Tigeer Wrote:

tigersharktwo Wrote:Fan feelings especially from selected outside the BE groups about conference memberships hold minmal value as compared to the financial strength of the BE.With regard to bb the Meadowlands will not be the location for the BE tournament.Those who own msg and the hartford civic center where the woman's bb tournament are one and the same.The reason the woman's tournament is there is to maximize BE revenues.Also with regard to the level of observance of NCAA regulations is a very strict interpretation.Just as in the case of UC,Memphis and its hc would be subject BE interpretations if(?) they were selected.The tv market for BE bb revenues would be hurt severely overall by the loss of many key markets(Philadelphia and DC),thus saying each sides gets 50% is completely inaccurate.If there is a split the total of the two would not equal the current level of revenue.Memphis CANNOT replace Philadelphia and DC.

Who mentioned Memphis?

I did. My model includes them as the 9th member.

tigersharktwo Wrote:Yes ND has an arrangement with the BE football worth 6 million per year.

Do the BE and ND know about this? Seriously, this is the absolute first time I've heard of a direct contractual agreement whereby ND directs $6M per year to the BE. I would really, really love a link or copy of a story covering this. Seriously.

Is this the amount ND is paying the BE in return for 3 games a season? If so, great for the BE, though I'd wager the Irish could've gotten away with this for much, much less. Yet you've never mentioned in previous BE financial discussions "Don't forget the $6M per year the conference gets from ND!"

Read my typing: No one is disputing the relative value of ND nor insinuating that the BE football members want to completely end all relationships with ND! They still want to play the Irish in all sports, but if they can do that in a way that provides even more money and security for themselves then don't blame them for taking it. The last thing the BE wants is to become the MAC to ND's Big Ten.

1. 3 games per year each game payout i million(3million)
2. the 2 bowls per year the BE shares with the BE (Houston:Sun/gator)(3million per year in payouts 3. plus ND support the BE in the BCS.

tigersharktwo Wrote:1. 3 games per year each game payout i million(3million)
2. the 2 bowls per year the BE shares with the BE (Houston:Sun/gator)(3million per year in payouts 3. plus ND support the BE in the BCS.

Your answers are completely speculative.

The Big East is less and less likely to need ND's support in the BCS. In fact I'd suggest that Notre Dame is the program that needs the Big East's support. This is not a one way street. :shhh:

l your definition of speculation is totally incorrect.The ND numbers for the bowls are REAL as well as the payouts for ND games.ND earns between 4-5 million for each of its home games.

tigersharktwo Wrote:l your definition of speculation is totally incorrect.The ND numbers for the bowls are REAL as well as the payouts for ND games.ND earns between 4-5 million for each of its home games.

I never disputed the numbers simply your train of thought. Notre Dame was nowhere to be found in a Big East bowl this season and the conference represented itself well by any standard in the stands and to a lesser extent on the field. The notion that the bowls dissapear if Notre Dame walks, even the notion that Notre Dame would walk from the deal the Big East gives them is absurd.

tigersharktwo Wrote:1. 3 games per year each game payout i million(3million)

Uh, I don't think ND will be paying the BE $1 M for the priviledge of playing a road game at the Dome or Mountaineer field. Nor will the net increase in TV contracts or gate receipts be such that the BE members need to tie themselves down to exactly doing whatever ND wants regarding the shape of the conference.

Quote:2. the 2 bowls per year the BE shares with the BE (Houston:Sun/gator)(3million per year in payouts
3. plus ND support the BE in the BCS.

These things swing both ways. ND won't suddenly turn completely against the BE (they need access to that market and want to play with the football members, as you've alluded to earlier) nor will the BE simply lose 2 bowls without having anything as a replacement. I thought we also established that the BE's BCS status is secure do to on field performance, market value/access and the fact the other BCS leagues wouldn't want to be in the minority?

any time I have insomnia I can always come over here and read split/expansion post number 3867 and it will put me right out.

Quote:The tv market for BE bb revenues would be hurt severely overall by the loss of many key markets(Philadelphia and DC)

-- Just throwing this out...TS2....DC is not a BE market...its not in football and its not in basketball...Maryland bball eclipses G-town in fan #s and media coverage...saying DC is a BE city is like saying Pittsburgh is an A-10 city because they have Duqusene


Jackson

Problem is Jackson you don't understand how markets and ratings work. The larger the market the lower the ratings can be for contract purposes.
DC is a great maket for the Big East even if the numbers are not all that good. A 2 share in DC is better than a 20 share in Fargo. Its all based on cost per thousand, how much is it costing the advertiser to reach a thousand people. Thats why all this split talk is a bunch of crap.

