts of the TV action over the balance of the MWC. Just how many schools from CUSA would really want to play a (very insulting) and lesser paid role as that?