TopCoog Wrote:Problem is Jackson you don't understand how markets and ratings work. The larger the market the lower the ratings can be for contract purposes.
DC is a great maket for the Big East even if the numbers are not all that good. A 2 share in DC is better than a 20 share in Fargo. Its all based on cost per thousand, how much is it costing the advertiser to reach a thousand people. Thats why all this split talk is a bunch of crap.

Which is why you guys are going to look like arses when the television numbers are released. National programs like the majority of the BE all-sport members have national appeal that is incomprable to that of Seton Hall or Saint Johns. While Topcoog and TS2 are lauding a 2 rating in the DC area the networks will be paying for national games that have national implications and bring good ratings nationwide. By using the logic of TC and TS2 Georgetown, Saint Johns, Providence and USF should have every game they play broadcast by ESPN.

Well...whether the split talk is a bunch of crap or not is a matter of opinion...but I think its foolish to say the DC market is something the BE can't afford to lose when we don't have it to begin with....take a look at the DC papers this morning...who got more coverage...G-Town or Maryland? Which confernece get more coverage...the Big East or the ACC? I'm sure even the average sports fan could answer those questions without hesitation...and G-Town and the BE are both a distant second


Jackson

TopCoog Wrote:Problem is Jackson you don't understand how markets and ratings work. The larger the market the lower the ratings can be for contract purposes.
DC is a great maket for the Big East even if the numbers are not all that good. A 2 share in DC is better than a 20 share in Fargo. Its all based on cost per thousand, how much is it costing the advertiser to reach a thousand people. Thats why all this split talk is a bunch of crap.

Jackson, did you even comprehend what I said? What did I say? You have it even if the numbers are modest. You need to learn how this stuff works before you invest so much of your life trying to figure it out.

Again and read very slowly....the contracts are determined by a share/market size ratio....


THE LARGER THE MARKEST THE LOWER THE SHARES CAN BE.

Example again a 3 share in Philly is the same as a 12 in Tulsa.
jesus.

Then why didn't Houston get invited into the Big 12 or the SEC.... Why are you stuck in CUSA with such a huge market ..its seems your school is a posterchild for why your theory doesn't work...TV markets are not as important as the size/support of fan bases


Jackson

jackson, I have worked in advertising all my life. I'm not trying to be ugly but you don't have a clue. Look, markets are not 'owned' by individual teams as you imply. If the Big east is working a TV contract the network could not give a rats ass what maryland draws in the market, all they care about is what Georgetown pulls. In other words, how many sets is georgetown going to deliver.

As for Houston, when the big 12 looked at the market texas and texas A&M had good shares. Why in the hell do you think the MWC wanted TCU? Think about it. You have the greatest set up anyone could possibly have and you are two dumb to see it.

Ok....then enlighten me... why did the SEC take Arkansas over Houston?...certainly league officials should have been drolling over that huge Houston market...Why pick Fayetteville and a largely rural state over the big city? Again, the struggles of your school to get into a big time league seems to reinforce my point that TV markets aren't the end all when it comes to league expansion....

Jackson

Putting together a good package for tv is a complex job..The BE was seriously hurt by the raid of the acc.Only now with the success of BE football gathering steam,that some have the idea of split being an effective way of increasing BE football.What has happened in the past year has been great.
1.tie ins with ND
2.5 bowl games
3.the possibility of adding Army/Navy and the MAC to both bowl games
and in-season games and tv
4.the packaging BE football/bb together to increase tv revenues
5.hopefully at least 6-8 BE slots in bb

Some however want to run off and kill all these positives and put everything where it was 2 years ago.

I want the split so add me to your list!

tigersharktwo Wrote:Putting together a good package for tv is a complex job..The BE was seriously hurt by the raid of the acc.Only now with the success of BE football gathering steam,that some have the idea of split being an effective way of increasing BE football.What has happened in the past year has been great.
1.tie ins with ND
2.5 bowl games
3.the possibility of adding Army/Navy and the MAC to both bowl games
and in-season games and tv
4.the packaging BE football/bb together to increase tv revenues
5.hopefully at least 6-8 BE slots in bb

Some however want to run off and kill all these positives and put everything where it was 2 years ago.

How is the split going to hurt any of that? Basketball would still be powerful after the split.